Paul Scholes is back

Varun_Utd

Wingers being in diabolical form didnt help him but both Ando and Clev should be ahead of him in the pecking order now. A Carrick Scholes CM pairing with our wingers in this kind of form is not going to work.

Randall Flagg

He was poor no arguments. But he helped get us back into the game.

He needs to be in a 3 away from home. He is good enough to be accomadated

Jimy_Hills_Chin

He didn't play that badly, it is just the system that we play when he is in the team, and in that formation. It is predictable as hell and Villa's game plan was designed to exploit it. They let us have the ball and when it inevitably ended up at Valencia's feet they had two men snuffing out his crosses, which were appalling when they actually were delivered into the box. They proceeded to counter attack us, on a few occasions, we saw our centre midfielders huffing and puffing to get back as Villa headed towards our goal.

kps88

Maybe leaving him out completely for four consecutive games for no particular reason was why he played the way he did. Was natural that he looked a bit off the pace.

Brightonian

Even with our wingers in form I just don't think having a midfielder whose only job is to receive it and curl it out to them is viable any more. Honestly, Rooney does that as consistently as Scholes these days anyway.

bosnian_red

I would think the reason was that we play better with Anderson or Cleverley in there, as they are much more mobile. In my opinion, he should be fourth choice in midfield now, behind Carrick, Anderson and Cleverley. He's still a fantastic passer as he showed today but he is a liability defensively and our whole team is way to static with him in the team.

TheGame

Scholes at the moment is great to bring on when you are leading and you want to keep the ball however from the start more urgency is required and we need ando or clev starting.

Fergus' son

That's not his only job, he contributes more than that. Atleast be fair.

marjen

Today, he actually nullified even that plus side of his game due to taking an absolute age before releasing the ball.

The point of switching the ball out wide is create space for the winger to do something. If you show every man on the pitch where you're going to play it for 4 or 5 touches then pings it out, the winger has about half a second to simultaneously control the ball and flick it past the full back, or else he's flattened.

Apart from his pass for Hernandez, every part of his game was atrocious today. It's just not acceptable with that level of performance if you're gonna play for United. If Anderson had played like that, he would've been fucking sold.

kps88

People saying he should never start again are getting carried away. Today was just a case of him being off the pace because he hasn't played in ages; and even then he could have easily won us the game if Valencia was in form. He's still more than capable of running games for us.

Fergus' son

I'm not sure I'll be able to convince you otherwise but there are some massive exaggerations in that post.

F-Red

Shouldnt have been started this evening

marjen

He needs to at least look like he's vaguely trying to do anything other than act as a cone whenever another team gets the ball. Particularly if you're the one who just passed them the fecking thing.

He can't run shit against any half-decent team in a two-man midfield anymore. It's apparent. Today was the worst I've seen him play ever, I'm quite sure.

Fergus' son

Yeah, I thought he looked rusty more than anything, nothing as damning as it is being made out.

Maciek

It's easy after the game, isn't it?

marjen

Yeah. Problem is, I called it an hour before the game when I saw the lineup.

Against any remotely half-decent footballing side, we would've been hammered today.

simonhch

Scholes, at this stage of his career, is a bit of a luxury player. Technically superb obviously, but he leaves us with a soft center because he just isn't mobile enough anymore. I would really only play him in a three at this point. As part of a two man system, we are just inviting trouble.

I find it rather alarming that this mistake is getting repeated over and over again. It's a constant source of ire on the cafe and beyond, so it's perplexing in the extreme that the coaching team aren't drawing the same conclusions.

marjen

Did anyone catch the time when Vlaar basically walked the ball past him while he stood there doing nothing, leaving Villa in a 3 v 2-situation when we actually were numerously superior to begin with? That was unacceptable. I would haul him off at half-time for that alone.

Maciek

I can understand what you mean.

His last game was three weeks ago, we could expect him to play today, or next week, but Norwich away is a tricky game as well.

I thought he did well in the first half, but Young had a shocking game and Valencia couldn't cross the ball properly, we lacked any idea, but he wasn't that bad. Yes, he can do better, but I always smile when I see such posts after the final whistle when we really could expect a certain player to start the game.

marjen

He didn't do well in the first half. He lost the ball unnecesarilly under no pressure a couple of times, he took an age on the ball, and he just didn't do the very basics off the ball. He was atrocious, and I think that's about the worst I've seen of him.

The pass to Hernandez was brilliant, but bar a couple of decent trademark Scholes-passes out to a Valencia marked by two players because Scholes took an eternity to decide to play it, he was horrendous. He really was.

gbgary

more valuable as a late sub.

Devil may care

This surely is his last season, I'd rather we didn't expose him in that type of game again. we are basically down to ten men when we don't have the ball and Scholes is on, he simply cannot get back and Carrick doesn't have the engine to run for two. The best way to use Scholes now is the way we used him against Southampton.

gooDevil

106 passes in 72 minutes, his 92% accuracy was best among starters.

This is Paul Scholes on a bad day.

SharkyMcShark

I thought it would have been more prudent to leave him for next weeks game (given the international game midweek).

VP

Risky to start him at all, suicidal to put him in a midfield 2.

lysglimt

In the first half he was the worst player on the pitch - he was excellent after we went 2-0 down though. But he wasn't helped by the fact that our attacking players were lack-lustre before the break. When Hernandez started making runs, Scholes had someone to aim at and he improved

Platato

Just stop this nonsense. That shows nothing towards how off the pace he was. Carrick had 155 passes but half of them had any purpose. When Scholes has a bad day, it rarely has anything to do with his passing.

surf

Scholes-Carrick is good for keeping possession and weak at stopping opposition runners through the centre. Still think Scholes is better as a sub than a starter.

scholesy legend

Why is Fergie still starting Scholesy and Giggsy? Sometimes I ask this to myself. Does he know more about them than us all? Does he overestimated the experience factor? Is he treating them like youngstes and play them early on in the season to keep the regular first teamers fresh? Or even are they at fault for their bad performances and not the whole team's?

kouroux

He plays them because he loves and he feels extremely loyal towards them.He wants to give playing time as starters as some sort of reward for services rendered for their entire careers, look at it however you want, Giggs and Scholes should play in protective formations (4-3-3 or 4-5-1) and should not start matches anymore

Forevergiggs

If we have to play with of Scholes or Giggs they need to be combined with a mobile, tough tackling midfielder with solid defensive attributes. Unfortunately, we don't have that player. Carrick doesn't have the mobility to cover the gaping holes left by Scholes or Giggs when they start in a midfield two with him.

surf

That could be Jones ... in a year or two. Alas, not yet.

Dargonk

He didn't have a good games. Gave the ball away quite often and then we get killed on the counter as he doesn't have the legs to get back and track runs any more. Normally he keeps the ball far better than he did in the last game, which helps us control the game. But its situations like one of the villa goals, where he found himself out wide and gave the ball away cheaply only for villa to run through the massive hole in the centre while he struggles to get back and punish us, that cause so many problems.

Scholes still very much has a place in the team, but we need to be careful which teams we start him against, and who we have around him in the team. Playing both him and carrick against teams that can quickly counter attack is dangerous if either are having a bad game. I'd prefer a third body put in with them, or at least someone who has the energy to sprint back quickly and track runs for them.

gooDevil

That's not Fergie's MO, he's supposed to be ruthless with players who can't meet his high expectations.

Of course if he would break that habit for any two players it would be Scholes and Giggs, but I'm not convinced this is the reason.

gooDevil

I was just making the point that Schmeichel once made, that his worst game, his lowest level is better than anyone else's worst game or lowest level. Even when he's considered to have a terrible game by his standard he still leads the starters in pass efficiency and creates a goal.

just looking at the bright side.

Lynk

I thought his passing was good. We just aren't designed to have both him and Carrick playing in the center, it leaves massive gaps behind the back 4. The ideal model would be the one Juventus are using to suit Pirlo.

Tomuś

I'll stick to what I've been saying, he IS good enough to start games, just not coupled with Carrick only and not away from home against Villa-like side. He's got one year more in his locker than Giggs seems to have. Just wait for his good ninety minutes and this thread will look different. Just like it did after the Everton game. Anyway, we'll never learn.

Play him in a midfield three, or protect him more defensively. You'll only realise what you're missing when wingers (currently out of form) stop getting constant service.

Amar__

I agree, put him in midfield three and enjoy, he can play at least one more season(plus this season). It was ridiculous how many usefull balls he passed to Valencia, and he did nothing.

marjen

My main gripe with him was that all those balls to Valencia weren't that useful, because Scholes was off the pace and took an eternity to deliver them. Valencia was basically marked closely by two players whenever he got the ball.

Someone like Rooney excels at setting Valencia up in good positions 1 v 1 much higher up the pitch after drawing teams in centrally, because he takes up smart positions in behind the oppositions midfield. So we don't need to sacrifice Valencia's usefulness in order to play a functioning midfield I.E. one without Scholes.

Platato

I recognize that. Point being, I'd be surprised if no one knew that. This is Paul Scholes we're talking about.