UNIFIL finds Hezbollah arms cache in S. Lebanon, forced away

Ballache

it was the pro-government militias who started shooting at Hezbollah suporters who were protesting against the shite standart of living and how expensive everything is...this is not the first time it happens, it has happened on a couple of occasions before and resulted in the death of many innocent civillians. this time they didn't take it and started fighting back...oh BTW Hezbollah havn't used their millitia yet, the ones fighting are from the amal militia and some hezbollah supporters, if Hezbollah actually use their force they would take over everything in 12 hours...so if you are trying to show that Hezbollah are ''bad'' you chose a wrong example, as all they are doing now if fucking up Israel and Americas plans in Lebanon...and i hope they succeed

Plechazunga

I don't think they need help from Holyland for that... doing things like hijacking planes, attacking embassies, blowing up 85 people in a Jewish cultural centre... in fecking Argentina... seem to have done the trick.

holyland red

Sweet. What you are saying here is that a government shouldn't mess with people who are strong enough to defy it, and accept that these are building a military force stronger than the army, a telecommunication network independent of the national one and so on. Obviously, that faction has a right to open fire on neighbouring states, and drag the country to war.

That's insane really...you don't really grasp the idea of having a central government, do you?

holyland red

To be honest nothing bad can come out of this for Israel. Hizballah has condrolled Lebanon de facto for years. When it attacked Israel in 2006 the LABOBs of this world claimed that Israel should have retaliated againt the militia and not Lebanon. I think things will be more straight-forward for us next round.

Ballache

Hezbollah has the right to have weapons, acoording to this same government attacking them now

and you will also get fucked in the next round

holyland red

If democracy was ever going to work in the Arab world, you'd have thought Lebanon was the prime candidate for this breakthrough. The tribal, backward notion that political factions within a state should each have their "right" for an armed militia only highlights the ridiculously naive efforts of the US to bring democracy to the Arab world.

Good for you that you can comment on the situation from the relative safety of Europe, but if most Lebanese share your opinion then they certainly deserve what they're being and will be served.

Sultan

Where democracy appears to fit in well with security interests, let's promote democracy. Where democracy clashes with our self serving interests, it is downplayed, ignored, and more worryingly autocracy is propped up.

McLovin

Hizbollah had every right to have that communication network, and had every right to defend what is theirs.

If you had watched Nasrallah's speech two days ago you would have understood that the network they had wasn't illegal at all. The Government knew of it long before then also but didn't say a thing about until now. Hizbollah used that network in the war against Israel, the Government knew about it, and did fuck all.

The Government this time had it very wrong, they did a couple of things they shouldn't have done, they rushed decisions, and they tried to cut down a communication network which had every right to be there in the first place, and they also removed a high ranked Airport official from his job for no reason at all.

If you own a store that sells for $1000 a day, you don't go and mess with the rival store in front of you who sells for $1000000 a day, especially if you have no fucking good reason to do so.

Hizbollah could have taken Beirut by storm if they wanted too, they were agressed. They instead went it, and took control of some media outlets which were for the Pro gov parties and gave them back to the Army. Today, there's army everywhere, but that's it. It's much more peaceful.

If anything, these last few days have shown us how the Government is much more run like a Militia than Hizbollah will ever be.

I almost never side with Hizbollah's decisions and actions, but this time, they had every right to do what they did.

Hopefully, that's the most action we'll see around here this summer.

Sultan

Am I seeing a unifying theme for Hizbullah developing here from our Lebanese posters?

McLovin

They seem to know what they're doing much better than the Government. If anything it's the Government who's looking for trouble.

I think it's time they settle their differences on a table of discussion. Lebanon can't be run correctly only by one of the two..

Ballache

i said it before and i'll say it again, im not their biggest fan i support the free patriotic movement. but our government has taken it too far. ths was not the first time pro government militias shoot at demonstrators and Hezbollah lost some innocent young men in the process and did not do anything as they wanted to keep the situation under control and i respect them for that. but things went too far and they had to do something. we all know that nobody in Lebanon can beat them, even the army, and they havn't even used their millita yet, it their supporters and Amal fighting because if they did, as Nassrallah said, most of them would be either in jail or trying to leave the country.

it winds me up like fuck when people call them terrorists.

holyland red

I share your hope for restored peace and quiet in Lebanon and elsewhere in the region. However, going back to your analogy a state should have one "store", and should not be rivaled by competitors for communication, security services and so on.

Governments often rush decisions, and on more than one occasion these are stupid decisions. Democracy involves accepting those stupid decisions as a necessary evil, while having the opportunity to replace the administration in the next general elections given a better alternative. What you are implying, and that's how far you are from understanding democracy, is that rushed/stupid/bad political decisions are a good enough reason for armed militias to storm the streets. The muti-ethnic nature of the Lebanese society coupled with political concepts of this sort combine to a recipe for disaster.

The Lebanese government does not do anything because it's too weak to do anything whether it's the communication network or armed militias taking orderes from outside. It's a sad state of affairs which has no chance of changing unless you Lebanese realise that you deserve better, and by that I mean making decisions based on your interests and noe those of Damascus and Tehran. You don't have to like your neighbour from the South, but you have ne reason to take a battering just because Syria and Iran use Hizballah to attack Israel without being held responsible themselves.

Ballache

we do and i can assure you even if you lot manage to enter and occupy some of our country, it will be hell for your soldiers as not only Hezbollah will be fighting but most of us will join in to defend Lebanon so please the Israeilis are more than welcome to try...

holyland red

You summed up the Condy Rice school of thought here. I'm not a big fan, mind.

holyland red

Don't behave like a teenage internet-warrior. It's pretty damn clear that we can take Lebanon in 10 days, just as it's clear we'll suffer heavy losses on the way. Let's stop the testicle-waving right there.

The thing is that sometimes there is a clash between interests of neighbouring states, and such is the horrible human nature that countries go to wars (that often end with both sides losing while winning nowt). What I'm trying to say here is that Lebanon too often finds itself in wars they have no national interests in. Unfortunately, unless Lebanese are courageous enough to take responsibility over their country this isn't going to change, and I'm not sure how your testosteronic comment about killing Israelis comforts you.

holyland red

BTW, just back from Abd Al-Hadi sweets in downtown Haifa. The best baklawa this side of the border

McLovin

Fouad Siniora, the Prime Minister, just talked now. Didn't seem to come up with anything like a solution!

He should have resigned.

Sultan

Nor am I.

I find it hypocritical.

holyland red

Often looks like an honest man in a complicated situation he has no idea how to deal with. It was really sad to see him crying in that 2006 press conference- crying for his country being drawn into a war which had nothing to do with most Lebanese, yet they paid the heaviest price.

holyland red

What's a tiny clash of civilisations when we can agree on Condy Rice and the football?

McLovin

Good man - shouldn't be Prime Minister anymore though.

McLovin

Holyland and Sults agreeing in the Current Events forum

holyland red

He does look weak and not suitable for the job. Ironically, he'd be an ideal PM if most Lebanese were willing to follow orders from Damascus. His weakness is exposed when he represents the Lebanese who are interested in finally rise to the challenge of having their say in how their country is run.

As for stepping down, and considering the presidential debacle, I worry the worst for your country if it went to general elections in the event of Siniora's resignation.

Ballache

it took you 33 days to take 3 villages in the south, what makes you think you can take the whole country in 10 days. this is Lebanon not Iraq or Palestine for that matter. even if you do, that's where the problem will start as your soldiers would be under daily attacks.

Ballache

he's a fucking thief, but i heard he is a brilliant economist

Plechazunga

Crap argument, Iraq had a far bigger and better-equipped army than Hizbollah or Lebanon, especially in '91. The difference is Iraq got invaded by a fecking superpower, not that they were incapable of defending themselves.

But anyway, tell us more about how invincible your beloved army of fundamentalist racist fruitcakes is.