Is Mourinho motivator/tactician but not the coach?

Discussion in 'Manchester United Forum' started by Rajma, Mar 14, 2018.

  1. Mar 14, 2018
    #1

    Rajma Full Member

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    Look, yesterday, was terrible and there's no one denying it. We all know over years he got a lot of things tactically (in nullifying the oppositions rather than in attacking sense) spot on and managed to install a winning mentality into his players on various occasions and during certain spells but is he a coach per se? It's not a Jose bashing thread as his methods obviously worked for him over the years but it is interesting debate nevertheless.

    Below is his recent quote after Liverpool's game, which even at that time I found alarming to be honest and that sort of explains in a way our laborious approach to the game...

    P.S. In before any coach (bus) jokes.
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2018
  2. Mar 14, 2018
    #2

    PepsiCola Full Member

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    Football has long since passed him by.
  3. Mar 14, 2018
    #3

    Marcky411 Full Member

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    I must say that I somehow missed that quote of his but then that explains a lot.
    I at the moment don't see Jose as a coach or motivator any more. He seems to have lost something, his fire/desire/passion what ever you want to call it and that is showing on the pitch. If you look at his first bout at Chelsea and at Inter you got the idea the players would run through walls for him, not any more. After the sacking at RM he wasn't the same coach the second time round at Chelsea and now at Utd I can't say he is even close to the manager he once was. He can call it maturity, I call it bull, he has definitely lost his edge.
    A team needs a true leader, not only on the field but in the dressing room and on training ground, someone to analyse their short comings and set them on their way. All I have heard from the players in interviews is how they are learning from their team mates. Now nearly two season in how often have people been asking what does the team do in training, we don't seem to see it on the field in games. They seem to have difficulty passing the ball to each other at pace, movement off the ball is poor, useless at corners and have often conceded from set pieces. These are things that should be addressed on the training ground and that is coaching/managing a team. To say “I’m much more a supporter of prepare the players to decide well and feel the game." Besides the shock of that statement, that it isn't working as the decision making of the players on the field leaves a lot to be desired.
    This sounds very negative but I feel we haven't got the real Mourinho at Utd, he is a shadow of the manager he once was and even his mind games have become very personal and nasty instead of being what it should be, just mind games.
    I really hope he finds whatever he seems to have lost because all his teams were always teams to be reckoned with but I doubt it.
  4. Mar 14, 2018
    #4

    Peyroteo Professional Ronaldo PR Guy

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    Pretty much every single manager does what he just said in that quote
  5. Mar 14, 2018
    #5

    haram Full Member

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    A pass to B, pass to C is probably something Van Gaal would do. If the path is blocked, go backwards.
  6. Mar 14, 2018
    #6

    kitress New Member

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    When's the last time his team is one to be reckoned with. His teams got dumped out of the CL three times in a row in very embarrassing manners.
  7. Mar 14, 2018
    #7

    Judas Open to offers

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    What tactics? What motivation?
  8. Mar 14, 2018
    #8

    noodlehair "It's like..."

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    If he's a motivator why do our players constantly look so bafflingly unmotivated?
  9. Mar 14, 2018
    #9

    Judas Open to offers

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    I've never seen a Utd team look that unmotivated in a 2nd leg CL knockout game in my lifetime.
  10. Mar 14, 2018
    #10

    Jando Full Member

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    So here's my 2 cents,

    This club need's a coach with a voice, a coach who is a litle bit crazy and is prepared to give players a massive kick up the arse at HT aka the hairdryer for not doing there job properly, just like SAF

    Do you honestly see Mourinho going crazy at HT yesterday telling them how important this game is or to get there hand out there ass, no, you could see in his body language at 60 minutes in he was calm and relaxed like were winning the game and that reflects on to these primadonnas,

    It was the same with Moyes, it was the same with LVG and now Mourinho, these players need to be terrified to not put a shift in and come off that pitch without giving there all, you can buy all the superstar's in the world in your Pogba's, Sanchez, Martial etc but if the coach isn't going to motivate them then forget it,

    We can laugh at how we used to destory teams with a midfield of Cleverley,Anderson, John OShea for christ sake but this was all down to SAF and his utter brilliant way's of motivating them to do a job for the team, we dont have that anymore, we have 11 individuals who think they can rely on there own skills to win games,

    I envy City with Pep, I watch City 2-0 up against your Brightons or Huddersfield and Pep is still screaming at his players to play better etc, he has the right mentality, yes he will never get everything right and will lose games but the correct foundations are there,

    The mentality is toxic at this club, there's something not right, I think it stems from the top, I feel the board are more happier with our commercial success than our actual on the field success and that's a scary direction to go in, I am not saying Mourinho out but doubt's are slighty starting to creep in, his comments worry me more than anything and the recent results have only papered the cracks, we are far from a team, were just a bunch of indivudals who are good at football (sometimes)
  11. Mar 14, 2018
    #11

    3KDré Full Member

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    Players don’t seem that motivated under him so if he’s supposed to be the motivator he’s not doing very well.
  12. Mar 14, 2018
    #12

    Red Indian Chief Torn Rubber Thus says Kemo

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    Its his motivating skills beginning to concern me
  13. Mar 14, 2018
    #13

    blue blue Full Member

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    Mourinho has always been more of a motivator than a tactician. I've been holding off for while and giving him the benefit of the doubt but I suspect that was the beginning of the end last night. He could come back and make me eat my words but at best Utd can come 2nd and win the FA Cup. If they don't do this it will be a step backwards from last season. Even if they do it will be one trophy compared to the two last season.

    I'm beginning to see some obscure comments coming from Jose. He's biting hard at certain questions and that can only be seen as the pressure getting to him. I don't watch all the games but it seems to me the team play defensively on a lot of occasions and the running off the ball seems poor. The tactics are letting Utd down and Lukaku's comments after the game lead me to suspect the players are starting to get a bit frustrated.

    I've seen a few posts suggesting he resigns but whatever happens he will not resign. Utd will have to sack him. Resignation would seriously damage his pride and pension fund. I'd be very surprised if he lasts past the end of next season.
  14. Mar 14, 2018
    #14

    Escobar Poster originally known as Michel04

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    His job is so much more than that and obviously he actually does more. It's just that he's not good enough anymore or that he struggles
  15. Mar 14, 2018
    #15

    Rifer Full Member

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    :lol:

    But seriously, that kind of mechanical coach, at its worst, sounds like LVG's style. It's predictable, repetitive and too systematic football. Boring and more importantly inhibits/holding back both flair and creative players. Useful coaching for children level of football, but not professional football.

    Anyone prefers that zombie/robot football?

    Edit: That aside, can't see Mourinho as a motivator, or at least a good motivator.
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2018
  16. Mar 14, 2018
    #16

    LoneStar Full Member

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    I personally think that he’s not lost anything. It’s just that his tactics and mentality doesn’t rub well with the modern generation players. Most of them are prima donnas these days.

    There is a drastic difference between players of the early 2000s and today’s footballers.
  17. Mar 14, 2018
    #17

    Rajma Full Member

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    In Lvg we had mechanical coach who did not emphasise on players movement and high pressing bit, without both of those traits or at least one of them passing is always going to be static.

    I mean in a way all the top coaches are mechanical in their methods, they work on patterns of play in training to achieve maximum level of understanding between the players and drilling into them on how to bring the ball forward without resorting to hoofball.
  18. Mar 14, 2018
    #18

    Marcky411 Full Member

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    True, at least LvG had a plan B, hoof the ball up to Fellaini, Jose doesn't seem to have a plan B. LvG's plan B has been integrated into Jose's plan A and hope for the best :lol:
  19. Mar 14, 2018
    #19

    Turnip Full Member

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    If he's in charge if motivation that's worrying, it's something our players lack in every game. It's been said time and again that he doesn't tell the olayers how to attack, maybe its time he did, or employed someone who does.

    It feels insane to think we have a manager in this day and age who doesn't think coaching attacking is necessary.

    Maybe we can have 2 managers. Jose to give funny abuse out at press conferences and tell the defenders what to do and someone else to do everything else.
  20. Mar 14, 2018
    #20

    MoskvaRed Full Member

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    Mourinho was a great motivator (Chelsea first time, Inter) but, looking at him now, it’s hard to believe he is capable of inspiring his players to run through walls for him. I thought his demeanour last year was down to his father’s illness but I am starting to suspect he is just burnt out after 15 years of high pressure management.
  21. Mar 14, 2018
    #21

    Sky1981 Fending off the urge

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    Our players seems to be not motivated by moyes, lvg, and now mourinho.
  22. Mar 14, 2018
    #22

    Sky1981 Fending off the urge

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    You dont win what he has won without being very good at what you're doing.

    Form is temporary class is permanent.

    Saf had his off years where chelsea and city takes the title. Do you say football has pass him by? It's only been 3 years since Jose last won the very same league. Unless he comes to a point where he ended up as a wenger then it's too soon to say jose has past it.

    Football goes in cycle, adaptation for managers takes 1 or 2 season. You don't change your paradigma every year you failed to win the league
  23. Mar 14, 2018
    #23

    ravi2 Full Member

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    Sounds like we need Simeone, which Id be all for btw.
  24. Mar 14, 2018
    #24

    Number1 Banned

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    He's not even a good motivator anymore, he's a has-been.

    Tactics are probably his greatest strength, but even then it's negative tactics that suck the life out of the enjoyment of football, it's not something i enjoy watching personally.

    Small teams can tame big teams now and again, that deserves credit. Watching Manchester United (one of the biggest clubs in the world) contain a big team after all money spent, i don't think a Manchester United manager deserves credit for that.

    How Pep's Manchester City control's big teams (just smashing them), that deserves credit, not how Jose does it.
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2018
  25. Mar 14, 2018
    #25

    redIndianDevil Full Member

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    He definitely isn't a motivator. And there is nothing novel about his tactics, even Sean Dyche and Tony Pulis employ the same tactics against any half decent teams. Only difference is the former has the likes of Matic, Lukaku, De Gea and Rashford whereas the latter has to make do with the likes of Ashley Barnes, Solomon Rondon, Wood etc.
  26. Mar 14, 2018
    #26

    Sky1981 Fending off the urge

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    The previous won 2 cups and runner up while parking the bus, while the later... i dont know what they win.
  27. Mar 14, 2018
    #27

    redIndianDevil Full Member

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    Yeah obviously they won't win feck all with the players they have.
  28. Mar 14, 2018
    #28

    ti vu Full Member

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    Those poor British never given the chance and money some foreigners being afforded. If only...
  29. Mar 14, 2018
    #29

    Angry Virginian Full Member

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    Could it be that attacking-minded players cannot be motivated to play defensive-first tactics in almost all games? United has a lot of attacking-minded players including Valencia, Young, and Pogba. The motivation seemed fine for the Liverpool game as the team went at them in the first half, got the goals, and closed up shop in the second half. The players were again asked to play a defensive game at home against Sevilla, a team most would refer as inferior to United, when United needed a goal to advance. Could it be that the players weren't exactly thrilled with the game plan?
  30. Mar 14, 2018
    #30

    adexkola Arsenal supporter

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    Who?
  31. Mar 14, 2018
    #31

    Jando Full Member

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    Definitely not, his style is very much similar to Jose and defensive, doesn't suit us,

    I genuinely cant think who tbh, there's 2 managers i'd want but there both at clubs in the prem, and im not talking about Poch
  32. Mar 14, 2018
    #32

    VeevaVee despite the protests, wears Ugg boots

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    He doesn't seem particularly good at motivating. Hate to mention Pep again, but I imagine he would've been on the sideline getting everyone going last night. If he says to the players what he said in public after the game last night then he's even worse than I would've ever thought.
  33. Mar 14, 2018
    #33

    E-mal Full Member

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    No, absolutely no. Am tired of watching some negative bullshit. Lets get some attacking coach and enjoy the game a little please.
  34. Mar 14, 2018
    #34

    World Game Full Member

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    Can't even call him a good tactician if he doesn't have any tactics for half the game i.e the attacking half.
  35. Mar 14, 2018
    #35

    Rifer Full Member

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    Ah I see. One big problem is we are not privy to the training sessions, so we can only see and speculate the result of it in games.

    This probably won't be popular, but the interchanging of position, fluid movements to receive passes, and 1-2 passes of the front 4 attackers plus Pogba when he joins in the attacks (many times this season) are all part of the attacking training session coached by the coaches. Not only that, at times Lukaku performed the target role well, but he needs runners beyond him for his headed pass (see Lingard Chelsea game and Rashford's 1st goal Liverpool). Why I assume the coaches did this drills with the players - it's absent during LVG's reign where the players are more static in their position, not much fluid movements, other than of course it happened so many times already becoming a predictable pattern our attacks.

    Thing is, the Sevilla game hoofball attack pattern is still strong in our mind, so we may not remember much of those other attacking patterns in other games.
  36. Mar 15, 2018
    #36

    RoyH1 Full Member

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    He hasn't instilled the siege mentality on the players yet like he did in Chelsea or Madrid (at the start). For better and for worse.
  37. Mar 15, 2018
    #37

    soapythecat Full Member

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    The players at times look like they have taken on the ego of the manager - we can just stroll around and wipe the floor with this team, without much effort. That's how it comes across at times. The performance against Seville summed this up perfectly. No one looked like they cared because they probably thought it was a given.

    Showing passion against Liverpool is one thing we expect as Manchester United but we have to be putting the lesser teams away, and make no mistake Seville are not a good side and would be way down the PL if they were playing there week in, week out.

    I don't think the players are buying his football style. There is no signs of motivation in this group of players most games.
  38. Mar 15, 2018
    #38

    Judas Open to offers

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    This is how I'm starting to feel too. I just don't think his heart is in it like it used to be and it's simply becoming just a job to him. Of course it's all speculation, but the performances don't inspire me, I don't really buy what he's selling anymore like I used to, and you wonder if the players feel the same.
  39. Mar 15, 2018
    #39

    Honest John Full Member

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    Not as much unmotivated moreover confused. Nobody knows what he's talking about. With a side full of foreigners the last thing you need is a manager that does not have perfect command of the English language and is unable to express himself clearly and succinctly. He hides behind ambiguity and the players know it.
  40. Mar 15, 2018
    #40

    Judas Open to offers

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    That's a new one. Should we get a good old English manager instead?