Lionel Messi

Cal?

So we are not allowed to point out his weakness in the 'Messi' thread? How about renaming it 'Messi-praise only'.

marcosdeto

brilliant idea! i vote "yes"!

Cal?

That's what I was getting at, it looks like Guardiola is indulging Messi's desire to score more goal even though he isn't very good at penalties.

Now because he's been taking most Barcas penalties, there isn't much stats available for Xavi & co, but I find it hard to believe none of them is a better Pk taker.

Cal?

Go start one. I promise not to criticise him in that thread.

adexkola

I agree. A good penalty is unstoppable, even if the keeper knows where it is going he can't do anything about it. It's a skill that can be worked on too.

Hectic

He could be, but then we don't really know the quality of other penalty takers on the team. Like for United, a lot of us question Rooney as a penalty taker, but I have faith that we wouldn't let him take them if there was someone clearly and consistently better. Nani, Hernandez and Berbatov all look like better takers in my eyes, but they haven't had the run in that Wayne has and aren't picked on the day, so perhaps it's not the gamble it looks like. I guess it's probably the same with Barcelona.

Cal?

That's all very well, but Villa takes penalties for Spain and has a better record for Valencia & Spain than Messi does.

Now I'm aware that Villa has been injured, dropped this season, but how about last season?

marcosdeto

really? because of the 27 goals he scored in la liga this season, only two were from penaltys

here:

Nombre Goals foot head Pen
C.Ron 28 14 4 10
Messi 27 24 1 2
Falca 14 6 3 5
Higua 14 14 0 0
Benzm 13 13 0 0

marcosdeto

a good shot is unstoppable, that doesn't mean that every shot should be at goal and if it doesnt the shooter is shit

you are defining "good" for "goal" and is not like that

juan mata's penalty last sunday agains birminghan was very good taken, and 90 percent of the penaltys taken that way are goal, would you say that the penalty was bad because the goalie stopped it?

and if that's the case, then the other penalties taken the same way were badly taken although they end up scoring?

Hectic

Okay, so let's just say Villa should take the penalties. Who cares? Why does this even matter?

Sarni

Because he needs to prove that Ronaldo is a better player than Messi.

Orton

Who actually cares if Ronaldo scored more penalties than Messi? Mark Noble scored more penalties than Wayne Rooney, does that matter? Should we sign him to take over penalty duties? Ridiculous.

Ole's_toe_poke

Seriously Cal? noone really cares about penalties.

As for indulging Messi, well so what? Managers always indulge their best players. What Messi brings is far greater than a few missed pens. So who cares?

Cristiano was a bit a twat when he was here. Fergie indulged him because he was good. Happens all the time.

FranklyVulgar

That can't be real? 10 penalties?? SO take away penalties and Ronaldo has 18 goals to Messis 25? So Messi missed one in the league so that means Barca have had 3 penalties whilst madrid have had 10? that's some stat.

Aslo Messi was taking penalties before Guardiola was the manager, so the idea that he's "indulging" him is a bit off.

Ole's_toe_poke

He's running out of arguments. Soon we will be talking about Messi's world cup record again.

You have to admire his persistence.

FranklyVulgar

really?

It's a trend, he scours stats looking for ways in which Ronaldo is better. Then this stat becomes the most important in the game. It's repetitive and boring, if i didn't know better i'd say he was just on the wind up. But no this is Cal????

marcosdeto

if you take away ronaldos penaltis, he only scored 4 more goals than higuain

and higuain doesnt play as much games as ronaldo

Orton

If you take away Messi's goals from open play he has only scored 2 this season.

WR

I think it says a lot on Messi's side, when Cal, the biggest Ronaldo fanboy going, can only now pick faults at his penalty record.

marcosdeto

that means messi is over rated!

Sewelly The Geordie

Give his pens to Higuian instead and...

Hectic

Stop. Don't go there or I will dismember you.

FranklyVulgar

Yeah, in La Liga Higuain has taken 40 shots at goal. Ronaldo 149.

Ole's_toe_poke

Tbf you can't just "take away" a goal. He's a good penalty taker fair enough. He scores them with ease. A lot of which he wins with his trickery.

But I wouldn't base my judgement on a player on penalty taking ability.

FranklyVulgar

eeek, i'll be more subtle.

Hectic

How about this, let's not use penalties to prove anything about Ronaldo or Messi, as it's completely immaterial. FV, Cal, you are both major embarassments to mankind.

Orton

Is it because Messi is left footed?

FranklyVulgar

Yeah we're the only ones who mentioned anything to do with penalties, good one.

Hectic

Obviously not, but look at the direction you are taking this in.

Seems a bit familiar doesn't it FV.....

You are clearly trying to get Cal to respond to your bollocks about Ronaldo, and he obviously can't help himself as evidenced above, which will spark off another little spastic unwinnable war between yourselves.

FranklyVulgar

tell that to the chief!

Ish84045

I just CANNOT understand or begin to grasp how a MUFC supporter can be that in love with Ronaldo. Sure, he was 1 of our greatest individual players ever, he did a ton for us, he left us in a respected manner & he never utters anything but praise towards us...

BUT the fact remains - he LEFT United, not the other way around. Your loyalty should stop at wishing him well etc, but some peeps take it to the extent where you have question their priorities: CR7 > United > Football.

I just think it's a tad much tbh.

Ish84045

Shit, let's not derail the thread. Sorry fellas

marcosdeto

you are right, you cant, a goal is a goal

FranklyVulgar

Alright alright, point taken, my reply was just to Marcos, i wasnt even aware of these stats.

Here's another look at probably the best performance of the season so far.

adexkola

I see what you're saying, there's a point where if the goalkeeper makes the save, you have to hold your hands up and admit he played a blinder making the save. But the player needs to make the save difficult. Place it in the top or bottom corner with speed, and 99.9% it's not getting saved. If it does, fair fucks to the keeper.

Someone made the point a while back, but in 2008 we played at the Emirates, and Ronaldo scored a penalty against Lehmann, lower left corner. The referee told him to take it again, and the bastard put it in the same place, Lehmann couldn't reach it. That's what I meant.

Cal?

suddenly someone points out that Messi is below average in an aspect of the game and FV wants to scratch penalties from goals records.

marcosdeto

to be fair, he wasnt the only one

Ole's_toe_poke

Popcorn gif.

E-fiiiigggghhhhttt

Hectic

Fair enough, I just wanted to nip it in the bud, more for Cal than you as I could see his hands rubbing together with delight at the mention of Naldo.

Cal?

Again, if a Messi thread is only about praising him, perhaps it should say so in the title.

You should note that I didn't mention 'him' at all and kept it only to Messi's shoddy penalty record.

If FV gets all sensitive and deem every little critism of Messi as me trying to praise 'him', it's not my fault.