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Old 21st August 2010, 11:11   #1 (permalink)
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Wenger on Scholes: "I'm sorry, for me he's not been a fair player."

Arsene Wenger labels Paul Scholes a dirty player | The Sun |Sport|Football


Scholes is a dirty player
ARSENE WENGER has launched an astonishing attack on Paul Scholes, branding him 'dirty'.
By SHAUN CUSTIS


Arsenal's boss claims the Manchester United veteran has 'a darker side' and insisted: "I'm sorry, for me he's not been a fair player."

The comments will anger United boss Alex Ferguson especially as Scholes, 35, produced a star-man display in Monday's 3-0 win against Newcastle.

It is not the first time Wenger has singled out a United player. Last season he intimated Darren Fletcher constantly got away with fouling.

When asked about Scholes, Wenger said: "Who wouldn't want a quality player like Paul Scholes in his team?

"But ask me if he's been a fair player, I say no. I'm sorry, for me he's not been fair.

"There's a little bit of a darker side in him. I don't like some things he does.

"It's not because you are older suddenly that you are a saint."

Asked if there was a specific tackle he had in mind, such as Scholes' reckless challenge on Jose Reyes in the 2004 FA Cup semi-final, Wenger said: "With Paul Scholes you have more than one.

"I can remember a few. Unfair? Of course."
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Old 21st August 2010, 11:12   #2 (permalink)
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Old 21st August 2010, 11:14   #3 (permalink)
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Oh dear.
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Old 21st August 2010, 11:15   #4 (permalink)
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Wasn't this an Interview for football focus originally?
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Old 21st August 2010, 11:17   #5 (permalink)
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Wasn't this an Interview for football focus originally?
Hang on, I'll check the United forum.
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Old 21st August 2010, 11:24   #6 (permalink)
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bout time. Scholes has always been dirty and not in good way.
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Old 21st August 2010, 11:46   #7 (permalink)
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Old 21st August 2010, 11:47   #8 (permalink)
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Hopefully Custis is just being a knob, and that's not all Wenger said about Scholes. It's hard to talk about the lad without heaping praise on him for the career he's had

I've no doubt this 'can't tackle' idea is a fallicy, he can tackle perfectly fine, and some of the late or clumsy ones he puts in do look a little... tasty! I reckon he knows what he's doing sometimes

But hey, who's perfect? In a football sense, Scholes aint too far off
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Old 21st August 2010, 11:52   #9 (permalink)
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Hopefully Custis is just being a knob, and that's not all Wenger said about Scholes. It's hard to talk about the lad without heaping praise on him for the career he's had

I've no doubt this 'can't tackle' idea is a fallicy, he can tackle perfectly fine, and some of the late or clumsy ones he puts in do look a little... tasty! I reckon he knows what he's doing sometimes

But hey, who's perfect? In a football sense, Scholes aint too far off
Yeah it's not all he said by any means, he talked about what a great player he is and how important he's been to us over the years, going on to say he would have loved to have him in his team. He mentioned the tackling thing, which I think is fair enough, but it was a reasonable summary I thought. The media have of course only highlighted the potentially controversial bit.
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Old 21st August 2010, 11:55   #10 (permalink)
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Wenger's always moaning about our physical side. Before Scholes it was Fletcher, before Fletcher it was Ruud, before Ruud it was Keane. I remember that game where Phil Neville played probably his best ever game and he complained about that too.

The irony of course his Arsenal side up until 2005 being very physical themselves and picking up lots of yellow/red cards. Since they've lost that they've won fuck all.

Go figure, Arsene.
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Old 21st August 2010, 11:58   #11 (permalink)
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Bit rich coming from a guy who had players like Keown, Vieira and Bergkamp in his side.
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Old 21st August 2010, 12:00   #12 (permalink)
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To be fair to Wenger, he also praised Scholes ability, longevity etc but Cuntis has basically edited it to look like some anti-Scholes rant

Also, if the shoe was one the other foot and an Arsenal player got away with as much as Scholes has over the years with people laughing it off, then we'd be screaming blue murder aswell.

Before anyone screams Vieira, he got pinged and was known to be a filthy cunt unlike our Paul who is percieved as clumsy, and who's fairly regular shockers bring chuckles rather than the condemnation they should at times.

Not that I'm complaining mind
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Old 21st August 2010, 12:01   #13 (permalink)
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Old 21st August 2010, 12:04   #14 (permalink)
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If Scholes was Italian then I'm sure the media would label him a typical foreign hatchet man, but he's successfully kept himself a low profile. That said he doesn't often make the really bad challenges where you think 'he's going to break someones leg'.
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Old 21st August 2010, 12:05   #15 (permalink)
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To be fair to Wenger, he also praised Scholes ability, longevity etc but Cuntis has basically edited it to look like some anti-Scholes rant

Also, if the shoe was one the other foot and an Arsenal player got away with as much as Scholes has over the years with people laughing it off, then we'd be screaming blue murder aswell.

Before anyone screams Vieira, he got pinged and was known to be a filthy cunt unlike our Paul who is percieved as clumsy, and who's fairly regular shockers bring chuckles rather than the condemnation they should at times.

Not that I'm complaining mind
Thing is none of his tackles are worthy of a red card, now a days most of his bad tackles results in a yellow card which is a fair punishment. He has got the 5th highest no. of yellow cards ever since the premiership started, so it's not like he gets away with his tackles. In contrast, I feel that these days his reputation as a bad tackler sometimes goes against him(for eg- the Spurs match, last season)
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Old 21st August 2010, 12:05   #16 (permalink)
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Old 21st August 2010, 12:06   #17 (permalink)
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If Scholes was Italian then I'm sure the media would label him a typical foreign hatchet man, but he's successfully kept himself a low profile. That said he doesn't often make the really bad challenges where you think 'he's going to break someones leg'.
That's what I said in the other thread where this was mentioned. He's dirty but he's not dangerous.
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Old 21st August 2010, 12:08   #18 (permalink)
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Wenger on Scholes
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Old 21st August 2010, 12:12   #19 (permalink)
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Thing is none of his tackles are worthy of a red card, now a days most of his bad tackles results in a yellow card which is a fair punishment. He has got the 5th highest no. of yellow cards ever since the premiership started, so it's not like he gets away with his tackles. In contrast, I feel that these days his reputation as a bad tackler sometimes goes against him(for eg- the Spurs match, last season)
It helped/helps him IMO. He gets away with a lot of booking offences due to his reputation as nothing more than an innocent player who can't tackle.

I remember the title game at Wigan in 2008, he should have got a second yellow but the perception of him being all sweetness and light probably saved his and our bacon.

Long may that continue, but I can see why other managers and players would be a bit miffed by the whole thing. It's a clear showing of favouritism by the refs and the commentators that laugh it off IMO.
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Old 21st August 2010, 12:36   #20 (permalink)
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It helped/helps him IMO. He gets away with a lot of booking offences due to his reputation as nothing more than an innocent player who can't tackle.

I remember the title game at Wigan in 2008, he should have got a second yellow but the perception of him being all sweetness and light probably saved his and our bacon.

Long may that continue, but I can see why other managers and players would be a bit miffed by the whole thing. It's a clear showing of favouritism by the refs and the commentators that laugh it off IMO.
That's hardly a phenomenon peculiar to Scholes though, is it? How many times have you seen Gerrard, Terry, Rooney and many others get away with nasty challenges?

I'm of the opinion that Scholes knows what he's doing with some of his, shall we say, "over zealous" challenges, but on the other hand he's often on the receiving end of similar tackles and accepts them in the same unfussy manner as he dishes them out.

The thing about Wenger is that he can dress an insult up as a compliment, presumably in an attempt to appear magnanimous. To suggest a "dark side" when referring to Paul Scholes is way over the top, and particularly when he has had so many players in his own teams that have been more nasty and vindictive than Scholes - Keown, Lauren and Bergkamp to name a few.
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Old 21st August 2010, 12:43   #21 (permalink)
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bout time. Scholes has always been dirty and not in good way.
oh dear.
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Old 21st August 2010, 12:53   #22 (permalink)
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Theres already a thread on this in the Man Utd forum, its pretty easy to find and has reached three pages.
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Old 21st August 2010, 13:02   #23 (permalink)
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A Man. Utd fan's reaction to bad Scholes tackle:

" Good ol' Scholsy!"

A Man Utd fan's reaction to a bad Gerrard tackle:

"Cheating scouse twat "
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Old 21st August 2010, 13:05   #24 (permalink)
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I should imagine there's a fair amount of malice behind some of Scholes' tackles, and it'd be completely hypocritical for a United fan to deny this.

Overall, Wenger was most likely quite complimentary.
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Old 21st August 2010, 13:09   #25 (permalink)
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If Scholes was Italian then I'm sure the media would label him a typical foreign hatchet man, but he's successfully kept himself a low profile. That said he doesn't often make the really bad challenges where you think 'he's going to break someones leg'.
He's not that bad though. He's so late sometimes it's almost comical, but we're not talking the Gattuso league of arguably being lucky to still be on the pitch by half time each game. These challenges are still relatively few and far between

And they are late rather than nasty for the most part too

It's a tough ask to knock Scholes for his professionalism if you ask me. But from what you've said here doesn't sound like Wenger has really done that, and Custis has a reputation for producing utter contrived shite that preceeds him
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Old 21st August 2010, 13:09   #26 (permalink)
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Wenger is the most hypocritical cunt in the game. Hes had more of his fair share of "dirty" players, but of course, he never saw it, prick. Hes only saying this, because he like the rest of the league knows, scholes is probably going to have a big season this year, and wants to limit him as much as possible.
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Old 21st August 2010, 13:10   #27 (permalink)
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A Man. Utd fan's reaction to bad Scholes tackle:

" Good ol' Scholsy!"

A Man Utd fan's reaction to a bad Gerrard tackle:

"Cheating scouse twat "
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Old 21st August 2010, 13:16   #28 (permalink)
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Has Scholes ever seriously injured someone? I don't recall anything.

He kicks players, and (often) mistimes challenges, but I don't remember too many two-footed potential leg breakers (see Gerrard above).

And he certainly would never spit on an opponent (see Fabregas).
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Old 21st August 2010, 13:28   #29 (permalink)
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A Man. Utd fan's reaction to bad Scholes tackle:

" Good ol' Scholsy!"

A Man Utd fan's reaction to a bad Gerrard tackle:

"Cheating scouse twat "
Wow, you don't say.

Interesting though that we're not debating Wenger's assertion that Gerrard is an "unfair" player and has "a dark side".
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Old 21st August 2010, 13:29   #30 (permalink)
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Well, that can't possibly be a two footed 'studs first' tackle by the saintlike captain of Liverpool FC. It must be photoshopped...
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Old 21st August 2010, 13:30   #31 (permalink)
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bout time. Scholes has always been dirty and not in good way.
Liverpool supporters lost all right to comment on whats right and wrong when they started attacking ambulances
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Old 21st August 2010, 13:39   #32 (permalink)
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bout time. Scholes has always been dirty and not in good way.
bout time for what ? What do you think this interview will change ? It's not like Wenger is telling the world a brand new scoop
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Old 21st August 2010, 13:50   #33 (permalink)
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The foolish hypocrisy of Wenger is obviously infectious because it's spreading throughout this thread.
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Old 21st August 2010, 13:51   #34 (permalink)
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just wait till Arsenal play Blackburn later, then they'll get kicked all over again
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Old 25th August 2010, 18:01   #35 (permalink)
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From RoM

“It depends what you call clever and what you call dirty,” said Wenger, who was asked whether he felt Scholes tackled unfairly. “Unfairly, of course, unfairly,” he replied. “How many times have you watched Paul Scholes? Have you seen only fair tackles from Paul Scholes? I don’t want to come out on one specifically but I can remember a few. [They are] a bit in the past, yes, but look at him playing now. He still doesn’t hide. No, I don’t [think his approach is OK]. You ask me about the quality of the player – who wouldn’t like a Paul Scholes in his team? You ask me: ‘Was he a fair player?’ I say: ‘No, I’m sorry, for me he was not a fair player.’ I just think I respect him highly as a quality player. I did not like some things he did on the football pitch and I have the right to say that. It’s not because you are older, suddenly, that you are a saint.”

Wenger then attempted to praise our player but couldn’t do so without again questioning his character.

“Paul Scholes is still one of the greatest football players in England and his contribution to the success of Manchester United is absolutely huge,” he continued. “The regret I have personally is he was not always the fairest player. There’s a little bit of a darker side in him, sometimes, that I did not like.”

Scholes makes some crappy tackles, Scholes makes some great tackles, but this isn’t a question of ability. Wenger isn’t saying Scholes is poor tackler, he is saying that Scholes has a side of him which is intentionally dirty. Wenger talks of Scholes’ “approach to the game”, not his ability to tackle or not. To say his approach to the game is unfair, is dirty, and isn’t OK, is an accusation over how Scholes chooses to play. If there is a “darker side” to him, then that is again accuses Scholes of intentionally playing in a less favourable way.

We’ve highlighted a selection of United and Arsenal players’ disciplinary record, looking at fouls and yellow cards. In brackets is also their “dirty” ranking in comparison to all the other players in the league.

There are some United and Arsenal players who have been omitted because it seemed pointless including every single player. For example, Dimitar Berbatov in 09/10 committed 36 fouls or Arshavin with 38 fouls, but neither of these really seem relevant to the discussion of “dirty” players.

However, every season, the player with the most yellow cards and most fouls has been included.

The player who has committed the most fouls and most yellow cards has been included for each season, just for the sake of interest.

Fouls 2009/2010
Kevin Davies – 103 (1)
Alex Song – 54 (21)
Vassiriki Diaby – 49 (28)
Antonio Valencia – 41 (50)
Patrice Evra – 36 (68)
Darren Fletcher – 35 (75)
Cesc Fabreagas – 30 (109)
Paul Scholes – 30 (109)

Yellow cards 2009/2010
Fabrice Muamba – 11 (1)
Alex Song – 10 (2)
Kevin Davies – 9 (3)
Paul Scholes – 9 (3)
Cesc Fabregas – 5 (66)
Patrice Evra – 5 (66)
Darren Fletcher – 5 (66)
Antonio Valencia – 3 (131)
Vassiriki Diaby – 2 (197)

Valencia was United’s “dirtiest” player last season and on average received 1 yellow card per 14 fouls. Song and Diaby were Arsenal’s “dirtiest” players and received 1 yellow card per 5 fouls and 25 fouls respectively. Fabregas committed as many fouls as Scholes but the United man received more yellow cards, on average 1 per 3 fouls.

Fouls 2008/2009
Kevin Davies – 110 (1)
Neves Denilson – 57 (12)
Robin van Persie – 46 (23)
Alex Song – 44 (30)
Nemanja Vidic – 39 (51)
Cesc Fabregas – 33 (84)
Vassiriki Diaby – 31 (96)
Darren Fletcher – 28 (121)
Paul Scholes – 17 (211)

Yellow cards 2008/2009
Marouane Fellaini – 12 (1)
Wilson Palacios – 12 (1)
Wayne Rooney – 8 (12)
Gael Clichy – 7 (24)
Cesc Fabregas – 7 (24)
Patrce Evra – 6 (44)
Alex Song – 6 (44)
Vassiriki Diaby – 5 (65)
Nemanja Vidic – 5 (65)
Robin van Persie – 5 (65)
Kevin Davies – 4 (91)
Darren Fletcher – 4 (91)
Neves Denilson – 3 (131)
Paul Scholes – 3 (131)

Vidic was United’s “dirtiest” player and received an average of 1 yellow card per 8 fouls. Denilson was Arsenal’s “dirtiest” player and received an average of 1 yellow per 19 fouls. Scholes received an average of 1 yellow per 6 fouls, Fabregas with 1 per 5 fouls.

Fouls 2007/2008
John Carew – 93 (1)
Emmanuel Adebayor – 57 (15)
Mathieu Flamini – 56 (17)
Wes Brown – 47 (30)
Gael Clichy – 39 (52)
Patrice Evra – 36 (65)
Nemanja Vidic – 35 (73)
Paul Scholes – 31 (100)
Francesc Fabregas – 29 (114)

Yellow cards 2007/2008
Michael Brown – 11 (1)
Nicky Butt – 11 (1)
El-Hadji Diouf – 11 (1)
Cesc Fabregas – 9 (8)
Wes Brown – 8 (13)
Wayne Rooney – 8 (13)
Gael Clichy – 6 (33)
Mathieu Flamini – 5 (56)
Nemanja Vidic – 5 (56)
Patrice Evra – 4 (100)
Emmanuel Adebayor – 3 (139)
Paul Scholes – 3 (139)

Wes Brown was United’s “dirtiest” player and collected on average 1 yellow per 5 fouls. Adebayor was Arsenal’s and collected on average 1 yellow per 19 fouls. Scholes was given 1 yellow per 10 fouls, Fabregas 1 yellow per 3 fouls.

Fouls 2006-2007
Kevin Davies – 88 (1)
Wayne Rooney – 48 (33)
Cesc Fabregass- 45 (43)
Paul Scholes – 43 (48)
Nemanja Vidic – 36 (73)
Gilberto – 34 (83)
Gabriel Heinze – 28 (107)
Kolo Toure – 27 (119)

Yellow cards 2006-2007
Nigel Reo-Coker – 13 (1)
Jens Lehmann – 8 (17)
Robin van Persie – 8 (17)
Paul Scholes – 8 (17)
Cesc Fabregas – 7 (27)
Nemanja Vidic – 7 (27)
Wayne Rooney – 6 (40)
Kolo Toure – 6 (40)
Gabriel Heinze – 5 (60)
Patrice Evra – 4 (91)

Rooney was United’s “dirtiest” player and picked up 1 yellow per 8 fouls. Fabregas was Arsenal’s “dirtiest” player and picked up 1 yellow per 6 fouls. Scholes was United’s second “dirtiest” player and earned 1 yellow per 5 fouls.

Fouls 2005-2006
Kevin Davies – 108 (1)
Gilberto – 55 (24)
Wayne Rooney – 50 (33)
Alan Smith – 47 (39)
Cesc Fabregas – 44 (47)
Ruud van Nistelroy – 44 (47)
Jose Antonio Reyes – 41 (56)
Darren Fletcher – 32 (97)
Thierry Henry – 32 (97)
Lauren – 30 (113)
Gary Neville – 30 (113)
Paul Scholes – 25 (162)

Yellow cards 2005-2006
Phil Neville – 12 (1)
Wayne Rooney – 8 (15)
Lauren – 6 (38)
Cesc Fabregas – 5 (48)
Jose Antonio Reyes – 5 (48)
Gilberto – 5 (48)
Ruud van Nistelrooy – 5 (48)
Alan Smith – 4 (84)
Darren Fletcher – 3 (136)
Gary Neville – 3 (136)
Paul Scholes – 3 (136)
Thierry Henry – 2 (188)

Rooney was our “dirtiest” player and was given 1 yellow per 6 fouls. Gilberto was Arsenal’s “dirtiest” player and was given 1 yellow per 11 fouls. Scholes collected 1 yellow per 8 fouls.

Fouls 2004-2005
Kevin Davies – 95 (1)
Patrick Vieira – 89 (2)
Alan Smith – 45 (39)
Paul Scholes – 44 (43)
Gabriel Heinze – 38 (76)
Ashley Cole – 36 (84)
Kolou Toure – 35 (88)
Roy Keane – 34 (89)
Jose Antonio Reyes – 32 (107)
Dennis Bergkamp – 30 (119)
Francesc Fabregas – 28 (140)
John O’Shea – 28 (140)
Ruud van Nistelrooy – 25 (160)
Thierry Henry – 24 (169)

Yellow cards 2004-2005
Ray Parlour – 11 (1)
Patrick Vieira – 9 (4)
Roy Keane – 9 (4)
Ashley Cole – 7 (18)
Wayne Rooney – 7 (18)
Cesc Fabregas – 4 (67)
Gabriel Heinze – 4 (67)
Paul Scholes – 4 (67)
Jose Antonio Reyes – 3 (111)
Alan Smith – 3 (111)
Thierry Henry – 2 (175)
Dennis Bergkamp – 1 (240)

Patrick Vieira was Arsenal’s “dirtiest” player and collected 1 yellow per 10 fouls. Alan Smith was United’s “dirtiest” player and collected 1 yellow per 15 fouls. Scholes picked up 1 yellow per 11 fouls. Dennis Bergkamp on average picked up 1 yellow per 30 fouls.

Fouls 2003-2004
Patrick Vieira – 93 (1)
Phil Neville – 51 (23)
Gilberto – 50 (27)
Sol Campbell – 43 (45)
Ray Parlous – 43 (45)
Mikael Silvestre – 41 (53)
Theirry Henry – 36 (83)
Kolo Toure – 36 (83)
Paul Scholes – 31 (111)

Yellow cards 2003-2004
Paul Ince – 14 (1)
Patrick Vieira – 10 (4)
Ray Parlour – 7 (25)
Ashley Cole – 5 (58)
P Neville – 5 (58)
G Neville – 5 (58)
Lauren – 5 (58)
Paul Scholes – 5 (58)

Fouls 2002-2003
Garry Flitcroft – 83 (1)
Thierry Henry – 54 (20)
Ruud van Nistelrooy – 50 (27)
Gilberto – 47 (35)
Patrick Vieira – 45 (39)
Ray Parlous – 42 (51)
Paul Scholes – 39 (63

Yellow cards 2002-2003
Ivan Campo – 13 (1)
Thierry Henry – 8 (16)
Phil Neville – 7 (20)
Martin Keown – 6 (33)
Patrick Vieira – 6 (33)
Lauren – 6 (33)
David Beckham – 5 (61)
Ashley Cole – 5 (61)
Roy Keane – 4 (87)
Paul Scholes – 4 (87)

Fouls 2001-2002

Patrick Vieira – 86 (1)
Ray Parlour – 50 (26)
Lauren – 42 (50)
Nicky Butt – 39 (65)
Ruud van Nistelrooy – 38 (71)
Dennis Bergkamp – 37 (78)
Paul Scholes – 33 (108)

Yellow cards 2001-2002

Robbie Savage – 14 (1)
Patrick Vieira – 11 (2)
Paul Scholes – 9 (5)
Lauren – 8 (12)
Ray Parlous – 7 (27)

Fouls 2000-2001
Olivier Dacourt – 84 (1)
Patrick Vieira – 65 (12)
Nicky Butt – 51 (23)
Paul Scholes – 43 (44)

Yellow cards 2000-2001
Olivier Dacourt – 13 (1)
Nicky Butt – 8 (20)
Patrick Vieira – 6 (48)
Tony Adams – 6 (48)
Wes Brown – 5 (66)
Paul Scholes – 3 (137)

Paul Scholes isn’t the dirty player Arsene Wenger makes him out to be. Given this is the manager who is quick to accuse others of making nasty fouls, even intentionally going out to hurt his players, only to “not see” his own players guilty of the same.

“There was a bit of an over-reaction with the way it was treated,” he said of what Owen Coyle described as the ‘assault’ of William Gallas on Bolton’s Mark Davies. “If it is a bad, malicious tackle I can understand that it is shown every half an hour, but the way that happened, it can happen every game.”

Wenger was asked the question and I don’t expect him to say “no comment” but you would expect him to be a bit more dignified and respectful. Agreed, Scholes is one of the best midfielders in the country, but trying to drag his name threw the mud and bring him down a peg or two by referring to a non-existent “dark side” is fairly insulting. Cesc Fabregas has a worse disciplinary record than Scholesy, does that make him a dirty player too? Did Wenger say that former captain Patrick Vieira’s approach to the game wasn’t OK or wasn’t fair? Course not.

So, if Scholes has such a dirty side, why do so many his central midfield opponents speak so highly of him? If his approach to football was unfair, then surely those who have played against him would know all about it, right? After all, they would be the ones on the end of his dirty tackles.

Zinedine Zidane – “He’s almost untouchable in what he does. I never tire of watching him play. You rarely come across the complete footballer, but Scholes is as close to it as you can get. One of my regrets is that the opportunity to play alongside him never presented itself during my career.”

Patrick Vieira – “The player in the Premiership I admire most? Easy – Scholes.”

Tony Adams – “I really rate Paul Scholes, because he hasn’t got the high profile of many of the Manchester United players, he doesn’t get too much attention, but he is one very good player. He is an intelligent player, he works hard and he scores some great goals. He is not flamboyant and is a quiet lad off the pitch but he is a tremendous asset to Manchester United and to England. He has already got my vote as player of the year.”


Cesc Fabregas – “He is the one whose level I aspire to. He is the best player in the Premier League.”

Thierry Henry – “I can’t understand why Scholes has never won the player of the year award. He should have won it long ago. Maybe it’s because he doesn’t seek the limelight like some of the other ’stars’.”

Edgar Davids – “I’m not the best, Paul Scholes is.”

Alan Shearer – “If you ask footballers to pick out the player they most admire, so many of them will pick Paul Scholes. He can tackle, and his passing and shooting is of the highest level. He’s the most consistent and naturally gifted player we’ve had for a long, long time.”

Eidur Gudjohnsen – “I’m more an admirer of Paul Scholes than I am of Ronaldo. Ronaldo is a fantastic player, but he has 10 other great players around him every week…Scholes is one of the most complete footballers I’ve ever seen. His one-touch play is phenomenal. Whenever I have played against him, I never felt I could get close to him.”

Oddly, not a single one of the players has a bad word to say about Scholes. No mention of his dark side, his dirtiness or his unfair approach to the game.

I guess it’s too much to ask for Wenger to show the same class.
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Old 25th August 2010, 18:02   #36 (permalink)
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The point is he got away with it for years.
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Old 25th August 2010, 18:07   #37 (permalink)
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RoM presented stats showing how many fouls Scholes has made over the past 10 years, stats showing how many yellow cards Scholes had picked up in this time and how many fouls on average he commits before being booked, all in comparison to several Arsenal players.

A popular reoccurring theme from Arsenal fans: If Scholes has been awarded more fouls/yellow cards, it’s because he’s “dirty”. If an Arsenal player has been awarded more fouls/yellow cards, it’s because Arsenal players are treated more harshly by the referee. However, if Scholes has been awarded fewer fouls/yellow cards it’s because the referee lets him off because he’s a United player/England. If an Arsenal player has been awarded fewer fouls/yellow cards it’s because they’re not a very dirty player.

To give an even clearer picture, the appearances of each player have also been factored in, so we can see just how “dirty” these players are, looking at the average amount of fouls they commit per appearance.

2009/2010

Paul Scholes
Appearances: 28
Fouls: 30
Fouls per appearance: 1.1
Yellow cards: 9
Yellow card per appearance: 0.3
Fouls per card: 3

Cesc Fabregas
Appearances: 27
Fouls: 30
Fouls per appearance: 1.1
Yellow cards: 5
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.2
Fouls per card: 6

Vassiriki Diaby
Appearances: 29
Fouls: 49
Fouls per appearance: 1.7
Yellow cards: 2
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.1
Fouls per card: 25

Alex Song
Appearances: 26
Fouls: 51
Fouls per appearances: 2
Yellow cards: 10
Yellow card per appearance: 0.4
Fouls per card: 5

2008/2009

Paul Scholes

Appearances: 21
Fouls: 17
Fouls per appearance: 0.8
Yellow cards: 3
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.1
Fouls per card: 6

Alex Song
Appearances: 31
Fouls: 44
Fouls per appearance: 1.4
Yellow cards: 6
Yellow card per appearance: 0.2
Fouls per card: 7

Cesc Fabregas
Appearances: 22
Fouls: 33
Fouls per appearance: 1.5
Yellow cards: 7
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.3
Fouls per card: 5

Denilson
Appearances: 37
Fouls: 57
Fouls per appearance: 1.5
Yellow cards: 3
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.1
Fouls per card: 19

Robin van Persie
Appearances: 28
Fouls per appearance: 1.6
Fouls: 46
Yellow cards: 5
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.2
Fouls per card: 9

2007/2008

Cesc Fabregas

Appearances: 32
Fouls: 29
Fouls per appearance: 0.9
Yellow cards: 9
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.3
Fouls per card: 3

Paul Scholes
Appearances: 24
Fouls: 31
Fouls per appearance: 1.3
Yellow cards: 3
Yellow card per appearance: 0.1
Fouls per card: 10

Emmanuel Adebayor
Appearances: 36
Fouls: 57
Fouls per appearance: 1.6
Yellow cards: 3
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.1
Fouls per card: 19

Mathieu Flamini
Appearances: 30
Fouls: 56
Fouls per appearance: 1.9
Yellow cards: 5
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.2
Fouls per card: 11

2006/2007

Cesc Fabregas

Appearances: 38
Fouls: 45
Fouls per appearance: 1.2
Yellow cards: 7
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.2
Fouls per card: 6

Paul Scholes
Appearances: 30
Fouls: 43
Fouls per appearance: 1.4
Yellow cards: 8
Yellow card per appearance: 0.3
Fouls per card: 5

2005/2006

Paul Scholes

Appearances: 20
Fouls: 25
Fouls per appearance: 1.3
Yellow cards: 3
Yellow card per appearance: 0.2
Fouls per card: 8

Cesc Fabregas
Appearances: 35
Fouls: 44
Fouls per appearance: 1.3
Yellow cards: 5
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.1
Fouls per card: 9

Lauren
Appearances: 22
Fouls: 30
Fouls per appearance: 1.4
Yellow cards: 6
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.3
Fouls per card: 5

Jose Antonio Reyes
Appearances: 26
Fouls: 41
Fouls per appearance: 1.6
Yellow cards: 5
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.2
Fouls per card: 8

Gilberto
Appearances: 33
Fouls: 55
Fouls per appearance: 1.7
Yellow cards: 5
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.2
Fouls per card: 11

2004/2005

Paul Scholes

Appearances: 33
Fouls: 44
Fouls per appearance: 1.3
Yellow cards: 4
Yellow card per appearance: 0.1
Fouls per card: 11

Patrick Vieira
Appearances: 32
Fouls: 89
Fouls per appearance: 2.3
Yellow cards: 9
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.3
Fouls per card: 10

2003/2004

Paul Scholes

Appearances: 28
Fouls: 31
Fouls per appearance: 1.1
Yellow cards: 5
Yellow card per appearance: 0.2
Fouls per card: 6

Gilberto
Appearances: 32
Fouls: 50
Fouls per appearance: 1.6
Yellow cards: 2
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.1
Fouls per card: 25

Ray Parlour
Appearances: 26
Fouls: 43
Fouls per appearance: 1.7
Yellow cards: 7
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.3
Fouls per card: 6

Patrick Vieira
Appearances: 29
Fouls: 93
Fouls per appearance: 3.2
Yellow cards: 10
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.3
Fouls per card: 9

2002/2003

Paul Scholes

Appearances: 33
Fouls: 39
Fouls per appearance: 1.2
Yellow cards: 4
Yellow card per appearance: 0.1
Fouls per card: 10

Thierry Henry
Appearances: 37
Fouls: 54
Fouls per appearance: 1.5
Yellow cards: 8
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.2
Fouls per card: 7

Patrick Vieira

Appearances: 24
Fouls: 45
Fouls per appearance: 1.9
Yellow cards: 6
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.3
Fouls per card: 8

Ray Parlour
Appearances: 19
Fouls: 42
Fouls per appearance: 2.2
Yellow cards: 4
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.2
Fouls per card: 11

2001/2002

Paul Scholes

Appearances: 35
Fouls: 33
Fouls per appearance: 0.9
Yellow cards: 9
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.3
Fouls per card: 4

Lauren
Appearances: 27
Fouls: 42
Fouls per appearance: 1.6
Yellow cards: 8
Yellow card per appearance: 0.3
Fouls per card: 5

Ray Parlour
Appearances: 27
Fouls: 50
Fouls per appearance: 1.9
Yellow cards: 7
Yellow card per appearance: 0.3
Fouls per card: 7

Patrick Vieira
Appearances: 36
Fouls: 86
Fouls per appearance: 2.4
Yellow cards: 11
Fouls per card: 8

2000/2001

Paul Scholes

Appearances: 32
Fouls: 43
Fouls per appearance: 1.3
Yellow cards: 3
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.1
Fouls per card: 14

Dennis Bergkamp
Appearances: 25
Fouls: 40
Fouls per appearance: 1.6
Yellow cards: 2
Yellow card per appearance: 0.1
Fouls per card: 20

Patrick Vieira
Appearances: 30
Fouls: 65
Fouls per appearance: 2.2
Yellow cards: 6
Yellow cards per appearance: 0.2
Fouls per card: 11

So, ranking these particularly players over these season, from cleanest to dirtiest, is as follows:

FOULS PER APPEARANCE

1. Scholes 08/09 – 0.8
2. Scholes 01/02 – 0.9
2. Fabregas 07/08 – 0.9
4. Scholes 09/10 – 1.1
4. Scholes 03/04 – 1.1
4. Fabregas 09/10 – 1.1
7. Scholes 02/03 – 1.2
7. Fabregas 06/07 – 1.2
9. Scholes 00/01 – 1.3
9. Scholes 07/08 – 1.3
9. Scholes 05/06 – 1.3
9. Scholes 04/05 – 1.3

9. Fabregas 05/06 – 1.3
14. Scholes 06/07 – 1.4
14. Song 08/09 – 1.4
14. Lauren 05/06 – 1.4
17. Fabregas 08/09 – 1.5
17. Denilson 08/09 – 1.5
17. Henry 02/03 – 1.5
20. Reyes 05/06 – 1.6
20. Lauren 01/02 – 1.6
20. Bergkamp 00/01 – 1.6
20. Van Persie 08/09 – 1.6
20. Gilberto 03/04 – 1.6
20. Adebayor – 07/08 – 1.6
26. Diaby 09/10 – 1.7
26. Gilberto 05/06 – 1.7
26. Parlour 03/04 – 1.7
29. Flamini 07/08 – 1.9
29. Vieira 02/03 – 1.9
29. Parlour 01/02 – 1.9
32. Song 09/10 – 2
33. Parlour 02/03 – 2.2
33. Vieira 00/01 – 2.2
35. Vieira 04/05 – 2.3
36. Vieira 01/02 – 2.4
37. Vieira 03/04 – 3.2
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Old 25th August 2010, 18:09   #38 (permalink)
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The odd thing about that interview was that he talked about how he didn't run after the media, and thus perhaps not getting the recognition he might've had, and then going on to talk about his "darker side", as if he saw Scholesy's mediashyness as part of his dark side.

BBC Sport - Football - Paul Scholes has a 'darker side' - Arsene Wenger

I think he's just trying to repeat his job on Fletcher last season when he succeeded in making sure the refs went after him for quite a while. Wenger can see what everyone else can see, that Scholes is running the show for us, and if he can turn the refs against him that's surely a good thing for Arsenal. However, he has a better case now than the Fletcher-nonsense. Scholes has certainly got away with a lot of bookable tackles through the years. His attack on Fletcher on the other hand didn't have a hint of truth to it, and the response he got from the refs was further proof as to their quality and intergrity.
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Old 25th August 2010, 18:09   #39 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by peterstorey View Post
The point is he got away with it for years.
How has he gotten away with it? The stats show he has fouled lesser per game more than all your Gunners and yet he has a much lower fouls per card value than all your players.
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Old 25th August 2010, 18:15   #40 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wr8_utd View Post
How has he gotten away with it? The stats show he has fouled lesser per game more than all your Gunners and yet he has a much lower fouls per card value than all your players.
I think he means that the referee doens't always blow his whistle when Scholes fouls, and that wouldn't show in statistics.

Mind you, I'm with you on this one. Just wanted to point it out...
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