Let's look on the bright side

Discussion in 'Manchester United Forum' started by Livvie, May 6, 2012.

  1. May 6, 2012
    #41

    Sunny Jim Full Member

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    true, at the end of the day they are businessmen not fans. Our business plan is based on three assumptions: we finish at least 3rd in the league, get to group stages of CL and don't progress, we sell certain % of stadium's capacity (IIRC 75%). Without any investment we capable of doing even more than thus balance the books. and that's what they are after.
  2. May 6, 2012
    #42

    iAm20Legend Full Member

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    Agree, totally. And yes, I can very much see us not being able to sign all four.
    :(
  3. May 6, 2012
    #43

    Donkey's Ears Full Member

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    Plenty of positives of course but also plenty of negatives. Ferguson has made as many bad decisions this season as I can remember. We seem to have a worrying tendency to let games drift. We've blown an 8 point lead without six games left. We blew a 4-2 lead against Everton with ten minutes left. We have one central midfielder of a decent age who has shown he has the necessary class and fitness for a season.

    We have to address the midfield this season. It is boring and simplistic but true.
  4. May 6, 2012
    #44

    kouroux Full Member

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    Then you're right Sarni
  5. May 6, 2012
    #45

    Sarni nice guy, unassuming, objective United fan.

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    £50m should've been enough last Summer - to spend £18m of it on someone like Ashley Young was our own fault.
  6. May 6, 2012
    #46

    redhoop Full Member

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    I just don't see it. Amongst the players, I see failings for sure but how can you cite complacency? Making dumb-ass mistakes can come from a whole load of different places: being played out of position, niggling injuries, refs ignoring fouls, stress, fear of failure, being too right-sided, thinking you're going to be hauled off any minute, trying to be Scholsey, trying to make a killer pass to get picked next game... all sorts of reasons.

    I agree with what you say about SAF. Much as I revere him and , indeed, think he has more than earned the odd off-season, some of his decisions this season have been baffling.

    Bottom line is that we can't win every single season and quite a few of our first choice team, not to mention squad, would not get into City's team. We've always used that as a barometer of our quality, looking at the rival's team and thinking - 'they'd never get picked by us'. That simply isn't the case at present. It will be again, one day but that doesn't make the current team complacent, just not quite good enough.
  7. May 6, 2012
    #47

    thegregster Harbinger of new information

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    They dont want a Liverpool on there hands either. Its not in their interest for a club to fall in value. Surely Fergie will tell them he needs a few quid. 60mil spent now could be a wise investment.
  8. May 6, 2012
    #48

    Liam147 On Probation

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    Well that's not true. As people have pointed out, we spent £50M. We needed a goalkeeper, who, barring anything unexpected, could be our goalkeeper for 15+ years. That's incredible 'value' straight away. Then there was Young. We suffered a lot in 10/11 in terms of width. We had Nani flying the flag on his own as Rooney misfired and Valencia was injured, that was good back up. We signed Jones, who again, barring anything unexpected could be our centre back (and possibly captain) for the next 15 years. These are positions we won't need re-bolstering for a while. Also, Jones was reportedly heading to Liverpool, so I think there was a bit of 'don't make your rivals stronger' on that one.

    If we then pay the £25M+ on Sneijder we'd be spending ~£80M. That's silly money considering our situation. We won't spend as much as last season, not that we need to. One central midfielder, possibly Martinez, and we could have our business done for ~£30M-£35M.
  9. May 6, 2012
    #49

    GaryLifo Nice Bloke

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    the only thing that bothers me about all this we are shite type talk from some is that City have 86 points and we have... oh yes 86 points. If they have had such a great season and we have not, how the feck are we level on points with them. You can't have it both ways.

    As with when we lost out to Chelsea in 2010 it is basically down to losing the big games between the two of us. A draw in either of the derby games and we'd be top and looking at winning the league away to Sunderland.
  10. May 6, 2012
    #50

    Sarni nice guy, unassuming, objective United fan.

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    From their point of view this season hasn't been all that bad. Had we progressed further in CL it'd have been perfect but even without it we've only probably lost around £10m as we still got the matchday revenue against Athletic and Ajax in CL.
  11. May 6, 2012
    #51

    Livvie Executive Manager being kept sane only by her madn

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    Someone said that half of Caf members were thick.
    If we don't tackle the problems by buying, then we need to stop rotating. Injuries allowing, we should play our best eleven week in, week out, giving others a chance one or two at a time.

    There have been some great team performances from 'lesser teams' who make up for their lack of world class players by moulding what they have got into a strong unit.
  12. May 6, 2012
    #52

    kouroux Full Member

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    I explained myself later.The money spent wasn't the issue, spending it wisely and more pressing need was the problem.Sorry if I didn't explain well myself initially
  13. May 6, 2012
    #53

    rcoobc Not as crap as eferyone thinks

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    This is true, but we know he is quality. Same could be said for Cleverley.

    We have a fantastic squad of players 23 and under.
  14. May 6, 2012
    #54

    roseguy64 Full Member

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    You can't play your best XI week by week. Not sure where you've got the idea from that that is somehow possible. Every club rotates.
  15. May 6, 2012
    #55

    Sparky_Hughes Donkey Buggering Tyrant who cheats at Monopoly

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    What we need is a cm or two, and an assistant manager with the balls to say, ummmm boss, are you sure thats such a good idea?

    Saf is the best ever but sometimes even the best need someone to say you might want to think about that again boss.
  16. May 6, 2012
    #56

    togg Full Member

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    it was the everton game that did us. With 8 minutes to go, 4-2 up Ferguson must have thought...that's pretty much it. He has talked about that ridiculous 8 minutes quite a few times. He knows, the team knows that it was that match that fecked us. If you are in contention in these last six weeks, this is where it is won....and we royaly messed up.

    Having said that, in all honesty City deserve this title if the team that plays the best football over a season is meant and should win it. I'm glad its over to be honest (notwithstanding a major miracle next weekend!!) because at least the real picture of the threat of city is now bloody obvious. We can't compete with city in the transfer market....no way...but I'm not sure whether all the city team will be back next season. Yes they have done it probably, but does it really really feel like a spirited win, or a win created by people who have no real interest in creating a history for a club, more making money in spite of a club.
  17. May 6, 2012
    #57

    Will Absolute Full Member

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    You can't really fault our league performance this season - we could finish on 89 points! It's just that City have done marginally better. We have been terrible in Europe though.

    As another poster said, we spent enough last summer on players we didn't really need - Young and Jones - to fund the purchase of a world class midfielder. I've always been convinced that transfer fees are not our problem. But if City offer a player like Nasri £160k a week we won't compete with that. To do so would devastate our profit margins, and lower the market value of the club. Which is directly contrary to the Glazers business strategy.
  18. May 6, 2012
    #58

    thegregster Harbinger of new information

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    To be honest if we could add three players of reasonable good quality we should still be major contenders. I dont think we will get the likes of hazard, Javi Martínez etc but their are plenty of other players who should cost less that couldnt but improve our squad. Its not as if Barry,De jong,Milner are really world class players yet they give city good options.

    Hopeful our Cm next season will be Carrick,Fletcher,Cleverley,two new players. Scholes and giggs to be still making an impact. I think Anderson time is up.
  19. May 6, 2012
    #59

    togg Full Member

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    just a thought, considering the title of the thread "lets look on the bright side" and also taking into account the major miracle it would be. But I reckon Mark Hughes has a few things in his mind. He's a united legend, still respected and no way doesn't he have united blood in his vains (I bet he dreams of managing united). Also the way City treated him during his time at city would make anyone pine for revenge. I don't know...but they won today....and I reckon he is going to have them so pysched up it isn't true...


    hey....you never know.....
  20. May 6, 2012
    #60

    thegregster Harbinger of new information

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    You never know alright. Its a long shot to say the least. We better beat Sunderland. if we didnt and City fecked up I couldnt take it.
  21. May 6, 2012
    #61

    Inigo Montoya Full Member

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    That is the key for me.Sunderland will be up for it;final game at home.

    But looking on the bright side.We start next season as underdogs as we did a few years back when the rentboys won 2 on the bounce and we looked worse...anyone care to mention Kleberson and Djembax2;). A couple of world class signings would be a decent start
  22. May 6, 2012
    #62

    charlenefan Far less insightful than the other Charley

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    De Gea's done very well from January onwards, probably fair to say that the jury is still out though. He needs to start next season the way he's finished this one. It's foolish to expect him to be faultless but certainly confidence wise we need to see him raring to go from the first whistle next season and then he can really establish himself.

    Evans is another that's done well but I still think had Vidic been in the side some of the goals against just wouldn't of happened with him in the team.

    Welbeck out of the 3 is the one I feel has the most to take out of this season, pretty much established himself as first choice partner for Rooney and at his best some of his link play has been very impressive. Very much looking forward to seeing him next season.
  23. May 6, 2012
    #63

    Livvie Executive Manager being kept sane only by her madn

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    Someone said that half of Caf members were thick.
    If you want to build a strong team, and you haven't got a huge wealth of world-class players, you rotate minimally. Players who play together regularly will read each other far better than those who don't. How can a team gel if it's constantly changing?

    One or two changes at a time, introducing younger players who can learn from a strong, cohesive unit.
  24. May 6, 2012
    #64

    dileno Full Member

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    THIS.

    I've been playing with the thought - what's best - that we continue to win titles without getting financial backup - or loose out on a title for them Glazers to realize that we need more money to compete with the big players.

    It's ridiculous we had to get Scholesy back on the pitch to be able to compete since January. He's obviously class but certainly a short term solution to a problem that's been there since Ronaldo's departure.

    There's still the possibility left that we win The Premiership after all and we'd be glad to do that - however the manner in which it was done has to be considered. Then again, we've had a ridiculous amount of injuries this season too. Maybe we don't pay physios so much and loose out on the best ones?
  25. May 6, 2012
    #65

    brewlio Alpha

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    There are players every bit as good as Messi and Ronaldo out there. The key is scouting and getting them whilst they still cost next to nothing. We've won the league before without any $ in the transfer kitty and I daresay we will again. Only for a sting of injuries in December and a couple of average to poor performances of late, we'd all be saying what a great season it's been. The lack of financial resources is worrying but realistically we're still as good as anyone with the squad we've got when we're on song. Disappointing the league has gone, but when you put things in perspective this season hasn't been a total failure, and not one based on the lack of money to spend.
  26. May 6, 2012
    #66

    Carl has permanently erect nipples

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    The league has been fecking shit. The quality has fallen dramatically in the last few years IMO.
  27. May 6, 2012
    #67

    Inigo Montoya Full Member

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    While I agree to a point.SAFs comments about City laying down the markers for transfers makes it 100% certain that we can't compete against them or Chelsea.We're going to have to be more astute
  28. May 6, 2012
    #68

    Cina Wants to get forked

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    Yeah, Fergie has always rotated a lot in recent years but some of his rotations this year have been baffling, to be honest, especially in Europe.

    We don't have the money to compete with City and Chelsea, but we haven't really maximised the money we have either. 7.5m for Bebe? 18m for Young (a good player, but quite frankly, we didn't really need him, especially not for that price and wages, with a year left on his contract). 2 signings that made no sense.
  29. May 6, 2012
    #69

    Inigo Montoya Full Member

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    Almost.It's gone from a 2 tier league to 4.It's never been a level playing field but it's never been a situation where the quality has been so concentrated among 4/5 clubs
  30. May 6, 2012
    #70

    Will Absolute Full Member

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    Well, I agree that the quality of our play has often been poor, but by performance I really meant the bottom line - results or points total. We'd normally win the league comfortably with 89 points.
  31. May 6, 2012
    #71

    Crustanoid Full Member

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    Unfortunately, for all the suggestions that this might spur the Glazers into giving us the cash we need to be able to compete, I wouldn't hold out hope
  32. May 6, 2012
    #72

    Cina Wants to get forked

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    I think he meant the league in general.

    If so I agree, the PL is far weaker than it was. We had a far better squad in 07/08 and finished with less points than we currently have. I don't think our points total this season can be taken too seriously.
  33. May 6, 2012
    #73

    BD94 A boob

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    Another positive, well for me anyway, was Berbatov. Back when it was announced he would be sold, I was sad as I thought he could really do well next season, and we'd find it hard to find a better 4th choice ST who is willing to sit on the bench most of the year. However, when he came on, he reminded me of how frustrating he can be, and tbh, I won't miss him as much. He will need replacing obviously, but I think if we get Kagawa, we won't see a ST come in.
  34. May 6, 2012
    #74

    Cina Wants to get forked

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    So it's a positive for you to see a really talented player stuck to the bench and now leave the club after being so loyal for the last few years?

    Of course.
  35. May 6, 2012
    #75

    manusteve Full Member

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    Do you think SAF is going to say that reinforcements are required in centre midfield?
    Today was terrible to watch - Swansea simply strolling through the midfield. Fortunately they weren't effective near goal.
    We really need some mobility and tenacity in there, both of which I think are missing. Scholes, brilliant though he has been this season, is showing his age, and I won't question Carrick because I don't think we have any alternative.
    I really have doubts that the likes of Anderson and Cleverley can control a midfield against good opposition.
  36. May 6, 2012
    #76

    BD94 A boob

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    Really talented, yes, but not really suited for us, and it has shown over the years. As I said, I was unhappy to hear he was leaving, but today jusy reminded me of how he just doesn't fit in. I'd be happier if we sold him, and replaced him, than if he was to sit on the bench for all of next year, and eventually play poorly when he does get on. I know he probably wasn't bothered today, and you can't really blame him, but I will be happy to see him move on, yes.
  37. May 6, 2012
    #77

    Cina Wants to get forked

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    SAF isn't the type of manager who will point out weaknesses in our squad. It's demeaning to the players in that position and he knows it. But I'm confident that he himself knows our midfield is very weak and that when he talks about signings 2 or 3 players, that's the main position he's on about.

    Of course, I though the exact same last year and he went and spent £35m on 2 players we didn't really need and left the midfield as it was. So feck knows.

    It's easy to forget how good Berbatov was last year when Rooney was out. He most definitely didn't look out of place. Personally I think it's SAF's fault for having him in the position he's in now. if I was him I wouldn't be 'bothered' either.
  38. May 6, 2012
    #78

    manusteve Full Member

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    I was asking if SAF was going to point out to the owners the weakness of centre midfield to secure funding, not whether SAF would say in public that we are weak there.
    Seems to me he might have said something in the summer, although we have no way of knowing his thoughts.
  39. May 6, 2012
    #79

    Cina Wants to get forked

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    I doubt the owners have a fecking clue to be honest :)
  40. May 6, 2012
    #80

    manusteve Full Member

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    Probably, but I remain disappointed with the lack of substance in central midfield.
    I know Cleverley and Anderson have been injured for significant periods this season, and surely there would have been doubts about Fletcher?
    And yet we did not invest in that area?

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