Discussion in 'Entertainment Forum' started by Kaos, Dec 12, 2010.
hadn't seen it thanks for pointing it out
I don't think so. Games aren't the same as TV. You can enter a game thread to ask questions and what not before even playing it. With TV shows you don't discuss stuff much at all if you haven't seen it. So with TV shows I don't enter the threads til I'm caught up but game threads I open up straight away because I know everything plot related will be spoiled. There aren't that many games that have these kind of plot related spoilers like ME so I don't see any problems sticking with that ethics.
Finished it yesterday. Fantastic series, fantastic game. Had me hooked throughout.
But my word do they know how to make a shit ending. It's just so terrible...its been 24 hours and my mind still can't comprehend how fecking retarded that was. Probably 100 hours of pure awesomeness and the lot is damn near ruined in 10 minutes.
Just finished the game. Really enjoyed it... though I did think Mass Effect 2 was a better game for some reason that I can't yet put my finger on. Also, Banshee's are fecking annoying bastards.
Anyway, this ending then... what gets me is that, considering large parts of Mass Effect 2 consist of nonsencial inconsistances, why is anyone suprised that the ending of Mass Effecr 3 should be the same. I didn't hate it, I didn't love it... it is what it is. I suppose its vaugley interesting, but I don't see myself thinking about it for more then 5 minutes.
I read an article attributed to one of the writers on the ME series who said that the writing on the final scenes were the only ones in the franchise that were not peer reviewed by the whole writing staff, that it came down to one guy wanting a particular ending.
Most people say it is only the very end they didn't like but I thought it began going downhill as soon as you arrive London.
Did people really like the dialogue concerning Shephard? I didn't at all. It was all the same. And only ever the two options. Very monotone every time he was alone speaking with someone.
It didn't bother me. I don't recall ever picking the middle options in the other games. It was basically just for neutral opinions. Top was paragon, bottom was renegade.
I didn't notice anything discernably worse from when it got to London... I would say that the conversation with your squad mates/friends was fine on the whole. Would have been pretty cool had some of your squad mates bought it during the battles... could have led to some nice emotional scenes, as well as get across just how much of a shitstorm they're in.
The ending was a bit of a cop-out and nonsensical... but like I say, the storyline has constantly been illogical and made no sense... right from the beginning of ME2, so why people are getting so OTT up in arms about it I do not know.
If they personally wanted to go with it, then fair enough, it's their game... if it were me i'd have gone with
Renegade - Shepard shoots Illuisive Man in the back, and then destroys all Repears and their technology, meaning the Relays and the Citadel are also destroyed, and millions of people are cut off from civilisation (and will probably die in the process), but the Repears are dead and no longer a threat to earth. Shepard manages to transport himself to earth before the Citadel explodes, but is wounded so heavily he dies making one last call to a character of the players choosing.
Paragon - Shepard talks Illusive Man down, convinces him he's wrong and that he's indeed indoctrinated. Illusive man stands aside and allows Shepard to transport the Repears to deep space (shutting them down in the process). Civilisation continues as it is and millions of lives are saved.... but one day, someone somewhere may find a way to reactivate them. Whilst he's doing programming above change, Repears assume full control of the Illusive man, who shoots Shepard in the back. A mortally wounded Shepard shoots Illusive Man in the head, finishes the reprogramming and dies... never being able to warn anybody that the Reapers still exist.
RT/R2 Renegade - You agree with the Illusive Man and try to control the Repeaers yourself. Obviously it all goes tits up.
All this is explained through a standard Citadel VI, or even through one of those multi-legged things that type all day (Keepers arn't they called?)... no wierd god-children in sight.
Nah, we all know Sheperd is indoctrinated and it's alllll a dream sequence
To be fair, I don't actually either the indoctrination or "it's all a dream" stuff are terrible interpretation of events (not that I necceserily go along with them). There are enough "clues" and "evidence" to suggest that either of those (or both) are what Bioware were shooting for (not that they make a terrible amount of sense... though as I keep saying, the a lot of Mass Effect hasn't made any sense!). If it is the Indoctrination thing, and that's what BioWare were going for all this time... then that's pretty clever on their parts (though I seriously doubt thats what they've been aiming for all this time! Could be wrong though)?
Regardless, the ending as it is is not some horrible abomination that people are making it out to be... it is quite interesting and more to Bioware for trying to swing for the fence with the conclusion of their biggest game of the year.
No, I quite agree. Although I understand it's not the best ending the trilogy could of had, it's definitely not an abomination that the whole Mass Effect crowd are going on about! I've played plenty of games with worse endings, and to be honest a part of me feels that some people would never have been happy with the ending regardless of what happened.
About the topic of indoctrination, to be honest I kind of hope that's what Bioware were aiming for! Although it seems a bit too far fetched and the possibility it could be used as a 'scapegoat' for them now with the future DLC, if that's what they were trying too imply all along - fair play to them. But maybe they could of made it a little more obvious.
Yeah I agree with all that. Think people just like complaining about stuff! I think a big annoyance for people was the fact that there weren't the 16 endings to comply with their choices or whatever was promised, but only 3, which largely play out the same why... in that respect I can sort of sympathise but a) it would have been tricky to do anyway, since stopping the repears is the games main concern... and there's only a finite amount of ways you can do that, and it's not like the majority of choices you've made along the way can affect this large outcome anyway! Ultimately your big choices (Quarians/Geth, Genophage) would only really impact 20/30 years (or longer) from then... and b) 3 choices when you want 16 fits nicely with the indoctrination stuff!
And like you, I do hope that's where they were going... whether I believe they were or not is a different story!
Do you remember the dream sequences where the area is all oily and the children fade away into that oily texture, that was almost identical in style to when Illusive man is trying to controlling you during the end sequence. I'd say thats a good sign they planned it all along or left it open to your interpretation that that's what happened
Yeah, that's true. I did notice the 'oily' texture around the screen when you encounter the Illusive man at the end. I also believe the points about only Shepard surviving the Reaper blast and making it to the beam alone, then Anderson managing to reach the Illlusive Man before you when there is clearly only one entrance into the room is a bit of a dream type scenario. But yet again, it could just be bad writing!
Oh and some news here:
So it's free of charge at least, but it's just cinematic sequences and no gameplay!
Interesting... I think the indoctrination route is the one they will take. I've been thinking about it for most of the day (even went back and played it through again) and it definitely makes the most sense (and indeed, does make a lot of sense comparitively)
The biggest give aways for me are:
The fact that at the end, the Renegade option is highlighted in blue, and the Paragon option is highlighted in Red. Something that goes totally against what we've been conditioned to believe for 3 games in a row. It clearly tried to trick our minds into thinking what the best option was, despite all logic being against it.
The lack of fight Shepard shows when dealing with the Catalyst, compared to the amount he shows when dealing with everyone else.
The (obvious) fact that the Catalyst is the boy from Shep's nightmares and all the stuff that comes with it.
I swear Shepard's eyes look different... though that might just be me.
I'm still not 100% sure, but I do now think that that is what Bioware were going for (and if it's not, it's surely where they're going to head with it)... in which case I take everything back what I said and think that it's quite fecking brilliant.
Indoctrination ending doesn't make the ending any better in the slightest. Same kind of lazy ending. No one knows what that would feel like so it's all bull shit speculations. The fact is that the ending was poor. It was as much of a good ending as Romeo and Juliet is a love story. It's all a parody of M. Night Shyamalan.
Reasons I think indoctrination has some merit, off the top of my head
- Black oily stuff on edge of screen
- All the blatantly ridiculous stuff with the kid still being alive, nobody else noticing him etc. Too large to be an oversight imo
- Shepard having the indoctrinated eye pattern at the end
- The blue and red switch for the end options
- Shepard only being alive at the destroy end
- Shepard being on Earth at the end instead of the Citadel
- Most importantly, I really don't think they could have possibly effed up the game ending that badly. In my game Javik ran with me to the Citadel beam thing, then walked off the crashed Normandy. They just wouldn't have screwed up that badly imo
Shepard being at the Earth? Why does that makes sense and everyone else has fecked off?
I'm not sure you can say it's a fact that the ending is poor. Ultimately they've gone for something pretty risky and for a lot of people it hasn't paid off... but at least they tried for something different if indeed they have swung for the indoctrination angle, plus, I would say it's an excellent way of capping off a series, as it's a theme that has been prevelant throughout both the first two games.
I can see why people don't like it... as direct closure would be preferably for many, plus it's not even 100% that indoctrination is what they were aiming for (though there is plenty of evidence to suggest its going that way)... and the whole thing with Joker/Normandy doesn't make much sense, and there isn't much about your decisions that impact the outcome (though I don't see how there could be to be honest).
Back to the ending, I also think it's quite clever how the two options the Catalyst try to steer you towards are either Saren's option of synthesis that he banged on about in the first game, or The Illusive Man's option of control.
Sorry I don't quite understand what your asking. I'm saying that Shepards body being on Earth indicates he was never actually on the Citadel.
I think the endgame was poor on the whole, it was no different to any mission from the original Call of Duty or Medal of Honour with wave after wave of enemies hitting you in a linear level, on top of which there was no boss fight to speak of so on top of the ending being very poor it came out of nowhere as there was no big crescendo.
its also very likely to have no dialog since the voice actors are saying they haven't been asked to do any more work.
It's just that you tried to gather anything from that ending that I find silly. Why would they finish a trilogy with something and have the "real" ending be something ambiguous that the players had to find out themselves. That doesn't make any sense at all and considering how mainstream EA is and how much they want to cater to the crowd there's no chance that it was supposed to be anything different than the shit it was.
Mainstream films do so all the time... so why can't video games? It's not far-fetched to believe that a video game could try challenge a player in the same way a movie would... inspite of how mainstream it is.
Also, if anyone's going to try it such and ending, it is Bioware, and with the mythology/themes that have been so strongly running through Mass Effect since the very first game, it is the perfect game to try it... ultimately, why would EA give a shit?? They knew they were going to shift millions of copies regardless of what the ending was.
True. I don't recall Inception getting slated for its ending.
(totally different, I know)
Like what trilogy? What movie trilogy have you watched were you had an ending but it wasn't the real ending?
EA gives a shit about money. When the next EA/Bioware game comes out and sells considerably less money they will be forced to listen to their critics (and by that I mean the people who buy the games, not those who are paid to give reviews).
I bought the "Final Hours of Mass Effect 3" iPad app, which is sort of "behind the scenes" feature on the game. In that you can actually look at the lead writers notes on how Mass Effect 3 would end, and its basically all about how he wanted it as ambiguous as possible so that everybody would keep questioning and draw their own conclusion.
I like your point about game reviews, they're as much of a joke as football journalism.
I'm not sure what you mean by "real ending" ... I'm talking about an ending that isn't clear-cut and has to make the player think/look deeper (if that is indeed what they are going for... which I think they are). The ending to Mass Effect is a "real" ending... it may not be clear-cut, but it's certainly real.
I don't imagine this will have a huge impact on whatever the next game Bioware/EA release together. Ultimately, if it's a good game that looks the part, people will buy it. The fact that people are upset by this ending will probably only affect the dlc... but I would be shocked if it had a huge impact on future releases.
a more accurate comparison would be 2001: a space odyssey (albeit a single film that feels like a trilogy ), the overarching theme is actually the same- technology getting to the point where it can reason and rebel against its creators.
So they are releasing a DLC in the summer to expand on the endings.
By the sound of it the endings won't be changed (thank god), but more cinematics and explanations will be provided. I'm happy about this. It's free as well.
I actively pirate games from EA for that reason. Their games are basically taken an established game and ruining it. I sometimes have fun playing them but they always disappoint in some way. They aren't making me start buying their games again. That's for sure. And I do buy PC games. Pretty much exclusively via Steam. Origins didn't help at all either.
I got turned off their product and I'm sure others will as well.
I'm sorry but giving you 3 different endings where the only difference is the color scheme and you what you didn't understand is why they made those ending mistakes is the only ambiguous thing about this. It's was a typical deux ex machina and trying to make out like this was a dream all along or indoctrination doesn't make it any better at all.
Finally up to 100% readiness, then they announce they are extending the ending, do I finish it now or wait for the DLC Hmm
Regardless of whether it makes it better, it seems to make sense. I hated that ending don't get me wrong. But when you look at the evidence it would seem to indicate that there's more to the story.
Finished it last night, didn't see what the fuss was with the ending, wasn't too bad, fit the way I had been playing my character perfectly
The ending just sucks because none of your choices ended up having any impact. I would have liked to at least see Geth and Quarian fighting side by side or something.
Well not in my game as the Quarians are all dead...but you get my point
Maybe if you read something about why people dislike it you'll understand why. If you don't think about it too much of course it won't bother you at all.
Had you played your character differently the ending would still have been the same. That's one thing.
I'm surprised more people haven't mentioned the one thing that really made me think there was an "expansion pack" shall we call it coming out to finish it off.
The fact that one of the guys you took with you on the mission to London and was with you when you got shot at by the Reapers appears completely unharmed stepping off the normandy on some random planet alongside Joker and EDI.
And that's also ignoring the "it's over 5000!!" ending where you get a glimpse of Shephard alive.
I might buy this for the 360 tomorrow.
That has been mentioned a few times.
Seems to me that the person you romanced is the one that steps off the Normandy and if you take him/her with you she/he will die and still appear there.
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