Discussion in 'Football Forum' started by peridigm, Dec 3, 2018.
Seeing confirmed reports all over Twitter. It’s about time.
Great news, they probably felt pressure after that Sterling trip over his own feet penalty and harsh Ronaldo red card. It's worked very well in the La Liga games I've watched so far this season. All the other big leagues have it already and the referees will have experience of using it from domestic games. Only the English oneswon't, at least they'll have a chance to learn ready for next season, if they get any games.
Wonderful, so no Barca offside goals to help overcome 4-5 goals deficit against PSG then
Not that it'll help us or anything.
So, Whats the point of VAR again?
Used to benefit Barca, Madrid, PSG. Will screw everyone else and they won’t even bother looking.
This is correct.
Its only till Glazers get seat in UEFA. Amrica
Clear and obvious.
Ajax fans were quite emotional about that decision, which is somewhat understandable since they were the better team in the first half.
There's absolutely no reason at all to assume that Skomina and the VAR wouldn't have made the exact same decision if it was Real Madrid scoring a goal like that though. Making all the talk about how the VAR is useless or ruining football quite silly.
Courtois is in no man’s land there, in the process of checking his movement forward because he knows the striker is heading it first. That he doesn’t appeal anything is telling.
Silly and unnecessary decision.
You mean like David Gill?
Yep. VAR is fine in principle, but they need to use it sparingly. Only use it for blatantly wrong decisions, otherwise you get stupid calls like today. The rules exist for a reason, to stop teams gaining unfair advantages. Tadic's position had zero bearing on the goal. VAR is going to be damaging for football if it continues to be used in the manner that it is.
It was Skomina's decision in the end though, not the VAR's. What you're describing sounds a bit like a have your cake and eat it too situation.
It's irrelevant whose decision it is. The point is calls like that should not be getting overturned by VAR. It's not a 'cake and eat it' situation, the whole point of VAR was that it was to be used sparingly for "clear and obvious errors", yet it's being used to overturn extremely close calls.
The ref was an absolute disgrace in the Ajax - Madrid match. Chalks off an Ajax goal, and then completely ignores a foul in the buildup for the Asensio goal.
VAR isn't there to correct decisions. It's there to help the sides that the powers that be want to see succeed. It wouldn't have been implemented if they really want to get all the decisions right.
It was so bad, even Real Madrid's mouthpiece admitted the mistake:
I think I'm going to give up on football, the corruption/incompetence used to be behind the scenes so no one could see it, but now it piercing that thin veil.
He wants to have a career as a referee. Once the incident was called back for video review, there was only one outcome.
You clearly don't understand the amount of subjectivity or arbitrariness involved in separating those two.
Same with your talk about Tadic' position having zero bearing on the goal, that's simply your opinion or interpretation and fair enough. But according to the current offside rules there wasn't really anything wrong with Skomina's interpretation either.
In the end you'll always end up with close calls and discussions like this, if you don't want any of that you should be against the implementation of VAR in football which is fair enough again. But then again the same VAR will make it 99% sure that the good old Thierry Henry handball goal will be disallowed, for which you say you do want the referees getting video assistance. That's what I mean regarding having your cake and eating it too.
Even if you disallow the Ajax valid goal, how can you allow the Madrid goal when there was a clear foul on De Jong which was more suspect as compared to how active the actually non-offside Ajax player was in obstructing the flapping goal keeper without chance. I believe in VAR in that it generally should improve the error to correct call ratio, but here it seemed like a cowards excuse to turn decisions in favor of the richest team, which is very damaging to VAR. It shouldn't be used to indulge the big teams like Madrid.
What are the current offside rules like? My understanding is the Ajax player needed to block Courtois view for the offside to get called, and I don't think that was the case in this situation. The goal should have stood.
VAR is used only for goals, penalties, red cards and offsides which result in goals.
Not only or simply the view from the way I read it.
“Interfering with an opponent” means:
Preventing an opponent from playing or being able to play the ball. For example, by clearly obstructing the goalkeeper’s line of vision or movement
https://www.fifa.com/mm/document/afdeveloping/refereeing/5. law 11_554.pdf
I thought it was a foul at first, as you did, but now I have more doubts.
If you have a look at the second movement De Jong makes it looks like Lucas Vazquez is fouling De Jong, but if you pay attention to the first movement he makes I think it might be an obstruction.
Fine, an interpretation. The point is that both the interpretations go in favor of the richest team.
It was correct call. Tadic was blocking Cortouis in an offside position
None of those apply in that case imo. It should've been a goal.
It's not an opinion to say Tadic's position had no influence on the goal, it's an indisputable fact. If you remove him from the situation Courtois does not save the goal. You're deliberately being argumentative if you're seriously suggesting that the incident was a 'clear and obvious error'. If the linesman originally gives offside then I'd also be annoyed if VAR overturned it. It was a call which could have gone either way, and thus should not be requiring the intervention of VAR to overturn the decision. I am against the use of VAR if it's going to be used in the present fashion and disallow goals such as the one today. It's not a binary choice between no VAR and VAR but it's used to rule on the most trivial of debatable infractions, which is how you're presenting it.
None of them are 50-50 calls imo. The goals should've been stood in both cases. The referee got it very wrongly with the offside imo, it's a huge mistake.
Don't know what the complaints are about it was the correct decision to disallow the goal, he was in an offside position interfering with play
Yeah, I'm the one being deliberately argumentative. My bad then!
Even if he wasn't blocking him, which he really wasn't, he was in an offside position and affected play.
Vasquez thing looked more like a Jong foul than anything. VAR didn't miss it.
Our ref was just bad. Kimpembe should have gotten a 2nd yellow but not a straight red and therefor VAR couldn't intervene.
Why would it matter though. Vazquez didn't do much after that. VAR is for red card, goal and penalty only reviews
I think VAR could have intervened if the ref gave a freekick. I think they could have said, have a look at that and decide if you want to give a red card?
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I like that they are explaining the decision publicly. Would have been needed during the WC.
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You’re joking right
How was Tadic not obstructing Courtois vision? Never mind stopping him from moving forward.
Why don’t people understand the rules...
Completely agree. How they can say the player interfered with the keeper is a head scratcher. They should just check if it was offside and that's it. Slow anything down enough and you can find something. Courtois reaction said it all. In other words, he had no reaction. If he was interfered with he would be the first to let the ref know. Brutal decision...
I would agree if he was doing something to interfere with play, but he wasn't. He was moving back towards an onside position and a horribly out of position Courtois hits him in the back. The player didn't make any motion towards the ball. It just seems off to me. I understand what they are getting at with their explanation but it just doesn't seem right. If Courtois was interfered with he would be the first to let the ref know. Instead Courtois reaction was one of "oh shit, I messed up". For me, the VAR should only check if the original play was offside. If we look at replays enough we are bound to find a foul somewhere and pretty soon no goals will count...
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