Is Robert Pirès an underrated winger ?

Discussion in 'Football Forum' started by Jib, Jan 11, 2019.

  1. Jan 11, 2019
    #1

    Jib Full Member

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    189 games - 62 goals and 42 assists in the premier league with Arsenal ( 6 seasons )


    Honours with Arsenal :
    - 2 PL
    - 2 FA Cup
    - FWA footballer of the Year in 2002
    - PFA Team of the Year : 2001-02, 2002-03 , 2003-04
    - top assist provider : 2001-2002

    He won the World Cup and the Euro with France too



    We talk a lot about Henry, Bergkamp and Vieira but Pirès was a key player for Arsenal too and the french NT badly missed him in 2002.
  2. Jan 11, 2019
    #2

    RedTiger Full Member

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    I personally always thought he was one of the best wingers France have ever produced.

    I Was always under the assumption that my opinion was shared by most.
  3. Jan 11, 2019
    #3

    Billy Blaggs Flacco of the Blaggs tribe

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    I always highly rated him
  4. Jan 11, 2019
    #4

    Aloysius's Back 3 Full Member

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    Great player
  5. Jan 11, 2019
    #5

    Tarrou Full Member

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    he was highly rated at the time but seems to be a bit forgotten now in discussions about the great players of that era

    diving twat though
  6. Jan 11, 2019
    #6

    Irwin99 Full Member

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    Brilliant player but strangely I can only recall him having one outstanding game against us and that was in the FA cup 4th round in 2003 (famous for the SAF Becks fallout). I don’t think he ever scored against us either did he?
  7. Jan 11, 2019
    #7

    ErranMorad Full Member

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    A buddy who is an Arsenal fan used to argue that he is better than Giggs. Excellent player for Arsenal, though. That Arsenal team was quite something.
  8. Jan 11, 2019
    #8

    Billy Blaggs Flacco of the Blaggs tribe

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    He wasn't better than Giggs imo but I am biased because Giggs was my favorite player.
  9. Jan 11, 2019
    #9

    SoCross Full Member

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    Same. Superb player.
  10. Jan 11, 2019
    #10

    ErranMorad Full Member

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    I didn't think Pires was better either. Giggs had more pace, more explosiveness, worked harder & was a better crosser. Pires was more technical, better first touch, better passer and goal scorer. I can see why Arsenal fans thought Pires was better.
  11. Jan 11, 2019
    #11

    RochaRoja Full Member

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    I think he’s probably rated about right. One of Arsenal’s best players of the mid-Wenger era (probably considered early-Wenger now, but I’m old) and had a wonderful partnerships with Henry and Cole. He won the FWA player of the year ahead of Henry in the 2001-02 season, which shows how good he was.

    Injury robbed him of starring in the 2002 WC at his peak. Had he not sustained that knee injury, he may well be ranked higher.
  12. Jan 11, 2019
    #12

    RochaRoja Full Member

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    Pirès between 2001 and 2005 was at a much higher level than Giggs ever was. Giggs’ pace and directness made him the more exciting player though.
  13. Jan 11, 2019
    #13

    Archie Leach Gooner

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    That fecking thin strip facial hair was a war crime. Bobby was the tits though.
  14. Jan 11, 2019
    #14

    RochaRoja Full Member

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    Forgot about that. :lol: Iconic!

    He actually got hotter with age. Pulls off the salt and pepper beard with the same swagger he had on the field.
  15. Jan 11, 2019
    #15

    Karel Podolsky New Member

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    Strange.
    I was thinking about him in recent days.
    People talking about how Liverpool undermine FA Cup, then I remember I felt gutted when Robert Pires got injured in an FA Cup match and missed WC 2002.

    I blamed Wenger why he played Pires in a not that important match.
  16. Jan 11, 2019
    #16

    ErranMorad Full Member

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    Which was this "much higher level" he was at? That's just hyperbole. And please don't come back to me with goal scoring figures. Pires was more a wide forward where as Giggs was a winger, so obviously his goal scoring number were higher. May be, just may be Pires had a slight edge when they were operating at the same time in the league but overall Giggs was a better player. Overall he performed better in the league and in Europe.
  17. Jan 11, 2019
    #17

    Inter Yer Nan Full Member

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    He was (correctly) rated very highly in his time. A great player.
  18. Jan 11, 2019
    #18

    RochaRoja Full Member

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    What’s the difference between a wide forward and a winger exactly? Both played on the left of a four man midfield during the same period.

    And yes, Pirès stats were much better. Both were in their teams for their attacking output, so Pirès’ stats are entirely relevant when comparing their impact over that period.
  19. Jan 11, 2019
    #19

    marukomu The Gatekeeper

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    Definite legend for Arsenal. Without his dive against Portsmouth, there would never have been 'The invincibles'.
  20. Jan 11, 2019
    #20

    RedRonaldo Full Member

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    Always rate him highly.

    Still remember his penalty kick combined effort with Henry though.
  21. Jan 11, 2019
    #21

    Robbie Boy Full Member

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    I just assumed most agree that he was fecking brilliant.
  22. Jan 11, 2019
    #22

    Chipper Full Member

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    Very good player, pretty much leaned the word "gait" because of him too.
  23. Jan 11, 2019
    #23

    meamth Full Member

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    Always infuriates me how he easily beat people with just average pace. Pure skill.

    Great player.
  24. Jan 11, 2019
    #24

    UnrelatedPsuedo I pity the poor fool who stinks like I do!

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    Good Lord.
  25. Jan 11, 2019
    #25

    ErranMorad Full Member

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    You'll have to google to find the difference between a wide forward and winger.

    They weren't "much better". Giggs scored 35 goals and made 57 assists in 184 appearances during that period; that is 92 goals and assists or 0.5/game. Whereas Pires scored 62 goals and made 41 assists in 189 appearances; which is 103 goals and assists or 0.54/game.

    In addition to your google research, these goals and assists numbers should also give you an idea about the difference between a wide forward and a winger
  26. Jan 11, 2019
    #26

    Darkhorsez Full Member

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    Ha ha ! I remember him as a great and skillful player at the time. Mind you that Arsenal team was amazing. However, somehow I used to dislike him a lot and thought of him as a little devious and dirty player. Perhaps it was down to our great rivalry at the time.
  27. Jan 11, 2019
    #27

    Stacks Full Member

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    Arsenal played 4 4 2 so how could he be a forward. He was LM straight up. Their wingers just had better movement than ours hence the goal feats
  28. Jan 11, 2019
    #28

    JPRouve can't stop thinking about balls - NOT deflategate

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    Pirès wasn't a wide forward, in fact he wasn't a forward.
  29. Jan 11, 2019
    #29

    Zlatattack Full Member

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    He was a very good player, one of the best of his time.
  30. Jan 11, 2019
    #30

    11101 Full Member

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    He was bloody brilliant. He and the young Giggs are the two stand out proper left wingers of the PL era.
  31. Jan 11, 2019
    #31

    roonster09 Correctly predicted France to win World Cup 2018

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    Going by that, Nani and Martial were better than Hazard and Pires was just slightly better than Nani and Martial.

    Pires - 138 mins per G+A
    Nani - 140 mins per G+A
    Martial - 141 mins per G+A
    Hazard - 142 mins per G+A (16 goals from penalty spot, if you exclude that then it will be even worse)

    Giggs averages 171 mins per G+A and it's not bad considering he started off as a teenager and played till he was nearly 40, whereas Pires played in PL when he was at his peak and left when he was on decline. If you consider their performances when both were in PL at same time (both are of same age) then Pires averages 138 mins per G+A, whereas Giggs averages 146 mins per G+A.
  32. Jan 11, 2019
    #32

    B20 HALA MADRID!

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    Giggs on his best days was a better player than Pires.

    Pires had a higher peak in terms of output over a season though and for some years was the better player.
  33. Jan 11, 2019
    #33

    acnumber9 Full Member

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    Why would you compare for just the same period? Giggs over a 23 year career provided a goal or assist in not far off every two games. Pires was closer to one in 3. Both great players but for Giggs to maintain that kind of record until he was 40 is remarkable. Pires was good but Giggs was better in whatever way you want to compare them except goalscoring.
  34. Jan 11, 2019
    #34

    Mrs Smoker Full Member

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    Giggs:

    [​IMG]
  35. Jan 11, 2019
    #35

    Thisistheone Full Member

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    No mate. Just no.
  36. Jan 11, 2019
    #36

    Gio 6 times Redcafe Draft Winner

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    Yep. He was an inside-left.
  37. Jan 11, 2019
    #37

    cyberman Full Member

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    You couldn't kick Giggs out of a game though, Pires was the first man to target when you wanted to put them under pressure and he never really did it in Europe.
    Overrated due to being on Cole and Henrys side IMO. Ljungberg was better for me
  38. Jan 11, 2019
    #38

    Thisistheone Full Member

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    These numbers never fail to blow me away. Unreal player.
  39. Jan 11, 2019
    #39

    Annihilate Now! ...or later, I'm not fussy Scout

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    He was my nomination in the underrated PL players thread.

    Anyway, brilliant player. Like others have said, I think at the time he was highly rated, but has been forgotten about a bit since.
  40. Jan 11, 2019
    #40

    RochaRoja Full Member

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    I’m saying the numbers are relevant when comparing the two players, but Pirès also had the edge in his general involvement in the play, touch and technique. Pretty much everything good that Arsenal team did for years was down his side. If they were collecting stats for key passes at the time, I’m sure it would show how huge his influence was.