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VAR - All is forgiven we love you

Discussion in 'Football Forum' started by Pavl3n, Jun 18, 2017.

  1. Jan 11, 2019

    Rafaeldagold Full Member

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    Here’s an opinion piece from the Guardian a year ago- really good points:

    ‘Refereeing decisions are not the real problem here. The real problem is the ludicrously disproportionate attention devoted to discussing refereeing decisions. The number of actual injustices, as opposed to disagreements, is minuscule next to this overwhelming fog of rage.

    Let’s face it, people are the problem here. Like the block button on Twitter, like silent touchlines and anger management courses, VAR is just another attempt to cope with and soothe and manage their feelings of disempowerment and alienation. It is people’s rage that demands this, more than any meaningful search for objective truth.

    This is not cricket, where TV replays can establish the definite truth of angles and nicks. More than any other sport football constantly presses itself up against the limits of its own laws, relying on continual judgment calls simply to function at all. There is no objective truth in football. Instead the idea is to play the game at the very edge of what is defined as football and what is defined as foul, an interpretation of various physical movements that depends on the application of a set of descriptive words. What amounts to a grey area is itself a grey area. The areas for debate are always up for debate.
  2. Jan 11, 2019

    Mb194dc Full Member

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    Dont agree with the Guardian point above. In English football there are big refereeing issues frequently.

    E.g, just off top of my head in last two weeks. Shelvey tackle on Pogba and Kompany tackle on Salah very clear red cards.

    We've had 4 incorrect offside descions in last 4 gaming resulting in 3 goals chalked off incorrectly and one given.

    Refereeing is absolutely woeful and they can't even implement VAR properly.

    English referees are the laughing stock of world football.
  3. Jan 11, 2019

    Peyroteo Professional Ronaldo PR Guy

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    They're probably the best in the world, if you think english refs are bad then you don't watch other leagues consistently.
  4. Jan 11, 2019

    Mb194dc Full Member

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    I watch more Spanish football than English.

    Aware of controversy in recent Madrid / Barcelona games. Posted earlier in the thread and la Liga thread. I understand the referees process in those games. Marginal decisions but I thought they were ok.

    Saw Lyon Strasbourg as well recently and thought the referee got things right there too. First pen a bit soft, fekir one stonewall.

    True though, there could be leagues I don't watch where is worse.
  5. Jan 11, 2019

    mitchmouse Full Member

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    VAR is a must. I'm sure there was a fuss when goal-line technology was first mooted but it has made a fantastic difference
  6. Jan 11, 2019

    Rafaeldagold Full Member

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    No there wasn’t a fuss about goal line technology as it’s a simple yes/no question & doesn’t interfere with the game.

    I was 100% in support of goal line technology & 100% against VAR.
  7. Jan 11, 2019

    MikeKing Full Member

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    It is easier to update rules, implement change and enforce consistency with a system in place. VAR can be that. You can train refs up to a point but there will always be wrong calls due to the refs being humans, you might have a bad view, different interpretations of rules etc. With VAR there exists this possibility of enforcing consistency beyond what was possible before. A ref will have limited potential to improve, but a panel with video footage have no excuse for not finding consistency through storing info and then applying it in the same way every time.
  8. Jan 11, 2019

    Mrs Smoker Full Member

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    I'm confused, he's in offside, why wouldn't anyone agree with it?

    Mind you, he's in offside again, after that time they stopped the footage.

    Actually, never mind me, didn't interfere at all with the play. I think it's a feck up from the refs. Still not a fault of VAR.

    EDIT#2: Never mind again, at the end, it was a fair decision due to first offside, but yeah, doesn't seem to be great usage of the VAR there. Not sure how to do it though, if assistant didn't raise the flag at first?
  9. Jan 11, 2019

    Rafaeldagold Full Member

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    I just love how simple & quick VAR is & leading to no confusion whatsoever.

    Oh wait.
  10. Jan 11, 2019

    Mrs Smoker Full Member

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    Ref doesn't seem confused.
  11. Jan 11, 2019

    Peyroteo Professional Ronaldo PR Guy

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    There's an offside but Sevilla got possession of the ball, lost it and only then was it a goal. How far back can VAR go to invalidate a goal?
  12. Jan 11, 2019

    FootballHQ Full Member

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    Odd use of it in the Benfica match just now for anyone watching.

    Thought it was penalty on first viewing and now he sends off the Benfica player?!:lol:

    Edit: Oh wait, free kick on edge of the box. Surely the contact continued inside the area?!

    Double edit: VAR confusing me, it was Santa Clara player red carded, for what I don't have a clue as it was a foul on them. Thought Benfica were in red tonight.
  13. Jan 11, 2019

    FootballHQ Full Member

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    Actually on engaging my brain I've now realised it's all perfectly logical. Problem was I thought Benfica were playing in red (they're in white) as Santa Clara's shirt looks exactly like Benfica home kit!
  14. Jan 11, 2019

    Mrs Smoker Full Member

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    Another win for VAR! ;)
  15. Jan 11, 2019

    Peyroteo Professional Ronaldo PR Guy

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    No chance that was a red card though. Incredibly harsh
  16. Jan 12, 2019

    awop New Member

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    I hope you don't plan on becoming a VAR referee :lol::lol:
    About the video on the previous page, surely that has to be considered a "new" sequence of play. The guy that was offside didn't interfere at all with the following move.
  17. Jan 12, 2019

    FootballHQ Full Member

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    Did he get sent off for being a percieved last man or for arguing with the ref? I too was a bit bemused when he got the red (think he was orginally booked)....when I eventually worked out which team was which!
  18. Jan 24, 2019

    hellohello Full Member

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  19. Jan 24, 2019

    Rafaeldagold Full Member

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    More from Poch:

    Watching every single game in Europe now, nobody is happy," Pochettino said.

    "I promise you, nobody! What worries me a bit is that there is going to be a situation where football starts to annoy fans.
  20. Jan 24, 2019

    Tommy bigot with fetish for footballers getting fingered

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    I don't disagree. I believe things like offside & whether or not it's a throw-in/handball can be fully automated in a way similar to goal line technology (which would/will be great), but this whole thing with the on-field ref rushing over to look at a little screen several times a game is tedious.
  21. Jan 24, 2019

    Mrs Smoker Full Member

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    One to ignore on this topic.
  22. Jan 24, 2019

    Kostov Full Member

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    VAR must come into football, what Poch is saying is rubbish in my opinion. However it should be organized in a better way. No ref running out to the touchlines so he can review a situation himself. Have a 3 man panel which will do that and help the guy out properly, taking part of the responsibility from him as well.
  23. Jan 24, 2019

    hellohello Full Member

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    Poch is saying that in its current state it shouldn't be implemented next year. He is not against VAR as an idea, but its current implementation doesn't make football better in his view.

    "For me, I think it is a good idea to delay because if we don't have all the information and don't know how it will work or how we can better develop the system, it is better to stop for one year or more."
  24. Jan 24, 2019

    Mb194dc Full Member

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    There have been a couple of mistakes with VAR this season in La liga. The Bilabo one at the weekend is a bit of head scratcher, still haven't seen an explanation for it. The Spanish FA / Head of referees should come out at the end of the season and explain the decisions that have been controversial, what went wrong or not and how they will improve for next season.

    La Liga VAR is still working many times better than how the premier league is officated without it though.

    I only watched a few premier league games on the weekend and both had poor potentially game changing decisions also heard about the Fulham game but haven't seen it. Firstly Arsenal should have gone 3 0 up against us (Chelsea) missing an easy chance that was setup from an offside position. Secondly in the City game Sane was offside for the second goal. Also in the fulham game it seems Fulham had a stonewall penalty denied although I haven't seen that. I'd also like to see a properly calibrated offside replay of Jimenez setting the winner up against Leicester, no proper replay of it was ever shown so no idea if onside or not.

    That is just from one weekend of games. The level of refereeing in the premier league is far below that of the other top European leagues in my opinion.

    My concern with introducing VAR in England is that the officials are so incompetent, it won't be implemented properly (as seen with Kane's offside against Chelsea in the league cup first leg) and even when it works they won't use it properly.
  25. Jan 24, 2019

    awop New Member

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    End of the season ? Why wait until it doesn't matter anymore ? Have a meeting every Tuesday and sort every controversy that happened during the weekend. So any weird decision can be avoided during the next gameweek.
    I don't know if it's Pochettino or Rafaeldagold rehashing these quotes but it was dumb the first time and it's stil dumb today. "Nobody is happy.Promise" Right.
  26. Jan 24, 2019

    hellohello Full Member

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    I predict that the biggest frustration from fans won't be the decisions VAR make, but rather not understanding why something is not sent to VAR while another incident is.
  27. Jan 24, 2019

    Anustart89 Full Member

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    Poch sounds like Trump.

    ”Believe me, nobody’s happy. I’ve spoken to lots of people, smart people, the smartest actually, and they’re all unhappy.”

    Why has there been no vote to remove VAR so far if everyone’s as unhappy as he says they are?
  28. Jan 24, 2019

    Sunny Jim Full Member

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    Bingo
  29. Jan 24, 2019

    ROFLUTION Full Member

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    The FA have never really been that including, have they. Heavy organisation
  30. Jan 24, 2019

    ROFLUTION Full Member

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    Yeah thats my thought too, would be nice just for offsides leading to goals, but im sceptic about which penalties are given and not. So many grey-zone incidents atm, and some are dives, some are not. Incrdibly hard to be consistent there. As someone else said here, there should be some official explanation about the decisions to make it a more transparent system.
  31. Jan 24, 2019

    Anustart89 Full Member

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    These types of changes need a 14 club majority to be implemented, so can’t really say that.

    Regardless, I wasn’t talking about the FA, but the leagues that already have it, who are supposedly so unhappy with it but have taken no action to remove it.
  32. Jan 24, 2019

    Viral United Full Member

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    Correct
    That's why I think it should be used as challenge system like in Cricket or Hockey.
  33. Jan 24, 2019

    stevoc Full Member

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    And Solskjær has won it!
    I have a question that maybe someone with more knowledge on VAR can answer. Are the guys behind the scenes reviewing the replays for the Ref, also experienced Premier League refs?
  34. Jan 24, 2019

    Rafaeldagold Full Member

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    It’s Pochettino mate.

    Can you explain how his opinion is dumb? When he’s involved in football at the highest level & obviously speaks to a lot of people in other countries?

    Genuinely fascinated how his opinion is dumb but yours isn’t?
  35. Jan 24, 2019

    Rafaeldagold Full Member

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    People need to understand that VAR isn’t some magical technology- it’s just another guy looking at a slow mo replay.

    Ambiguous & close calls will still be that- just made by another guy minutes later
  36. Jan 24, 2019

    KirkDuyt Full Member

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    What say you.
  37. Jan 24, 2019

    Mrs Smoker Full Member

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    Would be interesting to know what are they saying.

    As for foul, I think it was.

    EDIT: Ref say no foul?

    Takes him out, ffs...
  38. Jan 24, 2019

    KirkDuyt Full Member

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    Ref says no foul. VAR tells him, come take a look at this. The VAR then proceeds to emphasize, do you see he does not get near the ball? He clearly takes him out and does not get the ball, I repeat, he does NOT get the ball.

    The ultimate explanation from the ref is: "I think it's just a football duel", and "the ball was moving away from the goal." Whatever that means.
  39. Jan 24, 2019

    Mrs Smoker Full Member

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    That ref's place in Premier League!
  40. Jan 24, 2019

    Pagh Wraith Full Member

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    Ik vind *** de bal niet weg is. :)

    Edit: Apparently the Caf finds certain Dutch pronouns offensive. :lol: