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Can't really argue with that. Herrera has so far been a key component in our midfield.
Very good again, winning the ball back and slipping some excellent passes into the channels.
Didnt he get dropped last season after scoring against Everton cos he was in a position he wasnt meant to be or something. Or he was pressing too much and LVG didnt like our players pressing and leaving their five yard zone. Or something.
Anyway, his high press is really important. I do miss when we have Carrick cos it allows him to press higher than he does when hes sitting himself.
Love everything about Herrera but I think his high presses are actually a bit stupid because he more often than not loses his man/gets bypassed because he's doing it alone.
I'm not talking about the interceptions or when he's on his back foot (i.e in a 'settled' position and reading the game) or making tackles/blocks. I'm talking about the situations the opposition are trying to bring the ball out and he's gone rushing in trying to put pressure.
His press is uncoordinated with everyone else (tactics, instincts etc) so imo he's actually harming the team because others behind him have to mop up. That's generally 'fine' against the opposition we're playing now but it'd be very risky against good teams. However, having said that, he usually turns it up a notch against the big teams so ermmm I guess it's mostly neutralised.
I'd love to see a proper organised full team press but at the moment, Herrera needs to cut that out of his game if he wants to be more tactically disciplined.
The fact I'm asking so much of him says it all really.
Maybe Herrera is the answer to our Carrick problem? I know they are vastly different player types as far as midfielders go, but his defensive stats speaks for themselves. Now ideally Carrick would be ten years younger, and our MF would be sorted for years, but he isn't and the fact is that the "Carrick type" of midfielder don't come around so often.
the fact that he always does that high pressing till now means Jose approves it, even he is our current starting 11. of course he indeed needs to be smarter again with his pressing
I don't think Herrera is suited for that role. His long passing is just not good enough. Even yesterday, it was Pogba who had to drop back and start spraying balls around. Herrera is also an all-action kind of player. So he will do much better as a defensive b2b where he can run around and close down players.
Yeah he's more akin to Darren Fletcher than Michael Carrick.
nope. He played the next game (Europa league away to cska) and the next PL game (city at home)
Wish we would have brought him off. He's only had one game rest and he's going to be massively important on Sunday in terms of pressing and high intensity running, 60minutes would have been fine, or even coming on for the last 30. Saying that, he looked bright and played well.
I believe he had at least 5 interception last game and the ones he missed and rushed at opponent we win the ball 9/10 and got back to attacking, even if he misses his man, it's important for the rest of the team to follow. Yes it can be risky but if we don't have a player like that, the teams will play out from the back easily and we wait for another 5 minutes to get the ball back.. sitting back is bullshit, it's also ineffective these days, more palyers need to press so not Ander should cut this out of his game, despite the fact that he might be more cautious at times, so I partly agree with you, but other players should add this to their game and we have very good centerbacks at reading the game and stepping out. I am sure if Mourinho had a problem with him Ander would be the one to get it immediately and stopped doing so..
You just described the main reason why the team as a whole functions a lot better when the heart of our midfield, the Pogba-Herrera combo, is supported by an extra midfielder behind them and not ahead of them.
In regards to Herrera, i don't think he'll ever cut the tendency to press the first attacker or to chase the second balls out of his game. It's one of the three things that make him a valuable asset to this team, the other two being his first touch (with which he almost always manages to create space for himself) and his ability to spot potential openings in the final third and offer supporting runs.
Furthermore, it's a rather sensible tactical decision. Firstly, while Mourinho's teams don't use active high pressing often, they try to make the first two or three passes out from the back difficult for the opposition in order to create more time for their defensive transition and regain shape in their half of the pitch. Now, the main options in our attacking trident (minus Mkhitaryan and Lingard) aren't very good at hunting down for the ball. In this sense, the statistics that show Herrera as one of the best players in the league in possession won in the attacking half/final third are indeed very valuable to us. Secondly, Herrera has to press, regardless of the risk of being overran, because our attacks from right include the right winger tucking in and the right back providing width in the final third. So, Herrera basically has to protect two channels when we lose the ball instead of one. In other words, he must try to cut off the pass, otherwise he'll find himself in no man's land with the opponent having time on the ball and options available for a free pass.
Your remarks about the space on Herrera's back which the opposition can exploit is, of course, correct. But to me it seems it's not so much a disciplinary issue for Herrera, whose positional problems occur in the holding role when he has to protect spaces instead of chasing the ball, as it is a tactical "weakness" we have chosen to live with. Another glaring weakness is the inability of our LB to defend 1v1 (at least until Shaw regains full fitness). The first weakness has brought Carrick back into the starting xi and the second has given Rojo (a natural left footed CB who knows what a LB must be aware of too) a second chance in the team.
The other option is to go in full defensive mode, like we did at Anfield, with 10 players constantly behind the ball. But, till now, what we get from Herrera in the midfield (offering Pogba license to roam free in the attacking half included) compensates for the risks we are willing to take in our tactics.
I'll finish as i started and i'll say i really hope that Jose won't change the tactics and he'll keep utilizing Herrera as he currently does. I still believe that they way we attack (recycling possession high up the pitch and working out openings instead of quick attacking transition and players aggressively attacking spaces both on and off the ball) isn't really his cup of tea and i also believe he doesn't feel comfortable without a play maker (#10 or #8) in his team. And since Herrera and Pogba are unmovable in the midfield, i suspect he might look for a #10. Which imho will be the same mistake LvG did when he decided to switch to his favorite 4231 at the start of his second season at United.
Couldn't agree more, having Herrera there clearly put more burden on Pogba to come further back and collect in order to spread the play.
6 assists? really. That's serious work for his role. I would like to see him forward more as he has an eye for a pass and good shooting technique from the edge of the box when he controls it first
I think the trio of Carrick, him and Pogba is perfect for all 3.
Oh for sure. Its just my selfishness wanting him on the scoresheet more.
He had some really good long passes yesterday for Valencia, Darmian and Mikhi i believe. Glad to see him utilising that aspect of his game as well.
Ander Herrera is going to be very important in the Liverpool game. We could do with some of his ace interception game. Was absolutely brilliant against Liverpool earlier in the season- tireless, intelligent and inspirational.
I thought he was excellent last night. I don't know what the stats were but he seemed to be winning the ball back non stop/
Played well against Hull, just as he does in pretty much every game. He will be very important for us against Liverpool.
Or Mou bought Pogba..
Ha ha cheers @ivaldo I have been busy at work so missed this. He's a good player but still not convinced. He also tends to favour going to his right a high percentage of the time thus nullifying our left attack. I get pelters of my mates when we travel down to games so maybe it's just me (probably) but I think we can do better still. But he is certainly not a priority to be replaced and he is a good player.
Agree with both bits but that's my (small atm but could be big) issue. It's the uncoordinated press/going in heads first. It's a double edge sword. Love his enthusiam and willingness to affect the outcome directly but it is reckless at times. He did it more than a few times against Hull and got bypassed but it doesn't matter because well, we were at home against Hull.
I've said he raises his game against better opposition, so I'm nitpicking really.
I think most teams in the world today would prefer 3 proper centre midfielders (with varying abilities) in the team as it brings so much stability.
As above agree with what you said, it's just I think he can choose and pick his moments better. I don't want to criticise him but looking at things objectively, he's making an insane amount of tackles and interceptions because he's alway involved in those action areas but there will be times, he'll need to patient and read the game more 'efficiently'. It's better for him (less physical output) and the team (assessing the situation instead of charging at it).
Anyways watch him step up again against Liverpool and make me eat my words.
Wrong. It takes more than one man with a powerful shot and silky technique to make a midfield. Carrick & Herrera are just as important as Pogba in this midfield
The more interceptions than Kante thing is a bit overblown. Herrera's been great this season but Chelsea on the whole make far less defensive actions as a team compared to us. Kante still makes a drastically larger contribution compared to most of his teammates.
The most under-rated, under-appreciated player in the United squad is Ander Herrera Aguera. He presses so well, picks the safer pass every time and for sure knows his place on the pitch. He is a very intelligent footballer and Jose is nurturing him into a fantastic mid-fielder.
What a player.
It can only be a good sign that we have so many players at the moment who seem like they'd make good captains. Herrera, Pogba, Jones, Smalling and Blind are all good candidates in my opinion. For me Herrera's the pick of the bunch. Big character, intelligent and really understands the game, likeable, devoted to the club, leaves everything on the pitch, rarely gets injured (touch wood touch wood touch wood), and he looks likely to be an absolute fixture in the side. He already does a lot of talking, directing play, etc.
Pogba is far better and more important than them.
Fantastic player. Very good on the ball and seems to have developed to good understanding with Pogba as well. He has all the traits to be the future captain of United.
You must be kidding. Have you read this thread? Herrera is apparently good even when he has an average game. He's having a great season and he's a fan favorite
This, Herrera is a huge fan favourite now and no doubt one of the first names on Mourinho's team sheet.
Of course, he is better than both of them. Not disputing that. But, more important? In in terms of overall effectiveness to the team, Herrera & Carrick are just as important as Pogba. He needs a platform to perform and that is provided by a double pivot of those 2 players
Pogba isn't just a player with powerful shot and silky technique.
And I think Pogba is much more important than the other two. That's why all big clubs wanted him. And I am certain that Mourinho will surround Pogba with better player in the future even if Carrick and Herrera are the CAF darlings because they aren't THAT good and important ( but Pogba is ).
Carrick and Herrera are better than Schneiderlin and Fellaini but Herrera isn't a WC player and Carrick is 35.
To return to the top, the club must have a better midfield...the goal is to become again a top 3 european side
Becoming a top 3 European team by only changing the midfield is like building castles in the air. We have a lot of other problems in the team elsewhere which need addressing. The midfield is the least of our worries at the moment.
Carrick at 35 is the most mature regista in the world. Who is better than him that's also mature and premier league proven? And you are definitely underestimating Herrera's role in the side. He is not there to play 50 yards Scholes type passes. His works as a defensive ball winning machine.
Pogba can do neither Carrick's nor Herrera's job. It's a pointless exercise to say who's more important. Imo, all 3 are necessary in the team. At the end of the day, you can't make a midfield with just Pogba. You need to surround him with players who will support him
Exactly, the midfield 3 is like a jigsaw puzzle, you need the right pieces to compliment each other's skill sets and make it a fluid engine room for the team. Right now each of our 3 pieces is operating at a high level and are a perfect compliment to each other.
He needs to score more, one goal this season??
he is playing deeper tbf. He can only take hopeful shots from 30-40 yards in this role
He goes forward often enough and should be in more scoring positions. One goal for a midfielder is not enough
from what ive seen he more often turns up in the wider positions than centrally.
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