Wilshere - where does the hype come from?

FlawlessThaw · 17th April 2012, 00:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neutral

Rooney suspended for the 1st two group matches right? Will England even qualify for the knockout rounds?

Probably not to be honest.

I'm hoping Welbeck gets injured or doesn't get picked. I fear he will go and not have the best of tournaments with a fickle English following which will cause him to start the new season low on confidence. Normally I am for players playing international as it can benefit United, not sure how much positive we will see from Welbeck's side.

Team Brian GB · 17th April 2012, 01:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neutral

Rooney suspended for the 1st two group matches right? Will England even qualify for the knockout rounds?

Considering we have been without a manager for two months now and the FA are yet to be seen doing anything about getting a new one then I would say no.

MikeUpNorth · 17th April 2012, 01:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Team Brian GB

Considering we have been without a manager for two months now and the FA are yet to be seen doing anything about getting a new one then I would say no.

Surely it's all been agreed behind the scenes and they're just waiting until the end of the season to announce it?

Team Brian GB · 17th April 2012, 01:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeUpNorth

Surely it's all been agreed behind the scenes and they're just waiting until the end of the season to announce it?

That is putting faith in the FA which is an unorthodox thing to do, perhaps it is wise we didn't win the 2018 world cup bid so we don't put actual responsibility in their hands.

Zen · 17th April 2012, 01:21

I dunno, I won't go into firmly believing we have no chance to get out of it, I mean whats the point in being that defeatist? I've never thought we could win anything, or been one of these incredibly mythical "England gonna win!!!" fans that alot seem to think is our fanbase when its actually a very small percentage.

But if somehow, whoever takes over, uses their head and gets Carrick-Scholes tandem, who clearly both know eachother supremely well, and are having fine ends to the season, rather than the other 4(Parker, Barry, Gerrard, Lampard) all being inconsistent at best to end the year....I'd be more optimistic. Gerrard can take Rooneys role for the first two games though. Obviously Scholes wouldn't start the middle game though. Get him in there for france and ukraine, draw and win possible imo, so just need to scrap a result vs Sweden without Scholes, Wilshere and Rooney.

Team Brian GB · 17th April 2012, 01:31

I think Lampard is playing very well at the moment.

TheHorse'sMouth · 17th April 2012, 01:33

Scholes has to go. Scholes, Carrick, Ox, Milner, Parker and one out of Gerrard or Lampard for midfield options.

Edit: Overlooked the fact that Gerrard can't play in midfield to save his life.

Team Brian GB · 17th April 2012, 01:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheHorse'sMouth

Scholes has to go. Scholes, Carrick, Ox, Milner, Parker and one out of Gerrard or Lampard for midfield options.

Edit: Overlooked the fact that Gerrard can't play in midfield to save his life.

I think that would just end up being a rerun of Walcott going to the world cup in 2006.

TheHorse'sMouth · 17th April 2012, 01:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Relevated

they probably thought that he is nothing that they cant produce from la masia academy.

There is a Greek kid called Spandanoukis (sp?) in Masia who looks absolutely class, they have the attacking mid prototype down to a tee.

TheHorse'sMouth · 17th April 2012, 01:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Team Brian GB

I think that would just end up being a rerun of Walcott going to the world cup in 2006.

Except Ox has been performing like a bison in the second part of this season and has shown he has what it takes to step up to the very highest level, while Walcott at that age hadn't even started a game for us. Ox is a far more accomplished player than Walcott was going into his first tournament.

Team Brian GB · 17th April 2012, 01:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheHorse'sMouth

Except Ox has been performing like a bison in the second part of this season and has shown he has what it takes to step up to the very highest level, while Walcott at that age hadn't even started a game for us. Ox is a far more accomplished player than Walcott was going into his first tournament.

That is pushing it somewhat, he looks to be a very good option for the future and exactly that, I just think it is too early for him as it would have been for the likes of Sturridge or Welbeck 12/18 months ago.

Zen · 17th April 2012, 01:48

Nah, he's far better than all 3 examples used, he has CL knockout experience, a game in which he was really good in for 50-60 minutes and been great at times in the Prem.

He's definitely in the 30 man squad, and if cut, will be one of the final ones to be cut. Even at his age, offers more than most wingers available, Lennon, Downing, possibly even Adam Johnson, Walcott and Young are the only two certs on the wings.

Aint gota Kalou · 17th April 2012, 08:53

I don't see why you wouldn't take Ox, I would much rather take a potentially brilliant talent like him rather than a more established but ultimately average player. He should certainly be above Lennon, Johnson, Milner and Downing.

Pogue Mahone · 17th April 2012, 09:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheHorse'sMouth

Except Ox has been performing like a bison in the second part of this season and has shown he has what it takes to step up to the very highest level, while Walcott at that age hadn't even started a game for us. Ox is a far more accomplished player than Walcott was going into his first tournament.

He should probably first show he has what it takes to step up to the Arsenal level first. He hasn't started any of your last 6 league games.

Pogue Mahone · 17th April 2012, 09:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zen

Nah, he's far better than all 3 examples used, he has CL knockout experience, a game in which he was really good in for 50-60 minutes and been great at times in the Prem.

He's definitely in the 30 man squad, and if cut, will be one of the final ones to be cut. Even at his age, offers more than most wingers available, Lennon, Downing, possibly even Adam Johnson, Walcott and Young are the only two certs on the wings.

Far better than Sturridge, Welbeck and Walcott? Not a chance. One day, maybe. Still got it all to prove.

Zen · 17th April 2012, 09:28

Well, not quite.

"Sturridge or Welbeck 12/18 months ago" and Walcott in 2006 being the examples.

Pogue Mahone · 17th April 2012, 09:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zen

Well, not quite.

"Sturridge or Welbeck 12/18 months ago" and Walcott in 2006 being the examples.

Sturridge and Welbeck were both coming to the end of a full season of PL football 12 months ago. Chamberlain has started a grand total of 5 Premier League games, his debut coming just 3 months ago.

Zen · 17th April 2012, 10:01

Good in his debut CL start vs Olympiakos
Brilliant for 50-60 in his start vs Milan.....in a new central midfield role for him too.
His replacement was boo'd against us in the 2-1 @ 1-1 and pretty much cost them a point.

All these performances, as a starter which seems key to you, are at a higher level than Sturridge or Welbeck for Sunderland and Bolton. He's looked very bright as a sub plenty of times too.....and yeah, also invisible, but that comes with the territory, and all of Welbeck/Walcott/Sturridge still suffer from that themselves, and they were far worse for that he was 12 months ago.

Steven Seagull · 17th April 2012, 10:02

He's a miles better "footballer" than Walcott, you can see that from watching 10 minutes of them. Walcott can be extremely effective though. He scares any defender. Chamberlain needs games, he's built like a rugby player

Pogue Mahone · 17th April 2012, 10:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zen

Good in his debut CL start vs Olympiakos
Brilliant for 50-60 in his start vs Milan.....in a new central midfield role for him too.
His replacement was boo'd against us in the 2-1 @ 1-1 and pretty much cost them a point.

All these performances, as a starter which seems key to you, are at a higher level than Sturridge or Welbeck for Sunderland and Bolton. He's looked very bright as a sub plenty of times too.....and yeah, also invisible, but that comes with the territory, and all of Welbeck/Walcott/Sturridge still suffer from that themselves, and they were far worse for that he was 12 months ago.

Seriously?

I would disagree with that. Sturridge scored some absolute screamers for Bolton. Welbeck was MOTM when Sunderland got one of their best results in recent years, beating Chelsea at Stamford Bridge.

Chamberlain has had a handful of decent performances, rarely lasting the full game. He's since been unable to hold onto his place in the team. I don't disagree that he looks like a real prospect but there's no way he's already "far better" than either Sturridge or Welbeck were this time last year.

Judge Red · 17th April 2012, 11:04

It's all gone a bit Hargreaves for Wilshere. It's difficult for me to think England will miss him when I've forgotten what it is that he does.

RedLars · 17th April 2012, 11:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pogue Mahone

Seriously?

I would disagree with that. Sturridge scored some absolute screamers for Bolton. Welbeck was MOTM when Sunderland got one of their best results in recent years, beating Chelsea at Stamford Bridge.

Chamberlain has had a handful of decent performances, rarely lasting the full game. He's since been unable to hold onto his place in the team. I don't disagree that he looks like a real prospect but there's no way he's already "far better" than either Sturridge or Welbeck were this time last year.

I agree with every word of that. Welbeck and Sturridge both showed prolonged periods of great promise last season, something which Chamberlain hasn't done as far as I'm concerned.

He's shown great flashes of what may come though, but the notion that he's done better this season as a whole than either of Welbeck and Sturridge did last season is way off.

TheHorse'sMouth · 17th April 2012, 16:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steven Seagull

He's a miles better "footballer" than Walcott, you can see that from watching 10 minutes of them. Walcott can be extremely effective though. He scares any defender. Chamberlain needs games, he's built like a rugby player

My point exactly. He can handle the physical side, but more than that he's someone who can create something out of nothing and that's something invaluable to have even if he starts as a sub. He's got to go, we need to start getting a lot more of the promising youngsters around the senior side's setup anyway and a good few of them should go to this Championship including Chamberlain.

Raven Blade · 18th April 2012, 01:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judge Red

It's all gone a bit Hargreaves for Wilshere. It's difficult for me to think England will miss him when I've forgotten what it is that he does.

I haven't forgotten. He would give us more craft and guile in midfield. Exactly what we're trying to instill in the England teams of the future. It's a real disappointment he won't be going so this means there's a greater chance of Cleverley and/or Oxlade-Chamberlain making the squad now. We could do with some young midfield talent hungry to make an impact.

TheHorse'sMouth · 18th April 2012, 11:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Judge Red

It's all gone a bit Hargreaves for Wilshere. It's difficult for me to think England will miss him when I've forgotten what it is that he does.

Steven Seagull · 18th April 2012, 11:37

When did the initial injury happen? Was it in the pre season tournament at the Emirates where he came off? Seemed unthinkable he'd miss 12 months from that.

Cheesy · 18th April 2012, 17:01

Missing the Euros could turn out to be a blessing in disguise for Wilshere. It gives him more time to fully recover and he won't have the situation of going into a new season on a confidence downer when England inevitably crash and burn again.

Don16 · 8th June 2012, 03:32

Jacks been a naughty boy if twitter is to be believed!

Carl · 8th June 2012, 03:32

Go on...

Carl · 8th June 2012, 03:33

Never mind. Seen it.

Don16 · 8th June 2012, 03:33

This is purely on twitter, I know as well as anyone it has a high chance of being horse shit, but they're saying he failed a coke test!

SharkyMcShark · 8th June 2012, 03:34

Saw this earlier.

Apparently being touted by the people that had the Giggs and Terry/Bridge stories early.

Carl · 8th June 2012, 03:35

Meh. So what if he has.

phelans shorts · 8th June 2012, 03:51

My sources tell me it's bullshit.

I'm not making that up, he's supposedly had another load of surgery this week, which means he is injured, not banned.

mariachi-19 · 8th June 2012, 04:31

Why don't we just ask solius? His cousins banging him/carrying his baby isn't she?

Red Dreams · 8th June 2012, 04:34

don't believe what is being said on twitter.

big loss for his club and his country.

hope he is back for the season.

Grinner · 8th June 2012, 04:46

I'm sure there were some drug rumours last year too.

Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber · 8th June 2012, 06:11

I hope his injury problem goes away.

Twigginater · 8th June 2012, 09:41

The drug rumours will have come from him deactivating twitter for "rehab".

Solius · 8th June 2012, 09:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by mariachi-19

Why don't we just ask solius? His cousins banging him/carrying his baby isn't she?

The baby is nearly a year old now.

I haven't heard anything, he flew to Sweden the other day for an op and I'm pretty sure the injury is genuine. He was in a cast for ages.

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17th April 2012, 01:21	#1045 (permalink)
Zen First Team Sub Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 7,281	I dunno, I won't go into firmly believing we have no chance to get out of it, I mean whats the point in being that defeatist? I've never thought we could win anything, or been one of these incredibly mythical "England gonna win!!!" fans that alot seem to think is our fanbase when its actually a very small percentage. But if somehow, whoever takes over, uses their head and gets Carrick-Scholes tandem, who clearly both know eachother supremely well, and are having fine ends to the season, rather than the other 4(Parker, Barry, Gerrard, Lampard) all being inconsistent at best to end the year....I'd be more optimistic. Gerrard can take Rooneys role for the first two games though. Obviously Scholes wouldn't start the middle game though. Get him in there for france and ukraine, draw and win possible imo, so just need to scrap a result vs Sweden without Scholes, Wilshere and Rooney.

17th April 2012, 01:31	#1046 (permalink)
Team Brian GB Baby Cameron loves X-Factor Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 16,248	I think Lampard is playing very well at the moment.

17th April 2012, 01:33	#1047 (permalink)
TheHorse'sMouth First Team Sub Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 6,169	Scholes has to go. Scholes, Carrick, Ox, Milner, Parker and one out of Gerrard or Lampard for midfield options. Edit: Overlooked the fact that Gerrard can't play in midfield to save his life.

17th April 2012, 01:48	#1052 (permalink)
Zen First Team Sub Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 7,281	Nah, he's far better than all 3 examples used, he has CL knockout experience, a game in which he was really good in for 50-60 minutes and been great at times in the Prem. He's definitely in the 30 man squad, and if cut, will be one of the final ones to be cut. Even at his age, offers more than most wingers available, Lennon, Downing, possibly even Adam Johnson, Walcott and Young are the only two certs on the wings.

17th April 2012, 08:53	#1053 (permalink)
Aint gota Kalou Reserve Team Player Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 2,644	I don't see why you wouldn't take Ox, I would much rather take a potentially brilliant talent like him rather than a more established but ultimately average player. He should certainly be above Lennon, Johnson, Milner and Downing.

17th April 2012, 09:28	#1056 (permalink)
Zen First Team Sub Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 7,281	Well, not quite. "Sturridge or Welbeck 12/18 months ago" and Walcott in 2006 being the examples.

17th April 2012, 10:01	#1058 (permalink)
Zen First Team Sub Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 7,281	Good in his debut CL start vs Olympiakos Brilliant for 50-60 in his start vs Milan.....in a new central midfield role for him too. His replacement was boo'd against us in the 2-1 @ 1-1 and pretty much cost them a point. All these performances, as a starter which seems key to you, are at a higher level than Sturridge or Welbeck for Sunderland and Bolton. He's looked very bright as a sub plenty of times too.....and yeah, also invisible, but that comes with the territory, and all of Welbeck/Walcott/Sturridge still suffer from that themselves, and they were far worse for that he was 12 months ago.

17th April 2012, 10:02	#1059 (permalink)
Steven Seagull Reserve Team Player Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: He's brought down by Peruzzi, Cole will finish it off, full speed ahead Barcelona! Posts: 3,503	He's a miles better "footballer" than Walcott, you can see that from watching 10 minutes of them. Walcott can be extremely effective though. He scares any defender. Chamberlain needs games, he's built like a rugby player

17th April 2012, 11:04	#1061 (permalink)
Judge Red Don't Call Me Douglas Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 2,038	It's all gone a bit Hargreaves for Wilshere. It's difficult for me to think England will miss him when I've forgotten what it is that he does.

18th April 2012, 11:37	#1066 (permalink)
Steven Seagull Reserve Team Player Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: He's brought down by Peruzzi, Cole will finish it off, full speed ahead Barcelona! Posts: 3,503	When did the initial injury happen? Was it in the pre season tournament at the Emirates where he came off? Seemed unthinkable he'd miss 12 months from that.

18th April 2012, 17:01	#1067 (permalink)
Cheesy Smells Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Scotland Posts: 9,096	Missing the Euros could turn out to be a blessing in disguise for Wilshere. It gives him more time to fully recover and he won't have the situation of going into a new season on a confidence downer when England inevitably crash and burn again.

8th June 2012, 03:32	#1068 (permalink)
Don16 Annoying cnut Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Let's swim to the moon Posts: 4,950	Jacks been a naughty boy if twitter is to be believed!

8th June 2012, 03:32	#1069 (permalink)
Carl Not Allowed A Hash Tag Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Formerly cw1984 Posts: 31,697	Go on...

8th June 2012, 03:33	#1070 (permalink)
Carl Not Allowed A Hash Tag Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Formerly cw1984 Posts: 31,697	Never mind. Seen it.

8th June 2012, 03:33	#1071 (permalink)
Don16 Annoying cnut Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Let's swim to the moon Posts: 4,950	This is purely on twitter, I know as well as anyone it has a high chance of being horse shit, but they're saying he failed a coke test!

8th June 2012, 03:34	#1072 (permalink)
SharkyMcShark Horrified Join Date: May 2007 Location: Using location as a tagline: because I'm just not cool enough to have my own. Posts: 19,945	Saw this earlier. Apparently being touted by the people that had the Giggs and Terry/Bridge stories early.

8th June 2012, 03:35	#1073 (permalink)
Carl Not Allowed A Hash Tag Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Formerly cw1984 Posts: 31,697	Meh. So what if he has.

8th June 2012, 03:51	#1074 (permalink)
phelans shorts First Team Regular Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Gaz. Is a Mewling Quim. Posts: 20,272	My sources tell me it's bullshit. I'm not making that up, he's supposedly had another load of surgery this week, which means he is injured, not banned.

8th June 2012, 04:31	#1075 (permalink)
mariachi-19 First Team Regular Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: I may be the devil, but i'm not a monster Posts: 13,342	Why don't we just ask solius? His cousins banging him/carrying his baby isn't she?

8th June 2012, 04:34	#1076 (permalink)
Red Dreams First Team Regular Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: 20 I 13 Posts: 28,210	don't believe what is being said on twitter. big loss for his club and his country. hope he is back for the season.

8th June 2012, 04:46	#1077 (permalink)
Grinner Fat gutted, hairy shouldered, stinky Arse. Join Date: May 2003 Location: I love free dirt and rocks! Posts: 34,820	I'm sure there were some drug rumours last year too.

8th June 2012, 06:11	#1078 (permalink)
Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber Thus says Kemo Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Founder of IhateMakeleles.org and Gourcufffanboysareus.com Posts: 40,865	I hope his injury problem goes away.

8th June 2012, 09:41	#1079 (permalink)
Twigginater WUM Alert! Join Date: May 2008 Location: Obertans #1 fan. Posts: 7,226	The drug rumours will have come from him deactivating twitter for "rehab".