Andy Gray: "I'm not sexist, I have four daughters and a mother"

Discussion in 'Football Forum' started by Frosty, Mar 6, 2012.

  1. Mar 6, 2012
    #41

    MG Full Member

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    :lol: Did I read that correctly? How utterly ridiculous - of course they have!

    Women have been suppressed for many, many thousands of years. In many countries around the world they still are. Thousands of years of violence, dominance, rape, exclusion from education and work, repression, silence, stonings, honour killings, forced marriages, female circumcision, gang rapes...

    I'm going waaaaay off topic but how utterly stupid to suggest women haven't been oppressed as badly as people of different races... for god's sake, women have only been regarded as equal human beings for about 20 years!

    I'm going to get another battering in this thread if I keep this up so I'll reiterate what I said earlier - I don't think what Grey and Keys said was enough for them to get sacked, and I do agree it was blown out of proportion, but I do think all the people saying they were only joking are wrong.

    They meant it, then backtracked when they got caught out.
  2. Mar 6, 2012
    #42

    EricaNo7 Full Member

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    I thought Keys leering and saying " smashed it " or " hanging out of the back of it " was much worse than Andy Gray's comment
  3. Mar 6, 2012
    #43

    MG Full Member

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    But apparently, referring to a woman as 'it' is in no way offensive - and if a woman thinks it is, it's her fault for letting it get to her, not the man's fault.
  4. Mar 6, 2012
    #44

    Liam147 On Probation

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    Yeah, well I'll say this and leave it here.

    I understand women have been oppressed, the whole suffrage thing is a good example of that, but you have the KKK in America, and the slave trade, neither of which were exclusively persecuting women.

    You've definitely missed my point. I get that calling a woman 'it' is offensive, my point was that isn't what he was actually doing.
  5. Mar 6, 2012
    #45

    adexkola American Arse

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    It's a harmless stereotype.

    "Women can't drive"
    "White people can't dance"
    "Asian people are good at math"

    etc...
  6. Mar 6, 2012
    #46

    MG Full Member

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    And you have stonings to death, and mass rapes, and exclusion from work, the vote, the right to an opinion, the right to a voice, the right to property and money, and mass violence... none of which is exclusively persecuting people of different races.

    But, no, if someone is sexist, it's the person who gets offended who's at fault, not the person who says it. :lol:
  7. Mar 6, 2012
    #47

    EricaNo7 Full Member

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    We've been called worse, and I'm sure we will be called worse in the future. It's not particularly flattering but I've heard much much worse
  8. Mar 6, 2012
    #48

    Rado_N Grinner ruined my tagline

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    Racist.
  9. Mar 6, 2012
    #49

    MG Full Member

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    Got a few more stereotypes for you

    "Women/black people are too stupid to be able to vote"
    "Women/black people can't work outside the house"
    "Women/black people can't have property"
    "Women/black people can't have a voice, they must be silent, and do as the white man tells them to"
  10. Mar 6, 2012
    #50

    adexkola American Arse

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    It's like Jeremy Lin in the states, people getting fecking precious over every hint at a stereotype play.
  11. Mar 6, 2012
    #51

    EricaNo7 Full Member

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    People are just too touchy these days.
  12. Mar 6, 2012
    #52

    rcoobc Not as crap as eferyone thinks

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    Yeah I think you just hit the nail on the head. This is a case of reality catching up to our moral values, the reality is that in every mens workplace a lot of "banter" may go down, but its not acceptable to be that sexist to women in the public eye.

    Maybe many on here are sexist, but many are probably a lot less so than what came out from Gray and Keys.
  13. Mar 6, 2012
    #53

    adexkola American Arse

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    :smirk:

    Well done.
  14. Mar 6, 2012
    #54

    Adzzz Astrophysical Genius - Hard for Grinner

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    Historical context, hyperbole and hypocrisy.
  15. Mar 6, 2012
    #55

    africanspur Full Member

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    Sexism is still a huge problem worldwide, even in the apparently 'enlightened' countries, at least the equal of racism. We treat our women like shit and have done for centuries.

    And this is one of the most ridiculous arguments I think I've ever seen. So by this, no-one can ever be sexist?
  16. Mar 6, 2012
    #56

    MG Full Member

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    Oh, I know there's worse.

    And the worse stuff would probably be defended on here by the likes of Liam147 saying it's the woman's fault for getting offended, not the man's fault, he can say what he wants... all because of that magical word 'banter', which immediately absolves anyone of any blame whatsoever.
  17. Mar 6, 2012
    #57

    africanspur Full Member

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    This one is true though....:angel:
  18. Mar 6, 2012
    #58

    adexkola American Arse

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    I chuckle in the club a lot when I see it :lol:
  19. Mar 6, 2012
    #59

    Waltraute She-Devil

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    'I've got a mother. She's 91, you know.'

    :lol: Reads like vintage Python, this.
  20. Mar 6, 2012
    #60

    MG Full Member

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    Every so often my faith in the male population is restored with comments this these. :)

    Of course sexism is just as big a problem as racism, and always has been.
  21. Mar 6, 2012
    #61

    Annihilate Now! ...or later, I'm not fussy

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    Well, considering they were directly saying that someone was incapable of doing their job properly soley because they are a woman, I would say that ventures out of the "harmless" territory.

    If someone implied I couldn't do my job properly I'd be annoyed, let alone if they said it was because I was black/brown/alien/Fernando Torres or whatever...
  22. Mar 6, 2012
    #62

    Liam147 On Probation

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    Tell you what, why don't you take everything I've said in this thread, change it, then blow it out of context?

    Banter is between friends. You can't go and insult strangers in the street. Which is why Andy Gray said what he said to Richard Keys, who I assume is one of his best mates. He might then go and say the same thing to his wife, his kids, his mother. That, for me, isn't a problem, because they know that it's a completely harmless joke. The problem occurs when he starts saying it to random people he doesn't know (which is what happened when the clip was aired to the public, he started making sexist remarks to the public). This is why I said that one of the main problems was the fact that it was in the workplace.
  23. Mar 6, 2012
    #63

    Gambit Desperately wants to be a Muppet

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    It isn't really gender specific. Now 'bint' that really gets them riled.
  24. Mar 6, 2012
    #64

    Mickey Banned

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    Stop paying attention to this a while ago
    Im sorry but you go tell the black slave a few years back when hes picking cotton off the field if he feels he has the same level of rights as a female and get back to me.

    Im not denying that women have had to fight their rights, they have, but clearly, when it comes to racism and sexism, ones clearly worse than the other. Many of the things you listed that females have to endure today arent only endures by females. Bar the circumcision, everything you listed can and does happen to males everyday.

    Also, they were only joking. It was a joke about her sex. So what? Ive heard plenty of racial jokes in my life time and joined in, because they are jokes. Thats the problem with society, cant take a friggin joke.

    I think youre trying to pick a fight here tbh.
  25. Mar 6, 2012
    #65

    Mick1991 Full Member

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    Surely it's the person he is insulting rather than the person he is talking to that should be the important aspect of the abuse?
  26. Mar 6, 2012
    #66

    adexkola American Arse

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    I should have qualified what I said by... Liam explains it better below

  27. Mar 6, 2012
    #67

    Gambit Desperately wants to be a Muppet

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    My Mrs just floored me with a cracker, I just asked the her do I ever do anything sexist, she said I'm always groping her.
    Hows that sexist I asked.
    Well you wouldn't if I was a bloke.
  28. Mar 6, 2012
    #68

    rednev God Save My Gracious Queen

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    Deary me.

    The day that the world's women are no longer treated by men as inferior beings is the day that most of world's major problems will go away. I think it's fair to say that sexism is a little bit more of a problem than you're making it out to be.
  29. Mar 6, 2012
    #69

    rcoobc Not as crap as eferyone thinks

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    This Black vs Women oppression argument is the most ridiculous ever.
  30. Mar 6, 2012
    #70

    Liam147 On Probation

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    What? Why do people keep doing this? Stop reading different posts to what I've actually said. I never said sexism wasn't a problem, I still believe it is, in fact, I know it is because of my mum's workplace. I said it isn't as big an issue as racism, and I think it was adexkola or Mickey that summed it up well. It's not.
  31. Mar 6, 2012
    #71

    MG Full Member

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    I refer you to what Annihilate Now! said perfectly...

    The reason it was an insult was because they suggested she couldn't do her job because she is a woman. Not because she's short-sighted, or has never watched football before, or because she's unintelligent... but because she doesn't have a penis.
  32. Mar 6, 2012
    #72

    Gambit Desperately wants to be a Muppet

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    Not really.
  33. Mar 6, 2012
    #73

    rcoobc Not as crap as eferyone thinks

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    Why? There isn't going to be a winner, both suffer oppression and both are still a problem today. It's just going to vary from country to country, year to year, organisation to organisation, class to class.
  34. Mar 6, 2012
    #74

    Waltraute She-Devil

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    It's extremely depressing. I detest the Oppression Olympics bickering. Intersectionality, anyone?
  35. Mar 6, 2012
    #75

    rednev God Save My Gracious Queen

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    You can't make a simple statement like that, because it obviously depends on the kind of racism and sexism we're talking about. And on your point about the things MG listed having been endured by both men and women, if you give it some thought, you'd see that the same could also be said for most of the major themes of historical racism. E.g. the transatlantic slave trade applying to white Irishmen as well as black Africans. It's a nonsense point.
  36. Mar 6, 2012
    #76

    LARulz Full Member

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    :lol: Oh dear. That is such a pathetic defence
  37. Mar 6, 2012
    #77

    africanspur Full Member

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    I've never understood why some men feel the need to make these kinds of jokes anyway? Oh, what's your bird doing out of the kitchen? She can't possibly understand the offside rule etc etc.. Is it meant to compensate for something else?

    I'm not going to bother getting into the black vs women argument. What I will say is that I have the utmost respect for black women (except Condeleeza Rice). And that I think we should all simply come to the agreement that Caucasian males and their ancestors are pricks. :angel:
  38. Mar 6, 2012
    #78

    Gambit Desperately wants to be a Muppet

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    Sorry i misinterpreted what you were implying.
  39. Mar 6, 2012
    #79

    rednev God Save My Gracious Queen

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    I did not accuse you of denying that sexism is a problem, I accused you of underestimating the severity of it as a problem.
  40. Mar 6, 2012
    #80

    Mickey Banned

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    Stop paying attention to this a while ago
    Noticed you ignored the entire post but no biggie. The joke reinforced the stereotype that women dont know the offside rule. You dont have a point. They werent being serious, it was a joke.

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