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Why aren't we coached as an attacking unit?

Discussion in 'Manchester United Forum' started by abdo99, Feb 1, 2018.

  1. Feb 1, 2018
    #1

    abdo99 Full Member City Lover

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    This is something that has been apparent throughout Jose's tenure so far but there surely has to be an answer for it. We look clueless everytime we need to get back into a game and it's a well known fact that Mourinho doesn't coach attacking patterns. Eden Hazard alluded to this last season and there are teams with inferior players than us but have better cohesive units in attack. Tottenham last night looked like a team out there but we were a bunch of strangers with no understanding whatsoever. Obviously Sanchez is still getting used to the team but his transition would've been a lot smoother if the team is well coached from an attacking perspective. A team with the attacking talent and depth of Sanchez, Lukaku, Pogba, Martial, Lingard, Rashford, Mata should not struggle so much to create chances and score goals. We are relying too much on moments of individual brilliance and this hurts us in situations where we need to think instinctively and make decisions on the pitch. The question is do we have any short term fix or does Jose bring in an attacking coach to help him? Or maybe he isn't the man to get the best out of these players? I'd start off by saying we need to pick a formation and best 11 and stick with it to build an understanding between players.
    Last edited: Feb 1, 2018
  2. Feb 1, 2018
    #2

    VeevaVee despite the protests, wears Ugg boots

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    It's definitely something that needs a lot of work and it's very frustrating to see.
    I'm hoping this will happen now we have Sanchez.
  3. Feb 1, 2018
    #3

    Foxbatt Full Member

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    Rui Faria needs to go and Jose needs to get a top quality coach for United.
  4. Feb 1, 2018
    #4

    ash_86 Full Member

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    Unfortunately It's not what Jose likes to do. We could try different formations but coaching wise it's not going to get better, unless players stumble on it by themselves.
  5. Feb 1, 2018
    #5

    haram Banned

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    There are games where Spurs look clueless as well. Our game vs Arsenal was clinical attacking play. All these threads come out when we lose a game. We beat these lot at our ground and they beat us at theirs. Move on.
  6. Feb 1, 2018
    #6

    el3mel Full Member

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    I'm only wondering why these kind of threads always pop up whenever we had a bad game but we hear nothing we got a good one.

    Always it has become terribly boring mentioning Hazard comments every time as it was a fact. The guy has been a hypocrite and said previously Mourinho has transformed him when the latter was in discharge.

    It was a terrible game from the first 11 seconds. No one really well today even the defense who was always good had a shocker, not just the attacking side.
  7. Feb 1, 2018
    #7

    MaxiPaxi likes to shove his mum's boiled eggs up his rectum

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    Was it? I saw two mistakes that we capitalised on, which is fortunate. I think we don't have a clear attacking cohesion, plan etc.. whatever you want to call it. Our players don't seem to be pulling out wide or dropping deep to create pockets of space. It's all very static. When you see teams like Liverpool and City who are clearly being coached in the final third - it makes our attackers look like mugs - which our players obviously not.
  8. Feb 1, 2018
    #8

    haram Banned

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    Liverpool sacrifice their defensive side so they can press and counter attack. Where is this great attacking coaching when teams sit deep against them? Where was it when we went to Anfield and they had the advantage in midfield? Is Lingard’s form a fluke? All just down to him? Or are we working on movement and link play?

    There was an attacking plan vs Arsenal. It worked so well we took a 2 goal lead and sat on it and then broke for the 3rd.
  9. Feb 1, 2018
    #9

    el3mel Full Member

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    They made mistakes at this game because we pressed them high in both goals. We forced these mistakes to happen. That's what Spurs did to us today too.
  10. Feb 1, 2018
    #10

    haram Banned

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    Of course Rashford, Martial, Lingard and Lukaku total goals and assists, and our increase in goals in general has nothing to do with us working on attacking play. It is down to us replacing Herrera with Matic.

    Maybe you know, we have Lukaku working in different attacking patterns compared to Ibra? And it is helping our other forwards?

    Forgot Lukaku and Mourinho are shit, sorry.
  11. Feb 1, 2018
    #11

    abdo99 Full Member City Lover

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    This isn't a knee jerk reaction to this game. It's an underlying issue since Mourinho took over and clear to see even in games we win. With teams like Tottenham and Liverpool you can see patterns being repeated but with us it's very hit and miss and the players make it up as they go along.
  12. Feb 1, 2018
    #12

    gr3yham3 Full Member

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    Exactly this. Spurs have only lost once at home so far. Other top 6 teams have been beaten there quite often. I kind of expected a loss, Sanchez or not. A draw would have been a great result, similar to the draw we had Anfield. Our current points total is more of a result of those 3 consecutive draws in December, that loss to Huddersfield and maybe failing to get a draw out of the home game against City. Getting those points would have put us only 3 points behind City if my math is correct.
  13. Feb 1, 2018
    #13

    el3mel Full Member

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    Why do people keep mentioning Spurs and Liverpool as the example we should be like ? The only team that's above us in the league and are much better than us and we should try to do more like them are City. Spurs had some shocking draws against nothing teams recently they aren't away from criticism and Liverpool have just lost to Swansea without even scoring a single fecking goal in 90 minutes! Spurs beating us in a single game changes nothing, they are terrible examples to be taken by us.

    BTW I'm sure you know Poch shocking record away from home against big teams as well.
  14. Feb 1, 2018
    #14

    haram Banned

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    For the record, we have scored the same amount of goals as Spurs and they have Harry Kane.
  15. Feb 1, 2018
    #15

    MaxiPaxi likes to shove his mum's boiled eggs up his rectum

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    I watched a lot of Liverpool games this season and I've noticed that Coutinho is really a big miss for them. He starts off by picking the ball up at around 35 yards from goal, passing it straight to a player directly in front of him. The receiving player then lays it off and he continues dribbling with intricate one two. It creates chaos when done right. I've seen Salah and Mane try to replicate it but they're nowhere near as good and better closer to the edge of the box and being played in rather than creating moves themselves. There is a clear cohesion there. Liverpool haven't did great in some game but when their plan works it's very good.

    As for us, how many times can you name where we worked teams? Usually, with us it's - Martial, Rashford, Lingard are trying to smash in a banger. If that doesn't happen we resort this reactionary football where we hope the other team makes mistakes or worse of all its percentage football where we aimlessly cross the ball into the box and such.

    Of course, rely on those methods too from time to time but with us it seems to be our Plan A.
  16. Feb 1, 2018
    #16

    MaxiPaxi likes to shove his mum's boiled eggs up his rectum

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    Yes but if you look at Spurs last night, besides their two goals, they've also played very good incisive football. I mean, I can remember at least 3 times Spurs played brilliantly to carve out chances. Hardly see it at United - in a sense that you go to yourself - well these players have clear chemistry between them.
  17. Feb 1, 2018
    #17

    haram Banned

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    So our forwards are just getting goals and assists via ‘bangers’? I’m sorry, you need to create space, movement, make runs, have a high work rate. It’s not a fluke, its been worked on. The difference from last season isn't just down to luck.
  18. Feb 1, 2018
    #18

    el3mel Full Member

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    I think after their goal for some minutes we played well and created 2 or 3 good chances. The OG later on has destroyed us and we seemed to have given up on the game very strangely and that's one point of the main criticism today.

    Spurs had very good games, but they, like Liverpool, pretty inconsistent and got some shocking draws from time to time and that's why they are in this position in the league. The point is, for both Liverpool and Spurs since they are competing for nothing it's always easy to take the good matches they had and ignore the bad ones, but for us, watching the team on weekly basis it's the opposite.

    The team that plays consistent good attacking football in the league are City. The others like Liverpool and Spurs are very inconsistent with their style. We're just following the rule " the grass is always greener on the other side".
  19. Feb 1, 2018
    #19

    MaxiPaxi likes to shove his mum's boiled eggs up his rectum

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    Well we obviously have some semblance of how to attack but you wouldn't call us a swashbuckling team or identify us with a certain style of play when it comes to attack.
  20. Feb 1, 2018
    #20

    PaidMonk New Member

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    I'm going for the big fish, Mou needs to go. He clearly doesn't fit the profile of a united manager.

    Come next season we better have a more attack-minded highly rated manager.
  21. Feb 1, 2018
    #21

    haram Banned

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    No because we have a larger focus on defending as well. You cant have both straight away. Mourinho is working towards a strong balance. Has the attacking improved? Yes. We are working on it.
  22. Feb 1, 2018
    #22

    MaxiPaxi likes to shove his mum's boiled eggs up his rectum

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    Funny enough I thought we looked very exciting. A lot of urgency. Martial and Sanchez playing one twos and getting into space. Switching play from one side to another with that Pogba pass to Young where he had a lot of space. We looked largely good but it's like, honestly the first time I've seen us this season where we played like we're out to go for the jugular. Agree second goal killed us mentally.
  23. Feb 1, 2018
    #23

    MaxiPaxi likes to shove his mum's boiled eggs up his rectum

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    Well I agree to this statement. But don't you think if we did get an attacking coach we could find this balance a bit quicker? I mean it's no shame. Sir Alex had Steve McClaren and Queiroz who were brilliant coaches - who by all accounts did all the tactical training whilst Sir Alex observed.
  24. Feb 1, 2018
    #24

    Sterling Archer Full Member

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    With you on this. We actually had some good potential show with Sanchez, Martial Lingard and Lukaku. Just seemed they were all half chances that petered out. Certainly seemed the energy died out with the own goal.

    My biggest issue this game was our midfield. It was absent. Matic was awful. And Pogba may well have stayed in the dressing room.

    Once we get proper balance we’ll be fine.
  25. Feb 1, 2018
    #25

    haram Banned

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    Perhaps, but attacking coaches could lean on pressing in certain ways which Mourinho doesn’t agree with from a defensive stand point. Mourinho has his way of defending and attacking as a unit. An attacking coach might require for the team to setup slightly different which compromises our defence. We are building our team and need to work on the stability and balance first. And then as we grow, sharpen our attacking/pressing/defensive play.
  26. Feb 1, 2018
    #26

    MaxiPaxi likes to shove his mum's boiled eggs up his rectum

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    Well you're right. It could a be a case of Mourinho hiring someone who just makes our team worse because they're getting instructions from people with two different mindset.
    Anyway, I think we will find balance and our attack will improve further. There is nothing to suggest it wont. It improved from last year.
  27. Feb 1, 2018
    #27

    el3mel Full Member

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    Let's agree that we are definitely not the finished article at the moment. There's a room to improve many things in the team. What I'm saying is I think we aren't that bad as some believe us to be. Yesterday was a terrible day from the very first few seconds though.
  28. Feb 1, 2018
    #28

    Fergie Steps In New Member

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    Through-balls and penetrating passes are CONSISTENTLY being over/under hit. If the players are sufficiently training that technique during the week, then the players are to blame. However, if the players are NOT sufficiently training that technique during the week, then the blame lies with the manager and coaching staff.
  29. Feb 1, 2018
    #29

    MaxiPaxi likes to shove his mum's boiled eggs up his rectum

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    Yeah for sure. I agree with that 100% it's just frustrating, just human nature to expect everything at once. Doesn't help the lot across the road playing like they are.
  30. Feb 1, 2018
    #30

    MaxiPaxi likes to shove his mum's boiled eggs up his rectum

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    Another thing that's grating - we can't seem to keep the ball under pressure. It's unbelievable. Swansea did it excellently few years back so don't tell me we don't have the personnel.
  31. Feb 1, 2018
    #31

    el3mel Full Member

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    Yeah I know. It has been a frustrating day.
  32. Feb 11, 2018
    #32

    Bastian Full Member

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    Are all teams coached specifically in specific attacking drills? If you are organised, know your roles, tactically sound and have gifted attacking players, I'm sure many managers trust them to play their own game up front.

    What did Clough do?

    I think our problems are more in terms of mentality, than in terms of particular coaching. That's of course also down to the manager.
  33. Feb 11, 2018
    #33

    engulfing Full Member

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    The problem isn't the attacking tactics that's good enough, we just couldn't finish today. The fact our best finisher martial fluffed 3 great chances tells you everything. We had more than enough chances to win, we just didn't take them.
  34. Feb 11, 2018
    #34

    charlenefan Far less insightful than the other Charley

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    Rooney said on MNF Fergie never worked on attacking shape/tactics and just let the players figure it out when they got out onto the pitch
  35. Feb 11, 2018
    #35

    flappyjay Full Member

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    I remember RVP scoring a goal in his first season and he said that he and Valencia had worked on it with Meulensteen . Rooney could be sprouting b.s or maybe rvp was lying
  36. Feb 11, 2018
    #36

    Rawls You'll never find, that microfilm of mine

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    Meulensteen working with van Persie and Valencia was more a case of developing certain moves and a certain chemistry between players as opposed to a case of developing an over-arching tactical strategy. Chelsea under Conte are similar in the automatisms they use; pre-ordained moves developed in training sessions that the players almost instinctively complete in matches. I think when Rooney was referring to SAF not working on attacking shape/tactics, he was more referring to how there was no real emphasis on positional play (Like a Guardiola team for instance), whereby every single player has to be in a certain position on the pitch based on where the ball is.
  37. Feb 11, 2018
    #37

    Jazz Full Member

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    We keep coming back to this and I 100% think we aren't being coached properly in this respect. Jose really needs to add to his coaching team.

    We need some top class coaches in to give him a different perspective. Otherwise it doesn't matter who we buy, we will keep having the same problems.
    It frustrates me as well because this is something the manager can implement without too much fuss. It would also help him a lot, so why not do something?
  38. Feb 11, 2018
    #38

    KingCantona87 Full Member

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    I think the attacking training/coaching is absolute shite and agree fully. I do however feel that the problems with this squad run deeper than just attacking coaching.

    Whenever we go behind or things don't go to plan, it all falls apart.
  39. Feb 11, 2018
    #39

    Murder on Zidane's Floor You'd better not kill Giroud

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    I'm sure the attacking players would train things and work on combinations etc but when it came to match day Fergie wouldn't instruct us to do something specific.
  40. Feb 11, 2018
    #40

    Booda New Member

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    Managers don't tell/show players how to play football , they work on shape for set pieces and thats about it