Discussion in 'Manchester United Forum' started by BringNaniBack, Jan 31, 2018.
That goal against Portsmouth fecked him up.
Lukaku isn't better than Yorke. Probably not Cole either. Goal King Cole had more variety in his goals. Could Rom score that Spurs volley in 1999? His touch may desert him at the Key moment. Until Lukaku wins PFA and FWA player of the year ahead of all other players in the division, then Teddy could tell you no also. Lukaku is a better goal scorer but Teddy the footballer. Teddy was keeping out some pretty big players in the England team. Again, way more to his game and goals (chips, dinks and all).
What the gentleman meant is RVP and Rooney were higher grade strikers than Lukaku. We didn't buy them when they were downed and moved them on when declining. Falcao, Welbeck, Ole are all inferior to Lukaku.
You don't get an award for being more versatile. Lukaku is a will finish as a better goalscorer than Cole. Let's say Lukaku stays here for 7 seasons and scores 180 odd in all competitions in 300 games. Would you remember him for his bad touches 10 years down the line? That's why I said you are letting football videos cloud your judgement about Cole. He was the most dropped played by Fergie through 95-99 period. Very inconsistent at times, that was the reason why he got Yorkey in the first place. I am good with my memory, and it won't desert me.
Assuming your age is true, weren't you 4 to 8 years old at the time?
Lukaku could have scored at least 20 goals by now but on many occasions, we've had players go on the selfish route. Against Burnley alone, Lukaku should have had a hattrick if he was passed the ball in the great positions he found himself in. This is what happens in an unbalanced team.
If we are trying to build a strikeforce around Lukaku, then enough of this 4-2-3-1 nonsense and go 4-3-3. Stick pacey wingers on either side of him who are willing to pass or can somewhat cross the ball and we'll be golden. Lingard wants to score, Rashford wants to score, Pogba wants to score, Martial wants to score, Mata at least crosses a bit but he's no winger.
In the games we lost or drew, do you think Lukaku played as well as possible and was let down by his team mates?
What do you mean?
They aren't very alike at all, Lukaku has said so himself.
Lukaku better than Cole. Jesus Christ.
Better finisher maybe but Cole was a vastly superior footballer. Elite movement, incredibly sharp in and around the box, moved the ball first touch and was off, pulled defenders all over the place. Could form a partnership with pretty much anyone, outside of Cantona, or play up top by himself.
You have to look beyond the goals.
Actually I watched Cole play every season he was at United and never understood the chants and "needing 7 chances to score" stuff.
Hard to say who will finish the better goal scorer as it depends what you mean. In the EPL they have the same rate, and if you add the old division one, goal king Cole has the better goal rate. Cole has scored against 95% of his opponents and I recall him frequently scoring vs our close rivals Newcastle and Arsenal. That's like Lukaku frequently scoring vs Man City and Chelsea.
anyways, if Lukaku stays here for 7 seasons and scores 180 odd, I won't remember his bad touches at all. I will remember his big goals or lack of, trophies won and whether he stacked goals against minnows as is the case currently.
Luckily I am old enough to have seen Cole so don't need to rely on videos. Fergie may well have dropped Lukaku too.
His memory must've been fantastic for a 3-7 year old, at a time when I was actually playing football.
I have watched every Man Utd game since I was 8. And have tried to find and watch atleast 50-100 of our games before that too. Season reviews, everything. I can probably remember every game we have played since 93. As a teenager, I was obsessed with United. It's not easy being a fan living in India, but you can't challenge me on my facts when you don't even know me.
I am saying it. And I'll say it again. There's no way Lukaku would even be allowed to enter their dressing room. Let alone start for them. Their fans will burn the stadium, the day Real starts Lukaku as their leading man.
He's already punching above his weight at United. He'll never be any better than a midtable striker.
That said, if he does become what all of you ate hoping for him to become, I will be very happy despite having been so wrong about him.
Cole was a superb player. Scored all types of goals, created his own chances and goals and his rapport with other players - not just Yorke - was superb. He wasn't so clinical but the fact he didn't rely on service counter-balanced that as if your team mate can give you the ball and back you to make something of it which he did with wonderful lobs, volleys, bicycle kicks and running at defenders made up for it. In addition goal scoring rates have been inflated in the last ten years with Messi/Ronaldo normalizing 40+ goal seasons. Cole played an era where 20 goals in all competitions was a strong return but now 20 league goals is the minimum standard for title challenging strikers.
Again, you must not have watched much Benzema. His mind hasn't been right for a while. He hasn't been the same since Higuaín was sold.
If you're going to bother reply then put some actual thoughts into your replies instead of just wade through your quote book and stick emojis at the end of them.
It's as much about him as a player stylistically as his output. In the sense that you usually see the leading striker at a title winning side having a far better all round game than Lukaku has.
People are obsessed with merely end product. Yes a striker has to produce a certain level of that of course but there's a whole lot of things that go into a great performance. If Lukaku keeps maintaining his supposedly great goalscoring record but just can't cut it in his general play and struggles against quality teams he's never going to be the number 9 required by Manchester United. Yes you could argue that there's not a lot available. But if he doesn't have that ability we'd have to be on the lookout for sure.
It's not about lack of service. He might be clinical or whatever but his movement is poor. People need to realise how other top class and world class strikers can score goals with worse service while Lukaku needs a better service than Pogba, Martial, Sanchez & Lingard. He doesn't make enough good movement in his game, this has been the problem since his first league game with us. Until now he hasn't improve it at all, we won't win the league with him as our main no 9 if he doesn't improve his movement or off ball movement because it's so easy for defenders to mark him right now and that's why he has only scored 2 league goals against top 10 sides. The service won't come if he's not making himself available and be in the right position.
I didn't try to undermine goal king Cole. All I said was, Lukaku is younger and more lethal than Cole in a worse team. Cole had a better technique, as more polished and probably a better footballer. None of the strikers in today's age score spectacular goals regularly like he did. But as a pure CF, Lukaku for me is on par with Cole and he is much younger too. Its a matter of opinion, but some people are talking as if Lukaku is a better version of Heskey because he is not. I have seen this repeatedly here in caf that we tend to overrate the players who played for us earlier while trying to undermine the present bunch.
Lukaku has a long way to go, but with the pathetic service he gets, his improvement through the season has been great. He will score more than 30 this season and that I am sure of. Lukaku has a long way to go in every department but he will score bucketloads at United. I don't think in the summer of 2017, we could have picked a better CF than him.
Kane, Aguero, Lewandowski, Suarez are the tier 1 strikers in the world.
Lukaku, Benzema, Higuain, Cavani, Morata, Auba, Costa are the tier two strikers.
Mbappe, Griezmann, weren't going to be available to us who are not really CFs anyway.
Out of the available bunch, Lukaku comes the closest to what Jose wants in his strikers.
Please tell me who could have we got instead of him (and would have done a better job than him)? Also people tend to forget his age a lot, his injury record and his numbers at 23 in the PL. Let's try to get the best out of him rather than wanting the shining new toy in the market. If Kane comes on the market, we can make a 100m + Lukaku bid for him. But that's the only better striker we can get to make it better than what we have right now. Or Rashford/Martial have a sudden meteroic rise as strikers like Henry or someone.
This is ridiculously over the top.
Lukaku is a better player than Benzema right now and would easily start games for them. Have you even seen Benzema these days? The guy is so fecking shit, it's embarrassing. We should really stop underrating United players and overrating others. Midtable striker my arse. He may or may not be an elite striker but he's much better than a midtable striker.
I think he’s improved, particularly his hold up play, as the season has gone on. He isn’t at Kane’s level yet and may never reach that level but he’s up there as one of the top scorers in what many say is the best league in the world. We are still, as a team, work in progress and like Pogba there are still questions that need answering in terms of playing to their individual strengths.
Way, way too earlier to write off Lukaku.
I don't even agree that his all round play is poor though, or isn't good enough against top sides.
A lot of the more impressive work he's done this season has been in setting up team mates or bringing team mates into the game. He's shown he can flick the ball on, he can hold the ball up. He can beat players then pick a pass. He can even run down the wing and put a pinpoint cross in.
There aren't many strikers who have this to offer, and I don't know what else people are expecting him to do on top of that and scoring goals. Two of his best performances were also against Arsenal and Spurs. The games he's been poor in against good sides, so have most of the rest of our team. Only the city game where he really had a nightmare.
The same accusations as this used to get levelled at Drogba a lot...but he struggled in games where the team struggled to play. Just the same as any out and out striker will.
It's quite simple; Lukaku is not a technically gifted striker; he's a bit of an oaf and not really entertaining to watch. Therefore he will be discredited for anything he does; because he doesn't do it with style.
You can tell that Lukaku has worked on his game, he is very efficient in everything he does. It feels as if many things he does are things he has trained into his game; rather than something that he had a natural ability for.
The simple fact that this myth of Morata being a better all round striker is still perpetuated is evidence of the above. Morata does things more elegantly and so that's what people say. The reality is that Lukaku is virtually better at everything compared to Morata except heading the ball. The opposite of the myth is actually the reality.
We've only ever seen him produce decent hold up play against poor or average opposition. Never against top teams. Even the likes of Troy deeny can look decent outside the box against poor opponents
Do you use the big games as a yardstick for how good a player is, or you look it over the season? Because we have a lot of players who haven't performed in big games, not just Lukaku.
Funny that because when we played Spurs at Old Trafford, every chance or decent attack we put together came as a result of him, and we wouldn't have won or looked like winning without that.
Two of our goals against Arsenal were a result of his hold up play. Our best chance at Anfield went to him after good link up play with team mates.
The problem with him is exactly that same as with any other out and out front man...If you aren't going to get the ball to him and support him, he isn't going to be able to do anything.
This thread is just people wanting to blame him for games in which the team gets outplayed, because he looks big and misscontrolled the ball a few times. It's pretty boring. Rooney used to be twice as oafish and equally ineffective when the team sat back and he was our front man...He'd also regularly play much worse than I've seen from Lukaku in that role. Didn't stop him being good enough to play there when we were contending for and winning leagues.
Lukaku isn't a target man but he is being played like one; get the ball to his feet and his hold up play and linking with attackers is good.
He's just not good at judging high aerial balls and positioning himself to receive them.
Hold on - Lukaku’s performance against Spurs at home is being held up as an example of him playing well? My recollection of that game was that he was very poor for most of it and should have been subbed off. In fairness to him, he did win a good flick on to create the winning goal but if that general performance is now deemed good enough, standards have dropped considerably.
This isn’t entirely his fault. Although he looks like it, he just isn’t really a player who can hold the ball up with his back to goal. I actually think he’s much more suited to playing in a front two - where he can use his pace and power to work off a player with more technical ability. Having decent wingers who could put a few crosses in for him would help a lot as well!
We have paid stupid money for Lukaku when we have Rashford haven’t we. Last season we dropped too many points against smaller teams and he was bought to solve that problem and he has.
I wonder now that we have Alexis if that changes the equation for Lukaku.
Rashford has a better record against top 6 as a striker.
I would bite the bullet and sell Lukaku to afford game time for Rashford and Martial. Our team would be more dynamic as well.
If only you were this levelheaded before you decided to create the Pogba equivalent of this thread. Or was that just to get people wound up?
Yep his performances always become myth like and get rewrote into triumphs in the build up to the next game. Then the next big game comes along and we start at square one again
Martial isn't at his best up front. Additionally, how the team plays impacts how the striker plays as noted by us not playing to Lukaku's strengths.
It isn't entirely fair to compare Lukaku to strikers we had when we were an excellent team.
He doesn't get terrific service at times to say the least. Much better than what anyone got in the Van Gaal days, but not up to the swashbuckling style of old.
Van Nistelrooy will take some beating in my head as our best all round striker. Imagine having peak Van Nistelrooy these days, when up front is the norm.
Do people actually watch these games and come to the conclusion Lukaku is the problem?
Even worse is when we sign real creative forward players like Sanchez, still struggle to score goals and the response is, "sign more players!"
It really couldn't be more obvious at this stage that this is down to Mourinho and what he does on the training pitch (or what he doesn't do).
I don't think it has anything to do with training. We have players who think they can just coast through games and no matter how many times we get stung they refuse to learn.
We will never win the league with Lukaku upfront is a non-existent attacking system implemented by a clueless coach. Sorry.
So buy more players?
Don't know, but you don't win a league by being literally the least hard working team in it.
Lukaku done everything expected of him today, top notch in every department - hold-up play, link-up play, won countless headers and created a multitude of chances for his team mates.
Best performance of the season and it proves he is United quality.
Na...I think Lukaku is pure mid-table quality. We should've waited to get a better striker if there weRe no better options. Just my opinion.
I've been very negative on him, but he's not the issue at the moment.
Benzema has been one of Madrid's best players and being a cornerstone for many of their titles since Higuain left.
Benzema might be out of form in term of goalscoring, but still comfortably a better all-round footballer than Lukaku nonetheless.
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