Berbatov | Fulham player

Brwned · 22nd March 2009, 15:21

Thought he was quite impressive at dictating our attacking play against Stoke too, FWIW.

relx · 22nd March 2009, 15:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by amolbhatia100

Dictate the play? When??? Carrick dictates play, Rooney dictates play, Berbatov just holds on to the ball well.

Plays with fear? Always. I cant believe you've seen his best from the Tottenham days and you think this is form is a patch on that. Hes nothing like the player he was for them. He used to go for the audacious and pull it off.

Name what outstanding he has. Hes had one outstanding MOMENT where he set up Ronaldo. No outstanding game.

Watch the FA Cup game against Southampton again. By the way, Berbatov's goals won 12 points for us this season.

amolbhatia100 · 22nd March 2009, 15:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brwned

When? Do you actually care? If I told you the game, would you take my word for it or say 'nah, he just held the ball up well'. Ekeke, one of Berbatov's biggest critics, also pointed out how well he was doing for a period of time, when he was dictating the play. I know you don't care though.

That's called being in a settled environment, not playing with no fear. Pretty clear difference.

West Brom, for one. 'Oh but it's only West Brom', whatever.

He was far from outstanding in that game. Outstanding is how Wayne Rooney comes on to the pitch and makes defenders look silly and looks a threat everytime hes on the ball. Or Ronaldo motoring past defenders, and scoring goals for fun. Outstanding is even scoring two goals, one a cracker from range in the FA cup and being all over the opposition. And no you never told me, you must have told someone else.

Tevez has hardly been in a settled environment ever for us. His first season was good and since hes been second choice striker. Yet whenever he comes on, knowing he will be harshly judged, he always tries things, not afraid of things not coming off.

As i said, i dont think theres much to pick between the two. They're both well below what they're capable of. But Berbatov's recent form has been woeful and if this was someone like Bendtner people would have been going nuts. When one of your strikers is playing so poorly, and you have someone like tevez in the ranks, you give him a run in and see if he can do better. As i said not much betweem but Tevez's attitude and Berbatovs bad form means IMO he should start starting regularly.

amolbhatia100 · 22nd March 2009, 15:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by relx

Watch the FA Cup game against Southampton again. By the way, Berbatov's goals won 12 points for us this season.

I reckon Tevez has done as much. His set up for the goal against Bolton was as important if not more than Berbatovs goal.

amolbhatia100 · 22nd March 2009, 15:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laphroaig

He was absolutely ridiculous against Southampton. ("Oh but it's only Southampton!")

To be fair, it is only Southampton. You cant compare that to any premiership opposition. Tevez destroyed Derby.

Brwned · 22nd March 2009, 15:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by amolbhatia100

He was far from outstanding in that game. Outstanding is how Wayne Rooney comes on to the pitch and makes defenders look silly and looks a threat everytime hes on the ball. Or Ronaldo motoring past defenders, and scoring goals for fun. Outstanding is even scoring two goals, one a cracker from range in the FA cup and being all over the opposition. And no you never told me, you must have told someone else.

Tevez has hardly been in a settled environment ever for us. His first season was good and since hes been second choice striker. Yet whenever he comes on, knowing he will be harshly judged, he always tries things, not afraid of things not coming off.

As i said, i dont think theres much to pick between the two. They're both well below what they're capable of. But Berbatov's recent form has been woeful and if this was someone like Bendtner people would have been going nuts. When one of your strikers is playing so poorly, and you have someone like tevez in the ranks, you give him a run in and see if he can do better. As i said not much betweem but Tevez's attitude and Berbatovs bad form means IMO he should start starting regularly.

Of course.

What a surprise that you bring Rooney into it again.

It gets a bit old mate.

amolbhatia100 · 22nd March 2009, 15:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brwned

Of course.

What a surprise that you bring Rooney into it again.

It gets a bit old mate.

So does his form when its average time and time again. He keeps playing this way, my response will be the same. When he does well, ill applaud him.

Why shouldnt Rooney be brought into it? Berbatov should be somewhere close to Rooney as a player and he isnt, nowhere near. Yet he keeps starting as of hes put in two seasons like Ronaldo has for us, and is absolutely untouchable. Its getting rather silly and its time we give others a chance. Berbatov should have to fight for his place on the evidence of his recent form.

Tevez to get some starts hopefully. Obviously if Berbatov does, and starts performing, i wont complain one bit.

Brwned · 22nd March 2009, 15:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by amolbhatia100

So does his form when its average time and time again. He keeps playing this way, my response will be the same. When he does well, ill applaud him.

Why shouldnt Rooney be brought into it? Berbatov should be somewhere close to Rooney as a player and he isnt, nowhere near. Yet he keeps starting as of hes put in two seasons like Ronaldo has for us, and is absolutely untouchable. Its getting rather silly and its time we give others a chance. Berbatov should have to fight for his place on the evidence of his recent form.

Tevez to get some starts hopefully. Obviously if Berbatov does, and starts performing, i wont complain one bit.

No you won't.

You'll ignore it.

relx · 22nd March 2009, 15:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by amolbhatia100

I reckon Tevez has done as much. His set up for the goal against Bolton was as important if not more than Berbatovs goal.

Unfortunately, no. If you want to take assists into consideration, I'm sure a few of Berbatov's assists have resulted into winning goals. Like the one against Stoke for Tevez.

Godfather · 22nd March 2009, 15:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brwned

Thought he was quite impressive at dictating our attacking play against Stoke too, FWIW.

Agreed.
On his day he can dictate a whole match.
Just needs to get into a great form me thinks and get some more support from our midfield than yesterday

Laphroaig · 22nd March 2009, 15:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by amolbhatia100

I reckon Tevez has done as much. His set up for the goal against Bolton was as important if not more than Berbatovs goal.

You reckon Tevez has as many match winning goals and assists as Berbatov this season?

amolbhatia100 · 22nd March 2009, 15:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brwned

No you won't.

You'll ignore it.

Sure.

Sadly, for you, i actually have no bias against any united players. People with biases usually have them against more than one player.

I thought Fletcher had talent when everyone was writing him off, i think Oshea is a useful player but probably not good enough against the best teams, i think Rio is great but struggles sometimes against physical strikers, i think Evans has some way to go to learning to deal with such strikers too etc These are OPINIONS. I like you as a poster, but you can never deal with someone else having a differing opinion. There has to be some other reason behind that person having that opinion.

I never said he didnt have any good games or never played well. I said he wasnt outstanding ever. Apologies if he was against Southampton but i think thats the only united game ive missed this season. But in this case, it really is ONLY southampton.

Brwned · 22nd March 2009, 15:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by amolbhatia100

Sure.

Sadly, for you, i actually have no bias against any united players. People with biases usually have them against more than one player.

I thought Fletcher had talent when everyone was writing him off, i think Oshea is a useful player but probably not good enough against the best teams, i think Rio is great but struggles sometimes against physical strikers, i think Evans has some way to go to learning to deal with such strikers too etc These are OPINIONS. I like you as a poster, but you can never deal with someone else having a differing opinion. There has to be some other reason behind that person having that opinion.

I never said he didnt have any good games or never played well. I said he wasnt outstanding ever. Apologies if he was against Southampton but i think thats the only united game ive missed this season. But in this case, it really is ONLY southampton.

I can a lot of the time.

With Berbatov I can't a lot of the time, because a lot of the criticisms aimed at him are silly and based on nothing.

amolbhatia100 · 22nd March 2009, 15:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brwned

I can a lot of the time.

With Berbatov I can't a lot of the time, because a lot of the criticisms aimed at him are silly and based on nothing.

All criticisms are based on something. No smoke without fire and all that.

Its typical really. No ones supposed to criticize Berbatov. You think hes been good of late? Do you believe you're expectations of him are high enough? Do you think he should be starting AHEAD of Rooney? On the basis of his last 4 or 5 games, shouldn't Tevez be first choice for a run of games?

Brwned · 22nd March 2009, 15:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by amolbhatia100

All criticisms are based on something. No smoke without fire and all that.

Its typical really. No ones supposed to criticize Berbatov. You think hes been good of late? Do you believe you're expectations of him are high enough? Do you think he should be starting AHEAD of Rooney? On the basis of his last 4 or 5 games, shouldn't Tevez be first choice for a run of games?

No. Yes. Rooney's our most important player. No.

amolbhatia100 · 22nd March 2009, 15:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brwned

No. Yes. Rooney's our most important player. No.

Then it shouldnt really upset you if i dislike him starting ahead of Rooney. Strange thing for you to take so badly.

So basically you agree on most counts apart from despite his poor form you think he should start whereas i think Tevez should.

Brwned · 22nd March 2009, 15:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by amolbhatia100

Then it shouldnt really upset you if i dislike him starting ahead of Rooney. Strange thing for you to take so badly.

So basically you agree on most counts apart from despite his poor form you think he should start whereas i think Tevez should.

Starting ahead of Rooney and Rooney getting a rest are two completely different things, are they not?

amolbhatia100 · 22nd March 2009, 15:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brwned

Starting ahead of Rooney and Rooney getting a rest are two completely different things, are they not?

We needed to win the game and having beaten them twice already they were always going to be up for it.

Why does Rooney need a rest and Berbatov not? Rooney is much younger and rarely looks tired. He was buzzing when he came on.

amolbhatia100 · 22nd March 2009, 16:01

After you've been whalloped by your fiercest rivals is hardly a time to rest your most important player, as you've claimed he is, rightfully so. Especially one whose had his injury issues this season and needs all the games he can get to hit top form.

Brwned · 22nd March 2009, 16:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by amolbhatia100

We needed to win the game and having beaten them twice already they were always going to be up for it.

Why does Rooney need a rest and Berbatov not? Rooney is much younger and rarely looks tired. He was buzzing when he came on.

Rooney needs a rest because he's our most important player and Berbatov doesn't because he's lazy*.

I'd have rested Rooney too, seeing as we'd just beaten them with ease a couple of weeks ago, and they'd lost their last three home games, and I'd want Rooney to get as much rest as possible.

*Intentionally over-simplified.

amolbhatia100 · 22nd March 2009, 16:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brwned

Rooney needs a rest because he's our most important player and Berbatov doesn't because he's lazy*.

I'd have rested Rooney too, seeing as we'd just beaten them with ease a couple of weeks ago, and they'd lost their last three home games, and I'd want Rooney to get as much rest as possible.

*Intentionally over-simplified.

Very odd. You'd obviously be wrong seeing how well Rooney played and that we really could have done with him from the start. You simply dont rest the big guns IMO after you've suffered such a terrible loss to such big rivals. You get everyone geared up and get stuck into the opposition.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but its clear as day that Rooney being on the bench was a mistake. Also, i just dont see why Rooney needs the rest. If anything he needs games for him to hit his best form. And hes so much younger than the likes Berbatov, he has a lot more stamina. Finally, i'd also like to say that a loss like last weeks would have motivated NOONE (bar possibly Neville) more than Rooney. All of it pointed to him having to start. Sadly it didnt happen. Mistake, IMO.

Brwned · 22nd March 2009, 16:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by amolbhatia100

Very odd. You'd obviously be wrong seeing how well Rooney played and that we really could have done with him from the start. You simply dont rest the big guns IMO after you've suffered such a terrible loss to such big rivals. You get everyone geared up and get stuck into the opposition.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but its clear as day that Rooney being on the bench was a mistake. Also, i just dont see why Rooney needs the rest. If anything he needs games for him to hit his best form. And hes so much younger than the likes Berbatov, he has a lot more stamina. Finally, i'd also like to say that a loss like last weeks would have motivated NOONE (bar possibly Neville) more than Rooney. All of it pointed to him having to start. Sadly it didnt happen. Mistake, IMO.

That'd be using hindsight.

I wasn't, I was talking about what I would have done before the match without using hindsight. It made sense to give him a rest.

amolbhatia100 · 22nd March 2009, 16:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brwned

That'd be using hindsight.

I wasn't, I was talking about what I would have done before the match without using hindsight. It made sense to give him a rest.

Hindsight can be very useful. Especially when your best attacking player looked that good when he came on and the ones who did start underperformed. Makes sense to conclude Rooney should have started. Anyway were bickering over small things.

Broyphs · 22nd March 2009, 16:12

Body language?

Fuck me, some people really know what's important, eh?

Name Changed · 22nd March 2009, 16:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by brophs

Body language?

Fuck me, some people really know what's important, eh?

Brwned · 22nd March 2009, 16:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by brophs

Body language?

Fuck me, some people really know what's important, eh?

Quote:

Originally Posted by amolbhatia100

Hindsight can be very useful. Especially when your best attacking player looked that good when he came on and the ones who did start underperformed. Makes sense to conclude Rooney should have started. Anyway were bickering over small things.

We are indeed.

Let's just leave it at that.

CptMarvel · 22nd March 2009, 16:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by amolbhatia100

To be fair, it is only Southampton. You cant compare that to any premiership opposition. Tevez destroyed Derby.

It may only have been Southampton, but it was also one of the only times this season where he's been used as our main creative force, we didn't miss Rooney or Ronaldo that game.

FlawlessThaw · 22nd March 2009, 16:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by amolbhatia100

To be fair, it is only Southampton. You cant compare that to any premiership opposition. Tevez destroyed Derby.

Tevez was also completely shite against Derby four days after Berbatov destroyed Southampton.

SAred · 22nd March 2009, 16:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by brophs

Body language?

Fuck me, some people really know what's important, eh?

If going into a game with not the right attitude isnt important then I dont know what is. You can be the most talented player around but if your attitude isnt right then your talent will count for nothing.

Its not only the game yesturday but there have been many times were Berba has been caught offside by simple being to bloody lazy to get back. And its this attitude that can and will cost United.

Brwned · 22nd March 2009, 16:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by SAred

If going into a game with not the right attitude isnt important then I dont know what is. You can be the most talented player around but if your attitude isnt right then your talent will count for nothing.

Its not only the game yesturday but there have been many times were Berba has been caught offside by simple being to bloody lazy to get back. And its this attitude that can and will cost United.

There haven't actually.

Berbatov's hardly ever caught offside to by recollection.

SAred · 22nd March 2009, 16:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brwned

There haven't actually.

Berbatov's hardly ever caught offside to by recollection.

Are your sure the 2rd goal against Inter Milan , Berba was standing in a offside postion. "There havent actually" so we have got anyway with it untill now doenst mean that we shall all the time.

busbysaces · 22nd March 2009, 16:58

The problem with Berbatov is that he's either very effective or he goes totally missing.

Frustrating.

Ekeke · 22nd March 2009, 16:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brwned

There haven't actually.

Berbatov's hardly ever caught offside to by recollection.

I can think of 2 or 3 occasions where he hasnt bothered to get back on side and if he had done would have been in a brilliant position to score.

Everyone gets caught offside though now and again. He just isnt very quick at making sure he's onside.

Laphroaig · 22nd March 2009, 17:13

Like against Aalborg.

SAred · 22nd March 2009, 17:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Laphroaig

Like against Aalborg.

Aalborg , Fcuken Aalborg and Southampton now I see why we spent 30 million pound. Fcuken Aalborg. Squeeky bum time and If our 30 million pound man doesnt start to preform be gald that at least we have the Carling cup in the bag. Liverpool have just ripped Aston Villa a new A-Hole and its time for our star players to be counted and lets hope that this man will be one of them.

Brwned · 22nd March 2009, 17:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ekeke

I can think of 2 or 3 occasions where he hasnt bothered to get back on side and if he had done would have been in a brilliant position to score.

Everyone gets caught offside though now and again. He just isnt very quick at making sure he's onside.

That's the crux of it. couldn't care less if he gets caught offside every now and again.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SAred

Are your sure the 2rd goal against Inter Milan , Berba was standing in a offside postion. "There havent actually" so we have got anyway with it untill now doenst mean that we shall all the time.

Who gives a fuck?

you were talking bollocks about it, end of.

SAred · 22nd March 2009, 17:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brwned

That's the crux of it. couldn't care less if he gets caught offside every now and again.

Who gives a fuck?

you were talking bollocks about it, end of.

Talking bollocks , please the guy has been caught a few times offside by being to slow to get back. You couldnt care less if he gets caught of side will I do especially if a player just scored a goal that has been cancelled out thanks to Berba not getting back in time.

Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber · 22nd March 2009, 17:44

I can't believe people on here are pissed Berba didn't do so well for us when we had only one functioning wing, were down to 10 men and he got injured. The cafe at it's best really...

CptMarvel · 22nd March 2009, 17:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by amolbhatia100

Very odd. You'd obviously be wrong seeing how well Rooney played and that we really could have done with him from the start. You simply dont rest the big guns IMO after you've suffered such a terrible loss to such big rivals. You get everyone geared up and get stuck into the opposition.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but its clear as day that Rooney being on the bench was a mistake. Also, i just dont see why Rooney needs the rest. If anything he needs games for him to hit his best form. And hes so much younger than the likes Berbatov, he has a lot more stamina. Finally, i'd also like to say that a loss like last weeks would have motivated NOONE (bar possibly Neville) more than Rooney. All of it pointed to him having to start. Sadly it didnt happen. Mistake, IMO.

Perhaps Ferguson was worried that after the loss Rooney was too fired up, liable to lose his head and get sent off.

CantonaVeron · 22nd March 2009, 17:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber

I can't believe people on here are pissed Berba didn't do so well for us when we had only one functioning wing, were down to 10 men and he got injured. The cafe at it's best really...

I've just been thinking about this I am sure Berbatov has been carrying this injury for a little while now hopefully he can now get some rest and shake it off.

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22nd March 2009, 15:21	#121 (permalink)
Brwned Have you ever been in love before? Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 39,395	Thought he was quite impressive at dictating our attacking play against Stoke too, FWIW.

22nd March 2009, 16:01	#139 (permalink)
amolbhatia100 Coach (But never a mod) Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: india Posts: 32,939	After you've been whalloped by your fiercest rivals is hardly a time to rest your most important player, as you've claimed he is, rightfully so. Especially one whose had his injury issues this season and needs all the games he can get to hit top form.

22nd March 2009, 16:12	#144 (permalink)
Broyphs Agent something or other's friend or the like Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Commas are important. "Come on, Barbie, let's go party" is much less sinister than "Come on Barbie, let's go party" Posts: 33,096	Body language? Fuck me, some people really know what's important, eh?

22nd March 2009, 16:58	#152 (permalink)
busbysaces Reserve Team Player Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 2,034	The problem with Berbatov is that he's either very effective or he goes totally missing. Frustrating.

22nd March 2009, 17:13	#154 (permalink)
Laphroaig First Team Regular Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: I've got some happiness Posts: 15,233	Like against Aalborg.

22nd March 2009, 17:44	#158 (permalink)
Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber Thus says Kemo Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Founder of IhateMakeleles.org and Gourcufffanboysareus.com Posts: 40,882	I can't believe people on here are pissed Berba didn't do so well for us when we had only one functioning wing, were down to 10 men and he got injured. The cafe at it's best really...