A serious look at Mauricio Pochettino

Discussion in 'Football Forum' started by NotBrendanRodgers honest, Jan 15, 2018.

  1. Dec 3, 2018

    hellohello Full Member

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    You are basing this on what exactly? We are 8 points ahead of Everton and only 1 point behind Chelsea and Arsenal. Chelsea also need to play Man City while we have played the top 6 once already.

    People keep pretending the top 4 is decided after every round... Before the Arsenal game people said spurs were nailed on for 3rd. Right now, there's a group of 1+1+3 imo. City ahead with Liverpool behind, and then Arsenal, Chelsea and Spurs who look to battle for the last 2 CL spots.

    Personally I still have us favourites for 3rd, but it will be a tough battle with Arsenal and Chelsea.
  2. Dec 3, 2018

    hellohello Full Member

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    It will be a different game, and anything can happen, I am quietly confident actually. At least there will be the same time for rest and we won't come off two high intensity games emotionally and physically.
  3. Dec 3, 2018

    Champ New Member

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    Poch got schooled yesterday, Emery out smarted him tactically in the second half and true to form Poch didn't have a plan b.
    Spurs were second best all over the park and had no answers, seen it before from Spurs, Poch doesn't seem to be able to change big games very often if things aren't going well.
  4. Dec 3, 2018

    Sky1981 Fending off the urge

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    The same base you based your assumption that you'll finish 3rd despite being fifth at the moment
  5. Dec 3, 2018

    hellohello Full Member

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    Far from it. I said I expect Arsenal, Chelsea and Tottenham to fight for 3rd and 4th. You said we could end up behind you and Everton and that Chelsea and Arsenal will finish top 4.

    Reason I see us as favourites for 3rd is because we have finished top 3 for the last 3 seasons where our form in the second half of the season have been better than our first half. We have also had many injuries to deal with with injuries to Verthongen, Alli, Eriksen, Sanchez, Lloris, Dembele etc., but now we got most of our squad back fit.

    Also, Arsenal will go to Old Trafford and Chelsea will play City before half of the season is over. I'm not certain we'll get third, but that's why I think we will end up finishing third. It's probably gonna be tight though.
  6. Dec 3, 2018

    crossy1686 Full Member

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    This is my biggest issue with Pochettino. I'm not sure he either knows how to change a game or inspire his players to do so. It could just be the mentality at Spurs seeing as he's done this on a relatively small budget in comparison, the players aren't exactly coming into the team as winners, they're having to develop that mentality. I'm pretty sure we'd be on the end of a quite a few high profile losses with him in charge, and you can forget getting anywhere near a Champions League final.
  7. Dec 3, 2018

    Champ New Member

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    Agreed.
    Although I will say that he doesn't have as many game changing options at Spurs as he probably would at a club like United.
    Having said that though, his only tactical change seems to be to change between 4 at the back or 3/5 at the back and nowt else.
  8. Dec 3, 2018

    Sky1981 Fending off the urge

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    We shall see then.

    Last season your team was on a forward trajectory, everything is going well. This season you wobble out of champions league, liverpool and city is guaranteed top 2 and chelsea and arsenal are better this year.

    Your team form also isnt as good as last season. So we shall see.

    I think you'd be out of top 4 losing your place to arsenal and poch wont be your manager next year.
  9. Dec 3, 2018

    Trizy Full Member

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    Is Poch always gonna be Spurs level? He's fallen short the past 3 years while having the 2nd best XI in the league. He has underachieved by not looking like they're gonna win anything. Have they even made a final?

    Not sure he's the right man at the head of United.
  10. Dec 3, 2018

    Sky1981 Fending off the urge

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    Poch greatest trick is making sure totenham viewed as a poor team punching above their weight, imagine if he's working on a bigger budget, etc.

    Same like moyes, probably a better manager than moyes, but once they made the jump to the biggest clubs (like madrid, barcelona, bayern) they fall short.

    Many midtable manager creating miracles, but got found out when they move up a class.
  11. Dec 3, 2018

    hellohello Full Member

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    Last season after 14 games we were 7th behind Burnley, and would go on to draw the next game as well.

    Table here.

    2017/2018
    1 [​IMG] Manchester City 40
    2 [​IMG] Manchester United 32
    3 [​IMG] Chelsea FC 29
    4 [​IMG] Arsenal FC 28
    5 [​IMG] Liverpool FC 26
    6 [​IMG] Burnley FC 25
    7 [​IMG] Tottenham Hotspur 24

    In 2016/2017 we were 5th with 27 points.
    In 2015/2016 we were 5th with 25 points.

    In fact, in all seasons under Poch we have been slow starters, but improved in the second half, and for me my biggest criticism of Poch is that we start the season slow. However, we have always finished the season very strongly.

    If we go out of the CL, which is still far from certain since Barca doesn't have anything to play for, then our chances in the league would be better. Chelsea and Arsenal have had the luxury of playing group games in the EL, far from the same intensity as the CL group stage. After Christmas we may all play EL or at the very least, EL playoff is more taxing than the group stage.
  12. Dec 3, 2018

    Mastadon New Member

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    Quite incredible that you would compare him to a midtable manager. He’s working with limitations that none of the other top 5 managers have. On a level playing field Poch would have 150m to spend and wouldn’t have to rely on the likes of Wanyama, Dembele and Sissoko but it’s not a level playing field and you are judging a manager who spent 0 in the summer negatively against other managers who have had large budgets to improve their sides.

    I think Poch has done all he can with Spurs current squad and without big investment it won’t move to the next level. Look at every other club they are where they are because they spend big to improve their squad. Spurs is the only exception.
  13. Dec 3, 2018

    Mastadon New Member

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    https://www.transferleague.co.uk/pr...tables/premier-league-table-last-five-seasons

    Look at the difference in spending between Spurs and the other big clubs. Football isn’t just about having an XI you need a big squad to compete and they have only recently started qualifying for the CL regularly.

    To finish top 3 and do decently in the CL with such little depth is overachievement IMO. Poch can only be judged if he had 150-200m to spend to be on par with the other clubs.

    You can’t on the one hand keep saying City’s success is down to money while criticizing Spurs for not having won anything when they have spent next to nothing. It’s illogical.

    Anyway you will all see I’m right when Poch moves to a big club and wins trophies in the next few years.
  14. Dec 3, 2018

    Trizy Full Member

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    Liverpool made the CL final last year with feck all squad depth. United won 3 trophies under Jose with shit enough depth. Chelsea the PL under Conte without unbelievable depth.

    Sorry but I can't take that excuse. Not every team has had the depth City have now. One could argue no one ever has.

    Madrid won 3 in a row without great quality on the bench. This is open to debate but it needs to be said.

    Just because some of the above teams I've mentioned have players on the bench people know doesn't mean they're actually good.
  15. Dec 3, 2018

    Mick321 Full Member

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    There's always a weird overreaction to him when Spurs lose a game, much like the Van Dijk thread when he makes a tiny error. :D

    He's done an amazing job, the fact people expect them to make finals and stuff now says it all about how good he's done rather than how bad. He's brilliant, would love us to get him, we should be on at his agent all the time offering him the chance of a big budget for once. It's odd on here seeing posts saying we can't expect to compete with City coz money then some of the same people say Klopp and Poch "have to win trophies now".
  16. Dec 3, 2018

    crossy1686 Full Member

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    The problem is that there's so much talk around Poch going to Madrid or United after he eventually leaves Tottenham, that he's judged as a manager of one of those clubs and not the manager of Tottenham. Yes, he's done great at Tottenham but he hasn't achieved anything that wouldn't be a bare minimum expectation at one of the aforementioned clubs.

    Poch isn't an elite manager and he hasn't shown the traits to be considered anywhere near it yet.
  17. Dec 3, 2018

    the_irish123 New Member

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    Redknapp did a similar job but doesnt have a fancy accent.
  18. Dec 3, 2018

    zizi New Member

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    The irony being that is exactly what mourinho is doing! The very fact that spurs are competing for top 4 is poch punching above jis weight imo
  19. Dec 3, 2018

    reddaz71 Full Member

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    Lets have a look at the one after Poch because nada will change while the club is run with the shareprice as the number one priority!! Absolutely baffling why fans are not looking at the wider problem here.
  20. Dec 3, 2018

    GlastonSpur Also disliked on an Aston Villa forum

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    Your original comment: "They really had to add some players during the last window."

    Now you say that your reason for this comment - and its timing - had nothing to do with a knee-jerk response to our losing away to Arsenal (having won our previous 6 games straight), but rather it's "Because … every single club brought in new players."

    Apart from the timing of your comment being suspicious (why didn't you make it at any point during our 6 game winning run?), the reason you now given doesn't stack up …. because some of the new players signed by other clubs have been flops and also because, as I've said before, the virtues of squad continuity are always under-rated on here in favour of drooling over shiny new toys.
  21. Dec 3, 2018

    GlastonSpur Also disliked on an Aston Villa forum

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    You clearly haven't looked at the remaining fixture list.
  22. Dec 3, 2018

    amolbhatia50k Sneaky bum time

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    Underachieved? No chance.
  23. Dec 3, 2018

    cesc's_mullet Get a haircut Hippy!

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    Tottenham should have bought players during the window to improve the squad, that much is obvious. It was obvious when the window closed, it was just as obvious this morning, and unsurprisingly it will be obvious again tomorrow.

    Every other side strengthened their squads and average clubs are throwing big money around. The league has been becoming more competitive in general as a result. With the threat of a potentially resurgent Chelsea and Arsenal at the start of the season it was critical for Tottenham to keep the momentum going IMO. If you stay still you fall behind - take it from an Arsenal fan who saw the exact same thing happen through our stadium transition years.

    This surely doesn't need any further explanation.

    Not even you can spin it as anything other than a missed opportunity. Though no doubt you'll try.
  24. Dec 3, 2018

    AaronRedDevil New Member

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    I'm not really into the idea of Poch. We need an attacking type manager. All of our midfield barring Matic are best at attacking. Pogba, Fred and Herrera. But saying Poch has underachieved is not true. Sure he hasn't won feck all. but hes doing good for them. for a man who spent nothing vs the man who's spend hundreds of millions. Right now they are 8 points ahead, the last season Spurs were just 4 points behind and the season before that, they were 2nd. I'd rather gamble on him. He could not be worse right now. Wait till the summer for him.
  25. Dec 3, 2018

    cesc's_mullet Get a haircut Hippy!

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    How can anyone say that he's underachieved when clubs like United, Chelsea, Liverpool, City and even Arsenal have thoroughly out-spent them in recent years?
  26. Dec 3, 2018

    Frank Grimes Full Member

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    Excellent manager but made a big mistake yesterday dropping Alderweireld.
  27. Dec 3, 2018

    Cee90 Redcafe Fantasy Football Champion 2012/13

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    That’s enough time looking at him

    Now let’s make a move.

    Sure, it won’t be easy but it’s not impossible.
  28. Dec 3, 2018

    Sky1981 Fending off the urge

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    In the real world points weren't given for "spending lest than the club above me".

    If poch gets the united job we will not care whether he spends peanuts. We will want him to spend, he will spend, and be judged among the rest as equal. Not with this "oh he did it on a shoestring budget".

    Did we give moyes a pass for 7th because he spents everton level of money?
  29. Dec 3, 2018

    AaronRedDevil New Member

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    That's not my point. It's just that the truckload of money Utd have spent. Tottenham have been above us twice in the last 3 seasons. And they haven't spent nearly as much as United have. Performance wise, he's been overachieving. You could say mou won feck all except the FA cup, had he not got the easiest path to the EL iv ever seen.
  30. Dec 4, 2018

    Sky1981 Fending off the urge

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    Mourinho spent truckloads, won the FA cup. EL. And the league cup. It's in the history. Years from now that cup will go along his cv and our history. It may not be what people wanted, he may still be doing a shit job and will still be sacked. But he did win something.

    Poch got zilch to show. It's amazing to win something while being an underdog (leicester). But being an underdog, placed 5th, and not winning anything is nothing to brag home about.
  31. Dec 4, 2018

    GlastonSpur Also disliked on an Aston Villa forum

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    If he gets it? You make it sound as if there'll be stiff competition for the job when Mourinho is sacked, when in all likelihood Pochettino doesn't even want it in the first place.
  32. Dec 4, 2018

    Sky1981 Fending off the urge

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    Forget united. He'll move to madrid next season and you'd be back with 2nd tier manager. My bet on ranieri
  33. Dec 4, 2018

    ayushreddevil9 Full Member

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    They might go for Eddie Howe if Poch leaves(if at all)
  34. Dec 4, 2018

    GlastonSpur Also disliked on an Aston Villa forum

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    Ah, the old "next season" departure prediction. It never fails to always fail. According to some on here Kane was due to have left 3 years ago.
  35. Dec 5, 2018

    JSArsenal Full Member

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    https://www.theguardian.com/football/2018/dec/04/maurico-pochettino-tottenham-hotspur-arsenal

    What would Poch know about celebrating trophies? Its telling he said "when I was a player". Also.......

    [​IMG]

    Spurs after beating Liverpool 4-1 last season.
  36. Dec 5, 2018

    AlwaysRed66 Full Member

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    Pochettino has really overachieved what with the resources he has compared to other clubs. If you rated all the managers in the Premier League by how well they have done with the resources they have then he would be top, & our clown bottom.
  37. Dec 7, 2018

    Berbaclass Full Member

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  38. Dec 7, 2018

    Snafu17 Full Member

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    United Xtra, The Sun and the Sunday Supplement is a unique combination of awfulness.
  39. Dec 7, 2018

    Johan07 Full Member

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    What does the labor legislation set forth in the UK when it comes to a manager and his contract?
    Would Pochettino or the acquiring club be able to "buy" him out of his contract? And if so on what terms?
    Anyone have an intelligent input on this?
  40. Dec 7, 2018

    InLevyITrust Full Member

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    Only Poch could buy his way out of the contact, which would be a massive amount the amount remaining on his contract. It won’t happen, I can’t remember any manager or player actually doing it he would be a PR disaster and Poch simply isn’t the tripe to even consider it.