Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

[sp_107]

We can win few games with a new manager bounce but not that kind of good run if our players are not talented. Agree that it was a run of easy fixtures but still they did well and raised the tempo/style proves it's more down to players than the manager.

Ddg/Shaw/Smaling/Lindelof/Dalot/Matic/Herrera/Pogba/Rashford/Martial/Lukaku that team can't put up a tittle fight but I still believe it should finish in top 4.

Moyes done well at Everton with AVG players and LVG/Jose were not average managers but they all failed proves our signings were bad and also they don't have the mentality to see through tough periods

OR it could be some kind of curse that Wheel of UTD is now consuming any player otherwise Sanchez the best player on/off the ball in the league can't become such a dud at UTD.No explanation to that.

We need a overhaul for sure to rectify 6 years of transfer mistakes but is OLE the man to change our fortunes ?

I am not sure about his capability but he has strong will to turn this around and that is a good start atleast. People bring up his Cardiff te tire/signings should realise working with Cardiff club/budget is different to working with UTD.

If Ole can see things as they are like all of us and make some tough calls by flushing out his favouritism on Young/Jones/Lingard and sign players with leadership qualities then we can talk of progressing

Don't think even ED likes to be remembered as the CEO crushed UTD wheel so he might be thinking of redeeming himself for sure in private.

 

[reelworld]

Of course it counts. But what he did after he was named permanent counts just as much.

never argue with that. But it's only fair to look at the Ole whole record rather than only looking at the ones before and after he was made permanent

 

[reelworld]

We should be equating Ole to the true greats of management then?

Even Ole’ most stern of supporters are getting worried and we’re two months or so into his reign. It’s ok to be worried, because what’s going on right now is nothing short of a shit show. If you think everything is looking rosey, more power to you.

No. I'm saying lets pull the break before equating Ole with anyone. Moyes has been proven disastrous at United. Ole never even got a chance to a transfer window and training camp. Let him got his chance first before equating him with one of the worst manager at United history

 

[Josh 76]

Wait, dont remember much of poll for next manager after JM but was there anyone in here who ever mentioned Ole as idea of next United manager, before 1st rumour popping in media or where ever?

If Ole was given the managers job on a full time basis at the start, their would have been up roar. I can remember Gary Neville live on sky, and was told they were giving the job to Ole (tempoary). He went whiter than a ghost.
As it was only as a temporary manager, everyone thought it wasn't a bad idea. We all fell into the trap when he had a good start, but many still had their doubts. Now it's a shambles.

 

[reelworld]

Yep. Exactly this

We shouldn’t be equating Ole with Moyes or with Mourinho. Or with any others.

And whether the Norwegian league is ranked 23rd or 5th is rather irrelevant. A 23rd-ranked league will have its own constraints like budgets and players etc and you can only work within those boundaries. The fact remains that Ole broke Rosenberg’s hold many times and helped Molde win their first title in history. This shouldn’t be belittled.

Now of course extrapolating that to the PL may be too far a stretch. So I am not going to say that he will definitely be able to do it at United. His stint at Cardiff was a blemish but it has been said many times the circumstances around Cardiff then were terrible but judge Ole all you want on that.

To me what matters is now.

On this forum, it seems like a growing consensus that our board/Ed is inept at transfers, hiring managers and creating a general structure at the club. These could determine the long term success or demise of the club but none of these are Ole’s fault.

They will become his problems but they are not his fault.

Ole is the manager for now so let’s see what he can bring. New manager bounce or not the way the team played when Ole joined was so different from Mourinho’s time and the recent weeks that it has to be questioned what changed. I don’t think Ole suddenly thought we were too exciting and the boring toothless footy would be better. There are factors we can’t see that forced Ole’s hand. There are many variables which I believe all have validity, such as fitness, distractions from contracts and form.

Out of his depth or not, you can’t deny Ole had a great start and in many matches he had good tactics and made some good substitutions. I am more inclined to think it was not luck because otherwise why can’t we attribute the recent bad run to luck? Ole’s been know to be a smart student of the game and some will argue that Man United is not a place for a good student of the game but a master of the game. Perhaps that is true, but Ole has been appointed and I don’t see the benefit is always looking at the negative end of things simply because Ole has shown glimpses that he has the capacity to achieve good outcomes.

Let’s also not forget that ultimately this isn’t Ole’s team. The players bought were according to other manager’s visions and it is unfair to expect Ole to get them fully on his side. The players themselves will constantly be doubting if this manager “needs” them or not, hence Ole is always assuring them for now. I have no doubt Ole can be ruthless if need be. People get too concerned about the interviews and press conferences. There is very little benefit in criticising players in public and showing your hand in the media. It doesn’t mean Ole is not giving them a bollocking in private.

It will only be truly Ole’s team after 2-3 transfer windows. That’s how and when we should be judging him. That’s unfortunately an eternity for fans who judge game by game but that’s only right. If we fire Ole without offering the opportunity to rebuild, then the club is truly screwed. It will be undeniable then that our club is clueless.

This forum has become so toxic. I really wonder what it means for some of our fans to support the club. This is not a top red argument but I am puzzled at fans being so unreasonable and unwilling to broaden their perspectives and exercise patience.

Now I don’t know if Ole will be successful or not. I hope he will be but he will need some ingredients outside his control, like time and support from the board. What’s sad is that some of the fans are already crucifying and writing Ole off before he’s got a real chance to build his team.

 

[reelworld]

Winning the Noggie league is the equivalent of winning League One. Doubt there will be many top clubs in for Mick Harford though.

It's really not.
He beat Rosenborg who's bigger and much richer than Molde to 2 league titles. It's like winning the league in Scotland with other clubs than Celtics or Rangers

 

[friendlytramp]

Factors which would have affected team selection over the last period:

1. The opportunity to qualify for the champions league.
2. Avoiding a (bigger) squad melt down during such an important stage of the season.
3. Doing his best to convince De Gea to stay
4. Seeing how people perform and who he can trust with an eye on next season.
5. Maintaining some kind of bargaining position and value for players that are likely to leave
6. It’s not the right time to throw kids into a team that are on a desperate run of bad form- you should blood kids in a winning team.

That’s a complex set of factors and doesn’t provide opportunity for ole to properly stamp his authority on the team. We need to give him a preseason and at least one transfer window before starting to judge.

His absolute commitment to the club is what makes me think he will get this right.

 

[Josh 76]

 

[Josh 76]

Quite interesting to see what they were saying when he got the job full time. (Before the bad form)

 

[Jim Beam]

200 million pounds question. Will you give to him since he never operated on this level of transfer market?

 

[SirAF]

It's really not.
He beat Rosenborg who's bigger and much richer than Molde to 2 league titles. It's like winning the league in Scotland with other clubs than Celtics or Rangers

Nah, not really. Molde is being bankrolled by a Norwegian billionaire which is why they were able to take on Rosenborg.

That specific period wasn’t as one sided as Norwegian football used to be either:

• 2005 Vålerenga
• 2006 Rosenborg
• 2007 Brann
• 2008 Stabæk
• 2009 Rosenborg
• 2010 Rosenborg
• 2011 Molde
• 2012 Molde
• 2013 Strømsgodset
• 2014 Molde

Although Rosenborg went on another cycle of domination after 2014 (which is now coming to an end again) it’s not really comparable to Celtic and Rangers in Scotland.

 

[reelworld]

Factors which would have affected team selection over the last period:

1. The opportunity to qualify for the champions league.
2. Avoiding a (bigger) squad melt down during such an important stage of the season.
3. Doing his best to convince De Gea to stay
4. Seeing how people perform and who he can trust with an eye on next season.
5. Maintaining some kind of bargaining position and value for players that are likely to leave
6. It’s not the right time to throw kids into a team that are on a desperate run of bad form- you should blood kids in a winning team.

That’s a complex set of factors and doesn’t provide opportunity for ole to properly stamp his authority on the team. We need to give him a preseason and at least one transfer window before starting to judge.

His absolute commitment to the club is what makes me think he will get this right.

He was thrown into the fire without any reinforcement and time. He basically figuring things on the fly with other managers players. How the team is set up next season and how it look like will determine how his management will pan out

 

[roonster09]

200 million pounds question. Will you give to him since he never operated on this level of transfer market?

It's not like he will be shopping like grocery shopping. He will work with chief scouts and come up with the players and positions they need to strengthen. Whether we target the right players who will fits the profile Solskjaer is looking for is the big question.

 

[Bobcat]

Keep on reading this, why? We arent some kind of experiment to give managers a fair chances of proving themselfs at our expence.
They can prove themselfs somewhere else. We cant afford more failures.

Because no matter who we hire, no one is a guarantee for success. We hired Van Gaal and Jose in the belief that their impressive CV alone would save us, and look what that brought us. If we hired Poch (or literally anyone else) with a "better CV" would you want to sack them after half a season, with a shite team they had no hand in creating?

Sacking Ole now and bringing in a new man wont solve anything. And what kind of signal does that send to the squad? "Yeah, you guys can just keep downing tools and stop playing whenever you feel like it, we will pin on on the manager and get a new one". We have a squad full of pampered fannies and wage thieves that think themselves above any manager. Either that or they simply lack the fitness to play at the top level. Neither is acceptable.

The fact that our performances and effort from the players took a nose dive the second Ole got the permanent deal is suspicious to put it mildly.

 

[7even]

We shouldn’t be equating Ole with Moyes or with Mourinho. Or with any others.

And whether the Norwegian league is ranked 23rd or 5th is rather irrelevant. A 23rd-ranked league will have its own constraints like budgets and players etc and you can only work within those boundaries. The fact remains that Ole broke Rosenberg’s hold many times and helped Molde win their first title in history. This shouldn’t be belittled.

Now of course extrapolating that to the PL may be too far a stretch. So I am not going to say that he will definitely be able to do it at United. His stint at Cardiff was a blemish but it has been said many times the circumstances around Cardiff then were terrible but judge Ole all you want on that.

To me what matters is now.

On this forum, it seems like a growing consensus that our board/Ed is inept at transfers, hiring managers and creating a general structure at the club. These could determine the long term success or demise of the club but none of these are Ole’s fault.

They will become his problems but they are not his fault.

Ole is the manager for now so let’s see what he can bring. New manager bounce or not the way the team played when Ole joined was so different from Mourinho’s time and the recent weeks that it has to be questioned what changed. I don’t think Ole suddenly thought we were too exciting and the boring toothless footy would be better. There are factors we can’t see that forced Ole’s hand. There are many variables which I believe all have validity, such as fitness, distractions from contracts and form.

Out of his depth or not, you can’t deny Ole had a great start and in many matches he had good tactics and made some good substitutions. I am more inclined to think it was not luck because otherwise why can’t we attribute the recent bad run to luck? Ole’s been know to be a smart student of the game and some will argue that Man United is not a place for a good student of the game but a master of the game. Perhaps that is true, but Ole has been appointed and I don’t see the benefit is always looking at the negative end of things simply because Ole has shown glimpses that he has the capacity to achieve good outcomes.

Let’s also not forget that ultimately this isn’t Ole’s team. The players bought were according to other manager’s visions and it is unfair to expect Ole to get them fully on his side. The players themselves will constantly be doubting if this manager “needs” them or not, hence Ole is always assuring them for now. I have no doubt Ole can be ruthless if need be. People get too concerned about the interviews and press conferences. There is very little benefit in criticising players in public and showing your hand in the media. It doesn’t mean Ole is not giving them a bollocking in private.

It will only be truly Ole’s team after 2-3 transfer windows. That’s how and when we should be judging him. That’s unfortunately an eternity for fans who judge game by game but that’s only right. If we fire Ole without offering the opportunity to rebuild, then the club is truly screwed. It will be undeniable then that our club is clueless.

This forum has become so toxic. I really wonder what it means for some of our fans to support the club. This is not a top red argument but I am puzzled at fans being so unreasonable and unwilling to broaden their perspectives and exercise patience.

Now I don’t know if Ole will be successful or not. I hope he will be but he will need some ingredients outside his control, like time and support from the board. What’s sad is that some of the fans are already crucifying and writing Ole off before he’s got a real chance to build his team.

OK. So his lack of experience and poor CV doesn’t count. Cardiff didn’t happened and being successful in Norway is equal to winning in a far more competitive league. Correct?

Secondly you say this isn’t his team. Sorry to disappoint you but it is. If you take this job you’re responsible for the results from day one. If you want to credit him for our first ten games then you have to accept he’s responsible for all the results up to this point. The wins and the losses. Nobody suggests it’s his fault only but the million dollar question is do we see any improvements under his command. Simple. Is this team any better then the team we saw in the beginning of the season? Do you see his vision, any structure or his long term plan? If so, enlighten me.

Five month and 20+ games isn’t a big sample size to judge him on but it isn’t a small size either. We have seen many new managers implement their identity and visions in less time so it can be done if you have the knowledge and the authority. Apart from this many supporters and some players want to see a leader who install respect and show leadership, someone who breathe confidence and knowledge. Do you think the players see this? Do you see this? If so, again, then enlightened me with what you see.

Finally, you don’t know, like the rest of us, but you hope he will be successful. This is your and many others posters defense in a nutshell. Hope....
(This is not personal, I like your optimism and the way you support Ole Gunnar the best you can. Nothing but respect even if we don’t share the same conclusions)

 

[nore1975]

In a weird way the form since he became permanent manager might in the long run help Ole. If Ole based his assessment of the squad on his time as temp manager then he would have done so under effectively a false pretence. He can now see the bigger picture. These players downed tools under Mourinho too. Mourinho isn’t blameless but he wasn’t the core problem.
Time, luck and recruitment are key to any manager succeeding and Ole is no exception.

 

[Sandikan]

This.It is ridiculous that some folks on here believe that Ole is more qualified than Moyes.Moyes was the most highly rated young British manager back in 2013.....He had the experience of managing a big club in England for 10 years.....Solksjaers resume isn’t even half as good as Moyes’s....

Its not about "resumes".
If you forget, our last two managers had the finest records in world football! And both were fairly underwhelming all in.

 

[Reiver]

We've come full circle this season. From the results and shithousery under Mourinho, the joy of his sacking, to Ole's appointment and that great run of form. Now, at the end of the season, we're back to Mourinho type results/performances, just without the shithousing. Its progress.

 

[Jim Beam]

It's not like he will be shopping like grocery shopping. He will work with chief scouts and come up with the players and positions they need to strengthen.

Roonster we have our 4th manager and about 25 transfers in since Ferguson. You could make a case for Fellaini being in top 5, it is that bad.
Would give him the money, but it is a massive risk also.

 

[rotherham_red]

His decision to take off Lindelof and keep Young was so mind boggling. I just couldn't believe my eyes.

Seems like he's fallen into the favoritism trap. Difficult to see how he can now emerge from it.

Lindelof was injured...

 

[IrishRedDevil]

Club didn’t really have a choice. He was doing great, fans loved him, he was asked in every single interview if he would get the job and it was starting to be awkward and disrespectful towards Ole.

At the time it made sense. Easy for someone like you to come out now as a Mr. Knowitall with the season result in front of you.

The club had every choice. They are in control and are under no obligation to hand out permanent contracts during a season, when there is plenty of games still to be played. The time would have been at the end of the season when all games were played and a full assessment could have been made.

I don’t care if the fans loved him. We loved the football we played yes, which has completely disappeared. Also that’s making decisions with emotion involved and I would expect people in charge to be able to see past that.

I said at the time it was far too early, so no I’m not acting like Mr Knowitall.

 

[Womp]

Its not about "resumes".
If you forget, our last two managers had the finest records in world football! And both were fairly underwhelming all in.

I can guarantee you both brought far more to us than Ole will at his time here.

 

[Member 93275]

That was a "lost the dressing room" performance yesterday. I think United should do now how Real Madrid does it with managers and players when in doubt: press the reset button. Rinse and repeat. Did he do well at the start and deserved the chance? It doesn't matter. Did he lose it when he said he wanted 5 new players and signed a contract? It doesn't matter. Does he deserve a longer shot? Would it be fair? Is it nice? It doesn't matter. Forget this romance. At such a big club you have to be brutal and press reset. Like Madrid did with Lopetegui and Solari, and even will do with Zidane if it doesn't work out.

 

[Fracture90]

The big question is: Why are we suddenly so shite now when we were great from December-March. The only probable answer seems that the players have downed tools

How is that that only probable answer in your opinion?

 

[JustAGuest]

All this faith in him as a manager because he scored that goal in 99 and because he consistently name drops Ferguson. madness.

Who would you replace him with?

 

[Revaulx]

There are lot of mitigating factors though. Imagine being the manager of this bunch. You depend on pressing but they're all too knackered due to Mourinho. Then you've got players in the middle of negotiating contracts due to Woodward letting the contracts run down. and then you have Sanchez disrupting everyone with his performances and wages - again see Woodward and the absolutely suicidal decision to pay him so much and cause a ripple throughout the whole squad who naturally want their wages increased.

For such a big business we have one of the most inept group of decision makers I think Ive ever seen.

People talk about Zidane and Guardiola having managed no one before they got their respective jobs. But this is on a scale way beyond that. We're talking about an entire rebuilding of a once global superpower. Those teams were not as broken as ours. We're talking about dismantling an entire squad and instilling a philosophy. Barca already had one. And both had proper structures in place.

Not only has Ole never managed a club of this size, he's never rebuilt a club, period.
We are ab absolute shambles in every aspect. The one absolutely essential thing right now is the hiring of a great Director of Football.
We are rudderless. In fact we're being steered by a blindfolded drunk who's never been in a boat before but think he knows what he's doing.

This whole old boy United Way worries me too. Sure it works for Ajax but again they are a tiny club in comparison.
I'm not sure putting in Phelan and Rio is the way forward, even more so now that we don't have the Champions League.

We need a guy who can hunt down the very best talent and has the business nous to get the deals over the line.

Everyone seems to be doing this better than us right now. We just lurch from one catastrophic mistake to another.

Ed's at the wheel!

This post deserves much praise.

An excellent summary of the situation the club has got itself into, that both Ole’s supporters and sceptics can agree with.

 

[Bestofthebest]

If we had acted as some people are acting towards Ole when SAF arrived from Scotland then we would never have had the glorious Fergie years. He was rubbish results wise for SIX years before finding success. However he had done a lot of work restructuring behind the scenes and building a culture at Utd. What some want now is instant success and if it doesn't arrive sack the manager and appoint a new one. These people are truly deluded and don't know how Utd work or even how football works. There a some good managers about but most would not be employed by Woodward as they would challenge his methods and that was what happened with Mourinho.

As bad as things got you could sympathise with Mou because although he was backed financially to quite some extent I am not sure he got the players he wanted. Sure Fred was not his idea. He did take us to a distant second but also knew massive changes were required and spat the dummy when not backed fully at the start of this season. This was obvious even on pre season tour of USA. The fact that the teams he put out did not play inspiring football just made the fans more restless. Had this style brought us to the level of city or even close it would have been acceptable to most Utd fans. However, he just made things worse by putting out ridiculous teams to try to show where he thought we were lacking and finally turned on individual players in public.

Now we are in a new situation with a new manager but the same players and it is plain that a lot of Mou's thinking was correct i.e. You can't make a silk purse from a sow's ear. Ole has to be given a chance to rebuild HIS team and the resources to do so. In the meantime people need to think long and hard before getting on his back and just look further up the tree to where the actual faults are.

 

[lRed]

I get why people are worrying but I don't get negativity for negativity.
Some are there looking for any mistake Ole does, could you let the guy in peace ?

Let's see what will happen in the summer and next season. Contracts, fitness and attitude cost us our current bad form.
It's ok to doubt Ole's philosophy but we need to back someone who actually cares about the club and his wellness, it's not just about the DNA.
Like others said, we already tried big CV's, van Gaal and Mourinho didn't succeed and failed bringing the big picture, long term.

I think we had problem before, in terms of structure, academy talents, board vision and goals (money). If we really are beginning to add the right minds and character at the right positions (players and board), we are taking the step forward. We need time, structure and also patience.

We shouldn't talking about Ole in or Ole out, it's so early.

 

[Bobcat]

How is that that only probable answer in your opinion?

Well if you have such insight, please share. How the feck could you explain going from 10 wins in a row to 2 in 10? Sure, injuries hit us hard at some point, but some of the performances we have seen lately have been some of the most gutless, lazy shite we ever had the misfortune of watching.

 

[Jazz]

Can anyone confirm that Ole said this:

Ole: "We have some really top players in this squad. Ashley Young, Chris Smalling and Phil Jones have won titles at this club, and they're the leaders in the dressing room and out on the pitch. We need more players like these so we can continue to improve.".....



I love Ole but surely he can't believe that. I mean we are in deep fecking trouble if the management believes they are leaders on and off the pitch. Are people at our club blind or stupid or both?

 

[arthurka]

I genuinely can’t believe we’re saying things like give him a crack. This is one of the biggest clubs in the world we’re talking about here. You give too many managers like Ole and Moyes a crack to rebuild your club from ruin and you end up in even deeper shit and it definitely can get even worse. Also, Woodward, a man that’s been a constant in 6 odd years of failure is still pulling the string somehow. Next season will be another hell as things stand.

Do you really think having another manager would change anything?
We had before Ole one of the greatest managers of his generation, before him we had a cornerstone of modern football. How did that work out?
There is something fundamentally wrong with this club and at least Ole has been vocal that things need to change.
Give him a chance to see out his plan for the summer there won´t be any Lukakus and Matic coming in thats for sure.
Thing wont get better until the board and Ed are removed, but sadly that might be to late as our catching up is huge as it is.

 

[Enigma_87]

Moyes got the job without winning any league, so if Moyes got 9 months and 2 transfer windows, it's fair to give at least Ole, a manager who at least won titles a similar chance.

What titles? You aren’t seriously counting that pokemon league as an achievement are you?

 

[R'hllor]

Can anyone confirm that Ole said this:

Ole: "We have some really top players in this squad. Ashley Young, Chris Smalling and Phil Jones have won titles at this club, and they're the leaders in the dressing room and out on the pitch. We need more players like these so we can continue to improve.".....



I love Ole but surely he can't believe that. I mean we are in deep fecking trouble if the management believes they are leaders on and off the pitch. Are people at our club blind or stupid or both?

There is no fecking way he said that, i mean they have been more carried then anything else.

 

[Jazz]

There is no fecking way he said that, i mean they have been more carried then anything else.

A fan mentioned that it was in the guardian. I will try and find it. I hope this is a misinterpretation of what he actually said.

 

[Jacckk1985]

Outside of Pochettino who do you guys even believe that is realistic to get this summer who could be "better" option. Ole has the right to get the chance to prove what he can do.

 

[sugar_kane]

Can anyone confirm that Ole said this:

Ole: "We have some really top players in this squad. Ashley Young, Chris Smalling and Phil Jones have won titles at this club, and they're the leaders in the dressing room and out on the pitch. We need more players like these so we can continue to improve.".....



I love Ole but surely he can't believe that. I mean we are in deep fecking trouble if the management believes they are leaders on and off the pitch. Are people at our club blind or stupid or both?

Nothing on Google - closest is a quote he made after Young's contract renewal but didn't say anything about needing more players like him.

Sounds like something someone made up as a wind up tbh...

 

[Lexxxzi]

Problem with Ole is that we still haven't seen a true tactical imprint on the side from him which you'd expect from someobody of the level we need. Can only hope that comes next season.

I fear he genuinely believes the change required is to play with freedom, take risks and work hard, as opposed to any proper systemic and structural sweeping changes/patterns that need to be instilled and perfected over repeated practice.

I would say that's correct, yes (to some extent). Under his time with Molde (I am a Molde fan) the team was shaky defensively. Very good offensively, few touches, especially practiced moves, etc.

 

[Compton22]

Can anyone confirm that Ole said this:

Ole: "We have some really top players in this squad. Ashley Young, Chris Smalling and Phil Jones have won titles at this club, and they're the leaders in the dressing room and out on the pitch. We need more players like these so we can continue to improve.".....



I love Ole but surely he can't believe that. I mean we are in deep fecking trouble if the management believes they are leaders on and off the pitch. Are people at our club blind or stupid or both?

Fake. He affectionately calls Phil Jones "Jonah" I believe. Or "Duncan". One of those two.

 

[edgar allan]

200 million pounds question. Will you give to him since he never operated on this level of transfer market?

We need double or triple that to have any chance of a turnaround

 

[Jazz]

Nothing on Google - closest is a quote he made after Young's contract renewal but didn't say anything about needing more players like him.

Sounds like something someone made up as a wind up tbh...

Ok thanks. I can't bloody find it either. It was a comment made by a fan under an article. I felt like I wanted to cry reading that