If it wasn't for City...... | Sorry, definitely not a thread about City

Discussion in 'Manchester United Forum' started by Dobbs, Dec 18, 2017.

  1. Dec 18, 2017
    #1

    Dobbs Banned

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    Is this not the weakest, lamest excuse ever uttered by a bunch of football fans?

    It's repeated here on a near constant basis and had me thinking has this line of reasoning happened before?

    When Blackburn started chucking money around and won the league did we bemoan our bad luck? If it wasn't for Blackburn we'd have won the league after all!!

    Same goes when Arsenal won the league with that unbeaten run. If only they didn't exist that season. During Mourinho's first stint at Chesea did United fans shrug their shoulders and blame circumstances?

    The three clubs mentioned all raised the bar relative to their time but I remember our response, within the club and fan base, being one of self reflection. A club had moved past us and we needed to up our game. It wasn't out of our hands, we had the resources to respond and did just that. We didn't use Blackburn or Chelsea as the excuse to wipe away our own shortcomings. Fergie simply upped his game, made sure his signings were spot on and it all came back.

    Is that how everyone else remembers it or did we react as many do today?

    This isn't a thread to discuss City. Nor is it a demand to be top. Clearing that up now before the drama queens start their fiction.
  2. Dec 18, 2017
    #2

    Sarni nice guy, unassuming, objective United fan.

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    No, it's not. When you are having a very good or even excellent season but don't win a title because another team is having a historical season, it's not really totally your fault.

    Nobody is saying we shouldn't ever compete with them but people are just realistic about competing for a title with a team that have won 94.4% of their games until middle of December.
  3. Dec 18, 2017
    #3

    esmufc07 Elvis has theft the building Scout

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    Yay another City thread.
  4. Dec 18, 2017
    #4

    crossy1686 Full Member

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    I've said this in a previous thread but I'll repeat myself here. City cannot do what they're currently doing and not expect an almighty response from the likes of United and Chelsea. I'm predicting an English Champions League winner in the next 4 seasons (including this one).
  5. Dec 18, 2017
    #5

    Zlatattack Full Member

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    I'm sick of this shit now. Can the mods please merge all the city related threads into 1 big thread called City wankfest and have all the fanboys post just in there please?
  6. Dec 18, 2017
    #6

    roonster09 Correctly predicted France to win World Cup 2018

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    :lol:
  7. Dec 18, 2017
    #7

    Sarni nice guy, unassuming, objective United fan.

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    You mean in all 4 seasons or at least once in 4 years?
  8. Dec 18, 2017
    #8

    Bestietom Full Member

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    Forget City. We need to concentrate getting back to the top where we belong. There is improvement, the table don't lie but we need to keep improving and bring in the best. 2 little magicians up front is what we need.
  9. Dec 18, 2017
    #9

    KirkDuyt Full Member

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    The only difference is there was less internet back then. People have always moaned about stuff and rightly so. Moaning is awesome.
  10. Dec 18, 2017
    #10

    Dobbs Banned

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    I explicitly stated it wasn't a thread to discuss City!!! Read all the words guys. Especially the mod who changed the title. Who clearly only read the title.

    I'm asking fans to reflect back on previous challenges. Did fans bemoan our bad luck or did we actually accept that maybe we hadn't done quite as well as we could?
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2017
  11. Dec 18, 2017
    #11

    charlenefan Far less insightful than the other Charley

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    Stat I saw yesterday

    Points after 18 Premier League games:

    Chelsea's record season: 43
    Arsenal's Invincibles: 42
    United this season: 41

    So yeah if it wasn't for City....
  12. Dec 18, 2017
    #12

    Dobbs Banned

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    True and I love a moan.

    However when Blackburn won the league we accepted we'd come up short, got a littlr complacent. Fergie made radical changes the next summer and the title came back. That's how I remember it anyway. I don't rememer us blaming Jack Walkers money.
  13. Dec 18, 2017
    #13

    Dobbs Banned

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    I'm asking did you say "If it wasn't for Arsenal/Chelsea..." back when they were setting a new standard.
  14. Dec 18, 2017
    #14

    Ducklegs Part of first caf team to complete Destiny raid

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    Yea we did, because Walker set out to buy the league and thats exactly what he did, its what their premier league title will always be remebered for:


    https://sports.vice.com/en_uk/artic...rs-blackburn-rovers-and-jack-walkers-millions

    They were a nothing club financed buy a man capable of virtually unchallengeable spending power.

    Just like City and Chelsea they caused a massive escalation in transfer fees and wages that proved to be detrimental to the game as a whole.

    With Arsenals unbeaten run, they set about how they were going to play that season from the very start, a Robert Pires dive which would have seen him banned today secured a point from a match they didnt look like winning:

    https://www.dailystar.co.uk/sport/f...uring-Invincibles-season-admits-Arsene-Wenger

    They benefited from some incredibly inept refereeing, no doubt to create “theatre”and “spectacle” in the league with a London glamour club and fancy european manager going the whole season unbeaten playing football the “right way” when in fact had they not had the bemefit of some creative officiating they wouldnt have come close.

    And boy, did we fecking complain about it, it was a running joke that the other teams might as well not bother turning up as the match will be handed to Arsenal.

    Chelsea went from being a competitive team on the verge of bankruptcy, spending well above their means, to a premier league powerhouse, capable of securing any player they wanted, at any price, for any wages.
    Capable of massively increasing their squad scope, depth and quakity with limitless spending.

    It was all anyone could talk about, Jose was a “breath of fresh air” as his chelsea juggernaut rolled over all comers, powered by a resources that the club hadnt earned and could never repay.

    Money clubs are a cancer in any league, clubs that are not accountable for their spending and can spend with no restraints are not “lucky” not “the best teams ever” they are created by financial doping and have no place in a competative environment.
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2017
  15. Dec 18, 2017
    #15

    Sky1981 Fending off the urge

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    People don't use it as an excuse.

    But putting things into perspective for moaning fans who thinks jose is shit, our team is shit, and all that.

    We're magnificent this year, sadly city are twice better. Doesn't mean we're shit, it's just that they're extraordinarily better this season
  16. Dec 18, 2017
    #16

    VanGaalEra Full Member

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    I think it’s time we have one big city related thread in the United forum.
  17. Dec 18, 2017
    #17

    roonster09 Correctly predicted France to win World Cup 2018

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    Spot on.

    Also not about any specific poster but there is a small group who moan not because of how our season is going, they moan because we have Jose as manager.
  18. Dec 18, 2017
    #18

    Dobbs Banned

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    Yeah that's a description of what Blackburn did but do you remember our response? That's the question. The following summer we sold Ince, Hughes and Kachelskis and ushered in a new era after a little spell of complacency.
  19. Dec 18, 2017
    #19

    cyberman Full Member

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    It's because City have warped the perception of our progress.
    We've gone from 6th to matching the points haul of great teams from the past, that's fantastic progress and it's all that should really matter.
    This forum only thinks we know what long term planning is, they gave Jose incredible stick over it last summer but the meltdown on here because we're not matching 17 wins out of 18..
  20. Dec 18, 2017
    #20

    Dobbs Banned

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    I think it's time we dedicated a thread to posters who simply don't read properly.

    Guys I've explicitly stated in the OP this isn't a thread to discuss City. I also pointed out I was clearing that up from the get go before anybody claimed otherwise. Yet here you are.
  21. Dec 18, 2017
    #21

    roonster09 Correctly predicted France to win World Cup 2018

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    Now who is saying we won't do that just because couple of posters used that phrase on online forum? We didn't win league for 3 years when Roman took over, did we write off manager and the team when Chelsea won the first time and second time?

    Like few have already said, few used that phrase to put some perspective on the progress we have made this season. It's not as a resignation that we will never win the league again.
  22. Dec 18, 2017
    #22

    Dobbs Banned

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    That's exactly what I said. Be honest, did you read the full post or just the title?
  23. Dec 18, 2017
    #23

    crossy1686 Full Member

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    Within the next four seasons an English club will win the CL.
  24. Dec 18, 2017
    #24

    Schneckerl Full Member

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    not at all.

    City PPG is historically great - no excuse at all.

    the money excuse is stupid though
  25. Dec 18, 2017
    #25

    SirAF Ageist

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    :lol:
  26. Dec 18, 2017
    #26

    Dobbs Banned

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    It's way, way, more than a few. It's constant. I could quote you a shitload right now.

    When Chelsea usurped us I'm sure we recognise we couldn't keep starting so slowly. We also improved massively in the transfer market after a poor few years.

    Fergie said publically that we'd respond to the challenge. It was all introspection as opposed to looking at others for explanations.
  27. Dec 18, 2017
    #27

    Epicurean Banned

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    Bluecafe.net :lol:
  28. Dec 18, 2017
    #28

    roonster09 Correctly predicted France to win World Cup 2018

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    That's what SAF did, Jose didn't use the phrase, he said he will fight till may or till the title is mathematically impossible. We don't even know what we would do next summer to address the challenge.

    At that time what was said on the forums? Someone should dig it.
  29. Dec 18, 2017
    #29

    Zlatattack Full Member

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    You're right - egg on my face.
  30. Dec 18, 2017
    #30

    Dobbs Banned

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    But Blackburn did a similar thing relative to their time. They ushered in a new era of spending we hadn't seen before. Starting signing players like Shearer who previously we'd have got.

    I seriously though don't remember fans using Blackburn as an excuse. The club definitely didn't. Following that season Fergie went extreme.
  31. Dec 18, 2017
    #31

    VanGaalEra Full Member

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    The title has the word City in it, that's enough for me.
  32. Dec 18, 2017
    #32

    Dobbs Banned

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    Jose has been spot on with what he's said publically. This is more aimed at the fans. I don't remember this being the response to previous challenges that felt huge at the time.

    Back then there was much more emphasis on looking at ourselves. Instead of going on about City or whoever we should recognise for example that we don't have a functioning No.10. Who wins a league by choosing the No.10 playing least badly? You can't do it.
  33. Dec 18, 2017
    #33

    cyberman Full Member

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    @Dobbs
    Who cares about Blackburn? We were already a fantastic side when they won the league and simply maintained our standards while they fell away.
    Sir Alex didn't have any grand plans to overthrow them nor change course or panic with how he was building his side, Blackburn died a death all on their own
  34. Dec 18, 2017
    #34

    Dobbs Banned

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    Ha the problem in a nutshell. Did you even get as far as the last paragraph?
  35. Dec 18, 2017
    #35

    roonster09 Correctly predicted France to win World Cup 2018

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    Well I'm all for it. We should stop all the city threads first ;)
  36. Dec 18, 2017
    #36

    Di Maria's angel Captain of Moanchester United

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    I'm on the "we're having a good season" side but that stat is wrong. Last season, Chelsea had 46 points, Mourinho's Chelsea from 3 seasons ago had 43 points and, in Fergie's last season, United had 43. Regardless, we'd be withing touching distance of every previous PL champion.
  37. Dec 18, 2017
    #37

    Dobbs Banned

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    The following summer he sold three of our biggest names and brought in the class of '92. If that's not a grand plan I don't know what is. His reaction to that loss couldn't have been more marked.
  38. Dec 18, 2017
    #38

    Massive Spanner Thinks Geoff Shreeves has one

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    we've only finished in the top four once since SAF retired. We finished sixth last season.

    Whatever way you look at it, we're now in second place with easily our highest points tally since SAF retired, a tally that would likely have us top in almost any other season.

    We have made significant progress in the space of less than a year and that needs to be acknowledged instead of the constant moaning that's on here. We're clearly going in the right direction.

    Also I'm not sure what the feck people expect. In order to be top right now we would literally have to have a perfect record after 18 games.
  39. Dec 18, 2017
    #39

    Varun Moderator Staff

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    I don't think the OP realises what people mean when they say "if it wasn't for City".
  40. Dec 18, 2017
    #40

    cyberman Full Member

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    @Dobbs
    Kanchlskis forced a move, Ince was too big for his boots (big time charlie) while Hughes was past it.
    If anything, being comfortable enough to do that should tell you how confident Sir Alex was in his side.
    Llisten to every Class of 92 interview there ever was, we knew what we had coming through so equating Sir Alex faith in youth with some sort of paniced response to Blackburn doesn't ring true.