Ronaldo- Does this change feelings...

Skelter · 5th September 2008, 13:03

We'll be able to judge his commitment when he plays, I for one believe it will be as strong as ever, he's a footballer and an egotistical one at that, he'll be compelled to play his best.

Plus the fact he's ahead of schedule in recovering for injury shows he's working hard to get back on the pitch. Some players would just sit around and take the pay check and not work to get back to fitness.

afrocentricity · 5th September 2008, 13:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by ecantona7

Those quotes are not new. He said those exact words right before the start of the season. The paper has just republished old quotes from a month ago.

True.

AdZzUtd · 5th September 2008, 13:11

I seem to remember Fergie saying he'll settle down now and enjoy his career here, I think the gaffers right. Viva Ronaldo

BAMSOLA · 5th September 2008, 13:16

The weather outside is fantastic why the hell would he want to move anyway, that boy needs he's head checked.

FlawlessThaw · 5th September 2008, 13:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Psmith

Ronaldo gave us good service in the first 3 years as well. Lot on here and media, make it out as if he was shit then and Ferguson completely transformed him. He was a pretty good player back then, definitely in the top 3 at Old Trafford.

He didn't handle the situation well at all. He was a cnut about it. In hindsight, it's a good thing I reckon. Imagine if he came out and said, 'I want to go to Madrid. Thanks for the memories. I want a fresh challenge etc.' We'd have been forced to sell him. Because he was so indecisive, SAF was able to sort it out.

There was a reason he seemed indecisive, he didn't want to burn any bridges in case Ferguson refused to budge. There is no telling if SAF would have been forced to sell if Ronaldo had made those statements, and there was always the threat (which I think was empty from SAF) that Ronaldo would be forced to play with the reserves hanging over.

Devils Advocate · 5th September 2008, 13:27

to be honest, i actually think ronaldo is one of the more intelligent and eloquent players in the game at the moment. i'd much rather he was honest with the fact that one day he wants to play in spain than forever say he doesnt only to turn round and fk off all of a sudden.

i think he was naive this summer but mainly as it was naive to think winning the european cup was mission accomplished at united in terms of cementing his place in the very elite of our club.

if he stayed for two more seasons then i think we'd have done very well out of the whole situation and he could leave with his head held high. that bullshit someone wrote about him being a cunt if he doesnt sign a new contract - idiot.

whatever happens, i'll associate ronaldo with moments like his back heel against villa but, due to the media manipulated world we now live in, lots of people are taking the warped moral high ground and criticising our most talented and entertaining player. who, as said above, i actually think speaks quite a bit of sense, certainly compared with the bullshit spouted by lampard and, particularly, adebayor this summer.

Devils Advocate · 5th September 2008, 13:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlawlessThaw

There was a reason he seemed indecisive, he didn't want to burn any bridges in case Ferguson refused to budge. There is no telling if SAF would have been forced to sell if Ronaldo had made those statements, and there was always the threat (which I think was empty from SAF) that Ronaldo would be forced to play with the reserves hanging over.

i disagree. if ronaldo had behaved as berbatov had, he'd be gone. if he was the twat that some people make him out to be, he'd have at least tried it, in which case i'd agree he's a nob. but i think you're presuming an awful lot about the relationship between ronaldo and ferguson, and also uniteds inner people as a whole. i think family are important to ronaldo and i think whats happened in the last 5 years has meant that wherever he goes in the future, he himself will feel bonded with the club in someway. interestingly, not in the way eric neccessarily was (with the fans) but with the staff (be they playing/coaching/other) of the club.

FlawlessThaw · 5th September 2008, 13:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Devils Advocate

whatever happens, i'll associate ronaldo with moments like his back heel against villa but, due to the media manipulated world we now live in, lots of people are taking the warped moral high ground and criticising our most talented and entertaining player. who, as said above, i actually think speaks quite a bit of sense, certainly compared with the bullshit spouted by lampard and, particularly, adebayor this summer.

So like Ronaldo you agree with Sepp Blatter?

FlawlessThaw · 5th September 2008, 13:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Devils Advocate

i disagree. if ronaldo had behaved as berbatov had, he'd be gone. if he was the twat that some people make him out to be, he'd have at least tried it, in which case i'd agree he's a nob. but i think you're presuming an awful lot about the relationship between ronaldo and ferguson, and also uniteds inner people as a whole. i think family are important to ronaldo and i think whats happened in the last 5 years has meant that wherever he goes in the future, he himself will feel bonded with the club in someway. interestingly, not in the way eric neccessarily was (with the fans) but with the staff (be they playing/coaching/other) of the club.

I do like how you are accusing me of presuming about Ronaldo's relationship with Ferguson. Then immediately make a presumption yourself!

Ronaldo may have felt like he had bonded with the club, yet he still continously pines to move away at such a young age when he has only given two years of good form.

lao · 5th September 2008, 13:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bilbo

Don't get me wrong, Madrid always deserve whats coming to them. They are a scumbag of a club. It still doesn't paint Robinho in a very good light though, and it illustrates the lengths that a player can go to if he want's out of a club. I don't think Ronaldo acted as badly.

We didn't use Ronaldo as bait to get Messi or Kaka either. You can't feel that wanted by the club if they're prepared to get rid of you in a cash exchange for a higher rated player. Would be humiliating to continue playing for a club that doesn't rate you.

Devils Advocate · 5th September 2008, 13:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlawlessThaw

So like Ronaldo you agree with Sepp Blatter?

not at all but it wasnt particularly in ronaldos interest to turn round and say 'i disagree' cos blatters view backed his desire to move to madrid. however, i dont think ronaldo saying that was the heresy its made out to be here. and it wasnt stupid or ineloquent for him to say it. it was wrong but then so was goebbels and he was a genius.

blatter, in his poisition, is a complete twat however on that point.

Devils Advocate · 5th September 2008, 13:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlawlessThaw

I do like how you are accusing me of presuming about Ronaldo's relationship with Ferguson. Then immediately make a presumption yourself!

Ronaldo may have felt like he had bonded with the club, yet he still continously pines to move away at such a young age when he has only given two years of good form.

yeah good point, i did kinda think that, but tbh either of us could be right and all im sayin is it isnt black and white and you cant say you know what ronaldos motives are.

ronaldo in uniteds shirt is strange cos it isnt the same as watching giggs or rooney, or even, dare i say, beckham (who to me was a red through and through and gets unfairly slagged off), in the sense that i've always had a feeling that he wouldnt ever be at united for life and that, its hard to put into words really, there's something a bit detached about him (hence i dont think his connection is so much with the public face of the club, ie the fans and stuff, but more a connection with the side of the club we seldom see).

as a sidenote, and to slightly contradict myself, on the point of beckham. i do think he is a true united fan and he was one of a team when playing with us (mainly cos he played, literally, with some of his best mates) but i remember thinkin in about 96 that scholes, nev, giggs and butt and neville would be here for life (or certainly not leave as a personal forward step) whereas becks was the only one who might move on. same with ronaldo and rooney. rooneys a lifer, ronaldo isnt. never thought otherwise.

FlawlessThaw · 5th September 2008, 13:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Devils Advocate

yeah good point, i did kinda think that, but tbh either of us could be right and all im sayin is it isnt black and white and you cant say you know what ronaldos motives are.

ronaldo in uniteds shirt is strange cos it isnt the same as watching giggs or rooney, or even, dare i say, beckham (who to me was a red through and through and gets unfairly slagged off), in the sense that i've always had a feeling that he wouldnt ever be at united for life and that, its hard to put into words really, there's something a bit detached about him (hence i dont think his connection is so much with the public face of the club, ie the fans and stuff, but more a connection with the side of the club we seldom see).

as a sidenote, and to slightly contradict myself, on the point of beckham. i do think he is a true united fan and he was one of a team when playing with us (mainly cos he played, literally, with some of his best mates) but i remember thinkin in about 96 that scholes, nev, giggs and butt and neville would be here for life (or certainly not leave as a personal forward step) whereas becks was the only one who might move on. same with ronaldo and rooney. rooneys a lifer, ronaldo isnt. never thought otherwise.

I never for once thought Ronaldo would be here for life. It would be a bit foolish to think so. But I did think he would be here for another two years as Ferguson had said. Then who knows, if he wanted to leave then he would have left as a United legend in my eyes.

Rob Bowman · 5th September 2008, 13:52

I think it is funny when a player does not meet expectations on the pitch we slate him and want him gone and dismiss any loyalty he professes. See Alan Smith's tenure before you dare disagree

.

Yet if a player plays well we want him to be ours and act indignate if he shows the slightest lack of loyalty.

I really think the fans are just as fickle as clearly we apply our standards when we want, not consitently

.

Devils Advocate · 5th September 2008, 13:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlawlessThaw

I never for once thought Ronaldo would be here for life. It would be a bit foolish to think so. But I did think he would be here for another two years as Ferguson had said. Then who knows, if he wanted to leave then he would have left as a United legend in my eyes.

he may well be yet, gonna be at least one more. i think he decided it would be time to leave a little prematurely, but i honestly dont think he's that much of a cunt or should be criticised overly. i dont particularly think he owes us anything so i wouldnt have hated him if he'd left. however, i agree he wouldnt have been a true united legend. a football legend maybe but i agree if he'd gone this summer he'd, for me, have been a level behind many players, including his predecessor in the number 7 shirt.

Devils Advocate · 5th September 2008, 13:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob Bowman

I think it is funny when a player does not meet expectations on the pitch we slate him and want him gone and dismiss any loyalty he professes. See Alan Smith's tenure before you dare disagree

.

Yet if a player plays well we want him to be ours and act indignate if he shows the slightest lack of loyalty.

I really think the fans are just as fickle as clearly we apply our standards when we want, not consitently

.

i often find myself agreeing with you rob, when i do my rare posts, and this is again the case. look at attitudes towards o shea and silvestre for example.

Virtuoso · 5th September 2008, 13:56

The silver lining from this summer will be that we now have a Cristiano Ronaldo on our hands with something to prove again on a personal level. For one reason or another, he seems to strive on people doubting him and even to an extent slagging him off - this season means a whole lot more to him personally now than it could have done without the whole summer saga as he clearly feels that he owes it to us fans to show how much he wants to play for this club and help us to further success. After a season like he had, winning all the personal accolades and the greatest prizes in world football with United - we've seen many players follow seasons like that with pretty mediocre ones (Kaká, Ronaldinho etc) but all that has happened could hopefully spark something even greater from Ronaldo this season.

I can't wait for him to return.

rotherham_red · 5th September 2008, 14:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bilbo

That's rubbish. He isn't using us as a stepping stone at all. The lad has a 'dream' (coming to hate this overused phrase - but I think in this case it has some merit) to play for Madrid. He hasn't just invented this idea to build up a move, he has said it from day one.

Who knows if he ever thought deep down that it would happen, but when they came calling and made such a massive play for him, its only natural that his head would have been turned. Madrid are the only club he would leave United for, I feel fairly confident about that.

So, if he went to say, Blackburn or Villa, would it still be regarded as him having a "dream". Of course it isnt! Look at the facts. He comes at 18 - A precocious, but unreliable young player, with little hope of playing week-in, week-out for Madrid at the time. 5 years later, he progresses and leaves JUST when he starts playing at a level expected of a world-class player! If he was hankering for a move three or four years down the line and not now, I would agree with your view that it was his dream, but the facts simply dont add up...

At the end of the day, he's a cunt, but he's our cunt (for a year)...

Ruben · 5th September 2008, 14:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob Bowman

I think it is funny when a player does not meet expectations on the pitch we slate him and want him gone and dismiss any loyalty he professes. See Alan Smith's tenure before you dare disagree

.

Yet if a player plays well we want him to be ours and act indignate if he shows the slightest lack of loyalty.

I really think the fans are just as fickle as clearly we apply our standards when we want, not consitently

.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Devils Advocate

i often find myself agreeing with you rob, when i do my rare posts, and this is again the case. look at attitudes towards o shea and silvestre for example.

To be fair, most of the posters on here thought it was a bit sad when Smithy left. There was one cunt in particular (Il Tulipo Nero) who badly wanted him gone, but most posters don`t want us to sell players. Richardson being the exception to the rule there.

And attitudes towards O`Shea and Silvestre are mostly exactly what it should be, an appreciation of them as squad players. There will be a few muppets who want players like that gone, but then again most of us are not like that. Silvestre got a lot of credit on here for his loyalty, and the service he gave us in his long time here.

The Ronaldo saga for me, is not a question of loyalty, I wouldn`t even use that term about him as it`s clear that his "dream" lies elsewhere. For me it`s the manner in which he went about with the whole thing, not only this year but a bit in the summer before and also in 2006.

It seems like everytime he travels out of England for a break, we have to put up with the way he drops a little hint here and there for the media to go wild with. He`s putting the club and supporters through a lot they haven`t asked for. And my guess is that it will happen again.

I know that many, perhaps most, disagree with all that, and everyones entitled to their opinion. For me though, the stuff I mentioned above, combined with the IMO arrogant attitude on the pitch at times and diving etc, just doesn`t make him my favourite player.

Not saying I hate him either, I probably nothing him.

Rob Bowman · 5th September 2008, 14:23

Don't get me wrong. I am sure Ronaldo could have handled it better, heck that is what the article is about- his own admission he handled it poorly.

Still I think we expect more loyalty from our stars than the squad players.

Ruben · 5th September 2008, 14:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob Bowman

Don't get me wrong. I am sure Ronaldo could have handled it better, heck that is what the article is about- his own admission he handled it poorly.

Still I think we expect more loyalty from our stars than the squad players.

True, but if I`m not mistaking that interview is the same as he gave when he made his "comeback" this summer. I wouldn`t be surprised if he didn`t even write it himself, but maybe that`s just me carrying a grudge.

We probably do expect a bit more from the star players, and it obviously feels worse when they leave. I do think we recognise all players fairly though, most of us anyway, you`ll always have muppets on an internet forum.

samabachan · 5th September 2008, 14:33

I certainly won't boo him but I won't be cheering when his name's read out. He's our player so I'll support him and that but I'd rather he'd been a bit more professional about asking for a move.

Devils Advocate · 5th September 2008, 14:35

nearly all the matchday threads contain a good percentage of posts laying into various players which is nauseating.

i dont really know what ronaldos supposed to do however. whats he supposed to say to relentless media questioning, he generally said he was happy here but that he wants to play for madrid and if they make an acceptable bid he'd like to go. it seems the only thing thatd keep united fans happy is if he said he was united through and through and he had no interest in going to real. if that was true then fine but we know it isnt and so does he so i have more respect for him that he's upfront with that rather than trying to come across better.

i just think a lot of people are suckers for how the media spins things. would you rather have ronaldo being like adebayor? i dont think he invited the medias obsession with the transfer this summer and he resolved issues in house with ferguson. you might argue that he could have turned round and said he wasnt leaving and he had no intention. however, as said above, he does want to play for madrid one day and he felt it was the right time to move so he'd be lying to everyone if he said otherwise. thankfully, he listened to ferguson and decided it was better for him to stay. even better, it wasnt against his will.

i just dont think he's wronged our club in the way many others do and i think his statements have generally made sense. personal opinion but i dont think he's a bullshitter. he loves himself, yes, but he has every right to and he's worked damn hard to achieve the things he has. i dont think there's any reason to doubt his feelings towards united either. same in a way as robbie keane leaving spurs for liverpool. you can fancy two birds at once so to speak.

samabachan · 5th September 2008, 14:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Devils Advocate

nearly all the matchday threads contain a good percentage of posts laying into various players which is nauseating.

i dont really know what ronaldos supposed to do however. whats he supposed to say to relentless media questioning, he generally said he was happy here but that he wants to play for madrid and if they make an acceptable bid he'd like to go. it seems the only thing thatd keep united fans happy is if he said he was united through and through and he had no interest in going to real. if that was true then fine but we know it isnt and so does he so i have more respect for him that he's upfront with that rather than trying to come across better.

i just think a lot of people are suckers for how the media spins things. would you rather have ronaldo being like adebayor? i dont think he invited the medias obsession with the transfer this summer and he resolved issues in house with ferguson. you might argue that he could have turned round and said he wasnt leaving and he had no intention. however, as said above, he does want to play for madrid one day and he felt it was the right time to move so he'd be lying to everyone if he said otherwise. thankfully, he listened to ferguson and decided it was better for him to stay. even better, it wasnt against his will.

i just dont think he's wronged our club in the way many others do and i think his statements have generally made sense. personal opinion but i dont think he's a bullshitter. he loves himself, yes, but he has every right to and he's worked damn hard to achieve the things he has. i dont think there's any reason to doubt his feelings towards united either. same in a way as robbie keane leaving spurs for liverpool. you can fancy two birds at once so to speak.

"I would like to play for Madrid but I feel I owe Sir Alex for turning me into the player I am today so I will talk to him about it and see where we stand."

As opposed to "Maybe, who can say? Only God knows. Yadda yadda."

Bilbo · 5th September 2008, 14:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rob Bowman

I think it is funny when a player does not meet expectations on the pitch we slate him and want him gone and dismiss any loyalty he professes. See Alan Smith's tenure before you dare disagree

.

Yet if a player plays well we want him to be ours and act indignate if he shows the slightest lack of loyalty.

I really think the fans are just as fickle as clearly we apply our standards when we want, not consitently

.

I agree entirely Rob. Most football fans expect far more loyalty from players than they are prepared to give out themselves.

Bilbo · 5th September 2008, 14:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by rotherham_red

So, if he went to say, Blackburn or Villa, would it still be regarded as him having a "dream". Of course it isnt! Look at the facts. He comes at 18 - A precocious, but unreliable young player, with little hope of playing week-in, week-out for Madrid at the time. 5 years later, he progresses and leaves JUST when he starts playing at a level expected of a world-class player! If he was hankering for a move three or four years down the line and not now, I would agree with your view that it was his dream, but the facts simply dont add up...

At the end of the day, he's a cunt, but he's our cunt (for a year)...

If he had long quoted that is was his dream to play for Blackburn one day, I don't see how the situation would have been any different.

Essentially, he worked his arse off to become the best in the world at his profession, thereby earning himself the possibility of a move to his dream destination? During which United also reaped the benefits of two trophy filled seasons in which he was the main player (deservedly so, for the role we played in his development).

Sounds like a person to be admired, not attacked.

Unfortunately, you have issues with him because it hasn't happened in a timescale that you deem to be acceptable? Sometimes, people need to remove emotion from a situation and look at the bigger picture.

5th September 2008, 13:03	#41 (permalink)
Skelter Reserve Team Player Join Date: May 2008 Location: Lancashire Posts: 1,915	We'll be able to judge his commitment when he plays, I for one believe it will be as strong as ever, he's a footballer and an egotistical one at that, he'll be compelled to play his best. Plus the fact he's ahead of schedule in recovering for injury shows he's working hard to get back on the pitch. Some players would just sit around and take the pay check and not work to get back to fitness.

5th September 2008, 13:11	#43 (permalink)
AdZzUtd Reserve Team Player Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Nepal - Goat Mountain Posts: 2,198	I seem to remember Fergie saying he'll settle down now and enjoy his career here, I think the gaffers right. Viva Ronaldo

5th September 2008, 13:16	#44 (permalink)
BAMSOLA Has issues! Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: What?!!!!!! Are you wearing a F***ing wire?!!!!!!! Posts: 3,123	The weather outside is fantastic why the hell would he want to move anyway, that boy needs he's head checked.

5th September 2008, 13:27	#46 (permalink)
Devils Advocate Youth Team Player Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 378	to be honest, i actually think ronaldo is one of the more intelligent and eloquent players in the game at the moment. i'd much rather he was honest with the fact that one day he wants to play in spain than forever say he doesnt only to turn round and fk off all of a sudden. i think he was naive this summer but mainly as it was naive to think winning the european cup was mission accomplished at united in terms of cementing his place in the very elite of our club. if he stayed for two more seasons then i think we'd have done very well out of the whole situation and he could leave with his head held high. that bullshit someone wrote about him being a cunt if he doesnt sign a new contract - idiot. whatever happens, i'll associate ronaldo with moments like his back heel against villa but, due to the media manipulated world we now live in, lots of people are taking the warped moral high ground and criticising our most talented and entertaining player. who, as said above, i actually think speaks quite a bit of sense, certainly compared with the bullshit spouted by lampard and, particularly, adebayor this summer.

5th September 2008, 13:52	#54 (permalink)
Rob Bowman Reserve Team Player Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 1,812	I think it is funny when a player does not meet expectations on the pitch we slate him and want him gone and dismiss any loyalty he professes. See Alan Smith's tenure before you dare disagree . Yet if a player plays well we want him to be ours and act indignate if he shows the slightest lack of loyalty. I really think the fans are just as fickle as clearly we apply our standards when we want, not consitently .

5th September 2008, 13:56	#57 (permalink)
Virtuoso Reserve Team Player Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: London, England Posts: 637	The silver lining from this summer will be that we now have a Cristiano Ronaldo on our hands with something to prove again on a personal level. For one reason or another, he seems to strive on people doubting him and even to an extent slagging him off - this season means a whole lot more to him personally now than it could have done without the whole summer saga as he clearly feels that he owes it to us fans to show how much he wants to play for this club and help us to further success. After a season like he had, winning all the personal accolades and the greatest prizes in world football with United - we've seen many players follow seasons like that with pretty mediocre ones (Kaká, Ronaldinho etc) but all that has happened could hopefully spark something even greater from Ronaldo this season. I can't wait for him to return.

5th September 2008, 14:23	#60 (permalink)
Rob Bowman Reserve Team Player Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 1,812	Don't get me wrong. I am sure Ronaldo could have handled it better, heck that is what the article is about- his own admission he handled it poorly. Still I think we expect more loyalty from our stars than the squad players.

5th September 2008, 14:33	#62 (permalink)
samabachan Cockface McSticklebrick Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: He plays on the left, he plays on the riiiiiiiight, our boy Ronaldo made you look shite. Posts: 4,252	I certainly won't boo him but I won't be cheering when his name's read out. He's our player so I'll support him and that but I'd rather he'd been a bit more professional about asking for a move.

5th September 2008, 14:35	#63 (permalink)
Devils Advocate Youth Team Player Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 378	nearly all the matchday threads contain a good percentage of posts laying into various players which is nauseating. i dont really know what ronaldos supposed to do however. whats he supposed to say to relentless media questioning, he generally said he was happy here but that he wants to play for madrid and if they make an acceptable bid he'd like to go. it seems the only thing thatd keep united fans happy is if he said he was united through and through and he had no interest in going to real. if that was true then fine but we know it isnt and so does he so i have more respect for him that he's upfront with that rather than trying to come across better. i just think a lot of people are suckers for how the media spins things. would you rather have ronaldo being like adebayor? i dont think he invited the medias obsession with the transfer this summer and he resolved issues in house with ferguson. you might argue that he could have turned round and said he wasnt leaving and he had no intention. however, as said above, he does want to play for madrid one day and he felt it was the right time to move so he'd be lying to everyone if he said otherwise. thankfully, he listened to ferguson and decided it was better for him to stay. even better, it wasnt against his will. i just dont think he's wronged our club in the way many others do and i think his statements have generally made sense. personal opinion but i dont think he's a bullshitter. he loves himself, yes, but he has every right to and he's worked damn hard to achieve the things he has. i dont think there's any reason to doubt his feelings towards united either. same in a way as robbie keane leaving spurs for liverpool. you can fancy two birds at once so to speak.