1. If you are having difficulty resetting your password in order to login to your account, please try again. There was a bug which is now fixed.
    Dismiss Notice

Jürgen Klopp Watch | "I will only be judged by God, not by Liverpool trophies"

Discussion in 'Football Forum' started by Samid, Oct 17, 2015.

  1. Mar 15, 2019 at 19:19

    el3mel Full Member

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2016
    Messages:
    23,917
    Location:
    Egypt
    - Look, your team has spent a lot last few years and ..
    - Net spend, lad, net spend! We have sold a player for 200m 10 years ago and we're still spending the money. Now shut up please.
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2019 at 21:46
  2. Mar 15, 2019 at 20:11

    Dumbstar Full Member

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2002
    Messages:
    13,820
    Location:
    Viva Karius!
    Supports:
    Liverpool
    A Madrid fan choosing this season to talk about trophies. Love it. :D #loveramos #seeyouinthefinalagain
  3. Mar 15, 2019 at 20:20

    OnlyTwoDaSilvas Gullible

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2013
    Messages:
    16,679
    Location:
    The Mathews Bridge
    Never took him for a god botherer. I thought he was into his heavy metal? They don't mix.

    Weird guy keeps getting weirder.
  4. Mar 15, 2019 at 20:21

    adexkola Arsenal supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2008
    Messages:
    33,258
    Location:
    Me, and you. Yo momma, and yo cousin too.
    Supports:
    orderly disembarking on planes
    Don’t pay the Luddites any mind
  5. Mar 15, 2019 at 21:09

    Chipper Full Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2017
    Messages:
    1,158
    Yup, it's quite frankly bizarre that some people insist it doesn't.

    We sell our entire squad for £1bn and then spend that £1bn replacing them = keeping our entire squad and adding £1bn of players to it for those who think it doesn't matter. That's just not rational. We'd obviously be in a better position with the latter and it makes the manager's job easier.

    Now sure, there's amortisation and players wages to take into account too as someone you get cheaply or even free could be on a huge salary (Ibra, Sanchez), but as a rule having a large transfer kitty to dip into over and above what you bring in from sales is a much better place to be in than only spending similar amounts to what you recoup from sales.
  6. Mar 15, 2019 at 21:12

    Haddock Full Member

    Joined:
    May 25, 2013
    Messages:
    421
    Christian Metal is a significant sub genre.

    (maybe Klopp means Robbie Fowler?)
  7. Mar 15, 2019 at 21:17

    Random Task Correctly predicted France to win World Cup 2018

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2010
    Messages:
    12,201
    Location:
    Chester
  8. Mar 15, 2019 at 21:25

    VeevaVee despite the protests, wears Ugg boots

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2009
    Messages:
    28,705
    RAWK is that way mate >
  9. Mar 15, 2019 at 21:31

    OnlyTwoDaSilvas Gullible

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2013
    Messages:
    16,679
    Location:
    The Mathews Bridge
    It is, but it's not one that is taken seriously.

    The Ska-Punk of Heavy Metal.
  10. Mar 15, 2019 at 21:31

    VeevaVee despite the protests, wears Ugg boots

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2009
    Messages:
    28,705
    Yep. Net spend is garbage. So what you got lucky with a club massively overegging a player's worth during the peak madness?

    At best it means they have some good scouts. Well done, who cares?
    Surely the whole reason it's supposed to mean something, if anything, when said by a fan, is that you nurture players into being good rather than buy a ready made team? All the Liverpool players were bought to immediately perform. They were all already at that level and admittedly excelled in a decent system they fit in to.
  11. Mar 15, 2019 at 21:31

    crossy1686 Full Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2010
    Messages:
    7,847
    Location:
    Stockholm, Sweden
    Do Liverpool not have a PR person? If they do they should get everyone into a room and say "Right, nobody and I mean absolutely nobody talk again until the season is over".

    Klopp looks and sounds like he's on the verge of a mental break down every post match and this continuing to belittle journalists because they ask a question he doesn't like is very, very Jose Mourinho-esque, at least Mourinho did it in a calculated way, Klopp just calls them an idiot.
  12. Mar 15, 2019 at 21:33

    SquishyMcSquish Full Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2018
    Messages:
    4,213
    Supports:
    Tottenham
    I think most people accept that net spends matter, but having a low net spend doesn't necessarily equate to having not had money to invest.

    Klopp has a low net spend, but the bottom line is that he still has been able to spend a lot on players. He has an expensive squad overall, one of the more expensively assembled ones in the country.

    That said, it obviously does have to be taken in to account that they had to sell Coutinho to fund a lot of that. This Liverpool team + Coutinho this season would be top of the league, City don't have to sell their star midfielder in order to fund the likes of Laporte or Walker, and that's obviously an advantage. They don't have to take a step back to take 2 steps forwards whereas Liverpool (to a certain extent) do, as they have to spend within their means.
  13. Mar 15, 2019 at 21:40

    soaphroniscuss New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2019
    Messages:
    66
    A Klopp meltdown is just a matter of time. He reminds me of my dentist.
  14. Mar 15, 2019 at 21:42

    PaulScholes99 New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2018
    Messages:
    73
    Liverpool is top of the league because their defense is very solid. Not because of their attack. Their defense is very solid for 2 reasons:
    -individual players are performing very good (Robertson, VVD)
    -midfield is helping them a lot

    Their offense is not as good as last year because of 2 reasons:
    -individual players are not performing as good as last year (Firmino, Salah)
    -midfield isn't helping them a lot

    Coutinho instead of Wijnaldum/Henderson/Fabinho/Millner (one of them) - yes, he would be the better individual player. There game would be more attractive to watch. But would they be on more points? I don't think so. Of course nobody knows, but you can't just say liverpool + coutinho would be top of the league.
  15. Mar 15, 2019 at 22:13

    SquishyMcSquish Full Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2018
    Messages:
    4,213
    Supports:
    Tottenham
    I really can. They're a point off, having Coutinho as another option would be an incredible asset. He had 7 goals and 6 assists in 13 games before he had to leave in January.

    They could easily go with a more defensive setup in the games that are necessary, but Coutinho would have turned plenty of their draws in to wins because he's exactly what they lack: a genuinely creative midfield player. I don't think it is at all a stretch to say having Coutinho as an option would have gained them at least a few points.
  16. Mar 15, 2019 at 22:15

    DavidDeSchmikes Full Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2013
    Messages:
    6,012
    Brendan Rodgers wasn't judged well......
    [​IMG]
  17. Mar 15, 2019 at 22:23

    MikeKing Full Member

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2017
    Messages:
    1,979
    Supports:
    Bournemouth
    God knows those prejudice trophies are not to be trusted among men. Should stay far away from them buggers
  18. Mar 15, 2019 at 22:38

    Josh 76 Full Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2018
    Messages:
    620
    Net spend is all about luck.
    Solanke was brought on a free and sold for 20m.
    Courthinho was brought for 10m and sold for 140m.
    Shaqiri was brought for 13m and will be sold next season for 25-30m.
    This kind of business is down to the financial people at the club and not Klopp. I have to admit it's a good model and it's working well. But winning a net spend cup means feck all. Just ask spurs.

    Utd have the money, so they don't run like Liverpool. Rafael, fellani, park, nani, Vidic, Rooney, Rvp, Evra, were all sold for less than 60m. That was the price of Di Maria. UTD don't do net spend because they don't need to.
  19. Mar 15, 2019 at 22:40

    Random Task Correctly predicted France to win World Cup 2018

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2010
    Messages:
    12,201
    Location:
    Chester
    Of course they have to spend within their means, every football club on the planet is obliged to operate under those same limitations, but some clubs have a great deal more room to work with than others - Liverpool are one such club. They have invested just shy of £1 billion on transfer expenditure over the last decade, placing them 7th on the list of Europes highest spenders during that period. They were spending large amounts of money in the transfer market long before the sale of Coutinho.

    Hearing Liverpool fans drone on about Netspend is frankly offensive. They support one of the most financially secure football clubs the world over, so secure in their wealth that reinvesting 100% of the Coutinho funds directly back into the transfer kitty was done so without consequence. There are few clubs in existence that can operate in such a fashion, as a Spurs fan you can appreciate this more than most.
  20. Mar 15, 2019 at 22:41

    SquishyMcSquish Full Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2018
    Messages:
    4,213
    Supports:
    Tottenham

    No, winning the net spend doesn't mean anything.

    But having to sell Coutinho in order to fund their biggest signings clearly does. They would have been much better off keep Coutinho and bringing in players, which is what the biggest net spends can do. That makes a difference.

    Of course there's a huge element of fortune (or a solid business model) in bringing in players on the cheap then selling them on, but Liverpool are still limited in a way their competitors aren't. They likely would never have OK'ed the splurge on VVD, Alisson etc, without the Coutinho money.
  21. Mar 15, 2019 at 22:50

    SquishyMcSquish Full Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2018
    Messages:
    4,213
    Supports:
    Tottenham

    And some clubs have a great deal more room to work with than Liverpool, i.e City and United, one is ran by people who don't care how much is spent, and the other is a club which has revenue streams far exceeding those of Liverpool.

    Liverpool have spent a lot, there's no doubt about it. But they've sold both Suarez and Coutinho in that time (two world class players) in order to fund much of that spending, which is simply something that clubs like City and United (who they compete with) really don't have to do. Liverpool even without sales can spend significant money, but not quite as much as the biggest spenders in the league.

    Of course, I agree with all of that. Liverpool are in the very enviable position of being able to reinvest pretty much everything and having owners prepared to spend a bit more on top as well, they're in a great position. I don't think anybody is denying that, it's just also a fact that they're competing with City: a club who don't have to sell anybody, they can keep all their stars and add players on top of that. That's a significant advantage. They don't have to remotely care about net spend.

    City don't sell De Bruyne to fund Laporte and Walker, they offer De Bruyne a new massive contract to keep away the biggest clubs, and then they bring in the players they need anyway.
  22. Mar 15, 2019 at 22:55

    purgethefallen New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2019
    Messages:
    57
    Supports:
    Basingstoke Bison Ice Hockey
    Looks more and more like a German Keegan every day.
  23. Mar 15, 2019 at 22:56

    VeevaVee despite the protests, wears Ugg boots

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2009
    Messages:
    28,705
    It doesn't matter where the money comes from though. Our money comes from our brand. Theirs came from Coutinho. Why do they get some kind of net spend pass? They've still spent a lot of money on their team.
  24. Mar 15, 2019 at 22:58

    SquishyMcSquish Full Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2018
    Messages:
    4,213
    Supports:
    Tottenham
    Nobody has said otherwise. I've acknowledged they still have an expensive team - and the expectations should come with that. They're on course for a 90+ point season, I'd say for their level of spending they're matching those expectations.

    You can't really expect them to win the title against this City side though, because they're at a clear disadvantage, needing to sell stars to fund their biggest acquisitions. They don't get a 'net spend pass', but I think it's silly to ignore the fact that they had to sell the best player at the club (at the time), because the bottom line is their competitors don't need to do that.
  25. Mar 15, 2019 at 23:43

    Haddock Full Member

    Joined:
    May 25, 2013
    Messages:
    421
    Well Heavy metal itself is not really a genre to be taken seriously, so there's that.
  26. Mar 15, 2019 at 23:49

    purgethefallen New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2019
    Messages:
    57
    Supports:
    Basingstoke Bison Ice Hockey
    Blasphemy.
  27. Mar 15, 2019 at 23:52

    No Idea For Nickname Full Member

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2015
    Messages:
    6,716
    Location:
    Split, Croatia


    :lol:
  28. Mar 16, 2019 at 00:00

    Casanova85 New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2018
    Messages:
    1,348
    Location:
    Northwestern Mediterranean
    Supports:
    FC Barcelona, Manchester Utd
    He's going Full Meltdown. Never go Full Meltdown.
  29. Mar 16, 2019 at 00:02

    GatoLoco Full Member

    Joined:
    Apr 7, 2018
    Messages:
    428
    Supports:
    Real Madrid
    :D
  30. Mar 16, 2019 at 03:29

    roonster09 Correctly predicted France to win World Cup 2018

    Joined:
    May 10, 2009
    Messages:
    14,114
    If you want to praise Liverpool for low net spend yeah, it makes sense (then again what should be years in consideration, why only last 5 years instead of last 10-15 years) but when the managers gets praised for it, it's just baffling. Its like the 250 million Liverpool spent in the last 2 seasons when Klopp took over is reset to 0, even the 120 million Liverpool spent (before Neymar transfer money) in summer is ignored just because Klopp took over in October.

    34 million was sent to sign Benteke under Rodgers, so by selling him Klopp started with -34 million. How does that make sense? He was signed by Rodgers. Same with Coutinho. Klopp was lucky that he has player worth 150 million whereas managers like Jose took over club who didn't have player worth that much to sell. Sakho was signed for around 20 million under Rodgers but Klopp sold him so again he starts with -20 million.

    So if Solskjaer spends only 50 million and sell 1 player for 50 million, can anyone really say Ole is achieving so much by spending nothing? Why should you ignore the squad cost or the money spent before manager took over?

    Net spend for a manager makes no sense at all, it makes sense if you want to compare clubs. Klopp shouldn't get credit for Rodgers signings a 150 million worth player.
  31. Mar 16, 2019 at 03:31

    yellowandgreens Full Member

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2008
    Messages:
    1,470
    Location:
    'I am not a man.... I am Cantona.'
    Why does Klopp want Cantona to judge him?
  32. Mar 16, 2019 at 04:53

    Needham Full Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2013
    Messages:
    9,292
    God's a Utd fan anyway so he'll be fine.
  33. Mar 16, 2019 at 05:16

    worldinmotion66 Full Member

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2015
    Messages:
    1,447
    Net spend is useful but not fail safe.

    Liverpool only got stupid money for coutinho because barcawere minted from the neymar sale, and a player's value is dictated by the selling club, not the buyer. Are Allison or Kepa worth more than ederson? Not really. The fact that they cost more doesn't necessarily mean that they're better players.

    You've also got to factor in wages, it's a completely pointless stat without that additional figure.
  34. Mar 16, 2019 at 05:38

    Dan-Utd New Member

    Joined:
    May 17, 2016
    Messages:
    34
    I think he's done a great job at Liverpool, he's given them some consistency.

    Every year Liverpool would go on a 7 game streak doing really well and then you would hear a Pool fan saying "this is goin ter be us year" and then they would lose the next match, they would then spend the rest of the season getting good wins but dropping silly points.

    Now you kinda expect them to take the title race right down to the wire, just like last year in Champions League they were consistent and you could tell they'd make it to the final.

    He also hasn't been afraid to play some of the youngsters and doesn't crucify them if they make a mistake.

    Rivals or not, I like seeing how foreign managers perform in the Premier League and unlike the guy along the road who has been given umpteen millions of pound to buy a whole new squad like he's on Football Manager, Klopp has had to do it in a more realistic way and i think he's done very well.
  35. Mar 16, 2019 at 07:49

    St Red KRAP

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2008
    Messages:
    1,235
    RedCafe over reaction to a nothing comment.
    Who'd have thunk it?
  36. Mar 16, 2019 at 08:23

    duffer Sensible and not a complete jerk like most oppo's Scout

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2004
    Messages:
    31,582
    Location:
    Chelsea fan.
    You're the Red Devils and have a picture of Satan on your shirts.

    God does not support a team but it's certain that you lot piss him off.
  37. Mar 16, 2019 at 08:36

    Tom Van Persie No relation

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2012
    Messages:
    9,033
    :lol:
  38. Mar 16, 2019 at 08:51

    GhastlyHun Full Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2015
    Messages:
    7,648
    Location:
    Bavaria
    Supports:
    Bayern München
    I applaud your roast from inception to execution. :lol:
  39. Mar 16, 2019 at 08:52

    sugar_kane Full Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2013
    Messages:
    1,307
  40. Mar 16, 2019 at 09:24

    Stacks Full Member

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2015
    Messages:
    4,982
    Location:
    Fresh outta jail
    Put it this way....You will be hard pressed to improve the quality of, add to or enhance your squad with a low net spend. You want to keep your existing talent and buy more. Not sell them to buy