Pogba on the left

Discussion in 'Manchester United Forum' started by MyOnlySolskjaer, Jan 1, 2018.

  1. Feb 9, 2018

    breakout67 Full Member

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    Exactly! Lingard is a pseudo midfielder anyway; he is good with the ball and is very good at pressing and doing the midfield basics.

    In the Tottenham game; Lingard and Sanchez were doing lots of yards in the middle and I lost count of how many times they motioned Pogba to press.

    Having two other midfielders do the dirty work for Pogba won't make him a better player; it'll just let him play 'playstation football' more often like he is his backyard.
  2. Feb 9, 2018

    Fergie 7ime New Member

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    Our midfield just got flooded at Wembley. Sure Matic and Pogba were pretty shit, but it was mostly down to Jose’s tactics. Pogba can be amazing in a 2-midfield, but against such an amazing high press team away from home he needs way more protection, any midfield player would.

    Just play him in a two in the easier games and let him loose by putting a third midfielder in there when we’re up against though opposition. It’s that simple imo.
  3. Feb 9, 2018

    RooneyLegend Full Member

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    The issue with Paul is this is a new development in his career, so in essence he's developing weaknesses which really shouldn't happen.
  4. Feb 10, 2018

    Rhyme Animal Modmins said "freeze" and I got numb

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    If Mourinho Keeps playing Pogba in a mid 2 in big games it will essentially limit what Mourinho achieves at Utd.

    It doesn't work. It will never work against any decent team with a mid 3. And it's rubbish to watch.

    If Mourinho does choose to keep doing it, it'll be his 'my captain shall always play' decision, that mad, blind insistence on something that has no basis in logic and ends up limiting the success of the manager themselves.
  5. Feb 10, 2018

    BigBebe Full Member

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    Are you the ref?
    I think that pretty much sums it up.
  6. Feb 10, 2018

    Raees Sporty Guy

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    This is heading for a car crash of epic proportions and honestly I don't know why most of you guys were giving Noodle stick when literally it seems majority of you are of the same opinion and completely behind Jose here which I think is the wrong stance to take.

    Jose is right in that Pogba is a midfield player but wrong in saying every midfielder should be complete and for him a Midfielder just means a CM. Opinions like well Pogba shouldn't be afforded any privileges because no other midfielder gets privileges are absolute horseshit they really are.

    Firstly how many midfield twos are their in the modern game in elite sides? And secondly would you guys say that Iniesta, Coutinho, Silva and De Bruyne would all thrive in a midfield two? Would someone like Kroos be ok with just him and say Modric without the cover of a Casemiro? No.. so why the feck is Pogba being expected to thrive in a midfield two?

    The worse thing is that we have seen enough of him in that pair to see that overall it isn't working.. in tough games against okay opposition we struggle to move the ball around fluidly and against top sides we have zero control and they walk through us. Anyone with half a brain would then think to themselves that okay maybe something isn't quite right here and okay you can argue here Pogba simply isn't good enough a footballer full stop which is fair enough (across any position) but the other logical assumption would be that okay we can't trust him in that double pivot where it involves a lot of defensive responsibility and so we need an extra body in there to share the load so the ratio of his attacking v defensive contributions is skewered more in favour of attacking.

    No one is arguing he needs a free role devoid of any defensive responsibility like a number 10.. he's not attacking enough or has the stats to warrant such freedom and as he proved at Juve he can do some element of defensive work - quite a lot more than your average attacking midfielder actually but just not enough for a proper out and out centre mid even in comparison to say a Xavi or Scholes who had a better positional instinct in the very heart of midfield.

    There is no shame on Pogba for being unable to do that. You wouldn't put Coutinho that deep, or Iniesta (who also frankly has pathetic stats and always has done for such a freakishly gifted footballer) but you give these guys attacking responsibility over defensive because they'll control the game for you and find those split defence passes which don't always register as assists but they break the lines for you. But they're still expected to drop in and be part of a three so they don't stroll around say like an Ozil. So in that respect they're kind of box to box, but in reality they don't actually enter any box they're more centre circle to just outside the box players. Get involved sometimes picking it up deep but assisting in controlling the game and also feeding the attacking players. Ask yourself isn't that what you also envision Pogba doing at his best. Or are you seriously going to argue you see him charging from box to box like a Viera making tackles upon tackles and acting like a warrior.

    No one is saying that he's the finished article or that he can't up his game or even if you provide the proper platform he will perform but for gods sake try and understand the different nuances and roles in midfield before you utter caveman crap about how he has all the attributes of a CM and therefor it's his own fault for not being able to play there and he needs to fix up or be shipped out. With that sort of opinion we would have for example a young Iniesta on our hands, play him in a two .. get overrun and then sell him. It's wasting talent and that is what we are in danger of here.. we are in danger of wasting Pogba at his prime.

    You watch and see, if we stick with this experiment he will once again be decent in smaller games and then there will be another disappearance act in a big game if we stick with a two in there because he simply is not a CM player. He doesn't have the skillset or the mental attributes to play there so Jose is wrong pure and simple IMO. The manager will soon have to make a choice, either he builds the team around what suits his players or he has to bench players and prioritise his system. Nothing wrong with either approach but the worst thing to do is shoehorn players into ill suited positions and then lambast a player for failing to fit into your system and thirdly build this myth that all other midfielders are so versatile. Could Xavi play where Iniesta did week in week out or where Busquets did? Or go on the wings or be an Ozil. Possibly he could but overall he wouldn't have been the Xavi we know and love if he wasn't given a proper position where he felt most comfortable. Most top footballers have a position where they feel most comfortable and even slight differences can really impact their level of performance.

    In midfield you have three subsets .. 1. Defensive 2. Central 3. Attacking and currently we are trying to play Pogba as a 1.5 because in a double pivot you have to hold and also be a centre mid which is for me very far from where I saw him at Juve which is more a 2.5 on that scale.

    Deschamps also has this issue where he's trying to fit Griezmann and Pogba into same team and messing Pogba around and he was poor in the Euros. Both him and Jose are misunderstanding Pogba. Either don't pick him or when you do make sure you play him in a three. Shoehorning him in just destroys the team balance and ruins the guys confidence. These managers instead of admitting their shortcomings in this regard have brainwashed the fans into thinking Pogba is lazy and it's his fault. He's a very hard working player for an attacking midfielder but it's okay we will just jump on the Pogba is a lazy immature prick bandwagon because the manager says so.
  7. Feb 10, 2018

    Raees Sporty Guy

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    @Invictus Im losing my mind here.. do you see it the way I do here?
  8. Feb 10, 2018

    POF Full Member

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    How often has he done it for you to make such a definitive conclusion that it will never work?

    The biggest criticism directed at Mourinho is being too defensive in big games. I liked the aggressive intent in that game. After the Sanchez signing and winning run in January, momentum was on United's side. Going to Spurs and winning would have been huge. I think it was the right call.

    Unfortunately they didn't turn up for the first 11 seconds and Pogba's effort levels were abysmal. It was one of the most disappointing games of the season and I think the players let themselves down. Due to how the game went, I don't think we'll ever know if the tactics were right or wrong.
  9. Feb 10, 2018

    TheRedHearted New Member

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    would love to see
    4-3-3
    Martial up front.
    Sanchez on the left Lukaku
    Pogba Lingard
    Matic as holding.
  10. Feb 10, 2018

    AngliaRed Full Member

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    Great explanation mate, Saves me typing a 3rd of that half assed!
  11. Feb 10, 2018

    Rajma Full Member

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  12. Feb 10, 2018

    Walters_19_MuFc Full Member

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  13. Feb 10, 2018

    gibers Full Member

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    It's the whole structure of the teams that's wrong. Mou relies on specialists too much, @porto he relied on Deco, @Inter Sneijder, @Madrid Alonso/Ozil and at Chelsea 2.0 Cesc. Once they are shut down the teams creativity generally goes with it. That's point one.

    Secondly, the Matic and Pogba playing as a double pivot wont be optimal because Matic also favours playing on the left side as does Pogba. So except they play in a 3 man mf the dynamics will always be slightly off.

    Even if we do play a midfield 3, the problem is Lukaku isn't very good outside of the box as we would need someone to either hold up the ball effectively and cobine with Pogba or a player like Dybala that can come deep and link up with him. This is why I feel Sanchez needs to play as the CF as it would free up Pogba. He isn't a #10 or an #8. He's sort of in between both.

    He is by far our best and most dynamic player and I've said this before, under Pep he would be the best player in the league by a distance.