Hargreaves - one signing too many?

Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber · 7th February 2008, 08:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sultan

...........
I go to Old Trafford to be entertained, and before someone says success, the past 2 decades have bought just that by playing 4-4-2...
...........

Do you really think you can't get entertained when United are playing another system?

In 2003 when we won the league title back from Arsenal, did United bore you?

Sultan · 7th February 2008, 09:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber

Do you really think you can't get entertained when United are playing another system?

In 2003 when we won the league title back from Arsenal, did United bore you?

Not compared to playing 4-4-2.

United play a fluid system at present, which has been mostly very good. Some of the worst games this year and in the past few seasons, especially away in Europe have been when United have played a rigid 4-3-3.

Ekeke · 7th February 2008, 09:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnno

Whilst officially Gattuso plays on the right, he is by no means a right-winger of any sorts, and by the same token, therefore Ambrosini or Seedorf who on the left are not wingers either, Milan play with a very regimental system in the midfield with Kaka being allowe to roam free with Gattuso, Ambrosini, Seedorf and Pirlo there to protect him if the attacks are broken down.
Chelsea began this system too, with Makalele, Essien and Mikel although they seem to be reverting to a more classic formation with the re-emergence of Wright-Phillips and Cole/Malouda.

This is exactly my point. It's a formation that helps the defensive midfielder and defends as a team.

I'm sure if we played it, Hargreaves would be good enough. But we dont play that formation and we won't play it regularly. So people need to stop comparing him to players who play in different formations. He is not Gattuso, he is not Makelele, we are not AC Milan, we aren't Chelsea.

We play a 442 and in that formation, an Owen Hargreaves needs to protect the back four and be good enough on the ball not to slow down our moves with his touches and to keep the ball with his passes. He's proven mostly capable of that recently.

Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber · 7th February 2008, 10:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sultan

Not compared to playing 4-4-2.

United play a fluid system at present, which has been mostly very good. Some of the worst games this year and in the past few seasons, especially away in Europe have been when United have played a rigid 4-3-3.

Fair enough. Everyone has what he likes. I just believe United have ever played a 4-4-2 game more entertaining better than what we did to Newcastle with 4-2-3-1 in 2003 (6-2) and the 7-1 Roma thrashing.

Truth be told though, rigid 4-3-3 is generally bull and dead dour in entertainment terms. Even Barca and Ajax..the main 4-3-3 users around.. don't play that way. I prefer a fluid formation like a 4-2-3-1 that gives you the best, 4-4-2, 4-3-3 and 4-5-1 can offer. When whenever we've played it, it has worked wonders. For me it should be that for tough matches and European games with 4-4-2 for everything else. If Saha wasn't so i jury prone we would be doing that. I think we are currently one forward short of staying in such a mode.

Wes · 7th February 2008, 10:16

I'm pretty sure Ajax play 4-3-3

Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber · 7th February 2008, 10:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by WesBrownIsAGod

I'm pretty sure Ajax play 4-3-3

Obviously. But it ain't rigid like Chelsea's, the bollocks we tried to replicate vs Milan most of the time. Which was my point. It's fluid like Barca's

Nucks · 7th February 2008, 20:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by WesBrownIsAGod

Still think it'll be Hargreaves, Carrick and Anderson in a midfield three. Hargreaves can't really play in a two, you suggest that we should always be going forward, not always possible in games, by him doing that he leaves us open, 3 is more solid, and has everything. Its been coming for a few years, lads.

That is very possible. I am working on the assumption that we will stick with a traditional 4-4-2 but who knows. Fergie does seem to want to make a 4-3-3 work.

IBleedRed · 16th April 2008, 20:52

hehe this thread amuses me even more now

noodlehair · 16th April 2008, 20:55

How many of these fecking Hargreaves threads are there?

ralphie88 · 16th April 2008, 21:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by noodlehair

How many of these fecking Hargreaves threads are there?

I blame the mods.

noodlehair · 16th April 2008, 21:21

I blame the Chief. He's got about 500 posts in each one

ralphie88 · 16th April 2008, 21:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by noodlehair

I blame the Chief. He's got about 500 posts in each one

As I said, I blame the Mods.

Sultan · 16th April 2008, 21:30

This all kicked off when noods called Hargreaves 'pointless'.

I blame noods.

noodlehair · 16th April 2008, 21:30

The Chief's not a mod

Sam#1 · 16th April 2008, 21:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by noodlehair

The Chief's not a mod

Thank God!

noodlehair · 16th April 2008, 21:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Plechazunga

if only Carrick and Hargreaves could be stapled together in some way, without UEFA noticing

Quote:

Originally Posted by noodlehair

It might work out the other way though, and we'd end up with "Michael Owen"

i.e. A permanently crippled English bloke with no personality

That's probably my most sensible contribution to any of these threads

Sultan · 16th April 2008, 21:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by noodlehair

That's probably my most sensible contribution to any of these threads

I missed this classic.

ralphie88 · 16th April 2008, 21:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by noodlehair

The Chief's not a mod

I can't get anything past you tonight can I?

I'm aware he's not. But some fucker promoted him!

Wes · 16th April 2008, 22:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wes

I've posted this before:

front six
--------------Carrick----------------
------Hargreaves---Anderson--------
Ronaldo-----------------------------
------------Rooney----Tevez--------

nice looking back seeing how right i was. good dig.

Kelvin · 16th April 2008, 23:08

he scored the winner against arsenal.

ralphie88 · 17th April 2008, 00:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sultan

I go to Old Trafford to be entertained, and before someone says success, the past 2 decades have bought just that by playing 4-4-2...

I hope you go to Old Trafford to do more than just sit back and "be entertained" Sultan. It's not the fucking opera mate.

John the Writer · 17th April 2008, 01:27

Shit thread.

Alex · 17th April 2008, 01:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kelvin

he scored the winner against arsenal.

And it was a god damn beauty. "Brilliant!"

Wittmann45 · 17th April 2008, 01:31

Hey, the whole 'insert name' flop thing always seems to work as of late

Sultan · 17th April 2008, 01:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by ralphie88

I hope you go to Old Trafford to do more than just sit back and "be entertained" Sultan. It's not the fucking opera mate.

Not always mate, results do matter. But I hate safety first style football. There's nothing more exciting than an open and passionate game. We can't always have these games, but I'm happy with a majority.

I fell in love with United because of it's footballing philosophy of entertaining football during the Busby days.

Wibble · 17th April 2008, 01:52

Formations

surf · 17th April 2008, 01:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sultan

Not always mate, results do matter. But I hate safety first style football. There's nothing more exciting than an open and passionate game. We can't always have these games, but I'm happy with a majority.

I fell in love with United because of it's footballing philosophy of entertaining football during the Busby days.

Also there's no advantage to safety first football when you get 3 points for a win and only one for a draw. United are top because they have won most and drawn fewest matches - he who dares wins, as Del Boy would say.

Raven_Blade · 17th April 2008, 02:41

Shit thread. Hargreaves was signed to do exactly what he is doing now and more.

Lizard King · 17th April 2008, 07:31

I thought he was bought to play in front of the defence, not on the right

Julian Denny · 17th April 2008, 07:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lizard King

I thought he was bought to play in front of the defence, not on the right

That's right. I think Fergie might be turning him into a sort of play

7th February 2008, 10:16	#1365 (permalink)
Wes Brown is no God Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Dublin, in the Irish Republic Posts: 7,710	I'm pretty sure Ajax play 4-3-3

16th April 2008, 20:52	#1368 (permalink)
IBleedRed likes to use pantyhose Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: apparently uses the term "limey" too much Posts: 4,227	hehe this thread amuses me even more now

16th April 2008, 20:55	#1369 (permalink)
noodlehair Giggsy Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems just with potatoes. Posts: 31,503	How many of these fecking Hargreaves threads are there?

16th April 2008, 21:21	#1371 (permalink)
noodlehair Giggsy Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems just with potatoes. Posts: 31,503	I blame the Chief. He's got about 500 posts in each one

16th April 2008, 21:30	#1373 (permalink)
Sultan Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Uneasy lies the head that wears a crown Posts: 16,272	This all kicked off when noods called Hargreaves 'pointless'. I blame noods.

16th April 2008, 21:30	#1374 (permalink)
noodlehair Giggsy Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems just with potatoes. Posts: 31,503	The Chief's not a mod

16th April 2008, 23:08	#1380 (permalink)
Kelvin First Team Sub Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 9,630	he scored the winner against arsenal.

17th April 2008, 01:27	#1382 (permalink)
John the Writer Banned Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: The back of the classroom Posts: 730	Shit thread.

17th April 2008, 01:31	#1384 (permalink)
Wittmann45 Reserve Team Player Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: In my S04 Posts: 2,364	Hey, the whole 'insert name' flop thing always seems to work as of late

17th April 2008, 01:52	#1386 (permalink)
Wibble Teeth like a reindeer. Hung like a horse. Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Ingadus Speramus Posts: 34,680	Formations

17th April 2008, 02:41	#1388 (permalink)
Raven_Blade Attention Whoring Common Crow Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Man Utd Will Never Die! Posts: 17,184	Shit thread. Hargreaves was signed to do exactly what he is doing now and more.

17th April 2008, 07:31	#1389 (permalink)
Lizard King Join Date: May 2007 Location: Manchester Posts: 12,295	I thought he was bought to play in front of the defence, not on the right