What do we still need? Aka The never ending story

Discussion in 'Transfer Forum' started by Devil may care, Aug 11, 2018.

  1. Apr 11, 2019

    KingMinger22 City >>> United. Moaning twat

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    I would be distraught if our budget was £200m because that is no where near what it will cost to fix this team.
  2. Apr 11, 2019

    Fosu-Mens Full Member

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    By fix you mean " seriously challenging for PL/CL"? Then yes.
    Removing a large part of the deadwood and building a team for the future, while still getting a safe top 4. Then it should be enough.
  3. Apr 11, 2019

    Godfather Full Member

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    As I've said we need a whole new attack, a rightback, one CB and possibly another midfielder.
  4. Apr 11, 2019

    bosnian_red Worst scout to ever exist

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    We dont need a new attack. Just a RW.
    We definitely need a new midfield with only Pogba being good enough to start, and McTominay and Fred probably just squad players with the others either leaving or should leave.
    CB and RB yeah, though I'd guess we only get one of those 2 and improving one impacting the other regardless.
    In order of priority I'd have it:
    1. All round, controlling central midfielder
    2. Right winger
    3. Right back
    4. Center back
    5. 2nd midfielder, probably a long term holding midfielder
    6. Look at a Pogba replacement for long term as he isnt starting more than a couple more years.
    First 4 would be ideal this year, though 3 of those 4 would also help. 5/6 the next summer.
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2019
  5. Apr 11, 2019

    Devil may care Full Member

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    We saw last night the issues in the forward line and yet people just keep going on about RW and the 2 English kids, on top of that we saw the frustrations that come from a fullback with crap delivery and people still want to spend £50M on a RB that is poor in the final 3rd.

    What we have up top right now isn't going to get us anywhere but a top 4 scramble in the immediate future, look at the main top 4 rivals and they all have attackers in their primes, it is crucial we add an attacker who is ready made and proven to this mix of young players, as the 2 attackers we have in their primes, Sanchez and Lukaku, are done and not good enough respectively.

    That's only going to see us struggle to finish 4th mate, I'm a fan of Martial but he's massively inconsistent, and Greenwood hasn't done anything yet, top clubs don't prep for their season by leaving a massive gap in the squad for a 17 year old who might be good enough in time, if he's good enough he'll get chances, especially if Ole keeps playing 2 strikers which he's been doing. I'm not saying Jovic is the answer, he's had a cracking season but is inexperienced himself, but we need something polished and proven added to this attack to balance it out, it's too erratic and inconsistent.
  6. Apr 11, 2019

    Rawls You'll never find, that microfilm of mine

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    GK: The only real change we need to make here is finding a replacement for DDG if he decides to leave. Otherwise, de Gea and Romero should remain the status quo.

    RB: Dalot should be a long-term option here, although I cannot say for certain whether that will be as a starter or as depth. What is for certain is that Young needs replacing either in Summer 2019 or Summer 2020. Here, we need to find a short-term option; a stopgap would both probably improve on the performances of Young without impeding the potential progress of Dalot. That's why it makes more sense to be targeting someone like Dani Alves on a one-year contract or someone like Meunier (Who is 28 later this year) instead of signing someone like Wan-Bissaka with a similar age profile to Dalot.

    CB: Lindelof should be one of the two starting CBs, and most people seem to think that the other CB we need is not yet at the club. Personally, I think Aldeweireld should not be an option; I don't think it makes sense in the long-run to sign 30-year old CBs. Koulibaly would make more sense, given that he could have a Van Dijk-like impact on our defence. I feel however we should target someone younger again here, like Skriniar. Skriniar is more than three years younger than Koulibaly; if we allow that a CB would be out of their prime at 32 (Which I think is a bit high), Skrinair would give you eight seasons of play whereas Koulibaly would give you five seasons.

    LB: Shaw here is the obvious starter, although we do need long-term depth here. Not an immediate need in Summer 2019, although likely to be a big need in Summer 2020.

    CDM: Recent performances make me think that Fred is capable of being a starter here. Matic on the other hand doesn't have long left at the top level. Provided that Fred continues to perform well, this shouldn't be an immediate need, although will likely be a need in Summer 2020.

    CM: Pogba is a definite starter, provided that he doesn't bolt to Real. McTominay offers good depth at worst and is a potential starter at best. If Herrera leaves and Fred plays mostly at CM, I think we need to make two signings here in Summer 2019. Saul Niguez is a pipe dream so I don't think we should really bother discussing him. Someone like Barella might make more sense here, given that he is attainable in a way Saul is not. We probably also need another option, so signining someone like Doucoure from Watford as a fall-back option mightn't be the worst option, given that he is suited to the PL and would offer good depth at worst.

    RW: Lingard offers good depth, although we do need to improve on him as a starter if we have genuine PL and CL aspirations. Sancho is the obvious link here, and is someone I do expect us to sign. However, we have to temper our expectations. Sancho has only just turned 19, and is likely to experience peaks and troughs throughout his early career. This is something which affects most players; our problem however is that while other clubs can gradually ease these young players in because they have good squad depth, our lack of depth in wide attacking positions will heap a lot of pressure on Sancho's shoulders.

    ST: I think Martial is best when central; moreover, I think he is better as a ST than both Lukaku and Rashford. If it were up to me, I would look to sell Lukaku, and rotate between Martial and Rashford at ST.

    LW: Given how I just noted how Martial is best as a ST, this then becomes a problematic position. Lingard can play here but he doesn't offer top-end ability, and Sanchez seems to be past it. Truth be told, this is a low-key real problem position for us, and at times I think we lose focus of the fact that LW might be as much of a problem position for us as RW. In terms of options, there is an abundance of LW talent in comparison with RW talent, so we shouldn't really be short of options.
  7. Apr 11, 2019

    Escobar Poster originally known as Michel04

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    A lot. We have some serious deficits in our team and god knows how we spent the money the past 4 years
  8. Apr 11, 2019

    Mr H Full Member

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    City spent when the club was required to. Liverpool did when the club was required to.

    There's no reason we should balk at spending considering we have the money and we're a little far from those two clubs.
  9. Apr 11, 2019

    Roboc7 Full Member

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    Even if he recovers form and fitness Sanchez isn’t a right winger, no one in the squad is actually good enough in that position.We need plenty but if we don’t buy a RW we can write next season off before it’s begun.

    Not convinced our budget will be over £150m and given prices we pay we won’t get much for that money. Think Ole is going to have to find some players through the academy to have any chance of being successful. He won’t get the 200m plus required this summer and again next summer and unless we have someone behind the scenes who miraculously suddenly starts unearthing bargains he is really up against it.

    Given the huge investment required in the squad and in Old Trafford (maybe even a new stadium eventually) surely Glazers must be considering selling up. They aren’t going to be able to keep selling the Utd brand as biggest and best for much longer when we are so far off the standards of the top sides and have been since SAF left.
  10. Apr 11, 2019

    bonothom Full Member

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    If Uniteds budget is £200 million then you can bet your life that Woodward will blow most of it on players we don't need, like Bale.
  11. Apr 11, 2019

    Adnan Full Member

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    Martial was a striker coming through the youth ranks and even LVG played him as the forward with good results. Martial has a better first touch and hold up play than either Lukaku or Rashford for a central attacker. What we need ideally is a player who can bring others into play with his hold up and link ability from the #9 position. That player in our current squad is Martial, who not only is better at the above but is also a better more composed finisher too. I think Martial is wasted as a LWF.. With the players we have, we'll create and score enough goals. Just need to sign a player on the right to compliment that.

    Our bigger issues are building up from the back. A CB who could pass between the lines and has recovery pace would do wonders for the team in the first phase. Koulibaly would be my ideal signing for that role and would contribute towards our attack too, due to his ability on the ball. Signing a top class CM is also important for us going forward. Both signings would give us a greater degree of control in games in conjunction with a top class winger. Just 3 signings who're ready to come straight into the team would elevate us to the next level.
  12. Apr 11, 2019

    KingMinger22 City >>> United. Moaning twat

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    Sancho, Griezmann, Wan-Bisakka, Alderweild, a top CM (Kroos), Rice.

    That would be a good start.

    What's that? £450m!? More!?
  13. Apr 11, 2019

    Devil may care Full Member

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    No arguments that this team could do with a ball player added to the defense and midfield, but it wouldn't change the fact Martial doesn't have the tools to be the #9 IMO, and I think it's telling that the last 3 managers have all moved him left, it's because while his touch is better than Rashford and Lukaku, his movement is poor and he doesn't make enough runs, I don't think he has the tools to be the #9 but the main thing is none of these forwards have the consistency to fire a team anywhere near a title challenge, adding a RW won't help because as I say, Ole wont use Martial as the #9, in fact I think Ole has reached the same conclusion as me, that none of them can play the central attacking pivot in a front 3, hence we are bouncing between the 4-4-2 diamond and the 3-5-2 so that he can play a striker tandem closer together.

    I'm 100% certain, no matter our views, that Ole won't use Martial as the #9, and no combination of Rashford/Martial + a RW is gonna fix the fact that our attack simply lacks polished, conistent quality, it was what Sanchez and Lukaku were supposed to give us and they haven't, that needs rectifying with a proven forward, not more U21 players IMO.
  14. Apr 11, 2019

    BrianMcClair'sBarnet Full Member

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    Sorry but I'm somewhat against the possible signing of Alderweireld ,even for 25 million.
    We've had our hands burnt far to often recently (Bastian,Sanchez,Matic) for bringing in players who's best years are clearly behind them.
    I feel Alderweireld would be no different.
  15. Apr 11, 2019

    Sanche7 Full Member

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    Get Jovic for 40-50 mill instead of Griezmann and sell Lukaku.
    Still not sure about Alderweireld though but I think we will go for him as we can't get a top CB and a top RW. Or it will be a top CB and no RW.
    The above list is doable IMO, sell Sanchez, Lukaku, Darmian, Rojo, Bailly for a combined 100 million minimum and then buy Sancho (100), Jovic (40), Bissaka (40), Alderweireld (25), Rice/Rodri (50-60), CM(60) with a bet spend of 220 million. That's very close to the 200 mill budget plus we will be saving a lot of money in wages
  16. Apr 11, 2019

    Adnan Full Member

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    His movement could surely improve under the guidance of Ole who was a top striker in his time. He just needs to be coached, because movement is something that will come if coached.
  17. Apr 11, 2019

    MyOnlySolskjaer Creator of Player Performance threads

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    Shouldn't have to worry then, the club saw fit to give both of them 4-year contracts + additional extension. They are not leaving.
  18. Apr 11, 2019

    RooneyLegend Full Member

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    In case you don't know, we have been spending. Sadly we've spent on the wrong players with ridiculous fees.
  19. Apr 11, 2019

    MrSingh2002 Full Member

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    Joao Felix is now on my wishlist.

    Reminds me a little of Aguero how he makes it look easy.
  20. Apr 11, 2019

    bosnian_red Worst scout to ever exist

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    If we were taking a dramatic/unrealistic look at who needs out and selling them all/letting them leave on a free this summer and starting fresh with players who realistically will be useful now and a few years from now (so basically all players who will almost definitely leave between this summer, next January, next summer and I'd hope no later), we can basically get rid of:
    • Grant
    • Valencia
    • Young
    • Darmian
    • Rojo
    • Jones
    • Bailly
    • Mata
    • Matic
    • Herrera
    • Sanchez
    • Lukaku (will probably want to be a regular starter, not in and out of the squad)
    • Pereira (will want to play more regularly then he ever will here)
    • Fosu Mensah (not good enough)
    13 players, literally half a squad. We're left with:
    1. De Gea
    2. Romero
    3. Pereira/henderson
    4. Dalot
    5. Lindelof
    6. Smalling
    7. Tuanzebe
    8. Shaw
    9. Fred
    10. McTominay
    11. Pogba
    12. Lingard
    13. Martial
    14. Rashford
    15. Greenwood
    16. Chong/Gomes/Garner?
    Basically leaves us with basically 8 players over this summer, January and next summer. Of that, clearly a fullback, starting centerback, 2 midfielders, a starting right winger and some depth in attack (depends on how the 3 younger players develop).
    This all without the scenario that both Pogba and De Gea might not be here past next season.
  21. Apr 11, 2019

    Woziak Full Member

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    Completely agree, we need 3 transfer windows to build PL/CL challenging side. The 200m in the Summer is to correct the madness of the last 7 years, then if we are in the top 3 by next Christmas,we might need to add another 2 players. One being a left back/Utility player like Kieran Tierney or Nathan Ake and the other an up and coming young English attacking midfielder like James Maddison. This would probably cost £75M and then Summer 2020 go out and buy 2 Elite young players like J Sancho and Sergei Milinkosavic to probably replace Pogba in 2020.

    My suggestion;

    2019 - Summer - T Auderweireld(25m), W Bissaka (40M), A Dacoure (40M), H Lozano (40M), D Costa(60M),D Rice (40M)

    2020 - Winter - K Tierney (30M), J Maddison (50M)

    2020 - Summer - J Sancho (110M), Sergei Milinkosavic (90M) - Total investment over 3 windows - £525M

    Players that would be releases over this period; Alexis (35M china), Rojo (15M), Darmian (10M), Bailey (35M), Herrera, A Young, Mata, A Valencia all frees L Grant (1M), N Matic (19M), Pogba (125M) - Total recouped in Sales £240M - Net Spend over 2 years £285M or A net spend of £140M per window.

    ( R Lukaku is 25 has not reached his peak, can and will improve has 45 international goals in 70 odd caps, is Icardi or any other others really any better when they will only be joining for money and no other reason?)

    2020 Squad would look like this, young, Hungry with a British core and the right mentality.

    Goalkeepers, D De Gea, D Henderson, S Romero (Old Pro)

    Wing Backs, Wan Bissaka, D Dalot, K Tierney, L Shaw (All under 24)

    Centre Backs, T Auderweireld, C Smalling, P Jones, V Lindelof, A Tuanzebe

    Centre Defensive Midfielder, Fred, A Dacoure, S McTominay, D Rice

    Attacking Midfielder, J Maddison, J Lingard, A Gomez, A Pereirra, SMS

    Winger, H Lozano, J Sancho, A Martial, D Costa,

    Strikers, M Rashford, R Lukaku, M Greenwood

    This would be a mostly British core of young hungry players with pace to burn and real options to play wingers in a 442, 433, 4312or 343 formation, with a squad of 28 and by keeping Lukaku we also keep the physical option. Sign up big Dave on £400k per week and make him captain.
  22. Apr 11, 2019

    Bwuk Full Member

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    What’s everyone’s thoughts on Jack Grealish?
  23. Apr 11, 2019

    Fosu-Mens Full Member

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    Despite us agreeing that we should build for the long term, i completely disagree with some of the transfers you propose.

    What i agree with:

    Fullback/Wingback: are a good combination with two very solid defensive players(Shaw, AWB) and two good attacking options (Tierney, Dalot).

    Doucoure: If we can get him for £40m, then we should consider it. Especially if Pogba leaves.
    Alderweireld: Short term, cheap option/improvement. Works well.

    What i have issues with:
    CB: If Tuanzebe becomes great, then this might be good enough, but Alderweireld/Smalling/Jones would need replacing/improving around this time. Enough promising central defenders around that we could buy one, without costing the world.

    Central midfield: Fred, McTominay and Rice are 3 players that arguably are better off the ball. One of the reasons we are currently struggling is the lack of players that are good with the ball. Having players able to receive and pass the ball without needing space or conciderable amount of time would benefit the squad.

    CAM: Selling Pogba and ending up with these players would be a big downgrade, regardless of how on/off he is.

    Wingers: 3 finishiers and 1 creator. Costa is a player we should stay well clear of, and Lozano should only be bought if we can get him for a good price and using him as a rotational player.

    Attackers: Lukaku and Rashford; Again two players limited on the ball.

    This team might be worse than our current team when in possession. And it would struggle with keeping the ball against most top sides and we would struggle to control the games against weaker team trying to press.
  24. Apr 11, 2019

    Fosu-Mens Full Member

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    Dependent on price. If Villa goes up he would cost to much to be worth the risk, if they stay down and he can be bought for £20m then he might be worth it --> At worst he is a creative backup that could be sold on for around what we bought him for.
  25. Apr 11, 2019

    jesperjaap Full Member

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    Agree, only two years ago people were laughing about Liverpool finishing ahead of us, they spent a lot of money and spent very well on the whole too. Unless we unearth gems next season that light us up such as Greenwood, Garner, Gomes.....and its too early and too much expect that, unearth gem signings at cheap prices, which we havent done for a long time.....then the only way we can fund the overhaul is with wholesale changes, especially considering the likes of Valencia, Darmian, Rojo, Mata, Herrera, Sanchez could all be off and barely bring in £30m between them.
    I have never been a huge Guardiola fan as a player or manager....the thing that has really impressed me about him though is his ruthlessness in building the team he wants. Eto, Deco, Ronaldhino all out at Barcelona. Kroos, Manduzucic and Schweinsteiger at Bayern....Hart, Zabaletta etc at City. Ferguson and Wenger were the same.
    I am concerned at some of these new contract handed out. Look at the likes of Bailly, Fred, Pogba, Lukaku, Matic thats £250-300m worth of sales right there and I am not saying we should sell them all.....but Pogba is the only one I would actually rather keep regardless of the fee.
    I actually hope 7-8 players leave this summer at least, which I am pretty sure wont happen, if that gives us £350m odd to spend then we cant sign all the top targets we see in the press....but I would rather say Upemecano AND Romagnoli for example than Koulibaily as I think we need two quality centre backs, Bissaka is a definite for me....that would give us a great defence and maybe leave us with £150-200m. I do think we need a potential superstar like a Felix/Sancho for the right side and then we could still have a couple of gambles in midfield like an Ascacibar, Tonali, Rice. The other option is instead of the superstar to sign a good young striker to replace Lukaku lik a Jovic/Lincoln to batlle it out with Rashford and still have Rashford available for the flanks along with Greenwood.

    The only way I really see us competing for the title next year is a top four finish, a couple of big sales and a clear out to raise the funds needed to buy what we need and that is a hell of a lot to happen....but it is possible
  26. Apr 12, 2019

    croadyman New Member

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    I would maybe switch round the first two and possibly three of four, however I totally agree that those are the four positions that simply have to be addressed this summer
  27. Apr 12, 2019

    croadyman New Member

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    A very impressive and measured post
  28. Apr 12, 2019

    Woziak Full Member

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    Hindsight is a wonderful thing and I believe that maybe Swap Felix for D Costa who would be 29 by then but a First 11 in a 4231 formation of;
    D Gea, D Dalot, T Audwereild, V Lindelof, Shaw, Doucoure, SMS, Felix at 10, Sancho, Rashford, Martial.
    That team would have no problem keeping the ball.

    The reserve 11 wouldn't be too bad either;
    D Henderson, W Bissaka, C Smalling, A Tuanzebe, K Tierney, S McTominay, Fred, J Maddison as the 10, H Lozano, J Lingard, R Lukaku/M Greenwood.

    I think Romelu will realise he has not got the touch for a 9 but will be a great player when a proper no 10 pushes him higher up the field and he can conserve his energy rather then running aimlessly down the chanels waiting for passes to never arrive because Pogba likes to hold onto the ball far too long!

    I say this knowing that if we could prize an Ericssen or a Miralem Pjanic, of course it would be a major upgrade but we just don't seem to get this type of intelligent midfield playmaker early on in their career. That's why I believe Sergei Milinkosavic may be possible, still 22, the hype started to wane and he has 2 years left on his contract now.
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2019
  29. Apr 12, 2019

    ThierryHenry14 New Member

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    Just like Arsenal, you need a DOF to look after the transfer. Just look at the work Marc Overmars and Var der Sar do with Ajax.
  30. Apr 12, 2019

    SAFMUTD Full Member

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    Trophies. We need trophies.
  31. Apr 12, 2019

    Sandikan aka sex on the beach

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    It feels like we have this exact thread every single year.

    Centre midfield we're always a couple of players away from a good lineup as well!
  32. Apr 12, 2019

    Sandikan aka sex on the beach

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    Are Arsenal the best choice of club? They've hardly been going great guns this last decade?!
  33. Apr 12, 2019

    Isotope Full Member

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    100% agreed. I think our attack is weak, and I don't see anything yet to change my mind. An addition of another 19 y.o kid won't be suffice, imho.
  34. Apr 12, 2019

    ThierryHenry14 New Member

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    I mean Arsenal needs DOF as well. Just look at the loan transfer Denis Suarez Arsenal did after Mislintat left the club, you can't bring players in based on manager's preference. Same happened in Chelsea for Sarri & Higuain.
  35. Apr 12, 2019

    Andersons Dietician Full Member

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    Supports good football
    DDG
    Dalot Smalling Lindelof Shaw
    Ndombele Saul Pogba
    Felix
    Lukaku Martial
    My opinion on this changes a lot because I wouldn’t mind a 433 with Sancho in it or a 352 but the one thing that needs to change is the speed in which our players move the ball or just make decisions. Because we do as a team tend to shy away from loads of opportunities be it a simple pass or just a slightly riskier one.

    Personally I think Martial and Lukaku are a better pairing than Rashford and when they’ve played together they’ve shown a decent understanding and Martial works better as sort of creator. They also both naturally drifted out wide opening space through the centre.

    We do need a CB but who is really available and attainable and is someone like DeLigt what we need right now or would we be better with more experience or a middle road player like Skriniar and is Varane even really a possibility.
    If we ended up with a couple from this list I’d be more than happy.

    Felix
    Sancho
    Aouar
    Doucoure
    Ndombele
    Neves
    Varane
    Skriniar
    Saul
    Koulibaly
    DeLigt
    Chiesa
    Neres
    WBS
    CHO
    Umtiti
    Rodri
    Fernandes
    Havertz

    2 or 3 from that list and I’d Class it as a great summer.
  36. Apr 12, 2019

    Fosu-Mens Full Member

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    End state summer window 2019; Have a squad that is younger, able to control the games against most sides through playing possessionbased football, players able to press, and on paper look like it is able to secure a safe top 4 spot.

    What we need to do: Sell/release players not suited/able to press, pass or control the ball. Replace them with players that can do this on a regular basis.
  37. Apr 13, 2019

    Sandikan aka sex on the beach

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    Surely the manager's preference is exactly why players should come in.
    There's more examples at Chelsea especially where a player the manager didn't want came in and it was a.disaster
  38. Apr 13, 2019

    willhse456 Full Member

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    I'd really like us to sign Tielemans to replace Herrera, I think we need someone that's good in possession that can also create goal scoring chances. He's looked great since Rodgers took over Leicester, and I doubt he'd be that expensive.
  39. Apr 13, 2019

    MetoTTT New Member

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    I'm not sure he's good enough but he's on loan to Leicester. He has his contract at Monaco till 2022.
  40. Apr 13, 2019

    Devil may care Full Member

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    I'm not going to say it can't be as you're right, but sometimes players are simply suited to certain things, they have strengths and weaknesses, the way Martial plays and moves, I'm just not sure making runs all game will ever be the best fit for him. Truth is though regardless of our views it doesn't appear like Ole has any plans to use him as the #9 in a front 3, in fact I feel like he's looking at the strike duo systems long term due to the type of strikers we have.


    Yeah, I'm not going to be upset if a player like Sancho or Joao Felix comes in the summer, but I just think everyone needs to realize they wont be the quick fix because we'll just be adding more potential and inexperience to a frontline that already consists heavily of that.