Jose: one hundred games and a 62% win rate

Discussion in 'Manchester United Forum' started by Salus Populi Suprema Lex, Jan 27, 2018.

  1. Jan 29, 2018

    stevoc Full Member

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    Welcome to United JoMo!
    That was the big thing for me when we won the Europa, it completed the set. It always annoyed me since i was a kid that we had never won it.

    Also it's not as well talked about but it put us along side Bayern as the only two clubs to have ever won every major domestic, european and international trophy available to them over the course of their history.
  2. Jan 29, 2018

    Ballache Full Member

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    Real Madrid have 2 EL's and I'm sure they've won everything or am I missing something?
  3. Jan 29, 2018

    buchansleftleg Full Member

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    I have found on a couple of occasions that Jose has been a over-cautious in how he has set up the team but it is still early days for him in this role and I think it is a slight hangover from his experiences at Chelsea and Real Madrid where the environment for a manager is pretty toxic.

    His cautious approach will see us do very well, given we are still a couple of players away from totally challenging on all fronts. I think City MAY have a blow up in the next few weeks as the competitions start to build up and the physical toll may start to rise, but they have such depth this may not be enough for us to catch-up if it does not go beyond a few draws.

    I think Jose is aiming to create a real legacy - he has coveted this job for years and he is not about to hit his 3 year syndrome because he is not working for a club that will put that same pressure on him for results right away. It would be nice of the fans to reflect that too, because we can't criticise him for not winning the league this year. He has strengthened the team, is building a good mix of youth and experience and is tactically a real expert. If we give him the time and investment we will be able to cram those 5 European Cups up Liverpools hole!
  4. Jan 29, 2018

    stevoc Full Member

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    Welcome to United JoMo!
    They never won the Cup Winners Cup, Barcelona have never won the Uefa Cup.
  5. Jan 29, 2018

    Ballache Full Member

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    Oh, didn't think about that. Fair enough.
  6. Jan 29, 2018

    stevoc Full Member

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    Welcome to United JoMo!
    Its an easy one to forget about to be fair mate. Thats why i think's it's a nice little stat that United are one of only two clubs to have won everything.
  7. Jan 29, 2018

    Revaulx Full Member

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    Well I’m happy for you that you thought the Southampton match was satisfactory.

    Oh wait:
    I think those comments are spot on, and I’d have posted them myself if I hadn’t been At Old Trafford at the time.
  8. Jan 29, 2018

    The Alchemist Banned

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    Hahaha, who said it was satisfactory?

    The difference is I didn't use that performance/result to reach an evaluation/assessment of the manger's ability to steer the club in the right direction.

    Those posts were in time match day posts when the game was live, which I'm sure you are aware will be reactionary. However no where did I allow the result to cloud my judgement so much that I began to believe that we are above being subjected to draws and question the manager's position. In fact it was I who called for reason amid many who lost their heads and were lamenting that they had enough of the man, as that was the period, when we were struggling for goals and good performances which was the final straw for some of the impatient ' I want all the trophies now'' crowd.

    Your last passing comment about being at Old Trafford, to attempt to subtly show you are some superior super fan, doesn't really impress me to be honest. Especially considering more often than not, you'd get more sense out of a stray dog, then the average match goer.
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2018
  9. Jan 29, 2018

    dirkey Full Member

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    At no point did he call it satisfactory.

    Love the "i was at Old Trafford at the time" comment Adds loads to your comments. Because you were there for that particular game, your viewpoints have more weight. You're a true fan, unlike those of us who were not at that game. Well done, gold star.
  10. Jan 29, 2018

    Revaulx Full Member

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    I wasn’t aware that I had either. I thought I’d made it clear that the general direction looks good, but while I have recent memories of the team looking clueless and uninterested I’m going to retain an element of scepticism. As I said, I’m looking forward to the CL blowing that scepticism away.

    Completely agree with all of this.

    Gosh...

    Who’s being superior now?
  11. Jan 29, 2018

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    Oh, that was a warning was it ? I thought the Mods were just highlighting the quality of my post :lol:

    99/100 when a Manager get's a job it's because what went before them wasn't working, be it the squad wasn't good enough, team spirit was low, the scouting isn't good enough etc etc, it's just that most Managers knowing how difficult it is to get everything right when you don't know how long you're going to get in the job appreciate that and don't feel the need to be critical of what/who went before - just my take on it - apologies to the Mourinho lovers offended who believe he can walk on water.
  12. Jan 29, 2018

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    He didn't really need too, we all knew that the Sanchez transfer came about(out of the blue, or so it seemed) only weeks after Mourinho was saying he needed more money.
  13. Jan 29, 2018

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    Good post.
  14. Jan 29, 2018

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    If you mean some of his comments whilst at United, yeah, but by that time he already knew he was a dead man walking.
  15. Jan 29, 2018

    The Alchemist Banned

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    Fair enough, though I believe your scepticism is misplaced considering during that period it was during the Xmas and new year holidays with congested fixture list where the only other team that didn't look fatigued and uninterested were an in form City.

    We will get those kind of games in football it's the natural considering all factors - congested fixtures, injuries and inconsistent line ups, human beings getting complacent etc. Obviously if it becomes a running theme then it is an issue.

    But those sort of performance we'd often get even under Sir Alex where it looked like the players were trying to run through cement looking uninterested until they got a kick up the backside through either conceding or the hair dryer at HT.

    This is why I got on your case because it's ridiculous to act as if a manager should never be afforded games where their team deliver a poor sub standard performance or draw a game which looks on paper on odds to win. Just reeks of entitlement and unrealistic expectations.
  16. Jan 29, 2018

    Bobski Full Member

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    Personally I do not consider the Europa League to be on the same level as the UEFA Cup. There was a long period when the Uefa was of a higher standard than the European Cup, had depth of quality in the teams involved and was harder to win, if easier to get into.

    Tells all that the main prize for winning the Europa is to not have to play in it the next year. Maybe the addition of that CL spot will allow the tournament to build again, but it was a non-event for years before that decision, probably going back to expanding the entry for the CL to 4 from the main countries.
  17. Jan 29, 2018

    stevoc Full Member

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    Welcome to United JoMo!
    And at Sociedad and at Sunderland. It's never Daves fault don't you know.
  18. Jan 29, 2018

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    I didn't pay much attention, it's probably only those that wanted him to fail that did ;)
  19. Jan 29, 2018

    Salus Populi Suprema Lex Full Member

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    I think we had more than an outside hope in both 1999 and 2008. We were then definitely amongst the top two or three sides in Europe each time, but that isn't the case just now. This team isn't as good as either of those. I'm going to enjoy the ride whilst it lasts this season. I'm sure we'll be more realistic contenders within the next couple of years.
  20. Jan 29, 2018

    Ban Full Member

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    Ok. We might win it or we have a possibility of winning it imo.
    Is that ok by you?
  21. Jan 29, 2018

    Summit "do the dead, spread your seed and get out"

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    Why you being so shirty over me finding it funny how someone saying we were going to win the CL? Jeez pal, you need to lighten up.
  22. Jan 29, 2018

    Ban Full Member

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    Look I get it why you found it funny. Just asking if you think we have a chance of winning it.

    I'm not being shirty or anything like that.

    (Although I don't know what that means :D )
  23. Jan 29, 2018

    Summit "do the dead, spread your seed and get out"

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    Everyone in it has a chance, as has previously been shown by other teams like Chelsea and Inter.
  24. Jan 29, 2018

    Ban Full Member

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    ;)
  25. Jan 29, 2018

    Chesterlestreet Man of the crowd

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    It obviously ain't.

    The older format was completely different. Which means that the people who pretend we've now finally won «The UEFA Cup» are either - indeed - pretending for the sake of feck knows what - or being plain ignorant about the old format.

    Barca (with Messi) and/or Real (with Ronaldo) would have been regulars in the old UEFA Cup. Just like Maradona's Napoli was back in the day - or what have you.

    The Europa League obviously isn't comparable at all, and insisting that it's «technically» the same trophy is ridiculous, not to say RAWKish.
  26. Jan 29, 2018

    stevoc Full Member

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    Welcome to United JoMo!
    I didn't want him to fail just knew that he would, at United anyway.
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2018
  27. Jan 29, 2018

    Alvaro Maestre New Member

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    Is he going to win Manager of the month ? 5 wins and 5 clean sheets.
  28. Jan 29, 2018

    stevoc Full Member

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    Welcome to United JoMo!
    To be honest i think it's a bit silly to try to argue that it isn't the same competition. Physically it's the same trophy, Uefa and football in general consider it to be the same competition and it is the 2nd most prestigious competition in Europe just like the Uefa Cup was. So if it looks like a duck and walks like a duck, then well it's a duck.

    Now it isn't as hard to win as the old Uefa Cup you're right and i don't think you will find anyone arguing that point, thats one of the main reasons it was re-branded after all. So yes it's contested by a lesser level of team these days but conversely the Champions League is much harder to win than the old European Cup for the same reason. Do you think that devalues the old European Cup and/or do you even consider those competitions to be the same as that was also similarly re-branded and had a format change?
  29. Jan 30, 2018

    eat_grass Full Member

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    I think his comments were intended to set fans' expectations right. He's very honest about his teams' chances. He said Chelsea were not ready to challenge for the title even while his team were top of the table in April. The next year he pronounced himself and Chelsea Champions-elect with only a 5-point lead in the table in March.

    When he first signed on he said United were three summer windows away from challenging for the title, but said the team would still fight to challenge for all honors. The start of this season (after the 7-1-0 start) he said one more transfer window away from challenging. Purely objective.

    The difference with Mourinho and other managers that take over clubs is his track record. He always* wins the league his second year -- well, he wanted to be absolutely clear to the fans what the state of the squad was, and let the fans connect the dots.

    I'd rather the manager be honest about existing conditions than peddle platitudes. So his comments didn't offend me.
    Last edited: Jan 30, 2018
  30. Jan 30, 2018

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    100%
  31. Jan 30, 2018

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    It must've been nice for Mourinho to say he'd need, and fully expect to get three transfer windows for him to have a team capable of challenging for a Title, something his predecessors weren't afforded.

    Anyway that's me taking a brief time-out from this Mourinho love-in, but i'll be back.
  32. Jan 30, 2018

    Regulus Arcturus Black Banned

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    They didn’t earn it, winning 2 trophies and getting CL football in your first season gives a manager a wee bit of leeway.
    He’a also supremely confident that unlike the previous two, he’ll get the minimum required CL place again after season two.
  33. Jan 30, 2018

    dirkey Full Member

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    Exactly this. Whatever people may say about style of football (and I get the argument ), he's giving us undeniable improvement as we go along. He's earning the right to stay. The other two simply had to go. Let's not pretend those sackings were unjustified or harshly early.
  34. Jan 30, 2018

    Nik70 Full Member

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    From what I can remember he was answering a question about the state of the squad and gave an honest assessment. It wasn't about being openly critical of a particular manager. He gave his opinion and he was correct. Not denying that Mourinho is a straight talker and can be a bit of a dick at times.
  35. Jan 30, 2018

    mike bird Banned

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    When you put Jose on the same sentence with Giggs, when it comes to judge characters, is utterly disgraceful. I m guessing you never played competitive sport in your life to have an understanding about heat of the moment situations.

    Jose a respectable figure in the world of football, successful and above all, a family man.
  36. Jan 30, 2018

    VanGaalEra Full Member

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    What a username.
  37. Jan 30, 2018

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    Mourinho is similar to SAF, he's an intelligent bloke, he chooses his words carefully, he knows exactly how his comments will be interpreted.
  38. Jan 30, 2018

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    Not sure what me not having played competitive sport has got to do with the price of snuff, we all do daft stuff, but most of us admit we were in the wrong, then apologise, i'll say no more.
  39. Jan 30, 2018

    Class of 63 Full Member

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    Says VanGaalEra :lol:
  40. Jan 30, 2018

    Nik70 Full Member

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    If you're trying to imply that he was being verbally malicious, maybe so, but it was the truth nonetheless. You clearly don't like Mourinho which is fine but we were in the shit when he became manager and he was answering a question put to him by the media.