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Old 27th October 2011, 16:39   #161 (permalink)
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It's not the incidents themselves but the duration they last. The choice of 'something new' was probably wrong in my initial statement but things definitely seem to stick with Ravel, he'll be alright though, we just need to be patient.
For me it's the severity of the first one: hanging around with guys who have guns and intimidating a witness - that's not normal. Go clubbing until 5 in the morning - get told off for betting too much. But associating yourself with thugs while trying to have a footballing career under the most watchful manager in the world, is not something that leads to success.

He seems to have cleaned himself up a bit (or the PR team are doing their jobs better!). We know SAF loves to throw a lifeline to people in hopes that rewarding them helps them mature so we'll see.

I think he's shown a lot of personal arrogance and recklessness, which is why I said he had his head up his arse last game. There's one thing to have the freedom to roam, but you're still playing a position - he just seemed to want to be where the ball was no matter what was around him.
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Old 27th October 2011, 16:44   #162 (permalink)
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For me it's the severity of the first one: hanging around with guys who have guns and intimidating a witness - that's not normal. Go clubbing until 5 in the morning - get told off for betting too much. But associating yourself with thugs while trying to have a footballing career under the most watchful manager in the world, is not something that leads to success.

He seems to have cleaned himself up a bit (or the PR team are doing their jobs better!). We know SAF loves to throw a lifeline to people in hopes that rewarding them helps them mature so we'll see.

I think he's shown a lot of personal arrogance and recklessness, which is why I said he had his head up his arse last game. There's one thing to have the freedom to roam, but you're still playing a position - he just seemed to want to be where the ball was no matter what was around him.
First of all we don't even know if he was instructed by SAF to roam, if he was then there's nothing wrong with it. Even if he wasn't I liked what he was doing, he was going into the midfield and dictating play, you know that midfield which has a big sign hanging round it saying 'area most likely for you to break through into the first team.' I like that air of confidence and swagger about flair players anyway, he's of the Cantona/Ronaldo ilk and we need someone like that.
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Old 27th October 2011, 16:46   #163 (permalink)
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For me it's the severity of the first one: hanging around with guys who have guns and intimidating a witness - that's not normal. Go clubbing until 5 in the morning - get told off for betting too much. But associating yourself with thugs while trying to have a footballing career under the most watchful manager in the world, is not something that leads to success.

He seems to have cleaned himself up a bit (or the PR team are doing their jobs better!). We know SAF loves to throw a lifeline to people in hopes that rewarding them helps them mature so we'll see.
Mightn't be normal where you come from but I doubt your grew up in the same environment that he did.

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I think he's shown a lot of personal arrogance and recklessness, which is why I said he had his head up his arse last game. There's one thing to have the freedom to roam, but you're still playing a position - he just seemed to want to be where the ball was no matter what was around him.
This bit is just fecking weird. What on earth has his personal life got to with how he plays football?

Besides, he actually put in a very disciplined performance and did a lot of tracking back to help out his full-back. Something our firs-team wingers didn't do enough of in our previous match.
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Old 27th October 2011, 16:54   #164 (permalink)
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he just seemed to want to be where the ball was no matter what was around him.
This is meant to be a criticism, right?

Heaven forbid we encourage our developing young players to desire the ball at all times...

Instead of wanting to get rid of the ball at first opportunity - like lots of players his age would want to do - he wants to use it, and just be on it. I think it's fantastic.
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Old 27th October 2011, 16:57   #165 (permalink)
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For me it's the severity of the first one: hanging around with guys who have guns and intimidating a witness - that's not normal. Go clubbing until 5 in the morning - get told off for betting too much. But associating yourself with thugs while trying to have a footballing career under the most watchful manager in the world, is not something that leads to success.

He seems to have cleaned himself up a bit (or the PR team are doing their jobs better!). We know SAF loves to throw a lifeline to people in hopes that rewarding them helps them mature so we'll see.

I think he's shown a lot of personal arrogance and recklessness, which is why I said he had his head up his arse last game. There's one thing to have the freedom to roam, but you're still playing a position - he just seemed to want to be where the ball was no matter what was around him.
What he was involved in was serious. The club realised this and decided to support him throughout in the hope he could get on the right path, stay there and realise his prodigious talent. I have absolutely no problem with him roving all over the show so long as its to good effect - which it is at the level he's being playing at. After all he's an attacking "midfielder". The fact that he wants to be involved all the time is great - its shows he has the necessary confidence. One would never accuse Wayne Rooney of not "playing a position". We need flair players - that's what this club is all about isn't it?
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Old 27th October 2011, 17:21   #166 (permalink)
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When he was coming on I thought we'd take a striker off and play him further up as it might have been a risk having both Pogba and Morrison in midfield. This leads me to think that he was allowed to roam as he's a tricky one to fit into the system that he went into. If he was told that our left side was his defensive duty then he did extremely well. I don't remember seeing many player roaming right across the pitch but still being back in position for their attacks.
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Old 27th October 2011, 17:30   #167 (permalink)
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If anyone watches the Reserves and Academy regularly, then they'll know that Ravel has always been a team player. His on the pitch attitude has always been spot on.

It's a joy to watch him play honestly, always wanting the ball is a sign of a quality player IMO.
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Old 27th October 2011, 19:22   #168 (permalink)
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Sorry for just jumping in and asking a general question, but what are the chances that he'll gets run in the first team in league games? Or is that a unrealistic aim for him this season?
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Old 27th October 2011, 19:36   #169 (permalink)
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Mightn't be normal where you come from but I doubt your grew up in the same environment that he did.



This bit is just fecking weird. What on earth has his personal life got to with how he plays football?

Besides, he actually put in a very disciplined performance and did a lot of tracking back to help out his full-back. Something our firs-team wingers didn't do enough of in our previous match.
Never did. But if I was on a professional football team's youth squad with the basic knowledge that if I kept out of trouble I'd be a millionaire, I know who the first group of friends I'd drop...

Don't be daft. Or you've never played football before. Your personal life has everything to do with your footballing. See Rooney's personal problems and how they affected him, see drug use that has lead to players retiring early, see reckless gambling behaviors that ruin players. See Balloteli.

If his personal life hasn't cleaned up (which I said I thought it had), hanging around with guys carrying guns is certainly going to affect how you play. I'm confused how you could think otherwise.

And for all those complaining about me not liking that he roamed so entirely out of position that we left huge holes on the left (in my opinion) - that's my opinion. Our team is disciplined and even when Rooney wanders, he never wanders so far that he puts us at odds. Ravel had a very intriguing game, and I love swagger, but I don't like arrogance in the squad. Cantona had swagger and arrogance about the sport, he did not have any arrogance about United nor his position in it.

Cocky, arrogant, selfish, reckless off the pitch - i.e. handguns and intimidating witnesses = an attitude. You're not one person on the field and another off. You bring your personal life on the pitch.

He's our Balotelli - fantastic skill, wonderful swagger, arrogant, and with the possibility of danger about him. At least he respects SAF.
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Old 27th October 2011, 19:39   #170 (permalink)
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Personal problems off the pitch can make someone play badly. To suggest they would affect the role he plays on the pitch is absurd.

Not that it matters. Morrison put in an excellent, disciplined performance on the night. Unless you can remember an incident where he failed to carry out his defensive duties, made a reckless tackle, or took a selfish option?
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Old 27th October 2011, 19:40   #171 (permalink)
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Sorry for just jumping in and asking a general question, but what are the chances that he'll gets run in the first team in league games? Or is that a unrealistic aim for him this season?
I would presume his chances of being included in the match day squad for one or two games has improved greatly after his midweek display.
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Old 27th October 2011, 19:42   #172 (permalink)
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Sorry for just jumping in and asking a general question, but what are the chances that he'll gets run in the first team in league games? Or is that a unrealistic aim for him this season?
He'l start our last 2 league games i believe when we've already pocketed the league and rest our 1st team to prepare for the CL final

seriously though, i dont think there will be any starts this season. far too soon that. he might sneak in a couple of sub appearances though.
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Old 27th October 2011, 19:58   #173 (permalink)
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I would presume his chances of being included in the match day squad for one or two games has improved greatly after his midweek display.
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He'l start our last 2 league games i believe when we've already pocketed the league and rest our 1st team to prepare for the CL final

seriously though, i dont think there will be any starts this season. far too soon that. he might sneak in a couple of sub appearances though.
Yep, his midweek performance can't hurt for sure.

Even if it is sub appearances, or just him getting on the bench, its a sign of progression and will surely make him hungrier. If he gets on the bench without playing, he'll know he's close to getting his chance and that is surely enough motivation for him to push on further.
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Old 27th October 2011, 20:05   #174 (permalink)
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The thing is you never know with SAF, I wouldn't like to say he's a gambler because I feel there's a fair amount of calculation behind his decisions but it wouldn't surprise me if he threw either Morrison or Pogba in the deep end at one point this season. Or perhaps this is just wishful thinking.
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Old 28th October 2011, 01:35   #175 (permalink)
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I think the United tradition in youth is in Morrison's favour. The vast majority of United fans would love to see him given a chance to show what he can do in the Premier League. We'd love to see it this weekend! But face facts, Fergie sees him all the time in training and it's up to him to decide if and when he's ready
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Old 28th October 2011, 02:28   #176 (permalink)
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If he did we'd never know. Hell, he had affairs when playing and the press loved him so much they didn't report it!

But then he gave them the interviews they wanted. I wonder if anyone would get a pass like that these days. But then Jordan is possibly the most charismatic sporting great in American history outside of Cassius Clay.
That's not his name. His name is Muhammad Ali. He detests the name Cassius Clay as it was given to his name by the white slavemaster in America. He dropped the name Cassius Clay
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Old 28th October 2011, 02:39   #177 (permalink)
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Didn't know he detests his name, but yeah, this is true.

But Cassius Clay is possibly the coolest name ever given to someone, along with Lou Alcindor. And he had to go change his name too. What are the odds?
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Old 28th October 2011, 03:01   #178 (permalink)
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For me it's the severity of the first one: hanging around with guys who have guns and intimidating a witness - that's not normal. Go clubbing until 5 in the morning - get told off for betting too much. But associating yourself with thugs while trying to have a footballing career under the most watchful manager in the world, is not something that leads to success.

He seems to have cleaned himself up a bit (or the PR team are doing their jobs better!). We know SAF loves to throw a lifeline to people in hopes that rewarding them helps them mature so we'll see.

I think he's shown a lot of personal arrogance and recklessness, which is why I said he had his head up his arse last game. There's one thing to have the freedom to roam, but you're still playing a position - he just seemed to want to be where the ball was no matter what was around him.
am I really so bad?
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Old 28th October 2011, 03:21   #179 (permalink)
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Never did. But if I was on a professional football team's youth squad with the basic knowledge that if I kept out of trouble I'd be a millionaire, I know who the first group of friends I'd drop...

Don't be daft. Or you've never played football before. Your personal life has everything to do with your footballing. See Rooney's personal problems and how they affected him, see drug use that has lead to players retiring early, see reckless gambling behaviors that ruin players. See Balloteli.

If his personal life hasn't cleaned up (which I said I thought it had), hanging around with guys carrying guns is certainly going to affect how you play. I'm confused how you could think otherwise.

And for all those complaining about me not liking that he roamed so entirely out of position that we left huge holes on the left (in my opinion) - that's my opinion. Our team is disciplined and even when Rooney wanders, he never wanders so far that he puts us at odds. Ravel had a very intriguing game, and I love swagger, but I don't like arrogance in the squad. Cantona had swagger and arrogance about the sport, he did not have any arrogance about United nor his position in it.

Cocky, arrogant, selfish, reckless off the pitch - i.e. handguns and intimidating witnesses = an attitude. You're not one person on the field and another off. You bring your personal life on the pitch.

He's our Balotelli - fantastic skill, wonderful swagger, arrogant, and with the possibility of danger about him. At least he respects SAF.
I remember a little somebody named Roy Keane who has few incidences being locked up, brandishing an airgun or so in his youth.
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Old 28th October 2011, 08:12   #180 (permalink)
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I remember a little somebody named Roy Keane who has few incidences being locked up, brandishing an airgun or so in his youth.
That was Paul Ince.
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Old 28th October 2011, 17:25   #181 (permalink)
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7^2...

He'll be our number 7 in 2 seasons.
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Old 28th October 2011, 17:31   #182 (permalink)
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Or in 7 seasons he'll be our number 2.
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Old 28th October 2011, 17:41   #183 (permalink)
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Or in 7 seasons he'll be our number 2.
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Old 28th October 2011, 18:45   #184 (permalink)
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Or in 7 seasons he'll be our number 2.
what's wrong with Mike Phelan?
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Old 29th October 2011, 08:46   #185 (permalink)
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Let's do a little OTT. Has anyone else noticed a similarity between Morrison and the great Brazillian Rivaldo? Not just looks but style as well ? Granted our man has a long way to go in his career but the signs are more than promising.

On a bit of a cynical note, it would be good to see Ravel on the bench and to start staking a claim for a first team spot. After all Wilshere did it at the same age and there's every possibility that Ravel is going to be an even better player. However, is his immediate progress tied to that of Pogba's. As we all know the latter is also a great prospect and, at some stage a future star. However, he probably needs to have a season's loan somewhere first. Here's the cynical bit. Pogba is currently in contract talks which we understand have stalled with Wenger apparently watching proceedings closely. It's hardly likely that Ferguson is going to put Morrison forward - and not Pogba as well at this time in case the latter feels somewhat shafted. Just a thought.
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Old 29th October 2011, 08:49   #186 (permalink)
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what's wrong with Mike Phelan?
Seven years is a long time.
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Old 29th October 2011, 09:36   #187 (permalink)
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Let's do a little OTT. Has anyone else noticed a similarity between Morrison and the great Brazillian Rivaldo? Not just looks but style as well ? Granted our man has a long way to go in his career but the signs are more than promising.

On a bit of a cynical note, it would be good to see Ravel on the bench and to start staking a claim for a first team spot. After all Wilshere did it at the same age and there's every possibility that Ravel is going to be an even better player. However, is his immediate progress tied to that of Pogba's. As we all know the latter is also a great prospect and, at some stage a future star. However, he probably needs to have a season's loan somewhere first. Here's the cynical bit. Pogba is currently in contract talks which we understand have stalled with Wenger apparently watching proceedings closely. It's hardly likely that Ferguson is going to put Morrison forward - and not Pogba as well at this time in case the latter feels somewhat shafted. Just a thought.
Contract talks have stalled?...wwhere did you get that from...the rags?..hardly trustworthy
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Old 29th October 2011, 09:44   #188 (permalink)
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what's wrong with Mike Phelan?
i dont think the players respect him.
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Old 29th October 2011, 09:51   #189 (permalink)
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i dont think the players respect him.
A team with 3 league-wins in 4 years don't respect their assistant ? I find that somewhat hard to believe.
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Old 29th October 2011, 10:00   #190 (permalink)
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Contract talks have stalled?...wwhere did you get that from...the rags?..hardly trustworthy
Yes "stalled" may be an exaggeration. However, his contract runs out at the end of the season and he is almost certain to be wanting an imporved deal. How improved is the issue and whether or not United will provide it. Speculation that Wenger is keen on him is fairly wide but I must say it would be extraordinary if Arsenal were able to offer him substantially better terms than we would. After all they're not City or Chelsea !
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Old 29th October 2011, 10:20   #191 (permalink)
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Yes "stalled" may be an exaggeration. However, his contract runs out at the end of the season and he is almost certain to be wanting an imporved deal. How improved is the issue and whether or not United will provide it. Speculation that Wenger is keen on him is fairly wide but I must say it would be extraordinary if Arsenal were able to offer him substantially better terms than we would. After all they're not City or Chelsea !
Arsenal pay their young players a fair whack and he is more likely to get into their first team than yours. He's getting to an age now where he would want to be playing more than the odd carling cup game.

That being said, he'll sign a contract with you and probably go on loan to whatever team Fergie's son is manager of.
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Old 29th October 2011, 10:25   #192 (permalink)
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But he (Pogba) does play in a position where we've probably got the least quality, so if he has the kind of potential people think he does then there's nothing stopping him. It's not exactly as if we've got Keane and Scholes in central midfield.

Anyway of what I've seen (very little) they both look classy and talented but Morrison based on even that one cameo, looked on a different level to most young players you see. I just can't wait to see him again.
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Old 29th October 2011, 10:57   #193 (permalink)
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But he (Pogba) does play in a position where we've probably got the least quality, so if he has the kind of potential people think he does then there's nothing stopping him. It's not exactly as if we've got Keane and Scholes in central midfield.

Anyway of what I've seen (very little) they both look classy and talented but Morrison based on even that one cameo, looked on a different level to most young players you see. I just can't wait to see him again.
When Pogba came on at Leeds and again at Aldershot he played quite deep and was a link between defence and attack. It seems he could ultimately play the midfield holding role with success. However, like all young players he gradually needs more experience at the higher level. Where does he get that - by being given more opportunities at United or, as is customary these days, out on loan elsewhere?

I think Morrison is different as he has loads of confidence, arrogance even, and I'd imagine wouldn't worry a jot about playing in the PL right now. What's more Fergie will want to keep an eye on him so a loan spell is unlikely.

One can readily see the future of United's midfield as being Cleverley, Morrison and Pogba. However, the midfield needs strenghtening now - certainly with a ball winning defensive midfielder who is likely to be around for the next four or five seasons. So what effect would a new signing(s) have on the futures of these three ?
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Old 29th October 2011, 11:17   #194 (permalink)
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When Pogba came on at Leeds and again at Aldershot he played quite deep and was a link between defence and attack. It seems he could ultimately play the midfield holding role with success. However, like all young players he gradually needs more experience at the higher level. Where does he get that - by being given more opportunities at United or, as is customary these days, out on loan elsewhere?

I think Morrison is different as he has loads of confidence, arrogance even, and I'd imagine wouldn't worry a jot about playing in the PL right now. What's more Fergie will want to keep an eye on him so a loan spell is unlikely.

One can readily see the future of United's midfield as being Cleverley, Morrison and Pogba. However, the midfield needs strenghtening now - certainly with a ball winning defensive midfielder who is likely to be around for the next four or five seasons. So what effect would a new signing(s) have on the futures of these three ?
Pogba I reckon could do with a loan. He looks like someone who needs higher pressure games than reserves would provide. If Fergie thinks he's already ready for first team action then great but I doubt that's the case. This is one position I reckon he's very cautious in throwing youngsters in.

Morisson I can see being given games out wide in the first team pretty soon but I need to see more of both to properly come to any conclusions.
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Old 29th October 2011, 14:14   #195 (permalink)
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Just scored from the reserves. Very good goal from him, according to people on twitter.
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2-2! All about Morrison - picks out Lingard with delightful pass, gets in the end of the cross, dummies and coolly slots it home.
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Old 29th October 2011, 14:17   #196 (permalink)
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amortising?
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Old 29th October 2011, 15:13   #197 (permalink)
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Give this lad a game in the PL next home game.

Good opportunity to do so with Young out injured.
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Old 29th October 2011, 15:15   #198 (permalink)
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amortising?
Probably an autocorrect spelling error. Calm down It was clearly meaning Morrison
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Old 29th October 2011, 15:17   #199 (permalink)
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Give this lad a game in the PL next home game.

Good opportunity to do so with Young out injured.
Next league game is Sunderland at OT. I kind of wanted City in the CC quarter final, but I'm glad in a way we got Palace, as it's a chance to see Morrison again.
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Old 29th October 2011, 15:20   #200 (permalink)
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I know it won't happen but I'd like him on the bench for CL midweek incase we get ourselves in a comfortable position and can afford to take a risk in bringing him on.
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