Discussion in 'Manchester United Forum' started by Tom Van Persie, Dec 18, 2018.
Man you get to bit when they say up next is Phelan and it bloody ends! Tease
The issue now is, if we ultimately get fourth place and continue our upward trend as a team, if he doesn't get the job and results are not equal, does the new manager come under heavy scrutiny and we end up in the same position as under the previous permanent managers.
It would almost be better for a different manager if we stumble towards the end of the season, but if we roar in, finish fourth and get to the semi final of the CL and/or win the FA Cup, I'd say the board is going to have a hard time not picking him full time.
It seems that the players adore him but they also know that there is not a player in the current side that is even close to having as big an impact on Manchester United's history as the boss so the fans will never turn on him (same guise as Zidane at Madrid). I think where Sir Alex was feared because he was the boss, Ole is feared because our fans will look now to the players before they turn on the Manager. With Moyes, LVG and Mourinho it was Club > Players > Manager. With Fergie Club > Manager > Players. I think Ole gets the later treatment.
OGS will get the job full time imo, makes too much business sense and keeps the fanbase at arms length,a kind of emotional blackmail,theyre not daft those yanks yer know.
I agree completely. He is the man for us and I want him to be appointed permanently at the end of the season. He is the perfect fit for United, the low risk option. I can see him lasting 20 years as manager, which is the longetivity the club craved for when Moyes was appointed on a six years contract. I couldn't see Pochettino lasting that long - either we sack him if he flops like the last three did, or he gets his head turned by Real Madrid if he is successful for us.
I’m going to be singing that for days now....
I see the man has his heart out for United. I imagine, if he later on feels he can’t give more to the club, he’ll resign himself. Just like what Cantona did.
If it’s a sucessful receipe, why don’t you want to refer it to? I’ll be more than satisfied if we get the exact carbon copy of (younger) Fergie. Which of course, Ole sets the team differently than SAF, but the philosophy is similar.
it is fun, trust me, being singing it all day
At least he is trying to stop Mata going for a walk about the pitch. The MEN says that Ole was noticed trying to get Mata to come back to the right side so the defence can be stretched.
It just smacks of the old Lfc mistakes where they tried using the managers who played under their successful managers of Paisley and Shankly. Sometimes you just need a clean break. Yes of course it would be great to if Ole was successful here. It would be really poetic, however, we need to get the next appointment correct. By all accounts, Saf is very heavily involved at the moment. What happens when he’s not there?
Like I say, having Ole manage us would be a dream scenario. We all want him to be our Zidane. However, we need someone a bit more proven. That’s just my opinion. Not right or wrong, just my opinion.
Regarding Pochettino, a collegue of my who supports Spurs claims the chances of him of joining United are very slim, partly because of respect to Tootenham, but also because Real Madrid are on the prowl for a new manager and right now he seems like the best candidate
I do wonder if he'll stay on if they give Ole the job.
I want him to succeed so badly, and we give him the job full time. Come on Ole.
What mistakes? That model was extremely successful. Paisley, Fagan and Dalglish were all promoted from within. The only failure of that model were Souness.
I'd agree with you if we were doing the same as they did but in my opinion we really aren't. We went down a different path that was equally as flawed.
Dalglish was given the job with zero managerial experience at all (and yet was successful). He was player manager after Fagan retired (who never actually wanted the job). Dalglish then quit Keegan style after a 4-4 with Everton despite being 3 points clear at the top of the league. Moran was only a caretaker so I'll ignore him (he also didn't want the job), Souness did well at Rangers but he was also a complete cnut while he was there, Souness pissed off a lot of fans with a Sun interview published on the 3rd anniversary of Hillsborough. Then he sold Saunders who nearly helped Villa win the league while Liverpool sat in the bottom half of the table. Bad signings and losing the fans ended his tenure, so they gave it to Evans, yet another man who had never managed, only been a coach. To be fair to him, he created a good team from the mess he got. I hated facing Fowler and McManaman and the rest of them even if we did come out on top come the end of the year. Then the club tried to get Houlier in as joint manager which ended Evans but finally broke the cycle.
Liverpools mantra was to promote form within to maintain continuity if they felt the right man was there. The only one with any experience in the role was Souness and he might have been the least successful of the lot.
Ole has actually managed, both winning leagues against the odds, and getting relegated. Highs and lows.
If we had appointed Giggs after Moyes went we could easily be on the same set of tracks as Liverpool were, fortunately we didn't, despite the pleas for us to do so.
I also don't buy that SAF is "very heavily involved". Ole bending his ear on how to run the a club that only he has done well, inviting him to training and letting him try and pump up the players once is nothing that shouldn't be happening. SAF won;t be dresing anyone down or criticising anyone (to them anyway), and he doesn't talk about it to the media either.
Ole has been given a free hit. Caretaker for a prolonged period which most never get. Usually it's 10 or less games or so to see out the season. By the end of the season Ole will have managed us for a bare minimum of 25 games. 2 in the FA cup, 2 in the CL and 21 in the league. More if we beat Arsenal (possible imo) or manage to beat PSG (less likely).
No matter how hard we try, there is no guarantee that the next choice will be the right one. Right now probably the only way you could do that would be to abduct Pep which we know will never happen. Every other manager so far has been picked for fairly solid reasons, if flawed. Moyes - long term stability and PL proven with no money to spend, Gaal - international name, can deal with egos, won things (though his best years were a decade behind him), and finally Mou who in terms of winning things is a perfectly logical choice if you accept the baggage that you know comes with it.
None of them wanted to play football how we want to play football. None of them really got United what it means and why its special. Moyes was the only one who had it worked would have stayed more than 3 or 4 years.
What criteria do we set for our new manager? Exciting football? Freedom of expression? Deal with egos? Don't slag players off in public? Understand the club? Has managerial experience? Has won something, anything, somewhere? Absolutely won't get nicked by Madrid?
It's still too early to give him the job as the next 20 games could be a diabolical mess. Come the end of the season, 4th spot or not, CL progression or not, we'll know more about him as potential manager than basically anyone that was ever given the Liverpool job in those days apart from Souness, who, once again, was a complete bellend.
Nice read and well articulated points
I like Ole's style of play but am yet to be convinced on his tactical ability and adaptability. Thankfully we have around 20 matches to gauge that
I wish he would stay on whoever is the next manager. We need 2-3 staff members who know the club and can build bridges, especially in the beginning
So rare to happen these days as a new manager brings his own staff.
The tragic mistake was letting Moyes get rid of everyone when he came in as if Fergie had been sacked. Utter braindead decision from everyone involved.
Moran, Souness & Roy Evans
Cannot dispute anything you’ve written there. Agree with it all. My stance is, we really need to get this next appointment right. Obviously every appointment has it’s risk but we have to try and mitigate the risks.
Like you say, the remaining games will be a major factor but Ole was never considered for the full time job before being caretaker. We all know the likes of Saf and Ed want Pochettino. We should not let the heart sway the boards decision. If we can get Poch, we have to go and get him. If we can’t, Ole has a great chance.
He will 100% get the job.
No.1 He was chosen by Ferguson.
No.2 The fans are onboard and seduced by the whole situation
No.3 They are playing the United way again
No.4 Ole gives a good interview
No.5 Who says Pochettino (or anyone else for that matter) would actually want the job and the scrutiny anyway? 3 managers have failed so far. The odds on you being the one to change it all are not good.
My main concern with Poch is that Madrid will nick him and we'll be left holding our balls again.
We also don't really know to be fair whether Ole was thought to be in contention for the job full time. They felt he was good enough for 25 games so it's not nothing.
Tbf to the players, you can't fight internet trolls.
It's the first time since SAF that I'm looking forward to the next United game desperately. Even in Mourinho's second season I wasn't particularly dying to see us play because he was always so gloomy.
It's a priceless feeling and which is the reason why I started watching football in the first place. I hope he does well and gets a shot at it next season if we come within a couple of points of top 4.
Point is the model wasn't flawed, which is what you implied. It's impossible to choose the right manager every time over a period of time. Every club appoints duds as manager now and then. Liverpool abandoned their model of promoting from within after Souness. Would you say that model worked better for them?
It is too early to say but he is on the right path. There is a positivity about the club. We may or not make the 4th place but if there is good progress I hope he gets it. He is not going to promote himself and it is not about himself as Jose and others did. As others have said, if he feels it is not working he is going to walk away. He loves United too much to wait to get the sack and the cheque.
Very difficult question to answer. Because even if we look at our own records, Jimmy Murphy & McGuinness never worked either. Ultimately, it comes down to the person in charge.
Like I said in another post, there's nothing to suggest that Ole wouldn't work here. However, we have to make a decision with our brains and not hearts. The best indication of who will get the job will be when/if we sign our DoF/Sporting Director.
Tweet— Twitter API (@user) date
Tweet— Twitter API (@user) date
He is a manager with 250 games behind him. Wish the press will stop talking about him like some clown that's been brought to OT to smile at everyone.
Barnes was taking the piss in the post match analysis against Newcastle.
Probably the thing that pisses me off the most, give him due credit ffs. Stop with the narrative that all he has to do is smile to get good results, as if that has ever worked before.
I also wish MUTV would stop pushing the "atmosphere" around the club angle. Focus on his tactical changes a little bit. You feel the media make it seem like he's just told the players to express themselves and do whatever they want.
Exactly, he has clearly made changes to tactics and playing style. The positioning of the players, the off the ball tactics and on the ball tactics changed greatly as well, but hey, all he does is smile and all the changes is done by the players themselves apparently.
Do the MUTV pundits ever discuss tactics? They have a boring thing called box to box or something like that on MUTV. Many times it feels like someone sitting and commentating on highlights reel.
He has done all of that, but I also think his own interviews are fueling the impression that all he does is to tell the players to go and express themselves. He has refused to take any credit for Rashford's markedly better finishing for example. One hopes of course that behind the scenes the club knows all the work that goes into it and actually does consider him for the position full time.
To be fair, we've not been tested tactically yet, so it's a bit premature to be talking up his tactics.
Bit of a strange thing to say. Every game is a test. Mourinho's tactics often failed against the lower teams and against the top teams his tactic was to park the bus and pray for a miracle. It's not like tactics only come into play against the top 4..
You know what I mean. You're expected to beat the lower teams regardless, but tactics play much more of a role in the games against the better sides, and can be a real difference maker
Separate names with a comma.