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26th January 2011, 11:13
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#121 (permalink) |
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Reserve Team Player
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Egypt
Posts: 2,263
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Yesterday's protests were neither organized by the Muslim Brotherhood nor did they participate.
As regards different attitudes towards Israel, how about Israel doing something right for a change.. Persistence of the status quo is impossible |
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26th January 2011, 11:23
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#122 (permalink) | |
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Mighty Mouse
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Cuntastine
Posts: 2,555
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Until profound, fundamental change occurs in the Arab world - hopefully what we are seeing now - Israel must wait until it has true democratic partners to deal with. Democracies, rarely, if ever, go to war with each other. |
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26th January 2011, 12:32
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#123 (permalink) | |
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Banned
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Dromund Kaas
Posts: 12,843
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26th January 2011, 13:17
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#125 (permalink) |
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Its Baltic!
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: RS
Posts: 10,694
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Imagining the Israeli-Palestinian Borders
West Bank Map
Plus more elaborate and extremely detailed maps regarding land swaps. The Geneva and Triangle land swaps are interesting as the Palestinian territory seems to expand but I cant see what Israel gets in return. Publications |
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26th January 2011, 13:47
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#126 (permalink) |
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Banned
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Dromund Kaas
Posts: 12,843
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Mihaj, that Washington Institute institute think-tank was established by AIPAC. It's one of the most blatant tools of Israeli propaganda, so I'd take which ever 'information' they relay with a pinch of salt.
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26th January 2011, 13:59
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#127 (permalink) | |
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Mighty Mouse
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Cuntastine
Posts: 2,555
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If secular democracy ever truly takes hold - including a separation between mosque and state - then I'm willing to bet that any 'hatred' of Israel would evaporate too, exposing the whole spat as a regime driven diversion in the first place. These protest say as much. There's only so long you can suppress a people, and hiding behind Israeli 'evil' will only last so long. I really really hope that this leads to change. |
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26th January 2011, 14:00
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#128 (permalink) | |
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Mighty Mouse
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Cuntastine
Posts: 2,555
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Me being the most blatant 
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26th January 2011, 14:07
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#129 (permalink) | |
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Banned
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Dromund Kaas
Posts: 12,843
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You also have to remember that Israel was fighting secular Arab states in the 67 and 73, and Nasser - the leader of the secular Pan-Arab nationalist movement was a sworn enemy of Saudi Arabia. So I don't think the secular/religious distinction has anything to do with it. Again I'm going by general Arab opinion which deeply opposes Israel's current policies and status quo. That's not to say that the hypothetical new regimes would want war, but they would insist that there been deep, profound changes and will still most likely push for a Palestinian state. |
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26th January 2011, 15:04
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#130 (permalink) |
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First Team Sub
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 7,794
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The whole idea of an Arab brotherhood and support of a Palestinian state for the Palestinians by the Arab dictators is to shift vehemence against their own regimes onto Israel - this does not excuse Israel from its actions but in the Middle East nothing is at it seems.
You ask Saudis what would they want more - a democratic Saudi Arabia or a Palestine state - this goes for all countries in the ME and North Africa that are ruled by dictators. |
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26th January 2011, 18:32
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#132 (permalink) | |
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First Team Sub
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: LUHG
Posts: 9,289
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26th January 2011, 20:12
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#134 (permalink) |
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Reserve Team Player
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Egypt
Posts: 2,263
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FUCK FUCK FUCK>. Suez is burning. Live ammo for the first time and many dead. Chaos all over there..the people there are no more demanding political reform, it's about revenge. Things are out of control.. Police have been beaten and station on fire
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27th January 2011, 11:28
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#138 (permalink) | |
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Bites pillows thinking of John Terry
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: The day will happen whether or not you get up.
Posts: 10,457
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27th January 2011, 12:59
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#140 (permalink) | |
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السلام عليكم و رحمة الله و بركاته
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: It is better for a leader to make a mistake in forgiving than to make a mistake in punishing
Posts: 31,451
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27th January 2011, 13:07
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#141 (permalink) |
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Phones, soup, paint, chairs and computers are troubling.
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Where Albert Stubbins scored a diving header
Posts: 47,728
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A load of people just marched down my street singing, with green banners.
Unfortunately the banners were all in Arabic, literally every one, so I don't know what it was about. They were mostly children, veiled (but not burqa'd) women and what looked like intellectuals, plus a few clerics. |
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27th January 2011, 13:18
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#142 (permalink) | |
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Poster of the year 2008
 Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: "like a man in silk pyjamas shooting pigeons from a deckchair"
Posts: 59,498
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27th January 2011, 13:25
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#143 (permalink) |
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First Team Sub
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 7,794
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The US really doesn't know how to play this - they do not want protests in countries that are ruled by pro western dictators as the status quo suits them but they cannot object to these pro democracy protests as this is what they are promoting so they fudge the issue with qualifying their support.
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27th January 2011, 13:25
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#144 (permalink) | |
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Phones, soup, paint, chairs and computers are troubling.
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Where Albert Stubbins scored a diving header
Posts: 47,728
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27th January 2011, 13:28
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#145 (permalink) | |
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First Team Sub
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 7,794
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If someone wins a vote in a fair democratic manner then isn't this what democracy is about? Or are you saying democracy is only good when it results in a government we approve of? |
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27th January 2011, 17:01
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#146 (permalink) | |
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السلام عليكم و رحمة الله و بركاته
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: It is better for a leader to make a mistake in forgiving than to make a mistake in punishing
Posts: 31,451
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Even if some sort of democracy comes about after a free election, I'm not sure it will survive in the presence of long established systems. These people need to go, and the systems and authority have to be completely dismantled. We know what happens when long standing systems are broken up (Iraq, Afghanistan, and South Africa are recent examples). I also think democracy needs to be understood by those who come to power and more importantly by the voters. It's not as easy as just copying the West's model. The west has hundreds of years of experience, and trained minds. The Arab world is too tribal at present, and any changes will need to be gradual. I agree with your sentiment about the West being in a predicament. |
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27th January 2011, 17:14
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#147 (permalink) |
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Only poster to be named Poster of the Year twice
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Bangerang.net
Posts: 24,967
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This is all really fantastic (in spirit, obviously not in the inevitable spurts of violence). I hope it continues and the impetus that's started continues ... There's little more stirring than a population fighting together for it's rights.
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27th January 2011, 17:17
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#148 (permalink) | |
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First Team Sub
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 7,794
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27th January 2011, 17:22
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#149 (permalink) |
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Only poster to be named Poster of the Year twice
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Bangerang.net
Posts: 24,967
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Nonviolent revolution - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
..but I did say inevitable in this case..it's still undesirable really. |
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27th January 2011, 18:13
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#150 (permalink) |
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Believe
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Only around where Top Reds are!
Posts: 3,579
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Experience of the Brit journalist who was beaten up in Egypt by the state police...audio recording in link too..
Egypt protests: 'We ran a gauntlet of officers beating us with sticks' | World news | guardian.co.uk |
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27th January 2011, 21:53
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#156 (permalink) |
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Reserve Team Player
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Egypt
Posts: 2,263
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SMS services down. Mobile networks will all go down tomorrow probably. Social networking sites banned. Internet so slow
Words that Mubarak is damn angry at EL Adly (minister of interior) and that the police might fire live ammo at us tomorrow. They already did in Suez and Sinai and some of Sinai Bedouins responded with RPGs!!! Words also that Eladly might resign if Mubarak asks army to intervene. We don't know how the army will react. They are much stronger and powerful than in Tunisia and apparently they are loyal to Mubarak If the army fires at us..living is worth shit. pray for us. tomorrow is worrying . I am going down inshallah.. whatever happens. will happen |
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27th January 2011, 21:56
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#157 (permalink) | |
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السلام عليكم و رحمة الله و بركاته
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: It is better for a leader to make a mistake in forgiving than to make a mistake in punishing
Posts: 31,451
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May Allah SW protect you... |
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27th January 2011, 22:04
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#160 (permalink) | |
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Wants to be more like Top
 Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: RIP Sydney Youngblood, who died in a tragic go-karting accident in 2007. RIP my cat 2001-09. iRIP Steve Cunting Jobs
Posts: 42,368
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