Martial's United career so far?

Discussion in 'Manchester United Forum' started by Amar__, Apr 10, 2019.

  1. Apr 15, 2019

    TRUERED89 New Member

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    I wouldn't mind this either..
    --Rashford----Martial-----Lukaku--,
    But! would you test it against Barca?
  2. Apr 15, 2019

    Keefy18 Full Member

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    Not sure what your issue here is?

    Martial scored 11 goals for us in the league in his debut season. He was 20, Austin was 25.

    We weren't exactly a great side ourselves and relied very heavily on his attacking ability, lord knows Rooney wasn't delivering. A kid in a new league, new country and he delivered as well as much as can be expected. He won the FIFA Young player of the year award that year as well on the back of his performances.

    He didn't piss and moan once that season under LVG either, the complaints began long into Jose's reign of terror. You know Jose who basically fell out with the entire club and was despised by even the feckin club receptionist and cleaning ladies. Martial had every right to be unhappy, he delivered for Jose time and time again in terms of goals and assists, got dropped and Jose went and bought Sanchez. Sanchez gets more than double what he does, does one tenth of what Martial gives and still Martial couldn't get a look in?

    Jose cut his playing time in half immediately in his first season here and he played less again the following year. He was slowly being phased out, how in the hell can folks ignore this and go as far as to laugh about it then and say its a ridiculous sentiment to suggest Jose didn't hurt his development?

    Can you feckin blame him for being annoyed and wanting out?

    At a very rough count, I count approx 122 starts so far for Martial at United and he's been involved in 77 goals (48 goals, 29 assists). He's involved in a goal about every 1.5 games largely playing from LW.

    I'm almost certain of this when I say it, but there isn't another player in our squad that has been involved in more goals in the post Fergie era than Martial.

    And folks want rid?
  3. Apr 15, 2019

    wolvored Full Member

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    Well we need to try something new as the old isn't cutting it
  4. Apr 15, 2019

    el3mel Full Member

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    The replay is in bold. Sorry, I can't dissect the post as I'm on phone.

    For the last paragraph, it's up to you really and your opinion but it's logical to have high standards and higher expectation from our supposedly better players. The expectation from Martial and Pogba are higher than say Lingard, so they are evaluated harsher.
  5. Apr 15, 2019

    TRUERED89 New Member

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    Yea I'd like to see it. Keep the midfield the same as first leg, and see how it goes! Martial's work-rate (or lack off) wont be such a hindrance through the middle! Martial has shown in the past he is a good no.9!
  6. Apr 15, 2019

    wolvored Full Member

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    Agreed
  7. Apr 15, 2019

    Axle17 New Member

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    Love Martial. Think he has Henry like potential however he just doesn't apply himself the way he could. His dribbles are repetitive acts of nothingness, the act of insanity - To do the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

    If I were Ole, my practises would be brutally focused on Martials runs until he gets it right .i.e have Martial practise his dribbles against our defense 1 on 3 over and over again until it starts to work. Failing that maybe work on his passing precision around the box
  8. Apr 15, 2019

    Josep Dowling Full Member

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    I see a player who when he can be arsed is unstoppable.

    However too many times he comes across as lazy, especially with his passing. His last few games have been evident of that.

    He also gets a helluva lot more slack on here than the entire squad put together.
  9. Apr 15, 2019

    haram Full Member

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    Grasp what? Im talking about him as a player. People were acting like Martial was some sort of nailed on first eleven player who would be so much better under another manager. It’s clearly bollocks.
  10. Apr 15, 2019

    cyril C Full Member

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    Martial and Rashford did a routine of 60/30 min rotation last season until Sanchez came onboard. I thought they were OK on this rotation, keeping fresh and both were contributing whether as starter or sub. Until the Sanchez story....
  11. Apr 15, 2019

    Cliche Guevara Full Member

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    This is far from true. He went eight games without scoring until January, and sixteen games after into the new season.

    He absolutely should have given Mourinho what he wanted and been the first name on the team sheet.

    Getting £10s of thousands per week to pull on a United shirt and reckons he can ignore his manager whilst posting those stats?

    Even now he hasn’t changed a bit and people are falling over themselves to make excuses for repeated nothing performances.

    Ironically in the first half of the season he started doing it for Jose. Since Ole he doesn’t look arsed again.
  12. Apr 15, 2019

    Kostov Full Member

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    He is for a team consisting shit players like Lingard and Mata. Name me a better winger in the team right now?
  13. Apr 15, 2019

    haram Full Member

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    We dont have any wingers. The fact is Martial isn’t as good as people think he is and Jose wasn’t stopping him from performing better. If anything, he played better under Jose. This doesn’t mean he should have been starting every game either. Even now people are scrambling saying he should play up front when he isn’t even better than Rashford and Lukaku.
  14. Apr 15, 2019

    Kostov Full Member

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    When I mentioned those months i meant this season, not the last one. And you can count games in which he didn't score last season as much as you want, fact is he was our best attacker until Mourinho decided to move him around and bench him.

    Those stats would have been a good argument if the players playing instead of him were actually better or close to what he can offer, the truth is Alexis was horrible yet continued to play. If that is not a problem for you than favoritism does not bother you as much as me and leave it at that.

    He's not been up to the required level recently but your agenda defending Mourinho in this shit shower makes me think that this argument is not worth it.
  15. Apr 15, 2019

    Reddy Rederson Full Member

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    Perhaps you could try reading then? I’ve made painfully clear to the guy. If martial is only worth anything when surrounded by world class then he’s not worth anything is he?
  16. Apr 15, 2019

    Kostov Full Member

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    Martial might be overrated by some sets of our fans as every other player, and maybe even more for players who are fan favorites. Jose disrupted his development and a period in which he was our best attacker, a period in which he won couple of PoTM awards. He played better under Jose simply because you are comparing a period of 2 and half years compared to 4 months in which he had couple of injuries. Martial will show his worth under Ole don't worry.

    No player should be starting games based on merit or his name. No he shouldn't have been starting every game, but he should have started more under Mourinho, instead of him persisting with Alexis. Not because he is that good, simply because we don't have anyone better. You seem to forget that part. I'm sure you defended this decision from Mourinho even though it was baffling the way he handled the whole Alexis introduction.

    I also don't think he is a striker, he is a LW.
  17. Apr 15, 2019

    haram Full Member

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    You are free to have your opinion. If he is a LW, he’s not a good one.
  18. Apr 15, 2019

    Keefy18 Full Member

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    Tell that to Messi. He can't win a world cup with Argentina! Best he managed so far was a single final spot. Performed in the group stages for them and vanished in every single KO stage game.

    So, if the worlds best player...arguably ever... can't drag a bunch of average to good players to trophies...What hope has a kid like Martial?

    Like I say, our fan base is fickle and has unrealistic expectations.

    He's a good player, very good on his day. Working with the like of Lingard, Herrera, Mata doesn't exactly help him either.
  19. Apr 15, 2019

    yamo123x Full Member

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    I'm a fan of his, but the reality is that his last few performances have been so poor, i seriously question his mentality and desire.

    There is talent there but if he cannot add consistency to his game or indeed the right attitude i would be tempted to sell to the highest bidder in the summer.
  20. Apr 15, 2019

    haram Full Member

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    It’s hilarious that people think Martial is so much better than the players he is on the pitch with :lol:
  21. Apr 15, 2019

    Kostov Full Member

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    He's a very good LW, I wonder why you are not so scrutinizing when accessing other positions in the team.

    He's got a goal every 177 minutes in the PL this season. A season in which we changed managers and played some horrific shit.

    Sadio Mane maybe one of the best LWs in the league has a goal every 171 minutes. Now stats is not everything, but branding him as not very good at what he does, is pure bullshit.
  22. Apr 15, 2019

    Infra-red Full Member

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    Bags of talent but no application. We have seen many players of his ilk come and go over the years, both here and elsewhere. I don't think he has the mentality to make it to the top.
  23. Apr 15, 2019

    haram Full Member

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    I think he is a forward. In terms of being a LW as a whole, I think he lacks a lot. That’s why regardless of manager he will have problems in that position. That’s why I never felt like he should own that LW position. He simply isn’t a LW.
  24. Apr 15, 2019

    Keefy18 Full Member

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    It's even funnier folks are too lazy or ignorant to bother researching for themselves, instead they take the word of idiot pundits or rag tabloids as gospel.

    https://tribuna.com/en/manutd/news/3083261/

    PS, Note the date of the article, This is at a time when he was at his worst under Jose, which many here have said.

    Further proof

  25. Apr 15, 2019

    Cliche Guevara Full Member

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    Well if you interpret this as an ‘agenda defending Mourhino’ you don’t seem receptive to reasonable discussion.

    This is supposed to be about how good Martial is meant to be, not how shite anyone else is.
  26. Apr 15, 2019

    Art Vandelay Full Member

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    Why do people keep bringing this up? This is a thread about Martial, why would other players be scrutinized in here? There's plenty of other places on the forum where people are saying Lukaku, Lingard, Rashford, etc. should be sold, but this one is specifically about Martial and no one is even saying he should be the first to go just that he should be on the list with others instead of given some sort of free pass like he's above the shit we've served up. He's a part of it.
  27. Apr 15, 2019

    haram Full Member

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    Oh yeah this proves Martial is soo great and above the players he plays with oh wow how dare they hold him back.
  28. Apr 15, 2019

    Keefy18 Full Member

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    Well he's performing better than them, the proof is in the numbers.

    Have you anything that actually proves otherwise or just silly childish replies as a best defence that Martial is failing and holding others back?
  29. Apr 15, 2019

    haram Full Member

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    So when he plays well its because he is better than everyone, and when he plays poorly it’s because the other players are holding him back? :lol:
  30. Apr 15, 2019

    Keefy18 Full Member

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    Answer my question, show me where he is failing? You are changing the subject to avoid answering a question you know I am right about.

    He plays well cause he is a good player. Others simply don't deliver as consistently as he does... Mata? Lingard? Herrera? Hell even Lukaku's numbers aren't as consistent as his and he's our CF and played nearly double the time Martial did under Jose.

    So, again... Who is out performing him? How is Martial holding anyone back by apparently under performing?
  31. Apr 15, 2019

    Reddy Rederson Full Member

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    But no one is saying messi sucks. Why is that? Could it be because he puts in the effort? No one needs to be surrounded by world class to show what level they are. Youre using others lack of ability to excuse what? His lack of running? His lack of tracking back? His utter lack of doing anything when he doesnt have the ball. What does anyone else have to do with his movement off the ball? Unless one of those that you mentioned have been tying his shoelaces together, they have nothing to do with. McT was in the same shit side and managed to show everyone that he can be good servant for us. He managed to do that in a month. Martial has had how many years? Yet still theres nothing but excuses for his performances.

    By the way, this isnt about winning trophies, or even games. Its about performances. "messe" lingard would look good surrounded by world class. Should we be building a team around him as well?
  32. Apr 15, 2019

    golden_blunder Site admin. Manchester United fan Staff

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    Last night I dreamt we swapped him for dybala
  33. Apr 15, 2019

    haram Full Member

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    By actually watching him play. His movement and work rate is poor, it has been apparent got a while now. Who’s fault is it that he lacks in these areas?

    Herrera won player of the year. Lingard was scoring regularly when playing at number 10. Martial is not being held back by other players. He is held back by his own deficiencies. Lingard and Herrera also have their deficiencies. I dont sit here and claim that they should be playing every week.

    First it was the manager holding him back. Now it’s the other players :lol:. Give me a fecking break.
  34. Apr 15, 2019

    Reddy Rederson Full Member

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    I bet that was one hell of clean up job in the morning :lol:.
  35. Apr 15, 2019

    Keefy18 Full Member

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    Well of course no one says that cause he's feckin Messi! So unless Martial hits Messi numbers he'll suck is that how it goes? :houllier::lol:

    I've said repeatedly, over and over on here that Martial's fault if he has any is his lack of movement. Looking past that and still looking at his performance data since he's joined us, he still delivers a very high level of returns. Some of the best in the league, he has often provided us with better returns than some of the leagues best attackers.

    What I am saying is he isn't an issue, Lingard and Mata are far, far, far bigger issues in our team than Martial. We've an army of supporters more concerned about Martial than Lingard, why? Routinely Martial has provided at a high level for us, has Lingard at any point? The lad has been involved in a single goal since Dec.... ONE! Mata likewise, a single goal vs Reading!

    All 3 players have approx the same amount of starts under Ole but Martial is out performing them both but lets get on Martial's case yeah?

  36. Apr 15, 2019

    AgentP Full Member

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    :drool:
  37. Apr 15, 2019

    Reddy Rederson Full Member

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    So when I said its not about winning trophies or even games, you chose to ignore that and completely distort what I was saying? I never said martial had to be messi. It would be a start though, if he showed the same level of effort as scott mctominay. Quit moving the goal posts, brobeans. Not a single person has said he should be first out the door. Not one. So why youre bringing up mata or lingard as being worse, I dont know.
    Last edited: Apr 15, 2019
  38. Apr 15, 2019

    Art Vandelay Full Member

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    But you're arguing a point that no one is making. No one is saying other players have been good enough, people are saying Martial hasn't been good enough either. There's no army of people saying we should keep them and get rid of him. There's just some people pointing out he's part of the problem and should be getting beat with the same stick instead of people constantly making excuses for him.
  39. Apr 15, 2019

    Keefy18 Full Member

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    Funny and cute, Martial won FIFA world Young player of the year.

    Lingard has had literally a singular good month in 2017-18 season, think it was around Nov / Dec and he scored in a few games back to back.

    • Lingard has played for us 164 time and scored 29 and set up 18 goals. Total of 47 goals involved
    • Martial has played 170 games scoring 48 and setting up 29. Total 77 goals involved.
    Martial has provided double what Lingard has, he's 3 years younger... Lingard is a senior player now. Why is there such an intense focus on Martial, but not Lingard? Still have folks giving it loads about Lingard being a kid and he'll develop! He's closer to retirement at this point ffs and delivers nothing.
  40. Apr 15, 2019

    coolredwine lameredboots

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    Pretty sure it's due to the wages they earn. For the wages Martial earns, he needs to be more consistent than Lingard, especially at bigger stages. for what its worth, I am not questioning his numbers. In terms of pure numbers, Martial has been fine for his age. But now is the time he needs to step up, improve his workrate and consistency instead of drifting in and out of matches.