Center Back... Who do we go for?

Discussion in 'Transfer Forum' started by Macern, Feb 2, 2018.

  1. Sep 13, 2018

    Woziak Full Member

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    Totally agree, perfect for what's needed or Koulibaly even Maguire has too many mistakes in his game!
  2. Sep 13, 2018

    11101 Full Member

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    Bit early to be saying that. Jaap was one of the all time great defenders.
  3. Sep 14, 2018 at 12:40

    poleglass red Full Member

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    the cost is pretty much irrelevant these days, the market is inflated and will charge accordingly. Take Liverpool, their defence was a joke last season. They over paid on VVD and we all laughed at the outrageous price they paid. But he was exactly what they needed, and the difference he has made to their backline is night and day. Overpriced as feck but they lacked a leader, due to their attacking game they needed a defender comfortable on the ball and strong in the air. He ticked all those boxes for them and the change was almost immediate. Some of us are too fixated on buying just simply the best defender out there. A) they aren't always attainable, we've heard stories from the likes of Herandez, Simeone and Boateng how they knocked us back. B) we did that with Pogba, ie bought what we thought was the best player out there for that position. He wasn't what we needed, we needed someone who can control a game. We need to buy for what we need and not because we think this or that person is the best at their position. We need exactly what Liverpool needed last season, good on the ball, organiser and strong in the air. If 70 mill is the going rate, then so be it. We basically paid that for Bailly and Lindelof combinded anyway.
  4. Sep 14, 2018 at 12:44

    Cassidy No longer at risk of being mistaken for a Scouser

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    The cost is relevant because it prevents purchases in other areas, unless you think we have an unlimited budget in a window. Especially if the player is a mistake and we can't get rid, hence why I said expensive mistake.

    Yes we didn pay that for 2 players, who if you believe the manager now are also mistakes. We have to actually sell those players at some point, we also have Smalling and Jones and even Rojo who we haven't been able to shift in 3 summers.

    I am happy for us to spend 70m on a CB, I am not happy for us to spend 70m on a CB who isn't any better than what we have, and that is my genuine belief he isn't better.
  5. Sep 14, 2018 at 16:24

    sam147 New Member

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    He would get thrown about left, right and centre in the PL. Have you seen PSG's new kit pictures. He looks as lightweight as neymar. Bailly is quick, aggressive and assertive. Yet he is the only player ive seen that gets shorter as he jumps. We need a strong defender who's good in the air and decent on the ball. Alderweireld was the obvious choice. Varane is a dream that will never happen. Skriniar is an option.
  6. Sep 14, 2018 at 16:29

    poleglass red Full Member

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    central defence is one of the key areas we need to improve. Jose doesn't have confidence in the defenders we have. We played 2 defensive mids v Burnley to give them protection. The fact that 3 high profile central defenders have made public they knocked us back shows how much we pursued that. The only other area we really need to immediately address is right wing. a club our size could have addressed that in one window, plus we've a fair few players we could sell, esp in central defence to fund such buys.How can anyone say Maguire isn't better than what we have. He is better on the ball, he is better in the air, he is better in the tackle than anyone we have. Plus he knows how to organise those around him. We don't have anyone who can do that. In an era of the high press, our defenders are prone, due to most of them crumbling under the slightest bit of pressure. Who would you suggest. I can name better defenders that Maguire myself, but for what we need he would fit seemlessly. As I said I don't esp rate VVD but he was exactly what Liverpool needed. Buy what we need, not the shiniest new toy.
  7. Sep 14, 2018 at 16:39

    Cassidy No longer at risk of being mistaken for a Scouser

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    He yet to show he can improve a defence imo. England were not very good defensively at the world cup and neither were Leicester last season.
    I have no issue with us spending money on a CB, I would have loved us to sign Alderweireld last season.

    I also recognise though that we had one of the best defensive records in the league last season and the season before that and also the season before that. I also recognise that players like Jones, Bailly and Smalling in a United shirt have show very good defensive displays, better than I have seen from Maguire. I agree though he is good on the ball, I just don't think hes a very good defender.

    If it wasn't for Shaws recovery I would have said that fullback was our weakest area. I think if we would have secured a RW or fullbacks that could deliver quality into the box we could have improved significantly this season upon last season with the same set of CBs.
  8. Sep 14, 2018 at 16:45

    sam147 New Member

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    I agree the CBs we have are very poor. We have quantity not quality. Jones has to go. As does one of Rojo and Smalling. However, it is not about shiny toys. Maguire had one average season in a team that sits back and a good world cup surrounded by 4 other defenders and a DM. He is not the player that will make a huge difference. And its laughable you think he is better in the tackle than Bailly or even Smalling. The only positive Maguire brings is he can stay fit and he can pass the ball. Apart from that he is as agile as a freight train. It isn't wrong for fans to demand better and it seems Jose wanted better too. Most the gossip came from his agent to get him a new deal. Our targets were players like Alderweireld, Boateng and Godin and it should stay that way. Would Maguire get a game at City? No. So utd shouldn't have scraps left over and B rate players. To get to the top you need readymade top quality players and youth with potential to be great. Slabhead is neither .
  9. Sep 14, 2018 at 16:53

    poleglass red Full Member

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    don't fall into that mindset that we had a great defense because of the numbers. The shots on goals last season paint a more accurate pic, we had something like 50 more shots on our goal than Liverpool who for most of the season had a terrible defence and shite keeper.Our record has been better than it should have been in recent seasons for one reason- De Gea. I agree I was worried about full back going into this season, but Jose obviously saw the progress Shaw as making. We also have Dalot to feature to put pressure on Valencia. All the central defenders you mention can have good days, but they lack consistency and they are all prone to making rash mistakes. Look at Maguire when he plays for England, he's constantly telling players where to be and move. He would actually make any of the players you mention better. Bailly to me can look the 2nd coming one day, and then the next like a sunday league pub player, same with Jones and Smalling. It's about creating partnerships, we are moving it appears to a more attacking systems it appears. The days of Jones and Smalling hitting hopeful long balls to Lukaku needs to change. A centre half with ability on the ball improves the whole team. Its about availability and who wants to come and play for us. From what I hear he was open to it as where his club if we paid the over inflated price.
  10. Sep 14, 2018 at 16:55

    Cassidy No longer at risk of being mistaken for a Scouser

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    I haven't but I also don't think we are as bad at defending as is being mad out.
    I also think our biggest issue is scoring goals not conceding them. Jones and Smalling can play passes to Pogba Fred, Pereira, Matic in midfield, or to the fullbacks they don't have to hit long balls to Lukaku unless their manager tells them to do so. Bailly is comfortable enough on the ball also.

    Yes it would be great if we could upgrade to have a very good ball player back there, but first and foremost they have to be a very good defender.

    Funny thing is we had Blind who could have easily slotted into a back 3 for us to offer more ability on the ball from the CBs
  11. Sep 14, 2018 at 17:57

    MyOnlySolskjaer Creator of Player Performance threads

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    Agreed, it amazes me how we even won some of our games with performances like this. We were fortunate we were clinical.

    Skip to 3:00. We are just shite under pressure.