Typo (on phone)
Louis Van Gaal | 2015-16 Performance Thread
- Thread starter Nighteyes
- Start date
-
In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik and Imran hold a long overdue conversation about United's awful league form with 1 win in 7. They discuss a disappointing draw at Bournemouth, a not so disappointing draw against Liverpool and a crushing defeat at Chelsea - Is time nearly over for Erik Ten Hag?
Then in a special second half of the pod, Nik welcomes Natalie ( https://twitter.com/natalie_17) to discuss the fortunes of Manchester United Women as they booked a place in the FA Cup Final after a historic first ever win vs. Chelsea.
He obviously doesn't like big personalities in the dressing room - its why he ended up falling out with Van Persie.
I don't think LVG is against big personalities or leaders, as he obviously made Rooney ours. The problem that i see, is that he appears quite one dimensional in his thinking, so if he doesn't think someone fits with what he wants to do, then he just wants them out, dismissing any notion that they could still play an important part. It seems they have to contribute the way he wants them too, or not at all.
Hernandez is a great example, LVG didn't believe he could play in his system, and so he got rid, completely disregarding his previous goal-scoring exploits for Utd, and what he has proven he can regularly contribute as a goal threat coming off the bench.
It baffles me still, -considering how short we are for goals and goalscorers- to fathom why Chica could not have contributed yet again this season, simply by doing what he has done for us so many times before. LVG has inexplicably traded a situation where we could have kept a proven impact substitute and goalscorer, -who would also endure being a sub- for a situation where we have absolutely no striker options whatsoever on the bench. Just how could that possibly be a preferable scenario in LVG's mind? What possible logic concludes that having less striking options is somehow deemed advantageous enough to outweigh the obvious benefits of a proven goalscorer/impact sub at our disposal all season, for absolutely no outlay.
It just makes no sense to me, yet it is this bizarre thinking that has contributed greatly to the situation we now find ourselves in. Already out of the CL, and still struggling for inspiration, goals and confidence domestically.
one of the worst in-game managers I've seen in the premiership in recent memory.
He just sits there and no tactical reaction whatsover to what is happening in the game. There was a period yesterday when were losing and Bournemouth had wave after wave of attacks, and he just sat there glum, looking like he'd rather elsewhere. I'm not asking him to stand per se, but to try and alter the game by changing our form/shape, trying to fix what's wrong.
When he does make substitutions, its like they've been randomly drawn out of a hat, and form no correlation with anything occuring in the game.
It's like he sets us out tactically before a game, and will not deviate from that all. It's rather weird and quite poor.
He just sits there and no tactical reaction whatsover to what is happening in the game. There was a period yesterday when were losing and Bournemouth had wave after wave of attacks, and he just sat there glum, looking like he'd rather elsewhere. I'm not asking him to stand per se, but to try and alter the game by changing our form/shape, trying to fix what's wrong.
When he does make substitutions, its like they've been randomly drawn out of a hat, and form no correlation with anything occuring in the game.
It's like he sets us out tactically before a game, and will not deviate from that all. It's rather weird and quite poor.
Similar when Martial first arrived and scored them goals looking deadly, then moved to the wing. When questioned on this LVG replied he isnt interested in individuals and thinks for the benefit of the team. Yet these individuals are the ones who win managers games. things like being OCD on having left footed centre halves look nice and balanced on paper but common sense always prevails, which his management style appears to lack. its like he manages on calculation than logicHernandez is a great example, LVG didn't believe he could play in his system, and so he got rid, completely disregarding his previous goal-scoring exploits for Utd, and what he has proven he can regularly contribute as a goal threat coming off the bench.
It baffles me still, -considering how short we are for goals and goalscorers- to fathom why Chica could not have contributed yet again this season, simply by doing what he has done for us so many times before. LVG has inexplicably traded a situation where we could have kept a proven impact substitute and goalscorer, -who would also endure being a sub- for a situation where we have absolutely no striker options whatsoever on the bench. Just how could that possibly be a preferable scenario in LVG's mind? What possible logic concludes that having less striking options is somehow deemed advantageous enough to outweigh the obvious benefits of a proven goalscorer/impact sub at our disposal all season, for absolutely no outlay.
It just makes no sense to me, yet it is this bizarre thinking that has contributed greatly to the situation we now find ourselves in. Already out of the CL, and still struggling for inspiration, goals and confidence domestically.
If Hernandez was here he would struggle, that Sums up VG
It's like he expects the real world players to perform like a computer program, eg if player A receives the ball at point B and runs at 8mph and shoots they score every time, if this doesn't happen they're not performing the flossofy as expected, he's a fecking idiot, and I was glad we got him by the way.
He complains all season about no striking options, no offensive threat, no one running in behind defenders, no one taking their chances after selling the one striker who could do all that and he is having an amazing season at Leverkusen. "Philosophy"!
Seriously though guys, what the feck is he doing that makes the offensive players underperform?
Tactics and philosophy. It's that simple. Zero pace on the passes. Zero supporting runs made to draw defenders off. Zero runs made into channels or into space behind defenders. Movement off the ball is slow. It's a combination of all these.
Teams are lining up the same way against us, playing counter attacking football. Yet our philosopher still being stubborn of playing the same way, making the same weird selections and substitutions.
Some may say injuries was a factor but a great manager like SAF, could use fringe players and get past teams at the bottom half of the table. Overall, I think LVG has started to fall apart slowly and surely. I really can't see him managing us the next season. Even if things does turn around, he has do more harm than good for his time here and I don't think any of the players/fans can accept this period of darkness anymore.
Some may say injuries was a factor but a great manager like SAF, could use fringe players and get past teams at the bottom half of the table. Overall, I think LVG has started to fall apart slowly and surely. I really can't see him managing us the next season. Even if things does turn around, he has do more harm than good for his time here and I don't think any of the players/fans can accept this period of darkness anymore.
Said that a few weeks back.
I think we're here and early. He's not getting until the end of the season.
He's now a shit manager.
He's lost the fans from what I gather, no real way back for him I don't think.
The way we're set up just doesn't seem to suit many of our attacking players, does it?
You can understand one or maybe even two players being played slightly out of position for the sake of overall functionality but for me Mata, Carrick, Herrera and Martial are all being misused, to varying degrees.
He simply needs to revert to an point "backward" 4-3-3, and get a midfield of Hererra, and Schneiderlin playing together with one of Carrick/ Basti. His needless desire to go back to the point forward 4-3-3 (and sticking with Rooney) have got him into a right mess.
His starting XI was always going to leak goals. Carrick, Fellaini, Mata, Rooney... Zero pace among them, so that's midfield over run straight off the bat.
His substitution.... Substitution. Singular. 2-0 down at home to Norwich. One sub. Thankfully it was to take the tall clown off, he should never be in the XI.... or the bench.
He then sends Varela to warm up... Like we needed a full back switch. Luckily, Luis got so engrossed in his clipboard, he totally forgot about Varela, who spent the last 35mins warming up.
Rooted to his seat, no passion, no reaction, no response other than to put Smalling upfront for the last ten minutes like some Sunday league roll of the dice... All in the same week after saying we don't need Wilson.
He boo's rang around Old Trafford & rightly so. The man is a sham, Utd will not win anything under him & he's getting worse instead of better after his £250m spending spree. Get him out & far away from our club.
His substitution.... Substitution. Singular. 2-0 down at home to Norwich. One sub. Thankfully it was to take the tall clown off, he should never be in the XI.... or the bench.
He then sends Varela to warm up... Like we needed a full back switch. Luckily, Luis got so engrossed in his clipboard, he totally forgot about Varela, who spent the last 35mins warming up.
Rooted to his seat, no passion, no reaction, no response other than to put Smalling upfront for the last ten minutes like some Sunday league roll of the dice... All in the same week after saying we don't need Wilson.
He boo's rang around Old Trafford & rightly so. The man is a sham, Utd will not win anything under him & he's getting worse instead of better after his £250m spending spree. Get him out & far away from our club.
I don't think we'll finish in the top 4 if he lasts the season. For a club that spunks money like Michael Jackson at an antiques fair it's just not good enough.
definitely time to upgrade the vote to go now.
what lower ebb than losing to Norwich at home after a long winless run!?
what lower ebb than losing to Norwich at home after a long winless run!?
Recorded the game, just got done with it. Can't fecking believe we lost at home to Norwich; particularly after a great first twenty minutes. He seems to have taken all the criticism about playing style to heart and decided to sacrifice all defensive stability in search of goals. I'd rather we continued keeping it tight at the back and bore teams into submission.
Last edited:
a poor premiership manager.
He has never adapted to this league, and his philosophy doesnt work here. Keeping him for however long people chant for it wont change that.
He has never adapted to this league, and his philosophy doesnt work here. Keeping him for however long people chant for it wont change that.
What did he have to say for himself in the press conference?
Well I'm glad that penny finally dropped.
He is not the playing the attacking football his teams have played in the past. He seems to have forgotten what made him successful.
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Get it done!
When he started, I wanted him to clear out the dead wood, sure up our defence and get us back in the title race. He's done those things, yet somehow I still think it's time for him to bow out.
Given the funds spent and the amount of control he has been given, the results and performances just aren't good enough. He came with a big reputation and has been allowed to make wholesale changes wherever he sees fit, including offloading an incredible number of players, full-scale changes to the make-up of the training grounds, to quirky tweaks such as the number of seats on his row in the dugout and the order in which the players sit in the dressing room.
He seemed to have a plan in place, but given his proposed three-year spell, he needed to hit the ground running and though we all wish it were different, it's perhaps time to admit that it hasn't worked out. Getting into the Champions League was a reasonable start, but that may have been a by-product of other sides underperforming. Our cup runs haven't been great. We were awful in the Champions League. We aren't making meaningful progress in the Premier League.
If he goes, I don't think he will be missed and it'll be a ignominious end to a terrific career.
If he stays, I would love to see him have the strength of conviction to try something different. The current philosophy isn't working, chuck that notepad out the window, get on that touchline and give it some old-fashioned welly. What harm can it do at this stage?
Given the funds spent and the amount of control he has been given, the results and performances just aren't good enough. He came with a big reputation and has been allowed to make wholesale changes wherever he sees fit, including offloading an incredible number of players, full-scale changes to the make-up of the training grounds, to quirky tweaks such as the number of seats on his row in the dugout and the order in which the players sit in the dressing room.
He seemed to have a plan in place, but given his proposed three-year spell, he needed to hit the ground running and though we all wish it were different, it's perhaps time to admit that it hasn't worked out. Getting into the Champions League was a reasonable start, but that may have been a by-product of other sides underperforming. Our cup runs haven't been great. We were awful in the Champions League. We aren't making meaningful progress in the Premier League.
If he goes, I don't think he will be missed and it'll be a ignominious end to a terrific career.
If he stays, I would love to see him have the strength of conviction to try something different. The current philosophy isn't working, chuck that notepad out the window, get on that touchline and give it some old-fashioned welly. What harm can it do at this stage?
14 wins in the last 33 games.
Let that sink in, and then tell me he's doing a good job.
Let that sink in, and then tell me he's doing a good job.
Is anyone on this forum actually saying that though?
The way he set us up against Wolfsburg and Norwich with one midfielder(Schweini/Carrick) basically covering the entire midfield alone reeks of desperation.
He has been trying to appease the fans and play more direct but with that also neglected our defensive organisation.
That is a big negative for me, he shouldn't have turned to such drastic decisions, but instead kept the belief that our players would finally get the goals we had been searching for while keeping the good shape we had.
He is an honest man and i like that, but he is beginning to look out of his depth right now.
I have been defending him here, but i also didn't expect to get beaten by both Bournemouth and Norwich.
He has been trying to appease the fans and play more direct but with that also neglected our defensive organisation.
That is a big negative for me, he shouldn't have turned to such drastic decisions, but instead kept the belief that our players would finally get the goals we had been searching for while keeping the good shape we had.
He is an honest man and i like that, but he is beginning to look out of his depth right now.
I have been defending him here, but i also didn't expect to get beaten by both Bournemouth and Norwich.
Vote change allowed, go for it.
Some actually were until very recently
The most positive people I have heard say give him until the end of the season. haven't heard a single person say give him his final year. So, pretty much no one has faith in him...its just more about when to show him the door. I doubt the board is any different. That being said, our club and our board seem incompetent so...
expecting vast majority to flock to option 1 now. (I did, from undecided between 2 and 3)
Crazy as it seems they are on here!
3-5-2, Jones on corners, it's all about his mad way, not about Manchester United, thanks for clearing out the shit, his only achievement, not giving him credit for playing youths, like Blackett, Borthwick-Jackson, Varela, McNair etc, he needed to do that as there was no other alternative, those players are not good enough, Wilson and Januzaj should have been kept, encouraged and nurtured.
But why though? It's completely and utterly stupid. I really don't get why our club is so fecking passive about everything and our fans our satisfied about it.
- Keep Moyes until we're out of the CL, then fecking panic in the summer when we're in the deepest of shits rather than actually doing something when we could've saved the situation
- Stick with old guard until their legs have fallen off, immediately right off our young defenders who haven't had any chance to play in their best positions
- Keep jokers like Anderson at the club until, literally every single club and human being who is watching football has realised he is absolutely fecking useless and has no interest in taking him off our hands for a fee.
- Need a striker? 23 year old Aguero's available summer 2011. Nah, feck it we'll stick it out a year and buy a 29 year old Van Persie.
Until recently I was for waiting until the end of the season, in case he delivered a serious title challenge, which was the bare minimum to keep his job for next season. However, recent results have persuaded me that he should be fired immediately, then either replaced by a temporary manager if we feel Guardiola can be convinced to take over in the summer, or by Mourinho straight-away.
The noticeable thing in the recent losses is how poorly some of our big name players have performed. Schweinsteiger shocking against Wolfsburg, De Gea conceding weird goals, Smalling astonishingly poor. To which you can add Carrick, Young and Jones asleep defensively against Norwich, Blind poor against Bournemouth, Carrick also at fault for Wolfsburg's 3rd goal from a corner. Rooney contributing little is no surprise; quite what he is doing on the pitch, is another black mark against LVG.
At this point in time, I would expect Giggs as temporary manager would be more likely to get us into the top 4 than if we continue with LVG.
The noticeable thing in the recent losses is how poorly some of our big name players have performed. Schweinsteiger shocking against Wolfsburg, De Gea conceding weird goals, Smalling astonishingly poor. To which you can add Carrick, Young and Jones asleep defensively against Norwich, Blind poor against Bournemouth, Carrick also at fault for Wolfsburg's 3rd goal from a corner. Rooney contributing little is no surprise; quite what he is doing on the pitch, is another black mark against LVG.
At this point in time, I would expect Giggs as temporary manager would be more likely to get us into the top 4 than if we continue with LVG.
Last edited:
Up until recently most people wanted to give him till the end of the season at least.
Things have changed since the Bournemouth game.