Who to buy to address the attack for next season

Discussion in 'Transfer Forum' started by VancouverUtdFan, Dec 30, 2017.

  1. Dec 30, 2017
    #1

    VancouverUtdFan Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2017
    Messages:
    2,514
    Supports:
    Canucks + NE Patriots
    Pogba. It’ll all be dependent and revolve around him with regards to how we look in attack and who United will purchase.

    What we can’t do is waste another prime year of his like we have these first 2 seasons. It’s a shame really because he’s a world class talent but hasn’t been able to quite fully showcase/tap into it here (yet) due to failing to surround him with corresponding top end creative players. It’s time to finally bite the bullet, build around Paul and complete the United attack by paying up for quality players as José has suggested; there’s no other way around it and a rather simple concept - you either pay up or be left behind. United are going to at the very least have to spend on 2 TOP QUALITY STARTING attacking players (RW + #10/SS or CM depending on where they want to play Pogba) to fill the voids by the time next season begins. It’ll likely be 3 as an additional CM option will have to be bought in considering we’re utter shit when either Pogba or Matic are not available + need a Carrick replacement anyways as Mourinho has suggested. Will be interesting to see if they’re able to get 1 done in January. If not, summer it is and it’ll be a busy & critical one at that.

    Here’s how I see the options which José has to choose from. Keep in mind, players/names are hypotheticals and interchangeable so what’s important are the concepts.



    >1A
    Either keep Pogba where he is (beside Matic with license to push up which imo is best suited to get the most out of him) and get a quality #10 or SS behind Lukaku who he can service the ball to and interact with at a high level, creating a powerful channel to cause defenders problems.

    ————————Lukaku
    Martial———Ozil/AG/Dybala———new RW
    ——————Pogba———Matic


    >1B
    If unable to get a quality #10/SS, get another midfielder who can play besides Matic and allow Pogba to play in front of the 2 in a roaming role.

    ——————Lukaku
    Martial———Pogba———new RW
    ————Matic——Goretzka/Pjanic/etc


    >2
    Long shot, but get a #10/SS and a CM to play alongside Matic and let Pogba play as a wide left playmaking threat sort of like how he did at Juvé. Least likely scenario considering it’d create a logjam with both Martial/Rashford having to be bench players and not really suiting the squad personnel in comparison to the available players.

    ———————Lukaku
    Pogba———Ozil/AG/Dybala———new RW
    —————Matic———Goretzka/Pjanic/etc



    ...what most likely ends up happening are the first 2 scenarios in which case that additional CM will be bought. Regardless of if we bring in a top quality starting CAM or CM, a rotational bench but starter level CM will be needed to have that crucial depth which we desperately lack right now. RWer can be just about anyone so didn’t even bother putting any names to it.

    Just as important will be to offload all the dead weight. There’s a number of mediocre players who have been gifted roster spots who just can’t be here anymore if you want to create a world class team+atmosphere. Not to mention a proper new LB/LWB will only add a new dynamic to the attack by opening things up more for our offensive players.
  2. Dec 30, 2017
    #2

    EASTSIDE777 Full Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2007
    Messages:
    779
    Location:
    Bermuda
    It's not a simple question of who we buy. Its more of who wants to come that is good enough to improve us. Most of the top talents seem to not want to come here and we pay the highest wages.
  3. Dec 30, 2017
    #3

    VancouverUtdFan Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2017
    Messages:
    2,514
    Supports:
    Canucks + NE Patriots
    I disagree. Just look at Pogba.

    It’s a case of United not cheaping out anymore and paying the price to acquire available players. It’s the only thing preventing us from getting those players. Reach the fee and clubs will accept, as we did with Juventus for Paul. As Liverpool did with VVD. As City have done for the players they’ve got. And as José has suggested being the case for us missing out and settling for lesser players.

  4. Dec 30, 2017
    #4

    Eyepopper Lowering the tone since 2006

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2006
    Messages:
    62,118
    Urgh, threads like this belong in the transfer forum, where they're closed after 4 replies for being so utterly shit.
  5. Dec 30, 2017
    #5

    Kops 'n' Robertsons Liverpool Fan

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2014
    Messages:
    250
    Location:
    Dublin
    Supports:
    Liverpool
    Harry Kane - £150m? (obvious choice I know).
    He’d be worth every penny, makes intelligent runs and is definitely clinical.
    Pogba would love to have someone like him to link up with.

    Levy would sell at the right price I think especially if Spuds miss out on Top 4.
  6. Dec 30, 2017
    #6

    Walters_19_MuFc Full Member

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2013
    Messages:
    16,112
    Location:
    Birmingham
    Jose will use Pogba exactly how he used Fabregas at Chelsea.

    Number 8 - Games we'll dominate

    Number 10 - Games we need to sure it up

    In my opinion, the focus should be on getting two players who will compliment Lukaku. We need him at his best.

    Right winger

    To me, we need someone to keep the width. In Martial and Rashford, we have the winger types that will want to naturally cut onto their stronger foot.

    What we need is a Nani type of winger, or Valencia (2009). Someone who is going to hug the touchline, take players on, and put in quality deliveries for Lukaku.

    Maybe that's why Jose was after Perisic? Looking at it now, he'd have been perfect for someone like Lukaku.

    Gerard Deulofeu was that type of winger, and he got the best out of Lukaku, assisting him with so many goals. Whilst I'm not saying we should go for Deulofeu, I think we should be looking at that type of player for our right wing.




    #10

    I'm not too sure about this one.

    Trying to figure out whether Lukaku would be better suited with a playmaker (Ozil) or a goalscorer (Griezmann).

    Lukaku does like to run off the ball, but occasionally he does like to drop and get involved in play.

    Think either one would compliment him. Ideally, someone who can do both would be amazing.

    That said, we've got to focus on what Mourinho likes from his 10. Having played Mkhitaryan there early on in the season, and now Lingard, suggests that Mourinho wants a more dynamic 10. Someone who is willing to run off it and create space for others, as well as bagging goals and assists.

    This is why I feel Mourinho will go in for someone like Dybala or Griezmann, or even Fekir. It will also take a bit of pressure off Lukaku, in terms of being the main goal threat.

    Based on what I said above, I'd want our front four to look something like this:

    Lukaku
    Martial Dybala Sanchez

  7. Dec 30, 2017
    #7

    SwSw Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2017
    Messages:
    387
    I know everyone wants a Dybala or Griezzman. However, i think we shouldn't be blowing our budget on both. Instead, we should buy players who can really pick a pass. Ozil and a deep lying playmaker comes to mind

    A 4-3-3 formation with the RW and CM being the emphasis here. Ozil on the RW would be great as his first intention is always to pick a pass. Lukaku would benefit greatly here. No more cutting in from the flanks type of players whose first intention is to shoot.

    Next, the CM who links the defence and the midfield. Someone who plays like Carrick and dictates the tempo. Doing so benefits Pogba. Frees up his defensive duties, helps Matic control the midfield and pushes Pogba up higher. If we do not get such profile player, Pogba has to come deep in order to drive us forward.

    Apart from that, we should also get a quality fullback. Preferably the RB since Young and Shaw can still do a job on the LB offensively. Despite Valencia defensively solidity, his offensive output has been dire for a while now.

    Let's spend smart and not screw up the next window.
  8. Dec 30, 2017
    #8

    Footyislife Full Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2015
    Messages:
    836
    A new manager who knows how to play attacking football & evaluating potential would do us much better if we ever hope to get back to playing the dominating style we used to play. Single biggest issue since SAF left: let's replace someone who's championed our attacking football for 26 years with 3 managers who have no clue/desire to play attacking football. Only to scratch our heads when they fail again and again.

    But for sake of this argument where Mourinho isn't the problem, you really have two choices and in both of them Matic can't be your holding midfielder in a midfield of two with Pogba. His lack of mobility is the reason we are forced to play so defensively with limited FB overlap. And no modern team will reach success without attacking FBs.

    So if we want a midfield of 2 with Matic - Pogba, the only choice is to play a 3-5-2 with the CD's all being pacey (which we have an abundance of). So a 3-5-2 would be:

    New WB - 3 CD - New WB
    Matic - Pogba - Martial
    Lukaku (slimmed down) - (Dybala/Griezmann/Sanchez)

    If we want to play a 4-1-2-3 which i personally prefer as we'd just need 1 superstar wide player and can use the rest of the funds to strengthen the depth at the wide positions (get rid of Blind, Darmian, Mkhi & bring on 2 FBs & 1 Winger). Having that defensive ball winning midfielder allows Pogba to push forward and show why we paid 90m for him, while providing enough cover to Matic to allow our FB's to push forward and support the attacking play.

    Valencia - Bailly - Jones - Shaw (Crossing lessons)
    TFM/Herrera
    Matic - Pogba
    Bale/Sanchez Martial
    Lukaku (Slimmed down)

    Somehow doubt either of those scenarios happen, but kudos to Mourinho if he does accomplish this.
  9. Dec 30, 2017
    #9

    Greck Full Member

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2016
    Messages:
    2,294
    Gonna be honest. Not feeling this idea of building around Lukaku of all people. Like we're just forcing it because of how much we paid for him. That aside I'd get a high workrate box to box mid to complement Pogba and a right winger
  10. Dec 30, 2017
    #10

    haram Full Member

    Joined:
    May 28, 2017
    Messages:
    9,098
    Guys Sanchez is going to City.
  11. Dec 30, 2017
    #11

    LeftyBlaster Full Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2013
    Messages:
    6,646
    Location:
    (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻)
    A bloody attacking coach who knows how to instill movement and decision making.
  12. Dec 30, 2017
    #12

    utdman New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2017
    Messages:
    34
    Ozil
    Mahrez
    Lucas
    Goretzka

    Realistically its the best we can do. If we go for a bigger name in today's market it will cost us the price of all above mentioned combined and we don't just need 1 player. We need 3-4 players who could improve our first team at once.

    Mahrez, although not a world class player will certainly be an improvement for us on the wings and bring in a bit of creativity and few goals as well. Ozil will be on a free and certainly go straight into our first team as creative midfielder/AM.
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 30, 2017
  13. Dec 30, 2017
    #13

    slir32 Full Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2009
    Messages:
    6,299
    Location:
    Sydney
    We are in desperate need of a RW and a #10 buy quality in those positions and we will be a total different team. We also need to buy a backup CDM, a CM (to rotate with Pogba), a future RB and a quality LB to rotate with an injured Shaw.

    We of course should sell players like Blind, Darmian, Young etc to recoup some of the money we spend.
  14. Dec 30, 2017
    #14

    amolbhatia50k Sneaky bum time

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2002
    Messages:
    68,833
    Location:
    india
    I don't see us signing a RW, 10, CDM, CM, RB and LB i.e 6 players in one summer.

    Most likely it'll be a CM, AM/RM/RW and LB. 4 signings tops if we get two attackers instead of one.
  15. Dec 30, 2017
    #15

    slir32 Full Member

    Joined:
    Dec 10, 2009
    Messages:
    6,299
    Location:
    Sydney
    Either do i but i think it may be possible to get most of them in January and Summer combined. Remember also we are still owed a winger from last summer.
  16. Dec 30, 2017
    #16

    VancouverUtdFan Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2017
    Messages:
    2,514
    Supports:
    Canucks + NE Patriots
    Agree with this and is essentially what United have to do. However I’d rather we not sell Young.
  17. Dec 30, 2017
    #17

    Bestietom Full Member

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2013
    Messages:
    2,273
    Location:
    Ireland
    I would like to see this for new Year:-

    Matic--Fabinho/Jorginho

    Malcom-----Pogba-----Martial

    --------------Lukaku--------

    Bring in these 2 players next week. Fabinho or Jorginho and Malcom. Then push Pogba further forward and we will score lots more goals.
  18. Dec 30, 2017
    #18

    Raees Legal Guardian of the Football forums

    Joined:
    May 16, 2009
    Messages:
    26,474
    Dare I say it but losing Lukaku and restarting the C.F. recruitment process or moving Martial to 9 might be a good first step.
  19. Dec 30, 2017
    #19

    IronCroos37 New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2017
    Messages:
    410
    I would like 3 new class fresh players, to start directly in the first team. Thank You. Something like Sandro+Malcom+Griezman.
  20. Dec 30, 2017
    #20

    Igor Drefljak Definitely Russian

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2013
    Messages:
    4,900
    Location:
    The Wastelands
    This is basically what I came in the thread to say. Yeah getting some more quality always helps, but I'd go as far as saying our attack fails as we are so conservative.
    Teams play expressive football, especially City and Liverpool, it looks great, it's entertaining and it's also hard to deal with.

    When they have the ball, players like Mane, Salah, Coutinho, Firmino etc make runs, take players from the opposition defence out of the game, open gaps and find space for themselves.

    What we do in attack is. Lets say Matic has the ball, the rest of the team stands still and just wait for the ball. The movement is horrendous. Lukaku drops deep and out of a goal scoring position. It's easy for defenders to stay with their men.

    That isn't really the players fault, it's how we are expected to play. Very rigid, conservative and always about not conceding a goal first, score second type attitude.
  21. Dec 30, 2017
    #21

    Godfather Full Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2007
    Messages:
    17,846
    Location:
    Austria
    Front 3 still look underwhelming
  22. Dec 30, 2017
    #22

    Jaybomb Banned

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2016
    Messages:
    4,460
    Dybala or Griezmann for SS.

    Perisic or Willian for the wing. Maybe both.

    Alex Sandro for LB.
  23. Dec 30, 2017
    #23

    Turkleton Full Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2016
    Messages:
    223
    This would be my first choice. I believe the players we have now are very talented but are not being helped reach their full potential due to training and tactics.

    For signings it really depends on what the main formation will be. I would like a 4-3-3 so a DLP to play with Pogba and Matic, another attack focused box to box midfielder, and some wide players who can cross. Hopefully Shaw can carry on with his recent progress and reduce the urgency of getting a left back.
  24. Dec 30, 2017
    #24

    Charles Miller Full Member

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2017
    Messages:
    1,710
    Location:
    Brazil
    In the long term i believe we need two full backs; one controling midfielder; one right winger and maybe another CF:
    - Alex Sandro; Sidibe; Kovacic; Griemann(?); Icardi.
  25. Dec 30, 2017
    #25

    James Peril Banned

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2016
    Messages:
    2,389
    Harry Kane would cost more than 150M, and Spurs could sell him for the same fee in two summers. Will not happen.
  26. Dec 30, 2017
    #26

    automaticflare Full Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2016
    Messages:
    1,348
    We should go get ozil and Sanchez for free
    My word would they improve our attacking third without much outlay immediately

    ----matic-pogba-----
    Sanchez-ozil-martial
    -------lukaku--------


    That would free up some cash to look for another midfielder to replace carrick and potentially a full back for either side who would be de facto first choice
  27. Dec 30, 2017
    #27

    MyOnlySolskjaer Creator of Player Performance threads

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2014
    Messages:
    12,720
    Location:
    Player Performance Threads
    If we’re only getting 3 signings then we have to make it count; Dybala, Milinković-Savić and Sanchez.
  28. Dec 30, 2017
    #28

    VancouverUtdFan Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2017
    Messages:
    2,514
    Supports:
    Canucks + NE Patriots
    Bingo.

    No point in settling for players that aren’t world class or of top quality if it’s 3 players we’re getting. Just means that much more money to spend on each buy vs otherwise having to spread it around on more players.
  29. Dec 30, 2017
    #29

    thegregster Harbinger of new information

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2009
    Messages:
    10,061
    Location:
    24 hours behind the transfer muppets
    Son Heung-min has only two years left on his contract at the end of the season.
    I would like us to be in for him. Very underrated.
  30. Dec 30, 2017
    #30

    adexkola Arsenal supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2008
    Messages:
    32,744
    Location:
    Me, and you. Yo momma, and yo cousin too.
    Supports:
    orderly disembarking on planes
    Let's buy out Sarri's contract and make him the offensive coordinator.
  31. Dec 30, 2017
    #31

    NotoriousISSY $10mil and I fecked it up!

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2012
    Messages:
    14,162
    Location:
    up north
    We need one of those elusive ghost like players. Someone who not only creates, but pops up in those areas where the ball flashes across the box.

    I don’t know who that is, but in the system we will play with Lukaku...that is the ‘profile’.

    As well as an actual winger of course.

    At this moment in time I’d like to see us go for Mahrez or Fekir + 1. But highly doubtful.
  32. Dec 30, 2017
    #32

    DannyCAFC Full Member

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2014
    Messages:
    1,470
    Supports:
    Charlton Athletic
    SMS, Sandro, Meunier

    3-5-2, United have looked better attacking in this system IMO. Quicker transitions, more dynamic build-up with the central players linking more fluidly. The problem is the lack of natural attacking width/quality coming from the WB areas, and the need for more creativity/end product from CM other than Pogba.

    I think these 3 would solve those issues. Sandro is excellent on the ball and a superb crosser, Meunier used to be a RW so is also great in the final third with the technical skills of a DM. Both are physical (Sandro is 5'11" but built, Meunier is 6'3") and can get up and down the pitch all day and stretch the play, they should be able to patrol the wings effectively largely on their own, with Pogba and SMS drifting wide to link up with them in the half-spaces.

    Milinkovic-Savic I think is verging on world-class, I expect him to be in the conversation of best CM's in the world within the next 2 years assuming he makes a big move soon. He's Lazio's creative fulcrum and provides a good number of goals from MF, both of which should take some pressure off Pogba and allow him to control the game in a more simple manner at times rather than looking to be the sole creative spark in the team centrally.

    He's also highly physical (6'3", strong, good in the air) and great at holding up the ball, I think this would even allow him to move to a target-man role as an out-ball further forward if needs be to back-up Lukaku/enable Mourinho to rest him (which he said yesterday he needs to but isn't able to do). This would absolve the need to spend big money on an additional striker he'd also eat in to Martial/Rashford's minutes.

    All 3 of these should be reasonable realistic transfers with a total outlay of around £175-£180m, some of which can be funded by selling off some of the deadwood/fringe-players (Darmian, Mkhitaryan, Blind) + 1 of the CB's (Rojo would be my pick).
  33. Dec 30, 2017
    #33

    An Irish Red Full Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2009
    Messages:
    6,145
    Location:
    Ros Earcáin/Tuaim/an Baile Meánach
    We need two attackers as Martial is the only one of the 'three' behind Lukaku that is good enough to build around.

    We could get away with one if we played Pogba further forward and bought a top central midfielder to replace him mind.
  34. Dec 30, 2017
    #34

    Ninja7Red Full Member

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2017
    Messages:
    236
    Location:
    In the effin' Promised Land
    Hehe! Brought a chuckle out of me!
  35. Dec 30, 2017
    #35

    United never give up Banned

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2017
    Messages:
    196
    Number 1 transfer priority should be an attacking coach.

    Jose is a great organiser, but its clear he isn't the most accomplished at coaching attacking patterns. Even Sir Alex delegated a lot to Carlos, Jose would be wise to bring in a top attacking coach to establish more consistency and reliability within our attacking play.

    This, in combination with a marquee attacking signing, would stand us in good stead. Throwing money at the situation alone won't fix all our problems - this isn't football manager/FIFA.
  36. Dec 30, 2017
    #36

    Rozay Master of Hindsight

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2012
    Messages:
    12,303
    Location:
    #SmallingPlusOne
    Main thing to purchase is a fecking clue.

    We will go nowhere without a clear strategy. This is the reason why everyone knows that Jose would not have the same City squad playing the same way.

    I’d like a foundation, first and foremost, that indicates that we know exactly what we want to do. I said in another thread, but nobody can even say with confidence what formation we will line up with from game to game. For too long, it appears our plan hasn’t extended much further than ‘buying good defenders to defend’ and ‘buying good attackers to attack’. Other than that, we play more defensive ones against good teams, and more offensive ones against weak teams.

    Mkhitaryan, for example, seems to have been bought without a plan. I remember Jose saying last year that his plan was to buy ‘one defender, one striker, one midfield player and one creative’. I appreciate he wouldn’t go into tactical depth in such a conference, but the impression is that Mkhitaryan was just bought to add a ‘creative’ player to the squad. Not much thought beyond that in terms of how he will specifically fit in. He was initially put on the right. Then in the middle. Just ‘be creative’ somewhere basically.

    If we have a clear plan, adding the right players would yield far greater return than just sending them out there to play. I don’t even care if our plan is defensive at this point. The press can do one. Just let our players know how they fit into a clear plan.
  37. Dec 30, 2017
    #37

    Von Mistelroum Full Member

    Joined:
    May 21, 2015
    Messages:
    2,245
    I think that if, as seems likely, we don't buy in Jan and fall outside of the top 4, then we might struggle not only to attract top class players, the likes of Pogba and Dr Gea who are top tier talents and deserve to be winning titles, might decide to move on.
  38. Dec 30, 2017
    #38

    Damien Self-Aware RedCafe Database (and Admin) Staff

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2010
    Messages:
    80,986
    Yeah, so many opposition fans (Liverpool, City etc) say Martial etc are good enough players but there's no clear attacking strategy in games compared to the other teams.

    Signing another attacking player will just be like a sticking plaster. Might work well to begin with but in the long run unless we have a purpose he'll end up like our other players.
  39. Dec 30, 2017
    #39

    Theonas Full Member Scout

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2013
    Messages:
    3,978
    Location:
    Stockholm, Sweden
    Absolutely. The underrating of our players or overrating of our rivals' depending which angle you look at it is really bizarre. Obviously if the new addition is Ronaldo or Neymar, that can probably make a difference on its own but there are about 3 or 4 players of that quality in the world, they are not realistic targets. The level after that is like you say will just end up like what we have already because the level after that needs more help tactically and coaching wise.
  40. Dec 30, 2017
    #40

    Devil may care Full Member

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2010
    Messages:
    29,844
    We need to decide on an actual formation, this bullshit of swapping from 4-2-3-1 to 4-3-3 when we face a good team means we autmotacilly start on the backfoot in big games, as whoever the player is that is only drafted in for dogsbody work in the 4-3-3 is not of the standard required, like the current two we use in that role.

    I think a creative CM not a #10 is needed, and a versatile attacker who can play off the right or behind the striker, but more than anything we need to improve the attacking training of the team, we look like a bunch of strangers out there in a lot of games.

    Great attacks aren't always of the videogame build of MSN at Barca, sometimes they are greater than the sum of their parts, even our own Yorke and Cole, neither were world class strikers but as a partnership with Giggs and Becks supplying they excelled.

    I agree with that, he should have competition for the spot but Mourinho's refusal to move away from a big man striker will likely see us plod on with this.