FAO Rival Fans and Others: Ronaldo

KingEric7

Greetings, Dippers, Renties, Gooners, etc...

Upon banging my head amongst a brick wall in the United forum, and contemplating whether more well-reasoned arguments are actually put forward in the general, I've decided to seek the opinion of you lot in regards to the Ronaldo situation.

Personally, as a few others have also stated, the attitude of Ronaldo over the summer has been nothing short of disgusting yet in spite of this, the reception he received at Old Trafford the other day was deemed to be acceptable. Do you find this to be the case, or do you also appreciate how fickle this makes us look as a collection of supporters?

Whilst basking in the glory of the Arsenal fans' apparent volatility and discarding of laurels regarding Adebayor's summer, I'm actually ashamed that Ronaldo is getting applauded as if he were some returning, benevolent and loyal hero when you consider that the majority of these fans literally stay quiet throughout each and every game. He is basically being applauded for his lack of loyalty.

Now, I can appreciate that Ronaldo has been exceptional (no more than Rio) for us over the last 2 and a half years or so, and that the seasons in question MAY have turned out quite differently were he to never have existed, yet I feel that after such an episode, he must regain such a following. Instead, 90% of the fans that were at the Villareal game (even the ones in the Stretty!) have made it clear that he pretty much is the club. I'm not one for booing, nor am I one for abusing the player in any way from the stands, yet is it ludicrous to suggest that the reactions towards Ronaldo could've been a bit more restrained?

Thoughts?

didsbury1982

United fan but I just wanted to say to the above question, definitely not! I don't understand why the guy deserved a heroes welcome.

Redlambs

I've absolutely no reason to believe it would be any different if Ronaldo played for any other team.

After the start we made, there were always going to be people who changed tune and cried out for him. The same can be said for any other fanbase.

duffer

No more or less fickle than any other set of football fans, as expected.

KingEric7

Which is quite sad really, isn't it?

Redlambs

Yes, but it's also very predictable.

KingEric7

Perhaps, but the strength of it all has provided yet another reason for me to become slightly disillusioned with football.

This is somewhat depressing, considering the part it plays in life.

Redlambs

Definitely. I think what helped me though, is that from the start I decided not to care too much about the Ronaldo situation. After all, whatever was going to happen was out of our hands, so I just ignored the Ronaldo thread and didn't read into any articles.

Now he's back and playing, I hope he does well. However, if I go back and sit in the stands this season, I won't be singing for him.

Gio

Given how quiet it was for the rest of the game, compared to the eruption when Ron came on, there seems to be quite a lot of Ronaldo fan-boys in the support.

Pogue Mahone

Maybe I'm just jaded but when we've got so many reasons to be hacked off with football, the whole Ronaldo return thing is just more off the same, so I barely noticed. Water off a duck's back.

Assuming duck's don't like water.

Or something.

antihenry

100 % correct.

Ronaldo is a world class star who hasn't even reached his prime yet. Losing him will affect any team even as strong as MU. Let's be honest, he was the biggest reason United won the two league titles and the CL over the last two seasons.

Fans may say things in the heat of the moment and his actions this past summer may even force quite a few United fans to never feel the same way about him again but after everything is said and done you want the world's best player on your side and deep inside most caftards hope he'll stay at MU as long as possible.


Ronaldo'll never be a United legend in a sense that Scholes, Giggs or Neville will be when they finish playing. But he may yet turn out to be the most talented footballer to ever wear MU shirt and people often tend to forgive those kind of players almost anything because of their brilliance on the pitch, however unfair and illogical it may seem.

Feedingseagulls

Oh my word - he wanted to leave - didn't - insisted it was our decision whether to accept a bid or not.


So, so, terrible wasn't it!

Shock, horror! - incarcerate him immediately.

samabachan

I never had anything against Ronaldo, for a variety of reasons. I'm happy he is here for another year at least, so I cheer him when he plays because he is a very good player. It is not my fault if other people who slated him over the summer cheer him because he is still here.

However, pretty much all of these arguments have been covered in minute detail in the Ronaldo thread, and this is treading a very fine line as to whether it is repeating that whole thread.

KingEric7

Any team would be affected if it lost its best player. You will feel the effects of Essien, for example, albeit on a small scale considering the 832 class midfielders ready to step in.

I would disagree here in regards to the bolded bit, and say that Rio Ferdinand is the best player we have, and has been for ages. I would say that also applies to our national team.

I would say that there is no point in keeping a player against his own will, yet the way Ronaldo is so egotistically driven and therefore professional, I wouldn't be surprised if he went on and replicated his form. However, on a purely vengeful level, i would prefer it if players such as this were not plying their trade here. In a few years, we will probably see the same from a few more players.

Nope, he won't. Don't know about the most talented either, but definitely one of the most effective and talented.
You are right, though. Ability > Attitude, seemingly...

Ceks

Sometimes I guess you've just got to look at the bigger picture and do what's best for the club. Jeering Ronaldo from the stands will do nothing for player, or team morale. I'm sure SAF has a watchful eye on Ronaldo, but he also recognises his immense talents, and has probably left character concerns at the back door for the greater good of the club. One motive being for the future and stability of the club, and second; to stand strong against the advances made by Real.

Most are in agreement that Ronaldo acted out-of-line. But players these days live completely different lives to what footballers used to. A dream world if you like. Can you actually imagine what it would be like to earn £120,000 a week? It's the same answer to 99 out of 100 questions in this day and age; money.

I think it's important to sit back from the situation and realise that the game has changed. The influx of foreign players has brought both pros and cons. It will always be atypical finding fidelity in foreign footballers at your club. I would just be thankful that you support such a big club, because you’re unlikely to ever face an Englishman turning his back on your club in pursuit of greater heights, and you're more likely to hold onto a foreign star than a club like Tottenham.

Fans will always be loyal, players won't.

kouroux

That sums it up perfectly

FranklyVulgar

At the end of the day alot of United fans see nothing but Ronaldo when they look at United these days. I can't imagine the turmoil when he said he wanted to join Madrid and tried (in a rather strange way) to force himself out of the club to follow his dream.

He is however one of the best players around and any team would welcome him so maybe it is relief that he stayed at United.

Personally i think his actions were poor and he lacks character or just isn't the brightest of boys. I would imagine he wouldn't get the same adoration as proper United legends and players who are loyal to the club but he will anyway. That is the way of football fans, i think the die hard United fans will be put off by him but at games these days it has become so corporate, almost like a tourist attraction and there will be a huge portion of fans there to just see Ronaldo.

He is arrogant in a bad way, he doesn't have humour or humility to make his arrogance less insulting.

Still, a great player. Just a bit of a twat.

Merman

I'd like to ask the same question to the older fans. Do you think fans in the 60s/70s would've accepted Ronaldo and given him a similar reception?

Bilbo

Don't share this opinion at all. People who feel this way are hugely oversensitive, and more than a little naive IMHO.

Marching

I can understand Ronaldo wanting to play for RM and no doubt he will at some stage in his career but for now, if I was a MU fan, I would making the most of such a great player being at my club. He should be cheered from the rafters and all this pre season nonsense put behind you and as for questioning his loyalty, he is still wearing the red of MU isn't he.

MU is just part of a career move as far as Ronaldo is concerned just as it is with the vast majority of players...the days when players arrived at a club as kids and stayed until they retired are long gone.

Fans give their unwavering support to a club and then expect the same from players....it just doesn't work like that....for fans it is a way of life - for players it is just a job.

Ceks

Well put.

Lynott

I don't think he did an awful lot wrong. He is bound to want to go to Madrid and probably thought that after winning the double it was a good time.

The fact that he has chosen to honour his contract and not push for a move, or worse sulk and refuse to play as Berbatov did, then he actually deserves some credit.

The slave statements were a bit stupid though.

FranklyVulgar

It was the way he allowed it to drag on, playing cat and mouse. Most would just say, i want to go and do it appropriately or dismiss it and say i'm at United, if they want to sell me they will do so.

He did niether and didn't allow United fans, players or staff members to understand and he allowed Madrid to sensationally flop (screw them) in their attempts to sign him which might damage his "dream".

He's a puffball and a cod.

Derek Brown

Very good post. Well said.

peterstorey

Yeah I'm amazed how much shite we can have chucked at us and still come back for more - but the people in charge know that, what they don't realise is that generation Z won't buy it. On the Ronaldo thing I guess you just have to judge him by his actions on the pitch if he gives his best there then that's probably all you can ask.

Stick

I see a Gerrard shirt burning and now I see cheering for Gerrard. I see Gareth Barry booed and now I see him getting full support from the Villa supporters. No point in lowering the value of one of your assets folks. I refer to players as assets now because that is how the club sees them.

Feedingseagulls

I don't think, in the 70s etc., the mindset of the players generally was that similar to what we have today.

Modern players live in a post-Bosman world of massive salaries, rocketing fame, and media opportunities. Players and their agents have much more power to direct their future. The possibility of 'going on a free' has made it much easier (potentially) for people to move clubs - either at the end ogf their contract or near it.

That's all players by the way - not just Ronaldo.

So I really don't think Ronaldo would have been Ronaldo - nor would the scenario in which he found himself be sufficiently similar to tell us how he would have reacted.


FS - dob 20/10/58

Dumpstar

Honest answer? I think 90% of fans have a secret realisation that Ronaldo may actually be the difference between winning the league/CL and not winning it. Rival fans have always argued this but your early season form without him may just have opened some inner eyes.

The cheers for him (as opposed to silence, not booing) was out of relief that he's still here and you still have a chance at defending your league title.

crappycraperson

Good point. IMO, if we had a flying start to the season without Ronaldo, the reception would have been less grand.

Bilbo

We'd still have a very good chance of winning the league with this squad minus Ronaldo. It would strengthen Chelseas position as favourites this season, but we'd certainly be the club pushing them all the way. Our early season form is almost always poor.

United fans often understate the importance of Ronaldo, because we don't want to be thought of as a one-man team. In contrast, opposition fans (mainly our closest rivals) overstate his importance, because you all would like to believe we'd be also rans without him. The reality is, as usual, somewhere in the middle.

If Gerrard, Fabregas, Ronaldo and Terry retired tomorrow, the status of our clubs would remain pretty much as it is in terms of league positions. In fact, I believe Liverpool and Arsenal would suffer a lot more than United & Chelsea should this happen.

Merman

well said Bilbo

MUFCgal

It's just fickle, all supporters have done it before. Gerrard in 2005, shirts being burned in the street one minute then the next minute he's their hero again. Adebayor this summer said he was leaving Arsenal but now after a hat-trick the fans are happy. Lampard refused to sign a new contract for months with Chelsea and eventually did this summer after much speculation he was going to leave for Inter Milan. Also Gareth Barry, saying he wanted to leave Aston Villa but now he's getting cheered every week.

I think the reason Ronaldo got such a warm welcome back was because the fans know how important he is to the team, as any star player is to their squads. If we had a great start to the season, then maybe he wouldn't have got such a good reaction but I think the fans were just so happy to have him back in the side, their emotions took over. Me personally, I'll never have respect for him again as what I've had in the last 2 seasons. Of course i'll support him for as long as he wears the United shirt but I'll not be singing Viva Ronaldo anytime soon.

jojojo

Can't comment on the grown-up fans of the 60s except to say the parallel is almost unimaginable. We "rescued" Law from a move to Italy that didn't work out. The concept of United buying a 18 year old kid who didn't even speak English from Portugal, and seeing him become a critical part of a team that won two Leagues and a Eurpean Cup in five years would have been almost impossible to take seriously.

If said kid then turned round and said that he'd given us his best shot but him and his family were getting homesick - would you mind taking this enormous amount of money and letting me go. I reckon quite a few would have gone to wave him off at Ringway - no hard feelings

Add to that the fact that we wouldn't have had to listen to 24 hour sports channels, and retranslated tabloid headlines changing by the hour designed to keep picking at the open wound and I doubt people would have got that upset. And if he had come back - then most would have thought it was a load of fuss over nothing.

Looking at the 70s, the closest comparison I can come up with is with george Best. It didn't matter how many times he let us down, I wanted him back. I was still too young to realise how hard it was for Best to come back - but from what I remember I wasn't the only one who used to cheer the return of the prodigal son (whether from suspension, a weekend drinking binge or retirement).

sparky

I agree.
Just look at Rooney or Alan Smith. Though you could argue that they moved for medals. I don't think we can actually say anything about Ronaldos personality when we don't know him. A lot of the stuff people still refer to on here came from the press or others surrounding Ronaldo. He is the worlds best player and I for one am pleased he plays for us and in the premiership itself.

kouroux

Throughout the whole saga this summer, did Ronaldo explicitly ask for a transfter to Madrid or is it something he just never tried to refuse ?

MUFCgal

He certainly wanted to go, that much is true. If we agreed to sell him, he would have been away to them like a shot but he never handed in a transfer request. SAF met with him, explained the situation and he simply had to accept it. Regardless of what he did or how he acted during the summer, what I do like about it is that he hasn't sulked over the whole thing. He hasn't thrown his toys out the pram or refused to play for us. He's trained hard, he's been dedicated in getting back to fitness and working his way back into the team. Regardless of how much of a cnut he can be, he always gives it 100% on that pitch.

Pat_Mustard

Interesting post. You've got a rare knack of being fair and nuanced with your comments about Ronaldo.

Totally agree with this.

Youngie

I don't remember Bestie getting booed for what was probably a bigger crime.. that of 'pissing his talent up against the wall' and disrespecting Sir Matt /Wilf/O'Farrell and The Doc. Sometimes you just have to indulge that rare Genius... when they offer talent no one else can match! In Football, emotion always outweighs reason...that's why we love it so much.
( P.S. Ronaldo wouldn't 'alf have been handy in our relegation battle of '73/'74!)