“Certainly he [Bobby Charlton], Ferguson and Gill were against the move”

Trizy

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They were against it yet they backed Moyes?.. Great judge of managers, those three.
 

Sarni

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True but we stopped trying in the last few games
Over last 6 games we lost to Brighton and West Brom and drew to West Ham. We could have probably got 4-5 points more here.
 

Ashley R1+O

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I'm not really getting it. Mourinho hasn't done anything like the eye-gouging or acting the twat that the greats could rightly have been concerned about before he joined the club. He's been subdued, genuine, calculating and heads a crop of dollops who don't want to take responsibility on the pitch.

Weird thread.
 

choiboyx012

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Although i originally preferred pep, I was happy to have mourinho at united. he's always been entertaining from a rival standpoint, and was a winner. I don't think you can fault any of the fans for wanting him here. We were risking falling deeper into long term mediocrity like arsenal and Liverpool.

Yeah he came with a lot of baggage and drama, but i think getting back to winning trophies was the biggest priority at the time, even if it meant going against "the United way", whatever that means. I really want him to turn it around, but it looks like it's too late. His biggest achievement was the Europa league trophy. Just not good enough and will be a blemish on his career.
 

NLunited

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I was hoping there would be some continuity after Mourinho's appointment of the good things the squad was doing under van Gaal, like ball retention/possession, alas it was a fecking shiitshow I've not been able to watch United much these years. I'm hopeful he will get fired but not sure Zidane is right man either.

I'd rather see someone like Southgate.
 

Camilo

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A number of people did though, he was like the Eddy Howe alternative back then. Was actually a good call by those people
A good call in hindsight. At the time it would've been a terrible appointment, and it may well have been a disaster.
 

red4ever 79

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Bumped due to seeing Sir Bobby with the England squad today. Looks well, shame he has lost his heart in our club at the moment.
 

Imperious

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I too was a big fan of Jose and his first spell at Chelsea provided some brilliant football and he did deserve the Special One tag.

I was not impressed with his treatment of the club doctor but saw this as a 'blip' and was thrilled when he replaced the dreaded LVG.

For some reason he has not seemed at home at OT and he doesn't seem to have bonded with the players.
Something is wrong and while I accept he has to take the blame for the way things have turned out on the pitch I suspect that there is something far deeper than just Jose..
[/QUOTE]

Agree with this completely.
 

ryansgirl

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They were against it yet they backed Moyes?.. Great judge of managers, those three.
Ha - good point! I never wanted Moyes because taking Everton to a respectable place on the table and qualifying for a European competition didn't cut it for me in terms of who had to come after the managerial giant Sir Alex. I didn't want him.

I thought Moyes seemed a decent person and manager but needed a solid history of real success as in silverware, real experience in a cooker pressure environment at the highest level, and a strong but not stubborn character. As it turned out stubbornness was one of David Moyes' guiding qualities at United. Disastrous. As was small-mindedness.

I think what attracted Sir Bobby et al was Moyes' low profile, decent lifestyle, seriousness. Nothing wrong with those qualities but they didn't come with the ones we needed at the managerial level. Sir Alex obviously pushed him as a fellow Scot who seemed to have the same managerial touch in doing well and being interested in youth development without splashing the cash.

I think Sir Alex honestly thought his knowledge of David Moyes would be helpful and that Moyes would follow in his footsteps. Of course sacking highly successful, respected staff just so you can apparently be your 'own man' is something Sir Alex never did at Aberdeen or United.

One thing that jars even now about David Moyes is the comments he made to a BBC journalist last year. He said she might get 'a slap' - I don't know if he said that because she criticised him or his team but that was completely out of order especially now as awareness of gender relations and appropriate use of language towards all groups are part of our society.
 
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ryansgirl

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Yeah that's what i wanna know. I haven't heard anything about him staying away due to Jose.
Some people will run with anything. There are people on the caf who don't even know Sir Bobby's age and it's likely some of them don't know about the injuries he sustained in the Munich air crash.

He recovered of course and some people lead normal and fairly long lives after sustaining injuries in accidents. However, these do catch up with you and Sir Bobby may be experiencing that now in his 80s.
 

amolbhatia50k

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I owe Sir Bobby an apology, he was right.
Yes. Many of us hesitantly accepted Mourinho because "he wins". But he's been a poor fit for this football club in pretty much every way. And he hasn't made up for it by doing good job either. Sir Bobby from everything we read was always against Mourinho.
 

championo

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And 81% of this forum was for it, if my memory serves me right.
I certainly was not one of them. I believe I was deep inside a place on earth where internet access was not possible. When I got back, Pogba, Zlatan, Mkhit were all signed.
I liked the Pogba signing but hated the price. It felt like selling your car and then buying it back for more than it was worth.
 

Patrick08

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Grudgingly I still keep some hope, Mourinho turns this around as I don't like to see him fail here. It's not like that pogba ain't got issues on his own and those will certainly come to light under any other manager as well. We can question his tactics and selection all the time but one thing is for sure that mourinho will give everything in his arsenal to turn this around, let's back him in January ( If it doesn't go ***s up) until then as i feel once defensively secure we will see a lot more positive attacking from him. Fingers crossed.
 

wolvored

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I cant see anything any different than the last 2 seasons from Mou. Whats going to change within him to make us a better team, and why would it suddenly change now? Lets take it into perspective we beat Newcastle at home, after having to go against everything he believes in to win, and we were still lucky not to have been 3-0 down in the first half. Thankfully VAR wasnt introduced this year to spot Youngs arm. Even second half we were fortunate that Newcastle couldnt capitalise on no defense. We have Chelsea Juve twice and City in the next 4 games. If we played like we did second half they will rip us open.
 

Andycoleno9

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People reacting like Jose Mourinho is a flop and failed to do anything good. Just to remind you all who react now in the way "i told you so".

1)Won Europa league( only trophy that we didn't have)
2) Won League cup( trophy is a trophy). Ask Liverpool or Spurs fan about it
3)Secured playing in Champ league both times
4)In second season Fa cup final and we finished second behind City who invested much much more than us. Not only in that 2 years. Yes, that second season is debatable in many ways and maybe it is not some great result but it is not bad result also. Still better than other rivals except City.
5) Rebuilded a squad with quality and young(ish) players. With central defenders he made a total mess but in midfield and attack any coach who comes here is covered with quality. People keep saying how he is short term manager but our squad is built for long term. Next manager can put this first 11:
De gea(27) -Dalot(19), Bailly(24), Lindelof(24), Shaw(23)- Pogba(25), Fred(25), Pereira(22) or Mctominay(21)- Lukaku(25), Martial(22) or Lingard(25), Rashford(20).
Alexis(29), Matic(30), Herrera(28), Smalling(28), Rojo(28) are bellow 30 so even by Caf standards they can be useful next 3 seasons at least.

Yes, third season is debacle so far. In every area, nobody can deny that. We can talk all day about reasons but it is all mentioned many times in many other threads so no need now. But to judge Jose only on these 2 months in 3rd season is ridiculous.
 

12OunceEpilogue

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I don't think anyone connected to United comes out of our post-2013 period smelling of roses. Fergie, Gill and Bobby may not have seen Jose as great fit for us, in private they may even have worried about this exact situation arising in Jose's third season, but they endorsed Moyes. We have to face the fact the planning for United post-Fergie has been shambolic and we're still thrashing around looking for some kind of collegiate identity years later.
 

Kazi

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Those 3 should have no involvement over who we hire as our manager.

No should Woodward, but that point is for another thread.
 

Masterman

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I'm not really getting it. Mourinho hasn't done anything like the eye-gouging or acting the twat that the greats could rightly have been concerned about before he joined the club. He's been subdued, genuine, calculating and heads a crop of dollops who don't want to take responsibility on the pitch.

Weird thread.
A crop of dollops didn't want to take responsibility on the pitch when Moyes and LvG were in charge of us.........
 

Raees

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They were against it yet they backed Moyes?.. Great judge of managers, those three.
To be fair they have made one mistake. Perhaps they got sentimental what with Moyes being a Scot. Does that mean we should never take their opinions into account ever again? They’re still worth listening to in terms of sounding board for ideas. Trust them more than Woodward put it that way.
 

Patrick08

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To be fair they have made one mistake. Perhaps they got sentimental what with Moyes being a Scot. Does that mean we should never take their opinions into account ever again? They’re still worth listening to in terms of sounding board for ideas. Trust them more than Woodward put it that way.
Well, we were without options courtesy Woodward.
 

ryansgirl

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Wow, we have so many proud nostradamus here.
Should be plural. That aside, I was one of those who didn't want Jose. My reasons were based on not wanting United to change its identity and buy expensive/over-priced foreign players instead of looking closer to home. I think I also referred to Jose's controversy with the club doctor at Chelsea as an indicator of how he was inappropriate.

But now I am one of those who think that as he is here, he has won silverware in his time with us, United should not be the sack-happy club that others are, some of the players have not only under-performed but white-anted their manager and in doing so have also damaged Manchester United and the media including social media have run with United's problems in such a toxic way then Jose should be given until the end of this season.
 

MoskvaRed

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Busby started the legend (and would have won more silverware if not for Munich).

Fergie revived the sleeping giant and was the most successful manager in the history of English football.

Charlton is the link between tbe two - the Munich survivor who was a key figure in the 68 side and subsequently was a strong supporter of Fergie in his early years of struggle.

So, it’s an impossible question to answer, particularly as most of us never saw Busby or Charlton in action.
 

finneh

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People reacting like Jose Mourinho is a flop and failed to do anything good. Just to remind you all who react now in the way "i told you so".

1)Won Europa league( only trophy that we didn't have)
2) Won League cup( trophy is a trophy). Ask Liverpool or Spurs fan about it
3)Secured playing in Champ league both times
4)In second season Fa cup final and we finished second behind City who invested much much more than us. Not only in that 2 years. Yes, that second season is debatable in many ways and maybe it is not some great result but it is not bad result also. Still better than other rivals except City.
5) Rebuilded a squad with quality and young(ish) players. With central defenders he made a total mess but in midfield and attack any coach who comes here is covered with quality. People keep saying how he is short term manager but our squad is built for long term. Next manager can put this first 11:
De gea(27) -Dalot(19), Bailly(24), Lindelof(24), Shaw(23)- Pogba(25), Fred(25), Pereira(22) or Mctominay(21)- Lukaku(25), Martial(22) or Lingard(25), Rashford(20).
Alexis(29), Matic(30), Herrera(28), Smalling(28), Rojo(28) are bellow 30 so even by Caf standards they can be useful next 3 seasons at least.

Yes, third season is debacle so far. In every area, nobody can deny that. We can talk all day about reasons but it is all mentioned many times in many other threads so no need now. But to judge Jose only on these 2 months in 3rd season is ridiculous.
This is a fair assessment.
 

All 3 United

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Jose was the man to steady the ship after saf but we were forced down the Scottish route. That’s when the damage was done.
 

sunama

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Over last 6 games we lost to Brighton and West Brom and drew to West Ham. We could have probably got 4-5 points more here.
If we had been in a proper title fight, I think we'd probably have won those matches.
There just wasn't anything left to play for, so the players went off the boil.
 

sunama

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To be fair they have made one mistake. Perhaps they got sentimental what with Moyes being a Scot. Does that mean we should never take their opinions into account ever again? They’re still worth listening to in terms of sounding board for ideas. Trust them more than Woodward put it that way.
One, catastrophic mistake.
The Moyes appointment sent MUFC so far down that it took LVG and Jose 5 years to get us back to 2nd place. And I would also argue that we still have not recovered.
Had Jose been appointed immediately after SAF, he'd have been working with a team full of title winners and with the addition of 2-3 signings, I think we'd be competing for the title in 2013 (and the subsequent years). Jose would've commanded the respect of the players and the chances of "downing tools" would've been slim-none.

The problem we have created is that we no longer have a bunch of players who know how to win trophies, with a winning mentality. Those (winning) players have long gone. Instead, we have mostly, a bunch of players who are not used to winning. This creates an extra hurdle for a manager to get that team of players, to win big trophies. The players we have now, have time and time again, demonstrated that they are not interested in playing well, against the minnows. When it comes to the big teams though, they raise their game. Unfortunately, you cannot win a league title with this mentality.
 

JK-27

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So this 'holy trinity' were for Moyes yet against Mourinho? And what was their position on LVG exactly? Because that didn't work either.