Discussion in 'Player Performances Forum' started by Sir Matt, Aug 19, 2012.
He is not really that good I don't think
Nope the comment was merely suggestive.
And what did it suggest?
Nothing at all. Its a basis to start a debate on his terms. He wants you to suggest something he can pick holes in. He's in to his fallacies I believe.
Hehe good try Comsmit but no.
Cina, merely suggesting Badstuber being better than Evans may not be so clear cut, but I digress.
Easily walk into the starting lineup of any team in the world? The hype train is out of control. He's a good player but come on.
Koscielny is clearly better. He's roughly the same level as Vernaelen and Mertesacker. So anywhere from 2nd to 4th best CB at Arsenal. Hardly the stuff world class players are made of.
Is he feck
I disagree, Evans is either on par or better than Koscielny. Koscielny, most of the time, is culpable for many of the goals you concede. Now I know Kos plays more regularly than Evans (therefore the stats must be biased towards Evans' favor) but it is still fairly obvious that Kos has more probability of making a mistake than Evans does when it comes to defending whenever I have watched the both of them play.
That's not fair at all. Koscielny has been at fault in the past but he was excellent last season and towards the end of 10/11. It was Mertesacker who was responsible for more of their shitty goals conceded.
To each their own, but I feel as though Koscielny is hampered by his inability to read the game properly. I feel as though he is always a step too late in his defending. Mertesacker reads the game much better than Koscielny. From what I've seen from both's full Arsenal careers so far, Koscielny is the more culpable of the two.
You having a laugh?
Evans might not be world class (yet) but he is better than people give him credit.
Koscielny was possibly our 2nd best player last year and in my opinion the second best first defender in the league. He can appear more rash than Mertesacker but its his job to make the first challenge while Mert scoops up anything that gets through.
Put it this way, there are at least ten centre backs i'd rather have than Smalling and I rate him more than most non-United fans.
Ten centre backs? Really?
Name and shame!
Koscielny has had a generally bad season so far.
Against Spain he was not at his best for sure. I laughed when he committed the penalty, it was a very amateurish tackle, you would normally expect in the middle of the field as some sort of retaliation and not in the penalty area
Whoops, said Smalling instead of Evans because I was thinking I would rather have him too.
So that is 12. Then there are guys who might be slightly better or worse but there isn't much between them like Badstuber, Lescott, Skrtel, Vermaelen, Terry and Coloccini.
While Evans has made good progress I honestly feel he could be a lot better player than what we are currently seeing. He really has it in him to be first choice center back at any club but right now he's been inconsistent. The most frustrating part of his game is the amount of silly fouls that he gives away, specially if you watched him progress through the ranks he was such a classy consistent defender who hardly gave away such fouls.
He doesn't have exceptional pace or heading which is the common things that people look for in a defender here so I doubt he'd be rated highly by ones who don't get to watch him on a regular basis. I'm quite confident if he was playing in a continental side then he'll get more recognition.
I didn't understand this, can you clarify please?
Don't rate Koscielny myself, you know he's typically the kind of player that's going to cost you points with major feck-ups, red cards and stupid challenges. His positioning isn't that great either. You'll have some stellar performances in and between, but he'll never have that sense of serenity about him that a world-class defender is meant to inspire, in my opinion.
That Gooners rate him so highly and believe he was the 2nd best player last season (when Song and Arteta were more important than him) just goes to show how fecked up their defence has been in the last few years.
As for Evans, didn't really believe in him I have got to admit, but he's proven me wrong and become a steady defender. To be honest, at a club like ours I'd put him as back-up, but very decent back-up
That's embarrassing. Typing with my iPod on no sleep. Ignore "first".
No worries. In that case:
I don't agree that he is the second best defender in the league. Let's take United out of the argument for a moment here. I believe that out of all the center backs of top 4 clubs (excluding United), I'd have the two starting center backs of Chelsea, and City before picking Koscielny. He is a good defender, there is no denying it, but he is also too rash without being clinical in his tackles.
Eboue, is Vermaelen a starting center back for you? Also, isn't he better than Koscielny in your opinion?
I think Wenger sees Vermaelen and Koscielny as his top two. They are both aggressive types and I think it would work better to pair one of them with Mertesacker. And no, in my opinion Koscielny is better than Vermaelen.
Id agree with most of these names, except IMO theres no way Mascherano and Pique are better than Evans.
I think we are yet to see the best of him, but his progress has been immense. A couple more years and he will be one of the best in the world. He has all the needed elements to his game.
How the hell is Mascherano in a list of quality CBs? Otherwise would agree all those are better than him. He's close to Pique, Koscielny, Ramos and Agger though IMO.
He plays mostly CB for Barcelona.
How many teams currently have 2 first choice defenders better than Evans? I never said he's world class, I merely stated he would walk into most teams as a starter and it's a fact as most teams do not have 2 world class defenders.
Wait, no one actually said Evans was top 10 in the World did they?
I like him but he's not even close. Yet...
He doesn't walk into his own team! Nevermind "any team in the World".
Teams where he would not "easily walk into the starting line up"
That's not to say he wouldn't get games at every club, but he isn't clearly better than even Skrtel, Boateng, Vermaelen, etc. Reasonable people can disagree over whether he is better or worse than these guys but it's not like we're comparing Iniesta and Downing here.
If Evans keeps going as he is I think he has a very strong chance of making himself the number 1 at united in defence and that will put him up. Was excellent last season, still getting started this year after injuries but he's been picking up. The qualities which have been showing themselves for a year or so now such as ability to carry the ball, passing etc are all consistently there. As much as I love rio an vidic, with rio being less consistent/reliable now due to injuries and vidic struggling for fitness I really hope we concentrate on Evans now. If we give him as much game time as we can and give him that reaponsibility he could really push on.
In my opinion, the top tier of defenders who are clearly world class and better than him
Vidic (if he ever recovers properly from his injury)
Rio (when he's fit)
On form, he's as good as everyone else, apart from those above mentioned.
Song's played CB for them too doesn't mean he's great there. Mascherano's no more than decent there. Will have the odd great performance but it's mostly just average stuff.
Visions of the Everton game after Evans missed the header and kightley goes and score. What an absurd miss
Absurd? The keeper saved it
He is overrated here. He is very good, but not close to walking into any team in the world. He may become brilliant, but he isn't there yet. The list of defenders who are better than him is much greater than some would suggest.
Not only that, Jonny showed some striker mentality with that, trying to get his header back where it came from. If that were a keeper who was quicker on his feet, he'd be gliding past in the other direction and Jonny'd have got a goal. Good effort, even if a simpler one would've resulted in a goal.
absurd miss? The keeper saved it. Evans tried to place it back across the goal and it nearly worked with the keeper struggling to keep it out
It was a bad miss as it was a sitter but his idea was a good one and I wouldn't criticise him too much for that. He was very good defensively, as he's been for the last what, 10 months?
I was wondering what people would be criticising him for. When he wasn't at fault for either goal conceded I knew someone would complain about something else.
BTW, he's really starting to stay up the pitch for prolonged periods. If the midfielders would pass the ball to him when he's up there it could be dangerous as he's often left unmarked.
Good point, he's also very comfortable with the ball for a cb in forward areas. I really like the style of his.
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