Gareth Bale | Signed new contract

Ash_G · 23rd April 2012, 13:46

Shit strikers? Adebayor is better than Hernandez/Welbeck/Berbatov however much of a cunt he is. Defoe has arguably played better than Hernandez this season and Saha is probably much better in the air then Hernandez/Welbeck. Spurs have problems but it's not really their strikers.

Bale is an excellent player, who like Valencia on his day will be an absolute nightmare to defend against. For the record I think he's better than Valencia, I don't think he's better than Nani though who as I said has more to his game imo. If you offered me a swap of him for Young/Valencia I'd take it, not for Nani though.

Hectic · 23rd April 2012, 14:10

If you are trying to find a stat that shows Nani can't play well down the left, or isn't clearly a great threat from that side, you won't find one because it doesn't exist.

I believe he is better on the right, but the difference is marginal. We've seen from multiple games, too many to count how effective he can be from the left. Yesterday, also, being a good example of that.

apotheosis · 23rd April 2012, 14:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hectic

If you are trying to find a stat that shows Nani can't play well down the left, or isn't clearly a great threat from that side, you won't find one because it doesn't exist.

No i am not looking for any stats. I can't understand why people give me general stats when i am talking only about Nani on the left. I have never claimed Nani is not good on the right.

Quote:

I believe he is better on the right, but the difference is marginal. We've seen from multiple games, too many to count how effective he can be from the left. Yesterday, also, being a good example of that.

Maybe but he did score his goal coming from the right. Brwned has also come out telling about Nani's good games on the left, which i admit he has had. But imo he is not as good as on the right. I remember last season he was being slagged for his performances on the left and then Valencia got injured he went bakc to the right and was on fire.

Add to that SAF went out and bought Young for the left, why would he do that if Nani is as sensational on the left as many would have me believe?

Ash_G · 23rd April 2012, 14:39

Tbh but for Valencia's resurgent form I think it was because he was looking for a more fluid dynamic front four which you can get with Nani, Rooney, Welbeck and Young. Although there are question marks over if Young can step up I'm certain that's what he was going for. Unfortunately because of mass injuries across the team, and people being in form at different times we've not seen the best of what that set up could offer.

Hectic · 23rd April 2012, 14:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by apotheosis

No i am not looking for any stats. I can't understand why people give me general stats when i am talking only about Nani on the left. I have never claimed Nani is not good on the right.

Yes, my point being you will not find any, because the statement Nani isn't good on the left is rubbish. It is, I'm sorry but it simply is. You can argue that Nani is better on the right, but to say he is not good on the left doesn't make any sense. Not many of your points over the last two pages have mind.

Hectic · 23rd April 2012, 14:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by apotheosis

Add to that SAF went out and bought Young for the left, why would he do that if Nani is as sensational on the left as many would have me believe?

The same reason we have more than one striker up front? Or more than one really good goalkeeper? Nani is capable of playing both sides, he offers cover for Valencia if he is injured or underperforming, who than covers his side?

Neutral · 23rd April 2012, 14:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by apotheosis

FFS not someone rolling out the stats as proof of anything. Go back and tell me how many of those assists and goals came from Nani playing on the left hand side, and it may have a modicum of relevance.

Have you forgotten that Nani is playing in a far superior team to Spurs. If you watch Bale you will also have noted how many fantastic deliveries he puts into dangerous areas that are not converted by Spurs shit strikers. His quality of delivery is as good and reliable as anyone's. How many people score off them is down to the players he plays with.

So stats don't tell the true story in the vast majority of instances. If you have to use them to make your case, then your case must be pretty thin.

My fault for engaging you...should have left you alone...the Nani stats are relevant, because Bale has played exclusively on the left for 95% of his career, and on his strong side last season he got 1 fucking assist...one...uno...un...ek

As for Nani playing for a better team...I suppose you downgrade what Messi accomplishes, seeing as he is playing with possibly the best club team ever assembled.

Hectic · 23rd April 2012, 14:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by apotheosis

Maybe but he did score his goal coming from the right.

So what? What does that prove about anything?

Cina · 23rd April 2012, 15:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hectic

So what? What does that prove about anything?

He ... can't ... turn ... left!

Rossa · 23rd April 2012, 15:11

Imo, Nani is the best winger in the PL, left or right. He has pace to fight it out with Bale, Walcott and Valencia, but he also has much, much more trickery up his bag. He is more unpredictable, has the best shot of the bunch and also provides great crosses. Note that he has as many assists as Valencia this season!

I wouldn't swap Nani with Bale, but Bale with Valencia might be a shout, although after Christmas I would argue that Valencia has been better than Bale who seems to drift too much inwards and shoots like a German SS-trooper with tourettes.

Freak · 23rd April 2012, 15:26

I wouldn't even swap Valencia with Bale. I feel that this season Bale has gotten ahead of himself and doing a really poor impression of Ronaldo.

Pogue Mahone · 23rd April 2012, 16:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hectic

If you are trying to find a stat that shows Nani can't play well down the left, or isn't clearly a great threat from that side, you won't find one because it doesn't exist.

I believe he is better on the right, but the difference is marginal. We've seen from multiple games, too many to count how effective he can be from the left. Yesterday, also, being a good example of that.

Yesterday can actually be added to the longish list of games this season when he's played better on the left than the right.

Hectic · 23rd April 2012, 16:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pogue Mahone

Yesterday can actually be added to the longish list of games this season when he's played better on the left than the right.

Definitely. It's one thing to debate over which side is better, but it should be clear to anyone who watches us that Nani is obviously very capable, if not equally so at playing on the left.

KingMinger22 · 23rd April 2012, 16:46

Bale is better than Nani was at his age.

Bale would be a world beater at United.

Ole's_toe_poke · 23rd April 2012, 16:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by KingMinger22

Bale is better than Nani was at his age.

Bale would be a world beater at United.

Shame he'll end up at City.

Hectic · 23rd April 2012, 16:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by KingMinger22

Bale is better than Nani was at his age.

Bale would be a world beater at United.

Bale wouldn't be as good as Nani even if he had spent the last 5 years here.

Cina · 23rd April 2012, 16:54

Nani is more talented than Bale and despite not being as good at him at that age, if you compare both of them at 22 I would rate Nani's potential higher quite easily. The problem was that his decision making was poor but since he sorted it out he's turned into the leagues best winger, I can't see Bale ever being as good as he is.

Hectic · 23rd April 2012, 16:55

Couldn't agree more. Bale does what he does very well ans is an exciting prospect, but yesterday was the perfect example of why he won't touch the heights of Nani. He has so much more to his game.

Varun_Utd · 23rd April 2012, 17:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cina

I can't see Bale ever being as good as he is.

Neither can i. Nani is on a different level as far as talent and ability goes. He has so much more to his game.

Sojiro · 23rd April 2012, 17:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pogue Mahone

Yesterday can actually be added to the longish list of games this season when he's played better on the left than the right.

Only a couple of loose touches as he tried to drive the by-line prevented him from doing in one game what we want Young to have done all season

Rossa · 23rd April 2012, 17:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hectic

Definitely. It's one thing to debate over which side is better, but it should be clear to anyone who watches us that Nani is obviously very capable, if not equally so at playing on the left.

He's even more unpredictable on the left, and he offers more of a goal scoring threat cutting in from the left than the right, although his left foot is also very good! To me, he's more entertaining playing on the left side, but arguably more productive playing on the right...

Garethw · 23rd April 2012, 20:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Freak

I wouldn't even swap Valencia with Bale. I feel that this season Bale has gotten ahead of himself and doing a really poor impression of Ronaldo.

Really? Bale is about 5 years younger than Valencia and IMO will become a far far better player. Bale can also play at fullback which is obviously a bonus too.

kouroux · 23rd April 2012, 20:38

Bale is talented but his main asset is still his pace and cross.He hasn't showed enough other attributes for me (and many others) to consider him better than Nani.Bale hasn't been helped but the enormous media hype, too much is expected from him and he may think he's too good

rednev · 23rd April 2012, 20:46

There's some serious underrating going on in this thread.

lysglimt · 23rd April 2012, 21:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by kouroux

Bale is talented but his main asset is still his pace and cross.He hasn't showed enough other attributes for me (and many others) to consider him better than Nani.Bale hasn't been helped but the enormous media hype, too much is expected from him and he may think he's too good

He is lightning quick, has very good crosses, strong penetrating runs and a very good strike, scores quite a few goals and is very good at set-pieces...

apart from that he is nothing special

Rossa · 23rd April 2012, 21:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by lysglimt

He is lightning quick, has very good crosses, strong penetrating runs and a very good strike, scores quite a few goals and is very good at set-pieces...

apart from that he is nothing special

He has about the same pace as Valencia, misses more shots than any other player in the PL, scores some goals but assists too little.

He is a left footed Valencia, who can also play as a fullback.

peterstorey · 23rd April 2012, 21:50

He has his big games when they don't really matter too. It's one thing to cane some hapless Bolton fullback at WHL, quite another to do it at Arsenal, Liverpool, Everton or OT.

Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber · 23rd April 2012, 21:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rossa

He has about the same pace as Valencia, misses more shots than any other player in the PL, scores some goals but assists too little.

He is a left footed Valencia, who can also play as a fullback.

Plus a superior finisher.

Rossa · 23rd April 2012, 21:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber

Plus a superior finisher.

And Valencia the superior assister, so one cancels the other...

If Bale had been playing for United and wasted as many attacks as he is now doing for Tottenham you would be demanding his head on a platter! Nani would never get away with it! After January or thereabouts, Bale has been quite poor!

Ole's_toe_poke · 23rd April 2012, 22:00

I still can't believe he won player of the year and got voted twice for team of the year based on two performances against an aging Maicon where all he did was kick and run. Not to mention the fact that in the grand scheme of things those performances meant fuck all in Tottenham's season.

God, footballers are stupid.

crappycraperson · 23rd April 2012, 22:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by peterstorey

He has his big games when they don't really matter too. It's one thing to cane some hapless Bolton fullback at WHL, quite another to do it at Arsenal, Liverpool, Everton or OT.

That's not true. He got them he CL two season ago by putting in big performance at the end of the season. Was MOTM against Chelsea.

This season as a whole their team has suffered in big matches but he has still been their best player this season for me.

friendlytramp · 23rd April 2012, 23:00

Left back

jakec · 24th April 2012, 10:02

Bale, who used to be a very under rated player, is now in the top 10 most over rated players in the league. He didn't deserve to be in the PFA team of the year.

apotheosis · 24th April 2012, 11:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neutral

My fault for engaging you...should have left you alone...the Nani stats are relevant, because Bale has played exclusively on the left for 95% of his career, and on his strong side last season he got 1 fucking assist...one...uno...un...ek

So what? Nani hasn't and that's the point. It's not your fault for engaging me at all, don't try and make out i am being unreasonable. You provided stats relating to both player's productivity, but seeing as Nani's stats are not only from the left hand side, they do not have much relevance in a discussion of Nani's productivity on the left.

For instance Nani on the right at the start of this season was on fire, socring half a dozen golas and assists in the first 4 or 5 games. Can anyone find a similarly impressive run from the left?

Quote:

As for Nani playing for a better team...I suppose you downgrade what Messi accomplishes, seeing as he is playing with possibly the best club team ever assembled.

I am not downgrading anything Nani does, but it should go without saying if you have better strikers they will score more of the chances created for them.

Hectic · 25th April 2012, 15:49

You still don't think Nani can play on the left, despite playing on the left and producing fantastic performances throughout the last two years? You can argue all you like about him being better on the right, but that doesn't mean he isn't quality on the left, which we get to see pretty much all the time.

Adam-Utd · 25th April 2012, 16:13

I would argue nani is more consistent on the right hand side, thus making it seem that he is "better" on the right wing.

But when he plays on the left he is still capable of very high standards.

(see everton + fulham away etc)

ciderman9000000 · 25th April 2012, 16:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam-Utd

I would argue nani is more consistent on the right hand side, thus making it seem that he is "better" on the right wing.

But when he plays on the left he is still capable of very high standards.

(see everton + fulham away etc)

Personally I believe that Nani is just as capable on either side and is prone to getting stuck in something of a rut at times if played on one side in too many consecutive games. Nani thrives on the freedom, novelty and creativity of being able to switch sides just like the Ronaldo of old; I'd fucking love it if we could sign another both-sided player who could switch a few times mid-game like Nani and Ronny used to.

apotheosis · 25th April 2012, 17:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hectic

You still don't think Nani can play on the left, despite playing on the left and producing fantastic performances throughout the last two years? You can argue all you like about him being better on the right, but that doesn't mean he isn't quality on the left, which we get to see pretty much all the time.

Hectic, i have never said he cannot play on the left, which you are now implying i said. I said he wasn't as consistent on the left, and i have never considered him a left winger. It's not just his attacking, him in front of Evra is an accident waiting to happen. We saw for Everton's second goal, how slow he was not only to spot the full back, but then to close him down.

My whole point on this was to ask the question whether we would be better with a hard working player on the left, with a consistent and reliable delivery, like we have on the right with Valencia. As i said before Nani is a great talent, with more skill than all of them.

As i have also said i do not rate his consistency as high as you and others do. With his talent, if he was as consistent as you believe why then is he not considered amongst the world's very best? He is a talented as any player, barring Ronaldo and Messi, so it can only be his lack of consistency that prevents him from being considered in that company. Surely not as unreasonable a suggestion as you have made it out to be?

In your view it may appear i am underrating him, but not in my view. I have acknowledged his skill and talent, but simply do not agree his runs of form are as lengthy as you claim. Nor do i overrate his ability to defend down either flank. For me he is a wide forward much better suited to a 4-3-3, than a left or right winger with defensive duties in front of a full back.

Ash_G · 25th April 2012, 18:50

I don't think that's necessary and I think it would weaken us. Nani isn't that bad at tracking back that we would need to go down that route and over the past few seasons he's shown how much more creativity he provides. I think earlier you were in the right lines of getting in another defensively competent midfielder, which I think would solve quite a few problems. But we definitely shouldn't be looking to get a winger in to protect evra more, we need more output from our wingers not less.

apotheosis · 25th April 2012, 19:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ash_G

I don't think that's necessary and I think it would weaken us. Nani isn't that bad at tracking back that we would need to go down that route and over the past few seasons he's shown how much more creativity he provides. I think earlier you were in the right lines of getting in another defensively competent midfielder, which I think would solve quite a few problems. But we definitely shouldn't be looking to get a winger in to protect evra more, we need more output from our wingers not less.

Ash i have never once suggested signing Bale. I only asked the question hypothetically. You have read enough of my posts to know what position i would like us to strengthen and my view hasn't changed on that since the end of last season.

The reason why this debate has gone on is that other posters have strongly disagreed with me suggesting Nani is less consistent than a Valencia or a Bale, which is fair enough. I can only be honest, but i have no problem with Hectic or anybody else having a differing view to mine.

I stand by my statement that in my view Nani is more a wide forward than a winger. Not only because i believe his strengths are better suited to that role, but also because i do not believe he is particularly adept at covering the full back which is a requirement of a winger in a 4-4-2 system.

I see him no more a winger than Ronaldo was for pretty much the same reasons. I also believe that Nani would be very effective played through the middle. His pace and trickery and ability to make that crucial yard of space, added to his capacity to go either left or right and shoot from distance, imo make him an exciting prospect through the centre.

So i have never once suggested i do not rate Nani, or think we should sell him in favour of Bale. Only that i do not think he is consistent as a winger because in my view his strengths are more that of a wide forward or possibly an AM or second striker. Not an AM in a 4-4-2 mind!

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23rd April 2012, 13:46	#961 (permalink)
Ash_G Reserve Team Player Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 4,636	Shit strikers? Adebayor is better than Hernandez/Welbeck/Berbatov however much of a cunt he is. Defoe has arguably played better than Hernandez this season and Saha is probably much better in the air then Hernandez/Welbeck. Spurs have problems but it's not really their strikers. Bale is an excellent player, who like Valencia on his day will be an absolute nightmare to defend against. For the record I think he's better than Valencia, I don't think he's better than Nani though who as I said has more to his game imo. If you offered me a swap of him for Young/Valencia I'd take it, not for Nani though.

23rd April 2012, 14:10	#962 (permalink)
Hectic Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Mike Phelan WILL kill you. Posts: 64,856	If you are trying to find a stat that shows Nani can't play well down the left, or isn't clearly a great threat from that side, you won't find one because it doesn't exist. I believe he is better on the right, but the difference is marginal. We've seen from multiple games, too many to count how effective he can be from the left. Yesterday, also, being a good example of that.

23rd April 2012, 14:39	#964 (permalink)
Ash_G Reserve Team Player Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 4,636	Tbh but for Valencia's resurgent form I think it was because he was looking for a more fluid dynamic front four which you can get with Nani, Rooney, Welbeck and Young. Although there are question marks over if Young can step up I'm certain that's what he was going for. Unfortunately because of mass injuries across the team, and people being in form at different times we've not seen the best of what that set up could offer.

23rd April 2012, 15:11	#970 (permalink)
Rossa Reserve Team Player Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Up north where football is slow and not quite as entertaining. Posts: 1,609	Imo, Nani is the best winger in the PL, left or right. He has pace to fight it out with Bale, Walcott and Valencia, but he also has much, much more trickery up his bag. He is more unpredictable, has the best shot of the bunch and also provides great crosses. Note that he has as many assists as Valencia this season! I wouldn't swap Nani with Bale, but Bale with Valencia might be a shout, although after Christmas I would argue that Valencia has been better than Bale who seems to drift too much inwards and shoots like a German SS-trooper with tourettes.

23rd April 2012, 15:26	#971 (permalink)
Freak Born a freak always a freak. Join Date: May 2004 Location: Somewhere in your mind, touching a nerve Posts: 11,295	I wouldn't even swap Valencia with Bale. I feel that this season Bale has gotten ahead of himself and doing a really poor impression of Ronaldo.

23rd April 2012, 16:46	#974 (permalink)
KingMinger22 City >>> United. Moaning twat Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Banbury Posts: 3,444	Bale is better than Nani was at his age. Bale would be a world beater at United.

23rd April 2012, 16:54	#977 (permalink)
Cina Love Nani, Hate Ando Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: The Bandwagon Posts: 24,176	Nani is more talented than Bale and despite not being as good at him at that age, if you compare both of them at 22 I would rate Nani's potential higher quite easily. The problem was that his decision making was poor but since he sorted it out he's turned into the leagues best winger, I can't see Bale ever being as good as he is.

23rd April 2012, 16:55	#978 (permalink)
Hectic Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Mike Phelan WILL kill you. Posts: 64,856	Couldn't agree more. Bale does what he does very well ans is an exciting prospect, but yesterday was the perfect example of why he won't touch the heights of Nani. He has so much more to his game.

23rd April 2012, 20:38	#983 (permalink)
kouroux No Lifer Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Djibouti (La terre des braves) Posts: 32,559	Bale is talented but his main asset is still his pace and cross.He hasn't showed enough other attributes for me (and many others) to consider him better than Nani.Bale hasn't been helped but the enormous media hype, too much is expected from him and he may think he's too good

23rd April 2012, 20:46	#984 (permalink)
rednev God Save My Gracious Queen Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 20,327	There's some serious underrating going on in this thread.

23rd April 2012, 21:50	#987 (permalink)
peterstorey Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: I've dealt with RiP being injured for 8 seasons - it's your problem now. Posts: 29,932	He has his big games when they don't really matter too. It's one thing to cane some hapless Bolton fullback at WHL, quite another to do it at Arsenal, Liverpool, Everton or OT.

23rd April 2012, 22:00	#990 (permalink)
Ole's_toe_poke First Team Regular Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 22,978	I still can't believe he won player of the year and got voted twice for team of the year based on two performances against an aging Maicon where all he did was kick and run. Not to mention the fact that in the grand scheme of things those performances meant fuck all in Tottenham's season. God, footballers are stupid.

23rd April 2012, 23:00	#992 (permalink)
friendlytramp More full of crap than a curry house toilet Join Date: May 2004 Location: J Stand Posts: 2,754	Left back

24th April 2012, 10:02	#993 (permalink)
jakec I'm a fecking politics student for Gods sake Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Follow me @_JakeCullen_ Posts: 21,070	Bale, who used to be a very under rated player, is now in the top 10 most over rated players in the league. He didn't deserve to be in the PFA team of the year.

25th April 2012, 15:49	#995 (permalink)
Hectic Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Mike Phelan WILL kill you. Posts: 64,856	You still don't think Nani can play on the left, despite playing on the left and producing fantastic performances throughout the last two years? You can argue all you like about him being better on the right, but that doesn't mean he isn't quality on the left, which we get to see pretty much all the time.

25th April 2012, 16:13	#996 (permalink)
Adam-Utd First Team Sub Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 5,983	I would argue nani is more consistent on the right hand side, thus making it seem that he is "better" on the right wing. But when he plays on the left he is still capable of very high standards. (see everton + fulham away etc)

25th April 2012, 18:50	#999 (permalink)
Ash_G Reserve Team Player Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 4,636	I don't think that's necessary and I think it would weaken us. Nani isn't that bad at tracking back that we would need to go down that route and over the past few seasons he's shown how much more creativity he provides. I think earlier you were in the right lines of getting in another defensively competent midfielder, which I think would solve quite a few problems. But we definitely shouldn't be looking to get a winger in to protect evra more, we need more output from our wingers not less.