Antonio Valencia

Eyepopper · 13th May 2009, 10:49

We've been heavily linked with him over the past two seasons and I personally have had a niggling feeling since January that we're going to sign him in the summer.

(no not to replace Ronaldo before anyone starts)

Quote:

ANTONIO Valencia has the chance to show United why he could be good enough to join their star-studded ranks tonight.

Wigan's wing wizard has been linked with a move to Old Trafford for much of the season - and the Latics' chairman Dave Whelan and his manager Steve Bruce were seemingly battling to out-do each other in singing the Ecuadorian's praises ahead of tonight's showdown with the Reds at the JJB Stadium.

His decision to snub a January transfer to Real Madrid fuelled speculation a summer move to United was on the cards and his outstanding form as Bruce's battlers punched above their weight this term has been closely monitored by the champions-elect's spies.

Former Wigan boss Paul Jewell, who took Valencia to the Premier League from Villarreal after spottling his potential playing for his country, is in agreement with his former employer and Bruce about the player's talents.

"Valencia had class written all over him," he said. "Add to this his pace, his ability to take on and beat a man, plus how he creates and has shots on goal and you have an exceptionally talented player.

Whelan added: "There's a buzz every time Valencia has the ball and this only applies to the very best players who are a bit special.

"Valencia is a terrific winger. There's nothing better than to see a winger take on a defender at speed.

"This is what Valencia does best - defenders hate this, believe me.

"My own hero was Tom Finney, he took on players. Valencia is certainly a talent and a fine player."

United's title rivals Liverpool have also checked out Valencia and the Wigan hieracrchy seem resigned to the fact that he will further his career at a higher level.

gaffs · 13th May 2009, 10:54

I haven’t seen much of him in this half of the season.

I though he was very impressive in the fists half, along with Palacios.

Crustanoid · 13th May 2009, 10:57

Is he United quality though?

Pogue Mahone · 13th May 2009, 10:57

He's a class player.

He's also to O'Shea what Lennon is to Evra - his bete noire (that's racist!)

Slightly nervous about the two of them facing up again this evening.

Brwned · 13th May 2009, 11:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pogue Mahone

He's a class player.

He's also to O'Shea what Lennon is to Evra - his bete noire (that's racist!)

Slightly nervous about the two of them facing up again this evening.

Nah, sure we've got Evra to face up to Valencia this time. O'Shea's on the other side.

gaffs · 13th May 2009, 11:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pogue Mahone

He's a class player.

He's also to O'Shea what Lennon is to Evra - his bete noire (that's racist!)

Slightly nervous about the two of them facing up again this evening.

"Where’s you muppet gone? Where’s you muppet gone?"

Isnt O'Shea going to be playing at CB tonight?

Pogue Mahone · 13th May 2009, 11:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by gaffs

"Where’s you muppet gone? Where’s you muppet gone?"

Isnt O'Shea going to be playing at CB tonight?

The Current Bun this morning said Evans came through a training session yesterday and is expected to start tonight. He'll probably have a fitness test at some point today.

Mind you, if O'Shea is in the centre I can see Valencia spending most of the game on the left wing, testing out wee Raffael (who had a bit of a mare, defensively, at the weekend)

Chirag · 13th May 2009, 11:12

IMO he is not good enough for us.. As I said earlier if we sign a winger he has to be a way above the level of the wingers we already have (except Ronaldo ofcourse)

Pogue Mahone · 13th May 2009, 11:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chirag

IMO he is not good enough for us.. As I said earlier if we sign a winger he has to be a way above the level of the wingers we already have (except Ronaldo ofcourse)

He's way above Nani, that's for sure. And better going forwards than Park.

Whether or not we should make a bid will depend on whether SAF sees Nani's decline as irreversible or just one of one those one-off shite seasons that can happen to a young(ish) player early on in their development.

gaffs · 13th May 2009, 11:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pogue Mahone

The Current Bun this morning said Evans came through a training session yesterday and is expected to start tonight. He'll probably have a fitness test at some point today.

Thats good news.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pogue Mahone

Mind you, if O'Shea is in the centre I can see Valencia spending most of the game on the left wing, testing out wee Raffael (who had a bit of a mare, defensively, at the weekend)

Do you think? I thought he had a good game. Made a couple of little mistakes, committing himself then getting beaten by Robinho. But generally, i though he was good.

So, where has your Muppet gone?

gaffs · 13th May 2009, 11:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chirag

IMO he is not good enough for us.. As I said earlier if we sign a winger he has to be a way above the level of the wingers we already have (except Ronaldo ofcourse)

Players don’t necessarily have to be stunning performers before we buy them.

I suppose scouts are looking at certain attributes a player has and how they can be improved on by coming to United.

The guys is 23 - we wouldn’t be buying a finished product.

Eyepopper · 13th May 2009, 11:39

I'm not saying we should or shouldn't sign him, I think he's a decent player and would be a good addition to the squad, I think Fergie wants more options for the wings, I dont think he wants Rooney playing the wing long term.

I just remember seeing a story in Jan that said he'd turned down Real because Utd had come in and said we'd take him in the summer, which seemed to make sense.

Chirag · 13th May 2009, 11:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pogue Mahone

He's way above Nani, that's for sure. And better going forwards than Park.

Whether or not we should make a bid will depend on whether SAF sees Nani's decline as irreversible or just one of one those one-off shite seasons that can happen to a young(ish) player early on in their development.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gaffs

Players don’t necessarily have to be stunning performers before we buy them.

I suppose scouts are looking at certain attributes a player has and how they can be improved on by coming to United.

The guys is 23 - we wouldn’t be buying a finished product.

You both raise very fair points but IMO Valencia is not what we need.. I am not yet convinced by him..

gaffs · 13th May 2009, 11:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chirag

You both raise very fair points but IMO Valencia is not what we need.. I am not yet convinced by him..

What do we need and why are you not convinced by him?

Pogue Mahone · 13th May 2009, 11:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by gaffs

Do you think? I thought he had a good game. Made a couple of little mistakes, committing himself then getting beaten by Robinho. But generally, i though he was good.

So, where has your Muppet gone?

I thought he was good overall but the over-commitment thing is a bit of a problem, especially against a winger who will put in more of a shift than Robinho did at the weekend (the lazy cnut)

As for my kermit, don't worry, I will always be a muppet at heart!

gaffs · 13th May 2009, 11:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pogue Mahone

I thought he was good overall but the over-commitment thing is a bit of a problem, especially against a winger who will put in more of a shift than Robinho did at the weekend (the lazy cnut)

As for my kermit, don't worry, I will always be a muppet at heart!

At times, his positioning is poor. Sometimes, he tucks in and leaves a man in behind when the opposition are attacking. I have seen him get caught in two minds so many times.

I think this will all come in time though. Mind you, i still see Gary Neville make the same mistakes!!!

Pogue Mahone · 13th May 2009, 11:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by gaffs

At times, his positioning is poor. Sometimes, he tucks in and leaves a man in behind when the opposition are attacking. I have seen him get caught in two minds so many times.

I think this will all come in time though. Mind you, i still see Gary Neville make the same mistakes!!!

Absolutely agree. The only flaws I see in his game could all be put down to inexperience and will almost certainly disappear (or improve anyway) over the next few years. The lad is gonna be a star, of that I'm certain.

Mind you, he still makes me a wee bit nervous and I hope O'Shea plays opposite Evra tonight.

Smash-E · 13th May 2009, 11:54

This story comes up almost every time we face Wigan

Average Joe · 13th May 2009, 11:56

a good player no doubt, but i would think we dont really need him.

ronaldo and park are our two current first choice wingers.

tosic and nani are the backups. nani has been shite this season but lets give him another season and see what happens, the talent is there.

tosic really impressed me for the reserves last night. i think in a few months he will be knocking hard on the door, what with a full pre season under him and a bit more time in the gym. he has already improved his strength on the ball.

And we have Ljajic coming in next season. not to say he will play in the senior squad but another winger/attacking midfielder that has been touted to achieve big things here.

gaffs · 13th May 2009, 12:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pogue Mahone

Absolutely agree. The only flaws I see in his game could all be put down to inexperience and will almost certainly disappear (or improve anyway) over the next few years. The lad is gonna be a star, of that I'm certain.

Mind you, he still makes me a wee bit nervous and I hope O'Shea plays opposite Evra tonight.

Im not exactly an O'Shea fan, but im so glad we have him now as the other options dont fill me with confidence.

Still a little worried about O'Shea against Henry/Keita/Iniesta in the CL final, but thats another subject.

gaffs · 13th May 2009, 12:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Average Joe

a good player no doubt, but i would think we dont really need him.

ronaldo and park are our two current first choice wingers.

tosic and nani are the backups. nani has been shite this season but lets give him another season and see what happens, the talent is there.

tosic really impressed me for the reserves last night. i think in a few months he will be knocking hard on the door, what with a full pre season under him and a bit more time in the gym. he has already improved his strength on the ball.

And we have Ljajic coming in next season. not to say he will play in the senior squad but another winger/attacking midfielder that has been touted to achieve big things here.

I hear Tosic is doing well in the reserves.

Chirag · 13th May 2009, 12:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by gaffs

What do we need and why are you not convinced by him?

I may go off topic but this is my understanding of it..

IMO we already have enough wingers: Ronaldo, Park, Nani, Tosic & Ljajic also I have a sneaky feeling that we may play Hargo on the right from time to time.. SO that is the 1st reason.

Then I have a feeling that we may not sign Tevez and not sign anyone as a replacement either.. Thus in many ppls opinion be a little lightweight upfront.. For which I think SAF has already decided that he want to move Ronaldo more permanently to an up-top position.. Thus us needing a replacement for Ronaldo.. & IMO he is not good enough to replace Ronaldo... however there are very few that actually can.. and it will be extremely difficult for us to get one of them.. Also if we do not manage to get the replacement for Ronaldo I think we will sign a striker instead or just get Campbell back..

So this is how I see things panning out..

Average Joe · 13th May 2009, 12:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by gaffs

I hear Tosic is doing well in the reserves.

he played great last night vs. Bolton. can't comment much on his other appearances as we get limited reserve team games here.

Pogue Mahone · 13th May 2009, 12:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chirag

I may go off topic but this is my understanding of it..

IMO we already have enough wingers: Ronaldo, Park, Nani, Tosic & Ljajic also I have a sneaky feeling that we may play Hargo on the right from time to time.. SO that is the 1st reason.

Then I have a feeling that we may not sign Tevez and not sign anyone as a replacement either.. Thus in many ppls opinion be a little lightweight upfront.. For which I think SAF has already decided that he want to move Ronaldo more permanently to an up-top position.. Thus us needing a replacement for Ronaldo.. & IMO he is not good enough to replace Ronaldo... however there are very few that actually can.. and it will be extremely difficult for us to get one of them.. Also if we do not manage to get the replacement for Ronaldo I think we will sign a striker instead or just get Campbell back..

So this is how I see things panning out..

The logic there is very strange. The possibility of Ronaldo being played as a striker makes it more, rather than less, likely we need another winger in our squad. A winger like Valencia, for example.

Anderson Searl · 13th May 2009, 12:27

My eyes will be on the lads in red, not an opposition winger.

Top · 13th May 2009, 12:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pogue Mahone

The logic there is very strange. The possibility of Ronaldo being played as a striker makes it more, rather than less, likely we need another winger in our squad. A winger like Valencia, for example.

Can't belive you rate him this highly Pogue, he's the new Morten Gamst Pedersen, who half of the people on here wanted us to sign as well a couple years ago based on some good performances against us.

I'd be disappointed if we sign him.

I'd much rather stick with what we've got and what we have coming in the form of Tosic and Ljajic who can play on on the wing as well.

No to Valencia.

gaffs · 13th May 2009, 12:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chirag

I may go off topic but this is my understanding of it..

IMO we already have enough wingers: Ronaldo, Park, Nani, Tosic & Ljajic also I have a sneaky feeling that we may play Hargo on the right from time to time.. SO that is the 1st reason.

Then I have a feeling that we may not sign Tevez and not sign anyone as a replacement either.. Thus in many ppls opinion be a little lightweight upfront.. For which I think SAF has already decided that he want to move Ronaldo more permanently to an up-top position.. Thus us needing a replacement for Ronaldo.. & IMO he is not good enough to replace Ronaldo... however there are very few that actually can.. and it will be extremely difficult for us to get one of them.. Also if we do not manage to get the replacement for Ronaldo I think we will sign a striker instead or just get Campbell back..

So this is how I see things panning out..

Ouch, my head hurts.

Bottom line is that, if Ronaldo goes or is converted to a forward, a wide player will be bought.

Pogue Mahone · 13th May 2009, 12:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Top

Can't belive you rate him this highly Pogue, he's the new Morten Gamst Pedersen, who half of the people on here wanted us to sign as well a cpiple years ago based on some good performances against us.

Personally, I never once said we should sign Pedersen and I think Valencia is considerably better than he ever was/will be.

My own opinions aside, this transfer rumour is one of those that just won't go away and usually ends up with the player joining us (like Carrick, Hargreaves or Berbatov) which means that SAF probably rates him too.

Eyepopper · 13th May 2009, 12:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pogue Mahone

Personally, I never once said we should sign Pedersen and I think Valencia is considerably better than he ever was/will be.

My own opinions aside, this transfer rumour is one of those that just won't go away and usually ends up with the player joining us (like Carrick, Hargreaves or Berbatov) which means that SAF probably rates him too.

Thats where I'm coming from too....

charleysurf · 13th May 2009, 12:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Average Joe

a good player no doubt, but i would think we dont really need him.

ronaldo and park are our two current first choice wingers.

tosic and nani are the backups. nani has been shite this season but lets give him another season and see what happens, the talent is there.

tosic really impressed me for the reserves last night. i think in a few months he will be knocking hard on the door, what with a full pre season under him and a bit more time in the gym. he has already improved his strength on the ball.

And we have Ljajic coming in next season. not to say he will play in the senior squad but another winger/attacking midfielder that has been touted to achieve big things here.

Ljajic is supposed to come next January, and even then its dependent on him playing for his country so he gets a work permit. So he's not really going to make an impact for us until maybe 2010/11 season.

Top · 13th May 2009, 12:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pogue Mahone

Personally, I never once said we should sign Pedersen and I think Valencia is considerably better than he ever was/will be.

My own opinions aside, this transfer rumour is one of those that just won't go away and usually ends up with the player joining us (like Carrick, Hargreaves or Berbatov) which means that SAF probably rates him too.

Probably being the key word here.
I know what you're saying about transfers, I had the same feeling about Tevez, Berbatov, Nani etc. - but those transfers made sense.
Buying Valencia doesn't make sense.

Tosic is beginning to shine for the reserves, on the left and on the right and thenw e have Ljajic coming who is currently taking the piss in Serbia despite being only 17.

Valencia has impressed me on a couple occasions, but overall he's one of the most over-hyped and overrated players in the league right now.
Really do believe it's a case of Gamsten-syndrome. I was laughing my ass off when people kept wanting us to sign Morten Gamst because he scored some cracking goals and always seemed to turn on the heat against us.

I can't remember the last time I was disappointed with a transfer, as I'm a sucker for transfers, but I really would be disappointed to see Valencia arrive.

Sultan · 13th May 2009, 12:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by gaffs

Ouch, my head hurts.

Bottom line is that, if Ronaldo goes or is converted to a forward, a wide player will be bought.

That's my line of thinking.

There will be no forwards coming. Ronaldo will be played as a striker in more games if and when the need arises. Ronaldo can also play on the left, Valencia on right, with Berbatov, and Rooney playing as the central strikers.

We also need to give opportunities to Welbeck, Kiko, and may be Campbell if he's not sold. Manucho I suspect will be out on another long term loan.

Chirag · 13th May 2009, 13:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pogue Mahone

The logic there is very strange. The possibility of Ronaldo being played as a striker makes it more, rather than less, likely we need another winger in our squad. A winger like Valencia, for example.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gaffs

Ouch, my head hurts.

Bottom line is that, if Ronaldo goes or is converted to a forward, a wide player will be bought.

I admit I may have made my earlier post a lil confusing but here we go: Attempt # 2

If Ronaldo moves up top
We may have to get in a quality winger in and around the ability as Ronaldo which Valencia definitely is not!

or

If Ronaldo doesn't move up top
& remains as a winger than no further winger will be required...

I hope this is clear & logical and doesn't make your head hurt..

Average Joe · 13th May 2009, 13:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chirag

I admit I may have made my earlier post a lil confusing but here we go: Attempt # 2

If Ronaldo moves up top
We may have to get in a quality winger in and around the ability as Ronaldo which Valencia definitely is not!

or

If Ronaldo doesn't move up top
& remains as a winger than no further winger will be required...

I hope this is clear & logical and doesn't make your head hurt..

i think we would find it very hard to find someone in and around ronaldo's ability, that is available.

There is no need to buy a replacement for ronaldo unless he leaves. playing as a striker or not.

Valencia would be brought in as a backup winger, someone we would rotate with park/nani.

We dont need him though

Lot 49 · 13th May 2009, 13:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Average Joe

i think we would find it very hard to find someone in and around ronaldo's ability, that is available.

There is no need to buy a replacement for ronaldo unless he leaves. playing as a striker or not.

Valencia would be brought in as a backup winger, someone we would rotate with park/nani.

We dont need him though

Agree with all this.

Doevle · 13th May 2009, 14:08

I havent seen him play a lot to form a opinion on whether we should buy him or not. What are his strongest attributes? Is he a good crosser of the ball?

Eyepopper · 13th May 2009, 14:38

I haven't seen a huge amount of him either, from what I have seen I think he's pretty pacey and can beat a man...

If we are interested, it appears we're not the only ones....

Quote:

Steve Bruce has admitted it is 'inevitable' that Antonio Valencia will leave Wigan in the summer.

The Latics manager revealed that Real Madrid look certain to renew their interest after a failed bid in January with a representative due to fly in to watch the winger in action at the JJB Stadium against Manchester United on Wednesday.

The Red Devils are said to be another interested party but as of yet Bruce insists that no offers have been made.

The Ecuadorian is expected to be sold to the highest bidder once the season is over with Bruce looking to use the sale to bring in new players in the summer.

"It's inevitable Antonio will leave, but where he goes I'm not quite sure," he told theWigan Evening Post.

"There are no deals done at all. I keep reading that one, but nothings been done.
Interest

"I believe someone from Real Madrid is flying in for today's game and I've also heard the Germans - Bayern Munich have been knocking on the door too.

"Whether that is true, I don't know."

Whatever fee the Latics receive for the 23-year-old they are likely to make a huge profit with the club plucking the player from relative obscurity in August 2006.

After an initial loan spell Bruce made the deal permanent in January last year and he now has the job of unearthing another gem to replace the winger.

"At the end of the season I'll sit down and have a chat with Antonio. But I know it will be difficult to keep him," he added.

"We've then got the task of trying to unearth another one. We cannot buy the finished article here, we have to buy potential and work on them."

Ekeke · 13th May 2009, 14:50

He's good but not one of the best. Will probably end up in Madrid.

Skelter · 13th May 2009, 15:56

Real Madrid in Wigan, wow.

Chirag · 13th May 2009, 16:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skelter

Real Madrid in Wigan, wow.

I doubt they have actually come to watch Valencia TBH..

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13th May 2009, 10:54	#2 (permalink)
gaffs First Team Sub Join Date: May 2007 Location: Moscow 08, Rome 09, London 11 Posts: 9,925	I haven’t seen much of him in this half of the season. I though he was very impressive in the fists half, along with Palacios.

13th May 2009, 10:57	#3 (permalink)
Crustanoid First Team Regular Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 12,637	Is he United quality though?

13th May 2009, 10:57	#4 (permalink)
Pogue Mahone Poster of the year 2008 Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: "like a man in silk pyjamas shooting pigeons from a deckchair" Posts: 56,773	He's a class player. He's also to O'Shea what Lennon is to Evra - his bete noire (that's racist!) Slightly nervous about the two of them facing up again this evening.

13th May 2009, 11:12	#8 (permalink)
Chirag Euro '08 League Winner Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 6,701	IMO he is not good enough for us.. As I said earlier if we sign a winger he has to be a way above the level of the wingers we already have (except Ronaldo ofcourse)

13th May 2009, 11:39	#12 (permalink)
Eyepopper Lowering the tone since 2006 Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Two manky hookers and a racist dwarf, think I'm heading home! Posts: 49,226	I'm not saying we should or shouldn't sign him, I think he's a decent player and would be a good addition to the squad, I think Fergie wants more options for the wings, I dont think he wants Rooney playing the wing long term. I just remember seeing a story in Jan that said he'd turned down Real because Utd had come in and said we'd take him in the summer, which seemed to make sense.

13th May 2009, 11:54	#18 (permalink)
Smash-E Reserve Team Player Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Adelaide Posts: 2,646	This story comes up almost every time we face Wigan

13th May 2009, 11:56	#19 (permalink)
Average Joe Reserve Team Player Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Johannesburg Posts: 1,269	a good player no doubt, but i would think we dont really need him. ronaldo and park are our two current first choice wingers. tosic and nani are the backups. nani has been shite this season but lets give him another season and see what happens, the talent is there. tosic really impressed me for the reserves last night. i think in a few months he will be knocking hard on the door, what with a full pre season under him and a bit more time in the gym. he has already improved his strength on the ball. And we have Ljajic coming in next season. not to say he will play in the senior squad but another winger/attacking midfielder that has been touted to achieve big things here.

13th May 2009, 12:27	#25 (permalink)
Anderson Searl Reserve Team Player Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: :lol: Posts: 16,450	My eyes will be on the lads in red, not an opposition winger.

13th May 2009, 14:08	#36 (permalink)
Doevle First Team Sub Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 6,801	I havent seen him play a lot to form a opinion on whether we should buy him or not. What are his strongest attributes? Is he a good crosser of the ball?

13th May 2009, 14:50	#38 (permalink)
Ekeke First Team Regular Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 22,336	He's good but not one of the best. Will probably end up in Madrid.

13th May 2009, 15:56	#39 (permalink)
Skelter Internet GYPO Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 5,730	Real Madrid in Wigan, wow.