Scholes defensive ability

reelworld · 19th August 2008, 19:00

Massively underrated.

The only thing he can't do is sliding tackle. But defensive skill is much more than just about that. His excellent positional sense means he can intercept passes, and closing down space available for opposition players. That's even less risky than tackling and both ends up with the ball in our possession.

Reading people posts around here, one would think that he was absolutely hapless. You can't play in midfield for Manchester United when you can't defend. Too much emphasis being put in sliding tackles, as in that's the only defensive skill worth having. It's fecking not.

Raven_Blade · 19th August 2008, 19:01

A great tackle takes perfect timing but unfortunately Scholes is sometimes a bit late.

reelworld · 19th August 2008, 19:03

Yeah, but he can won the ball in a few different ways. All I'm saying when I read people said that Scholes can't defend, they usually put it because he can't tackle. That's just so wrong

vijay · 19th August 2008, 19:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by reelworld

Massively underrated.

The only thing he can't do is sliding tackle. But defensive skill is much more than just about that. His excellent positional sense means he can intercept passes, and closing down space available for opposition players. That's even less risky than tackling and both ends up with the ball in our possession.

Reading people posts around here, one would think that he was absolutely hapless. You can't play in midfield for Manchester United when you can't defend. Too much emphasis being put in sliding tackles, as in that's the only defensive skill worth having. It's fecking not.

Scholes cannot defend but he has all essential skills to mark a player and run any midfield

The only English footballer who is the real Enganche, Number 10!

Rating a creative footballer on defensive skills is the worst aspect of English football, the reason they were unable to produce a player on the calibre of Zidane or a Riquelme.

Even the real talented ones from Hoddle, Le Tissier to Scholes all get underrated thanks to a jingioustic media and their obsession towards 4-4-2 and lump it up techniques.

Raven_Blade · 19th August 2008, 19:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by reelworld

Yeah, but he can won the ball in a few different ways. All I'm saying when I read people said that Scholes can't defend, they usually put it because he can't tackle. That's just so wrong

Point taken. He intercepts and anticipates very well. If he improved his timing and didnt go in so aggressive then there would be no problem.

iPete · 19th August 2008, 19:14

In his last if not one of tournaments for England, he was the impressive defensively of all the midfielders. Remember a game where he looked like the only one on the pitch

RedDevilCanuck · 19th August 2008, 19:23

not a good tackler but very good defensively. Great positioning and tracking back. You dont believe me? Watch the first leg at Nou Camp.

Trippin_Stoned · 19th August 2008, 19:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by reelworld

Massively underrated.

The only thing he can't do is sliding tackle. But defensive skill is much more than just about that. His excellent positional sense means he can intercept passes, and closing down space available for opposition players. That's even less risky than tackling and both ends up with the ball in our possession.

Reading people posts around here, one would think that he was absolutely hapless. You can't play in midfield for Manchester United when you can't defend. Too much emphasis being put in sliding tackles, as in that's the only defensive skill worth having. It's fecking not.

Totally agree. Massively underrated with regards to defensive ability. I'm fairly sure he kicks folk on purpose half the time anyway

Doevle · 19th August 2008, 19:33

Our semi-final versus Barcelona at Camp Nou last season was proof of Scholesys defensive ability.

Younited.7 · 19th August 2008, 19:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by reelworld

Massively underrated.

The only thing he can't do is sliding tackle. But defensive skill is much more than just about that. His excellent positional sense means he can intercept passes, and closing down space available for opposition players. That's even less risky than tackling and both ends up with the ball in our possession.

Reading people posts around here, one would think that he was absolutely hapless. You can't play in midfield for Manchester United when you can't defend. Too much emphasis being put in sliding tackles, as in that's the only defensive skill worth having. It's fecking not.

His positional sense is fantastic.

He is not the best at timing his challenges, but his defensive abilities would be flattered if he was 4-5 inches taller and was a bit stronger, we know he has a fantastic nod.

Castolo · 19th August 2008, 19:55

He's a nibbly little customer, always nicking the ball off the opposition. It must be very annoying to play against him. I'd probably end up smacking the bugger.

Rowem · 19th August 2008, 20:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by vijay

Scholes cannot defend but he has all essential skills to mark a player and run any midfield

The only English footballer who is the real Enganche, Number 10!

Rating a creative footballer on defensive skills is the worst aspect of English football, the reason they were unable to produce a player on the calibre of Zidane or a Riquelme.

Even the real talented ones from Hoddle, Le Tissier to Scholes all get underrated thanks to a jingioustic media and their obsession towards 4-4-2 and lump it up techniques.

I agree somewhat, however United play in the Premier League and so we have to focus on these things due to the physicality of the league. It is a massive boost for us that our creative players like Tevez and Scholes are able to defend as well. And not just in terms of getting stuck in, but having the brains to counter act against physical sides, i.e positional sense. Scholes has fantastic awareness of space, both when attacking and defending.

And to be honest, Scholes wasn't as effective when played behind v.Nistelrooy in a 4411 formation despite having extra attacking license. Scholes is fantastic at controlling a game from the middle of the pitch when played in slightly deeper, not just in and around the box. His positional sense and work rate enable him to control the midfield even at his age now.

Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber · 19th August 2008, 20:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by reelworld

Massively underrated.

The only thing he can't do is sliding tackle. But defensive skill is much more than just about that. His excellent positional sense means he can intercept passes, and closing down space available for opposition players. That's even less risky than tackling and both ends up with the ball in our possession.

Reading people posts around here, one would think that he was absolutely hapless. You can't play in midfield for Manchester United when you can't defend. Too much emphasis being put in sliding tackles, as in that's the only defensive skill worth having. It's fecking not.

Don't mix positional sense with defensive ability. Scholes has a very weak defensive game. A strikes defensive game infact. Too erratic. He also isn't even a regular interceptor of passes as you seem to believe. That isnt' a statement of underrating either but the truth. However he is good at helping keep the teams shape due to his positional sense. Thus, He helps out by being an extra body in defensive positions. Which is very useful. So he is not really hapless. That is why he has always thrived in United's midfield.

Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber · 19th August 2008, 20:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by vijay

Scholes cannot defend but he has all essential skills to mark a player and run any midfield

The only English footballer who is the real Enganche, Number 10!

Rating a creative footballer on defensive skills is the worst aspect of English football, the reason they were unable to produce a player on the calibre of Zidane or a Riquelme.

Even the real talented ones from Hoddle, Le Tissier to Scholes all get underrated thanks to a jingioustic media and their obsession towards 4-4-2 and lump it up techniques.

Agreed

Name Changed · 19th August 2008, 20:20

Part of a players defensive ability is the ability to make space for themselves or others in tight situations when they are under pressure. Scholes is the master of that. That in itself makes him pretty good defensively. He simply can't tackle.

vijay · 19th August 2008, 20:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rowem

And to be honest, Scholes wasn't as effective when played behind v.Nistelrooy in a 4411 formation despite having extra attacking license. Scholes is fantastic at controlling a game from the middle of the pitch when played in slightly deeper, not just in and around the box. His positional sense and work rate enable him to control the midfield even at his age now.

Scholes had a great season when he played in the free role beind Ruud and was our second highest scorer. Withdrawn forwards like Baggio or Bergkamp even if drifted out for longer periods without getting any where near ball usually create some thing whenever they touch the ball. Scholes a far more busier player gets lost. Apart from that as an attackin midfielder there is no glitch in his playing style.

The greatest and the most consistent passer I've seen at United in my life as a supporter...Beckham and Veron not far behind though.

Sylar · 19th August 2008, 20:38

Scholes is an awesome defender if you think about it. He manages to stop so many counter attacks and more often than not he gets away with it.

Genius.

Mozza · 19th August 2008, 20:46

It's not his tackling that is the problem, he can't run, he's been helped immensely by the control we have over possession and territory since Carrick signed, he'd be exposed without that

Justin · 20th August 2008, 07:39

He should take a chapter from Pirlo's defending. Just go for the smart intercepts, plug the gaps in midfield and don't go for the big tackles. But then again, the tackle without thinking is his way of staying involved in the game...

Dippersripper · 20th August 2008, 07:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rowem

I agree somewhat, however United play in the Premier League and so we have to focus on these things due to the physicality of the league. It is a massive boost for us that our creative players like Tevez and Scholes are able to defend as well. And not just in terms of getting stuck in, but having the brains to counter act against physical sides, i.e positional sense. Scholes has fantastic awareness of space, both when attacking and defending.

And to be honest, Scholes wasn't as effective when played behind v.Nistelrooy in a 4411 formation despite having extra attacking license. Scholes is fantastic at controlling a game from the middle of the pitch when played in slightly deeper, not just in and around the box. His positional sense and work rate enable him to control the midfield even at his age now.

You must be kidding. We played some of the best attacking football with Scholes behind Ruud around 2001-03, dare I say better than last season.

Dippersripper · 20th August 2008, 07:50

We just need bodies in our own half to deny the opposition any space. Whether they can defend or not is a secondary problem for an attacking midfielder. He should just try close down opposition players and that is what Scholes does.

CnutOfAllCnuts · 20th August 2008, 07:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber

Don't mix positional sense with defensive ability.

Ah, ok...

Tell that to players like Beckenbauer, Baresi etc..

The Hairdryer · 20th August 2008, 08:02

Lot of you clowns really need your head checked. Another season, same old shit being spouted by the same people.

The Hairdryer · 20th August 2008, 08:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by CnutOfAllCnuts

Ah, ok...

Tell that to players like Beckenbauer, Baresi etc..

Exactly cnut, another idiot that thinks good defending is last ditch slide tackling and recovery defending.

The Hairdryer · 20th August 2008, 08:12

Jamie Redknapp blowing apart the Scholesy can't tackle myth

So what is it like to suffer from one of Scholes's ginger tiger bites?
Last updated at 9:08 PM on 30th April 2008

Comments (0) Add to My Stories
When I was a player and the Manchester United team sheet came into the dressing room, I'd hope that Paul Scholes wasn't on it. He could really hurt you...and not just with his tackles.

It makes me laugh when people say that Scholes can't tackle. He can, he knows what he is doing. I spoke to Roy Keane about him and he agreed — when Scholesy leaves something on an opponent or goes through someone, he means it. That bite in the tackle is not mistimed. It's for real.

It's not a nasty streak...it's a winning streak, a real edge. You can't survive in the Manchester United first team for so long without it.

On the pitch, he left me with a few reminders of Liverpool versus Manchester United matches but I used to enjoy meeting up with him for England.

I wouldn't say we were mates but we would talk and he's a nice fella off the pitch: quiet, nothing fancy or cocky but a good lad, a passionate football man.

We played together in central midfield for England and he is such a good footballer, which is why he has adapted to the deep, holding midfield role in some recent games.

He started as a striker as a young lad. He's an excellent finisher but Sir Alex Ferguson obviously thought he had more to offer.

The ginger tiger can run a game with his passing and Fergie wanted him in the engine room.

Scholes can pass with both feet, he can go short and long and he shifts the point of attack by regularly switching the play.

When you don't want to be chasing the ball against teams like Barcelona you need his accuracy and the time and space he can create.

Yes, Scholes can ghost into the box, he is a good volleyer and still hits a cracking shot but his best art is his sidefoot passing.

He'll pass around corners and create openings but he will also ping the ball into the feet of his intended target.

It doesn't bobble along slowly, it comes at you at pace and helps you to make up your mind about what to do next.

He is such a terrific appreciator of a clean pass. His presence will grace the Champions League Final.

P.S. Paul Scholes might have been Manchester United's match-winner against Barcelona but the biggest shift of the night was put in by his fellow midfielder Ji-sung Park.

The Korean ran a staggering 7.4 miles at Old Trafford, much of the time closing down opponents who enjoyed 63 per cent of the possession.

Park's super-human efforts helped United keep an all-important clean sheet although it was hardly a one-man effort.

Michael Carrick covered 7.2 miles in the engine room while Carlos Tevez buzzed around up front for 6.8 miles

rooney__10 · 20th August 2008, 10:17

His the best player in the world when in possesion of the ball and in tight situations. Yes he is better than people give him credit for when defending. However his slide tackles are always late. But his determination to hurry his opponents is the key to his defensive game. He basically is a xavi with the attitude minus the execution of gattuso he's basically paul scholes.

Trippin_Stoned · 20th August 2008, 10:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber

Don't mix positional sense with defensive ability.

Don't they go hand in hand?

CnutOfAllCnuts · 20th August 2008, 10:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trippin_Stoned

Don't they go hand in hand?

Og course they do.

Chief is an idiot though.

Simon Adebesi · 20th August 2008, 10:51

The problem is the frequency with which he tries to sliding tackle. If he knew he was bad at it and just didnt do it that would be a massive improvement.

You are right about the other things. Of course he can defend.

19th August 2008, 19:00	#1 (permalink)
reelworld Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: "I was never a great player" - Roy Keane, after being reminded that great players rarely make great managers. Posts: 5,193	Scholes defensive ability Massively underrated. The only thing he can't do is sliding tackle. But defensive skill is much more than just about that. His excellent positional sense means he can intercept passes, and closing down space available for opposition players. That's even less risky than tackling and both ends up with the ball in our possession. Reading people posts around here, one would think that he was absolutely hapless. You can't play in midfield for Manchester United when you can't defend. Too much emphasis being put in sliding tackles, as in that's the only defensive skill worth having. It's fecking not.

19th August 2008, 19:01	#2 (permalink)
Raven_Blade Attention Whoring Common Crow Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: In Man Utd's Defence. Posts: 18,262	A great tackle takes perfect timing but unfortunately Scholes is sometimes a bit late.

19th August 2008, 19:03	#3 (permalink)
reelworld Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: "I was never a great player" - Roy Keane, after being reminded that great players rarely make great managers. Posts: 5,193	Yeah, but he can won the ball in a few different ways. All I'm saying when I read people said that Scholes can't defend, they usually put it because he can't tackle. That's just so wrong

19th August 2008, 19:14	#6 (permalink)
iPete Previously: PeteReDevil Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: I....declare...BANKRUPTCYYYY!!! Posts: 1,325	In his last if not one of tournaments for England, he was the impressive defensively of all the midfielders. Remember a game where he looked like the only one on the pitch

19th August 2008, 19:23	#7 (permalink)
RedDevilCanuck Reserve Team Player Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Decent mix between America and Britain. Posts: 1,412	not a good tackler but very good defensively. Great positioning and tracking back. You dont believe me? Watch the first leg at Nou Camp.

19th August 2008, 19:33	#9 (permalink)
Doevle Reserve Team Player Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Lost in a Roman wilderness of pain Posts: 1,485	Our semi-final versus Barcelona at Camp Nou last season was proof of Scholesys defensive ability.

19th August 2008, 19:55	#11 (permalink)
Castolo Reserve Team Player Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 1,192	He's a nibbly little customer, always nicking the ball off the opposition. It must be very annoying to play against him. I'd probably end up smacking the bugger.

19th August 2008, 20:20	#15 (permalink)
Name Changed weso26 Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Dublin Posts: 5,550	Part of a players defensive ability is the ability to make space for themselves or others in tight situations when they are under pressure. Scholes is the master of that. That in itself makes him pretty good defensively. He simply can't tackle.

19th August 2008, 20:38	#17 (permalink)
Sylar Reserve Team Player Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 1,094	Scholes is an awesome defender if you think about it. He manages to stop so many counter attacks and more often than not he gets away with it. Genius.

19th August 2008, 20:46	#18 (permalink)
Mozza "Geek" Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Let Rooney be Rooney Posts: 16,747	It's not his tackling that is the problem, he can't run, he's been helped immensely by the control we have over possession and territory since Carrick signed, he'd be exposed without that

20th August 2008, 07:39	#19 (permalink)
Justin First Team Regular Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 16,985	He should take a chapter from Pirlo's defending. Just go for the smart intercepts, plug the gaps in midfield and don't go for the big tackles. But then again, the tackle without thinking is his way of staying involved in the game...

20th August 2008, 07:50	#21 (permalink)
Dippersripper Educating ignorant bastards about God to achieve a near-perfect world Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Reason is an excuse for faith. Faith is everything. Please don't take, My Fletcher, Away..... Posts: 10,262	We just need bodies in our own half to deny the opposition any space. Whether they can defend or not is a secondary problem for an attacking midfielder. He should just try close down opposition players and that is what Scholes does.

20th August 2008, 08:02	#23 (permalink)
The Hairdryer Crikey that stung Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Never argue with a fool. They'll just drag you down to their level then beat you with experience Posts: 11,949	Lot of you clowns really need your head checked. Another season, same old shit being spouted by the same people.

20th August 2008, 08:12	#25 (permalink)
The Hairdryer Crikey that stung Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Never argue with a fool. They'll just drag you down to their level then beat you with experience Posts: 11,949	Jamie Redknapp blowing apart the Scholesy can't tackle myth So what is it like to suffer from one of Scholes's ginger tiger bites? Last updated at 9:08 PM on 30th April 2008 Comments (0) Add to My Stories When I was a player and the Manchester United team sheet came into the dressing room, I'd hope that Paul Scholes wasn't on it. He could really hurt you...and not just with his tackles. It makes me laugh when people say that Scholes can't tackle. He can, he knows what he is doing. I spoke to Roy Keane about him and he agreed — when Scholesy leaves something on an opponent or goes through someone, he means it. That bite in the tackle is not mistimed. It's for real. It's not a nasty streak...it's a winning streak, a real edge. You can't survive in the Manchester United first team for so long without it. On the pitch, he left me with a few reminders of Liverpool versus Manchester United matches but I used to enjoy meeting up with him for England. I wouldn't say we were mates but we would talk and he's a nice fella off the pitch: quiet, nothing fancy or cocky but a good lad, a passionate football man. We played together in central midfield for England and he is such a good footballer, which is why he has adapted to the deep, holding midfield role in some recent games. He started as a striker as a young lad. He's an excellent finisher but Sir Alex Ferguson obviously thought he had more to offer. The ginger tiger can run a game with his passing and Fergie wanted him in the engine room. Scholes can pass with both feet, he can go short and long and he shifts the point of attack by regularly switching the play. When you don't want to be chasing the ball against teams like Barcelona you need his accuracy and the time and space he can create. Yes, Scholes can ghost into the box, he is a good volleyer and still hits a cracking shot but his best art is his sidefoot passing. He'll pass around corners and create openings but he will also ping the ball into the feet of his intended target. It doesn't bobble along slowly, it comes at you at pace and helps you to make up your mind about what to do next. He is such a terrific appreciator of a clean pass. His presence will grace the Champions League Final. P.S. Paul Scholes might have been Manchester United's match-winner against Barcelona but the biggest shift of the night was put in by his fellow midfielder Ji-sung Park. The Korean ran a staggering 7.4 miles at Old Trafford, much of the time closing down opponents who enjoyed 63 per cent of the possession. Park's super-human efforts helped United keep an all-important clean sheet although it was hardly a one-man effort. Michael Carrick covered 7.2 miles in the engine room while Carlos Tevez buzzed around up front for 6.8 miles

20th August 2008, 10:17	#26 (permalink)
rooney__10 Banned Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 1,272	His the best player in the world when in possesion of the ball and in tight situations. Yes he is better than people give him credit for when defending. However his slide tackles are always late. But his determination to hurry his opponents is the key to his defensive game. He basically is a xavi with the attitude minus the execution of gattuso he's basically paul scholes.

20th August 2008, 10:51	#29 (permalink)
Simon Adebesi Reserve Team Player Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Sanctity, like a cat, abhors filth. Posts: 2,601	The problem is the frequency with which he tries to sliding tackle. If he knew he was bad at it and just didnt do it that would be a massive improvement. You are right about the other things. Of course he can defend.