If....

Discussion in 'Manchester United Forum' started by Class of 63, Jan 1, 2018.

  1. Jan 1, 2018
    #1

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    Not going to happen in a million years with Mourinho in charge sadly, but IF, after having a bang on the head he decided that going young is the way ahead, and went with the young lads already at the club in 2018, would you tolerate finishing outside the top 4 this season, and maybe next season, if there were enough signs that the young lads had it in them to take us to the next level ?

    Or is it all about the here and now ?

    De Gea

    Riley
    Jones (Cpt.)
    Tuanzebe
    Shaw

    Kehinde
    Pogba
    Lingard

    Lukaku
    Rashford
    Martial

    Pereira/Henderson, RS Williams, McTominay, Gribbin, Mitchell, Chong and AN Other.

    Reading comics I know, but....
  2. Jan 1, 2018
    #2

    Organic Potatoes Full Member

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    Never in a million years.
  3. Jan 1, 2018
    #3

    MyOnlySolskjaer Creator of Player Performance threads

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    The harsh reality is most of these kids won't have a future at the club. I used to see some posts where people were convinced Saidy Janko was better than Antonio Valencia at RB, and some recently where Demi Mitchell is better than Ryan Sessegnon. We overrate our youth because they are connected with the club and we don't know their ceiling. If we're completely honest with ourselves, if Andreas Pereira had started off at Granada and is where he is now a bench warmer at Valencia, there's no way in hell anybody here would be asking to sign him. Yet many here are convinced he will solve our problems.

    Don't get me wrong there is some talent among the academy but for there to be a player to take the XI by storm like Rashford is a rarity. There's no reason to sacrifice our season for 5/6 of them right now.
  4. Jan 1, 2018
    #4

    carvajal Full Member

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    Betting on young people is fine, but taking for granted that they will be very good is a mistake. It should arise naturally. That philosophy is for smaller teams, who sell a lot.
  5. Jan 1, 2018
    #5

    Janson Full Member

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    It wouldn't happen in a million years with anyone in charge.
  6. Jan 1, 2018
    #6

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    Well yeah, but at the minute Mourinho looks as though he doesn't have a clue what to do.

    It's more about you a a fan, would you settle/be happy if he decided to give the kids a chance, knowing over the next 18+ months there would probably be more downs than ups
  7. Jan 1, 2018
    #7

    InLevyITrust Full Member

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    Would Pogba and DDG, even Lukaku be happy with that?
  8. Jan 1, 2018
    #8

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    Why is that then ?

    8 of the players i've picked are regular starters for us already, it's not as though i've started from scratch.

    Just putting it out there.
  9. Jan 1, 2018
    #9

    Red_toad Full Member

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    Pogba wouldn't stay to be part of a project, nor would De Gea. They're of an age where they should be winning stuff consistently.
  10. Jan 1, 2018
    #10

    dichinero Banned

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    Tbf the OP has not fielded an unreasonable side in that;
    1. Given Valencia is not exactly a young fella and another knee injury puts him out for a bit, I'd advocate for Riley to be given a chance ahead of Darmian who might not be here next season.
    2. Tuanzebe is another decent and deserves a shot. I'd have him ahead of Smalling but has to contend with Lindelof, Jones and Bailly. But with Bailly being more injured than not, a chance is all he needs. Actually, Jones is also injury prone too.
    3. Kehinde is quickly becoming my favourite reserve player but I think a step up might be too soon. This one is the unlikeliest of the lot. The only available space was Carrick's and McTominay has taken that. Unless we have a serious injury.
    My opinion is that, it is actually possible to still make top 4 whilst playing some youth from time to time without them being regulars but being heavily involved as part of the squad.
  11. Jan 1, 2018
    #11

    Greck Full Member

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    Anyone else remember when this was the dream?
    Welbeck-Macheda
    xxx-Anderson-Cleverley-Nani
    Fabio-Evans- xxx- Rafael
    Look how that turned out. Hard to tell who'll make it
  12. Jan 1, 2018
    #12

    reddevil702 Full Member

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    Tuanzebe would make sense at RB given all of the injuries. There's way to incorporate youth with out giving up on the season. Matic needs rest and Herrera is out of form, why not try Tuanzebe as a CDM? We have had quite a few players at LB with Young being probably the best choice, another opportunity to try youth.
  13. Jan 1, 2018
    #13

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    Nothing changes much for Lukaku, he's already playing with Rashford and Martial, Pogba, as talented as Matic is, i'm sure he'd benefit more from having somebody(Kehinde) alongside him coming short with quick feet, and Jesse(by a country mile the best "Taxi" we've got), running players away allowing him the space to perform to his best, De Gea i'm guessing would be happier if the back four (Jones excepted)were happy receiving the ball under pressure for one-twos when they're needed, as apposed to just booting it.
  14. Jan 1, 2018
    #14

    shaky Full Member

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    Spend the next 2 years blooding youngsters, most of whom will end up playing Championship football if their careers go reasonably well, just in case one or two of them turn out to be decent? That's hardly going to bring the glory days back. Unless of course we just happen to have, by extreme luck, the most talented group of kids in 25 years.
  15. Jan 1, 2018
    #15

    Mciahel Goodman Worst Werewolf Player of All Times Staff

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    Shaw is playing due to injuries. Lingard is a squad player (doing very well too). Only one of Rashford/Martial would start if Jose had all his players fit (and in form). If he signed Perisic there's a good chance neither would start regularly, or if they did they'd be moved to the right wing (in place of Mkhitaryan).

    The likely scenario is that Jose wants to sign experienced players in the prime of their careers, or approaching it, to challenge and win things now (which means next season).

    If you want the above side to be realistic, van Gaal was the man. And he seemed to play young players for the sake of playing young players. Most of them were way out of their depth.
  16. Jan 1, 2018
    #16

    Mciahel Goodman Worst Werewolf Player of All Times Staff

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    Maybe Gomes might have a breakthrough season by 2020. Fosu-Mensah is probably most likely, as if he isn't playing with us next season he'll probably be sold.
  17. Jan 1, 2018
    #17

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    Axel is criminally under-used, not the greatest in the air playing centre-half, but like McGrath and Brown before him he's the gears to mug off those that think they've got the better of him once they've won the first ball.

    Quietly confident whatever position he plays, this kid will put Rochdale on the map.
  18. Jan 1, 2018
    #18

    POF Full Member

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    Picking youth players that are not ready or will never be good enough isn't looking to the future. It's just stupidity.

    One of United's biggest issues just now is that they are too reliant on young inconsistent forwards in Rashford and Martial and both are in poor form at the moment. Nobody is lauding Mourinho for looking to the future as chances are wasted and points are dropped.

    The best way to develop young players is to bring them in to a winning team.
  19. Jan 1, 2018
    #19

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    Yeah it is, but that's not what i'm asking, more if Mourinho has a brainfart, would you as a United fan be happy if he though sod it, I can't get anymore out of this shower, and decided to go with the youth ?

    ps. If Mads Timm doesn't make it i'll eat my head :lol:
  20. Jan 1, 2018
    #20

    Sky1981 Fending off the urge

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    Most youngsters from our academy ended up in championship not because they're not given enough game time, or because somehow the manager didn't develop them, didn't trust them, or don't take risk, etc.

    They ended up in the championship because they're not good enough, and championship. Is their level.

    You can ask zidane/pep/jose combo to coach macheda, play him 40 games a season and he's still won't become ronaldo.
  21. Jan 1, 2018
    #21

    Sky1981 Fending off the urge

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    If mourinho has this kind of brainfarts you and some of his haters in here would explode in stroke.

    Imagine the rage if he puts that team and lose
  22. Jan 1, 2018
    #22

    Flytan Full Member

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    No desire at all to rely on the youth setup, we're probably the best at developing talent for the premier league in the country but very few of those players end up being good enough for the top clubs (recently).

    We already have enough Youth anyways. Martial and Rashford are both bright young talents with a good future.
  23. Jan 1, 2018
    #23

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    Exactly, but that's not what i'm asking....

    Saidy, and Tyler Reid(an Arsenal reject)both struggled when they moved up to the u21/23 level when their physical advantage was nullified and they were found out, and as for Demetri(love the guy, having watched him since he was 15), well if he's our future left-back we've got problems !!

    Andreas said when he first signed if he wasn't in and around the first team when he was 18 he'd move on, and yet here he is.
  24. Jan 1, 2018
    #24

    OohAahMartial Full Member

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    Every team should be gradually developing their youth, a few last minute sub appearances, 15 mins then 30mins then 2nd half then 60mins etc. But we should do it more than others as we have the top academy and believe in it, and we have some great youth coming through.
  25. Jan 1, 2018
    #25

    Long Ball Full Member

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    I honestly wouldn't mind seeing pereira, fosu-mensah and Tuanzebe in the team right now

    But as for the op? No that's too far
  26. Jan 1, 2018
    #26

    Monte Clift New Member

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    Axel should be given a chance now, he is defo better than Lindelöf. Why is he not playing? Because when he plays better than a €35 million dud (with a potential €10 million in add-ons) that José bought, he can't keep moaning about money. Think of how many players are better than Lindelof and ask why none were bought...If you keep buying second rate crap you get second rate crap shows like the last 4 performances.
  27. Jan 1, 2018
    #27

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    I'm not asking that, 8/11 of the the team I selected are already regulars.
  28. Jan 1, 2018
    #28

    Fridge chutney Full Member

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    You have to have a balance. You can't only have young players.
  29. Jan 1, 2018
    #29

    K2K Full Member

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    "Can Manchester United score? They always score"
    That's the thing I mentioned to another poster.

    Our best players will not want to waste the best years of their careers fumbling in mid table.

    It's the same thing people happily predict that will happen to Spurs if you fell into mid table but they ignore it happening to us too.
  30. Jan 1, 2018
    #30

    K2K Full Member

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    "Can Manchester United score? They always score"
    A lot of our youth players are grossly overrated.

    At best, it's just 1 or 2 academy players that go to have a decent career here. The rest likely end up at some smaller premier league team , championship or lower.
  31. Jan 1, 2018
    #31

    Carolina Red Moderator Staff

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    My question from that is...

    Is that reflective of the Academy coaching, our youth scouts, or just the local talent available?
  32. Jan 1, 2018
    #32

    Beagle New Member

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    Youth players or not, the question to be asked is would we be more accepting of our current position and more supportive of the manager if we played better looking football? If we had the same results but while playing fast attacking football do you think the fans would not be so skeptical?

    Yes for me. It's easier to accept results like 2-2 with Leicester, Burnley if the players are going full pelt trying to score but end up not having any luck. Fans can feel more optimistic this way.
  33. Jan 1, 2018
    #33

    Paz ex-Goldman Sachs Janitor, Martial hater

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    fair point tbh
  34. Jan 1, 2018
    #34

    el3mel Full Member

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    That team will fight to finish in top 10.
  35. Jan 1, 2018
    #35

    Womp idiot

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    I don't know, but I do think we have some youngsters who could make it here. TFM looked juicy against City, I have high hopes for Gomes and Tuanzebe too. I don't think it's really sustainable though, you won't see any manager throwing in a bunch of kids anymore, the game is just far too competitive now and the lack of experience could be damaging over the course of a season.

    They need to be eased in and I hope they will be, as it could save us some big bucks. TFM is really beginning to look like he could replace Valencia for example.
  36. Jan 1, 2018
    #36

    Sky1981 Fending off the urge

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    It's the norm. You get 1 very good player out of every 50, probably 1 ronaldo / messi every 10.000, 1 useful squad player every 20. Even la massia didn't produce a player good enough for barcelona every year.

    Every once in a free decades we get a class of 92, barcelona has their golden generation, ajax in the 90s, but no there's really no guarantee.

    Even saf (the man dubbed the best in this business) didn't always produce. All he gets in his late years are fletcher, oshea, squad player that does the job.

    I discounted ronaldo, as much as saf has a part in developing him we bought him, he's not the product of our academy, his talent and dedication is exclusive his and not something that our academy can take credit for. The same with messi/Henry and the rest of the gang.

    There's no manager that can create a messi, at best they can spot the new messi earlier than the others and give them trust to start early on.
  37. Jan 1, 2018
    #37

    minoo-utd Full Member

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    And why you do something like that? No way of course.
  38. Jan 1, 2018
    #38

    UpWithRivers Full Member

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    We could sell all our players for 400 mill. Buy 40 of the best 16 year olds for 10 mill a piece. Sell the naming rights for our stadium and invest in a kickstarter project that looks to invent a system that statistically will make 51 percent of the people on here happy. But Mourinho is an arse and will never go for it.
  39. Jan 1, 2018
    #39

    wolvored Full Member

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    You could get away with introducing 1 a year and see how he does in a successful side, but when you havent won the league in a while, thats your aim and your the biggest club in England then even thats a gamble. He has given McTomminey a run out a couple of times, and if/when we are winning and a couple of goals up, he could bring him on regularly in the last 15 mins or so, to give him confidence and experience. Jones 19 Shaw 18 Rashford 18 and Martial 19 were all brought in at an early age. Rashford apart they were all bought, but whats the difference?
  40. Jan 1, 2018
    #40

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    I'm not suggesting for a minute that Axel, Joe and Tosin will definitely make it at United, far from it, but that's got more to do with being in the right place at the right time than ability.