Manchester United appearance stats 2016/17 | Darmian, Rashford & Jones with <50% win rate as starter

Discussion in 'Manchester United Forum' started by Damien, Jan 23, 2017.

  1. Jan 23, 2017
    #1

    Damien Self-Aware RedCafe Database (and Admin)

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    Just posted a few infographics on twitter for anyone interested.

    Tweet links:
    Consecutive starts
    Consecutive appearances
    Martial's minutes
    Rojo's minutes
    Pogba's minutes
    Most minutes played

    Images in spoilers:

    [​IMG]
    Top 5
    1. Pogba (13)
    2. Zlatan (11)
    3. Herrera (10)
    4. De Gea (9)
    5. Smalling (9)
    [​IMG]
    Top 8
    1. Pogba (13)
    2. Rojo, Zlatan (11)
    3. Herrera (10)
    4. De Gea, Mata, Rashford, Smalling (9)
    [​IMG]
    Top 5
    1. Pogba (2535)
    2. De Gea (2520)
    3. Zlatan (2462)
    4. Herrera (2179)
    5. Valencia (2042)
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Stuff to take away:
    • Three players with more consecutive starts than De Gea (9): Pogba (13), Zlatan (11), Herrera (10)
    • Four players with fewer consecutive starts than Martial (3): Fosu-Mensah (1), Romero (1), Young (1) and Schweinsteiger (0)
    • Rojo (11) is second only to Pogba (13) in consecutive appearances. He's become an important part of the team.
    • Smalling was important at the start of the season with 9 consecutive appearances but since his injury and Rojones' good form he's largely been consigned to the bench.
    • Pogba's the only player with more minutes played than De Gea.
    • An XI featuring players with most minutes would look like this: De Gea; Valencia, Jones, Rojo, Blind; Pogba, Herrera; Mata, Rooney, Rashford; Zlatan
    • Unsurprisingly players with most minutes are Pogba, De Gea, Zlatan, Herrera and Valencia.
    Hope you enjoy.
  2. Jan 23, 2017
    #2

    Samid follows Pogue around, fixing his images

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    I really feel Pogba's minutes need to be monitored. Yes he is young and is physically a beast but there really is no need to let him play 90 minutes in nearly every game. Rest him once in a while (especially in the cup games), take him off if the lead is comfortable etc. That will keep him fresh, body will take less toil and also reduce the chance of injuries caused by fatigue.
  3. Jan 23, 2017
    #3

    nokillingmoths Full Member

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    I agree, but its rare we are comfortable!

    Wigan and hull should be two rest games really.
  4. Jan 23, 2017
    #4

    Damien Self-Aware RedCafe Database (and Admin)

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    His fitness record is amazing. 4284' in 2015/16, had a hamstring injury in 2014/15 which kept him out for around 10 games but still had 3340' and in 2013/14 he played 4192'.

    Think he should get a rest in our next league cup and fa cup game as we should be able to progress without him, but think he'll be fine for the rest of the season. Agreed about resting him now and again if we do have a comfortable lead but like nokillingmoths says that is a rarity.
  5. Jan 23, 2017
    #5

    Samid follows Pogue around, fixing his images

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    True, but there have been a couple where he could've been taken off. Leicester and Feyenoord. Didn't have to start at that horrible Zorya pitch either.

    The other concern is we might become over-reliant on him. I know it worked out fine vs Reading but in case he picks up an injury/suspension we should be proactive and have a tried and tested formula ready instead of being reactive.

    Ideally he sits out both the next two but I can see him getting 30 min vs Hull and 90 min vs Wigan.
  6. Jan 23, 2017
    #6

    Damien Self-Aware RedCafe Database (and Admin)

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    Fair point, though I think he started against Zorya because our European away record has been poor and we needed the win. We were 9 points behind fourth at the time too so couldn't afford to be knocked out for failing to win against Zorya. He ended up setting up one of the goals anyway.
  7. Jan 23, 2017
    #7

    ivaldo Mediocre Horse Whisperer, s'up wid chew?

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    Pogba is a physical monster, he doesn't really need resting. Mourinho quite rightly played him into form when the calls to rest him came from the fans earlier in the season.
  8. Jan 24, 2017
    #8

    RamblingRebel Hitler dead!

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    Jones being in there is a big surprise to me. Seems as though he only back from injury a couple weeks ago.
  9. Jan 24, 2017
    #9

    daveoliver91 New Member

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    Probably Pogba will get a rest in the following games, probably against Wigan.

    We need him for the ticket to Wembley and to face Hull again on the PL.
  10. Feb 25, 2017
    #10

    Damien Self-Aware RedCafe Database (and Admin)

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    Appearances now:

    [​IMG]

    Quite amazing Mata has finished 90 minutes just twice.
  11. Feb 25, 2017
    #11

    Raw Full Member

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    Zlatan is just incredible.
  12. Feb 25, 2017
    #12

    lsd New Member

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    Not being funny but I'm actually shocked he has completed 90 mins ..I don't think it is a dig on him but more a sign of Jose liking to close games out by replacing his least defensive players
  13. Feb 25, 2017
    #13

    Revan Full Member

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    Martial playing just 40% of minutes is a bit worrying. Still think that he is one of our top players.
  14. Feb 25, 2017
    #14

    sammsky1 Full Member

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    That and also playing less than Rashford makes no sense.
  15. Feb 25, 2017
    #15

    ROFLUTION Full Member

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    Arousing excel-sheet :drool: Also says a lot on how much Jose is trying to create competition between players into the team. Only few who are regular starters.
  16. Feb 26, 2017
    #16

    JinnerJamie Small ginger

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    Mata and Rashford involved in every squad since the start of the season... :eek:
  17. Feb 26, 2017
    #17

    Devil81 Full Member

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    Not surprised Mata has finished 90 minutes twice myself, get's replaced every match. I thought Lingard would have more minutes in fairness.
  18. Mar 20, 2017
    #18

    Damien Self-Aware RedCafe Database (and Admin)

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    [​IMG]
  19. Mar 20, 2017
    #19

    harms Full Member

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    @Damien but Schweiny scored and assisted, he can't be on 0+0
  20. Mar 20, 2017
    #20

    Damien Self-Aware RedCafe Database (and Admin)

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    True, will update that later. Thanks. Think the stats hadn't updated for that game at the time and forgot to sort it out.
  21. Mar 20, 2017
    #21

    TMDaines Full Member

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    Can you do win percentage as starter?
  22. Mar 22, 2017
    #22

    Damien Self-Aware RedCafe Database (and Admin)

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    [​IMG]
  23. Mar 22, 2017
    #23

    AR87 Full Member

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    I don't know how relevant win% as starter really is. There are too many variables at play with that. In Rashford's case you could argue that most of his starts coming out wide put him in a position where he's not close to as effective as when he's played through the middle which leads to us putting in more ineffective performances as a team than when say Martial is in that position, which is his best.

    Rooney having such a high win% as a starter is another example of why I think the stat is of very limited value. I think most would agree he limits us on the pitch more than he helps us when he starts.
  24. Mar 22, 2017
    #24

    InLevyITrust New Member

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    I'd agree with you on that, tbh any stats like these i see little to no relivamce in at all unless it's done over a long period of time. Main reason is it takes no regard for the opposition each player is being played against with is possibly the most important one when it comes to winning a match.

    It's also what rag tops use as click bait.
  25. Mar 23, 2017
    #25

    Padawan New Member

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    The advantage of using stats to measure performance compared to mere opinion is that stats are free of subjective bias.

    Rooney's high percentage win as starter happens to coincide with his goal + assist contribution as well, which is only in the last 2 games has been surpassed by Mata as the second highest after Zlatan. Rooney contributed 15 goals and assists in 19 starts, while Mata contributed 16 in eleven more starts.

    Some have argued about the quality of his assists, as if the assists of other players were all of high quality, whatever that means, but the same performance yardstick applied to all is arguably better than just subjective opinions.

    He has missed many of our games this season, due to squad rotation and injuries, though some have questioned the many "injuries" that he had as a possible cover up for his fallen out of favor with Jose. I too had the first impression of that when he sat and stayed on the bench in the EFL Cup final.

    It could be true that Jose no longer rate him, but for our Club's sake, I hope that is not the case, as stats will show to those who bother to check (espnfc, squawka), that he has been one of our best players in the past seasons to date, and stats don't lie.

    We compete in many competitions, there is no guarantee that Zlatan will stay or Griezman will come, and no other top teams have had to rely on 19 and 21 year olds plus just decent players such as Fellaini and Lingard like us. We still need him, at least until two or three more quality forwards come to us, which I also hope to be sooner than later.
  26. Mar 23, 2017
    #26

    UnrelatedPsuedo I pity the poor fool who stinks like I do!

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    Fans : Why does Mata get subbed so much.
    Reality : Always fit

    He's been hugely underrated this year as everyone has wanted to see more of Miki (rightly) and Martial (wrongly,possibly). Lot to be said for an attacking player that's always fit.
  27. Mar 23, 2017
    #27

    finneh Full Member

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    Look at our win / draw / loss % when he starts - It's the best of anyone with 1000+ minutes.

    Not a coincidence in my view.
  28. Mar 23, 2017
    #28

    anant Full Member

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    If there is a competition wise breakdown, I think Mata's win% may well be the highest. Only Romero and Rooney have more, but they've started in Cup games more often than Juan
  29. Mar 23, 2017
    #29

    Pogue Mahone Poster of the year 2008

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    I'm sure they are. And not just his minutes. The club will have access to all sorts of metrics to monitor the physiological state of every player.

    Re the OP. No great surprises there but the drop-off in minutes/appearances after the top 5 proves that the idea we haven't been rotating is a myth.
  30. Mar 23, 2017
    #30

    Gopher Brown Full Member

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    Van Gaal used to sub him around 70min too. I expect it is more of a 'sports science' thing which indicates he's more likely to get injured in the last 20 min.
  31. Mar 23, 2017
    #31

    Salman Bin Ahmed Banned

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    Unbelivably this website ( TransfermarkT.com) claims United are 8th most valuable team, behind, Man City, Arsenal and Chelsea. Well, this just shows this site has no clue what its talking about.
  32. Mar 23, 2017
    #32

    dichinero Full Member

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    Juan is our secret weapon!!!
  33. Mar 23, 2017
    #33

    Leftback99 Full Member

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    Darmian appearing to have the biggest negative impact on results is no surprise. Rashford has also been pretty poor on the left. It would be interesting to see the win % with the combination of the two.
  34. Mar 23, 2017
    #34

    Sir Roi de Muppeterre New Member

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    Those numbers reiterate how vital Ander Herrera has been this season. He doesn't have as many minutes as Pogba but he may have ran more than Pogba. Whats fascinating is apparently he has more assist than Pogba in addition to his defensive contribution which Pogba doesn't come anywhere close to.

    I am not one of those who dislike Pogba. He is great. But this season he hasn't been our best midfielder.