Bailing Ireland out

utdalltheway

I'd agree with that. levels the playing field I suppose. there have been instances where foreign companies would come in for 10 years or so and then leave after their initial freebies expired.

VoetbalWizard

Even with decent WMATA service, I could never imagine living there without a car. Manhattan yes (flat 2 dollar/24 hour subway allows for that), but never in DC/MD/NoVA would I do that. I know a few people who do what you say in regards to cars but having to rely on zip car is a hassle.

I guess I'm just biased towards bethesda over arlington/NoVA.

Team Brian GB

I like what you did there.

Team Brian GB

More reasons why we retained Sterling though I can see the logic in streamlined corporate tax rates to an extent, however once you start getting in the game of liaising on taxation your sovereignty evaporates. The United Kingdom is able to offer much lower corporate tax rates because we are traditionally a low tax, laissez-faire economy, we don't believe the government should intervene and regulate to the extent that the French and Germans do so if this is the path the EU is going down it will ultimately be a battle of competing ideology that would go absolutely no where.

Not to mention that Her Majesty's Goverment and the British electorate would have absolutely none of it.

MikeUpNorth

Further lowering and lowering of corporation taxes is a sure-fire way to kill your economy (the real economy that is, the one that generates real money). You only end up as the dumping ground for unsustainable businesses and businesses that will up and leave the moment you need them to contribute.

Team Brian GB

As far as Ireland goes as a minnow economy with a ridiculously low corporate tax rate and little homegrown globally competing companies I agree with you, whereas the United Kingdom with an inviting but not outrageous 24% coupled with a well established and entrenched economy on the world stage is a completely different prospect.

Whilst I know full well where you stand on the British political spectrum, do you agree with the position I take with regard to the setting of tax rates?

MikeUpNorth

I don't know your position in enough detail to say whether I agree with it or not. Let's face it Brian, we rarely agree, so probably not. But feel free to start a thread and I'll contribute where I can.

Team Brian GB

Why Ireland think's it can get a bailout deal worth tens of billions when those granting it are not exactly rolling it essentially for free is beyond me.

Flying Fox

'tis cheaper than borrowing from the market though. Three percent could make a hell of a difference.

(I assume we're talking about the IMF package?)

Don't Kill Bill

So the Irish will ask for a 100 billion Euro loan. Britain will contribute but might do this through the IMF because it isn't in the Euro zone. So if this happens I want to know why the same govt which is prepared to borrow more money to help Ireland out wasn't prepared to do likewise for its own people, like say the 80 million pound loan for Sheffield Forgemasters?

Mister Jeebus

Because the alternative is letting the bond holders assume financial responsibility for reckless lending. The big British, German, and French banks especially would then take losses of tens of billions, and these countries are loath to allow their banks - and potentially their citizens - be burnt so. Infinitely preferable to get Ireland to take a loan to fund its errant banks, thereby forcing Irish citizens to take the financial hit rather than the foreign bondholders.

rednev

It's official. The Government of Ireland has made a formal request for a 'bail out'. The same government that only last week denied that they were heading for a bail out....

Eyepopper

Yep, Cowen and Lenihan doing a press conference on the TV now.... politicians, lying.... I'm shocked.

Both look shift as fuck and as if they're lying through their teeth to me.

WeasteDevil

That money has already been allocated, so it's not going to affect those others that are not rolling in it. Remember the late 70s? UK, IMF? You can't begrudge them it in a way, but you can when you see the net gain they have had since they joined the EU/EEC. It's incompetence on a massive scale considering how small they are. It's quite clear that they cannot ever economically stand on their own two feet - so much for independence. Maybe they should be left to rot to give them a reality check, because they certainly like other forms of cheques about to come their way.

TheReligion

Britain prepared to offer £7 billion pounds.

Bloody hell. I have a feeling the people of Ireland are going to have a massive shock soon with how much wages they will be taking home...

711

On the plus side Ireland used to be a really cheap (desperately cheap) place to go on holiday, so maybe that will come back again.

As for the 70s IMF loan to Britain, I've heard it said that it was repaid within two years, because it wasn't really needed. Maybe Ireland's will be the same.

Lynott

It might be the best thing for Ireland in the end. The demise of FF and the Irish people starting to appreciate the value of money and hard work again, particularly the middle classes, and realise that everyone cannot become a millionaire overnight.
Also the arrogance seeping through the country there for a while was pretty disgusting.

Eyepopper

I'll believe the demise of FF when I see it.... I bet they do better at the poles than people expect, as depressing as that will be.


On a lighter note, it seems we're not the only one.

Decotron

I cant decide what to do with my share of the loan.

Eyepopper

Buy a house!

Decotron

Breaking news.....

Green Party to call for an election in Jan......

golden_blunder

assuming its 70 billion, what does that work out per taxpayer head?

Mister Jeebus

John Gormley just announced same alright. Why not pull out immediately if they're announcing the need for an imminent general election? Cnuts.

WeasteDevil

You mean in which direction?

It will be around €16,000 per person in Ireland.

Assuming that the UK is giving €9bn, that's around 270 quid or €330 per UK taxpayer.

I guess that the only reason that the UK is getting involved in this is that the two economies are quite tightly entwined. How much money do the Irish banks owe to UK banks for example?

Mister Jeebus

£140bn apparently.

WeasteDevil

You don't really want them defaulting on that do you?

Mister Jeebus

Absolutely! The bond holders deserve to be burnt for reckless lending. Bit too late though given that the Irish banks are nearly all effectively nationalised, meaning the Irish state would end up defaulting.

Livvie

Well if I'm forking out £270, I want something for it.

A week in Popper's new house - breakfast and evening meal - will do nicely.

RedSky At Night

Thats a good idea Livvie. I'll book the 3rd week in March.

Mister Jeebus

I'd insist on a bolt lock on the bedroom door and check very carefully for peep holes, especially watch out for removable eyes on the full size portrait of pops in your room.

vanthaman

Steve Jobs has put a bid in and is going to rename the country iLand

Eyepopper

As long as you don't mind sharing with the missus Liv... oh, and the cameras.

Eyepopper

God no, what do you think this is? Capitalism?

golden_blunder

GB likes this

PJ

Ireland is a bigger consumer of UK goods than China, india, Brazil and some random country I forget, according to the radio this morning, you kinda need them.

Single European currency ftw btw.

Flying Fox

Banking on a free mac then GB?

Wonder Pigeon

Don't worry lads, we've got it all under control...

Minister and priest say pray for economy - The Irish Times - Mon, Nov 22, 2010

Flying Fox

I like that. Palm it off to the guy higher up the food chain.

Wonder Pigeon

The ultimate bail out, if you will.

Flying Fox

The collateral/terms must have been ridiculous.