Andy Mitten column: At Manchester United, things are very bad – and could get worse

Inigo Montoya

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"There are people on the football side who think it will get worse before it gets better; that Wolves, Everton and Leicester are primed to overtake England’s most decorated league champions in the country"

https://www.fourfourtwo.com/feature...-ole-gunnar-solskjaer-ed-woodward-andy-mitten

I think we're gonna find out what the Tampa fans felt when the Glazer's ruined them. Unless we can get them out somehow..
Depressing but nothing we didn't know.

I like Andy and have spoken to him a few times but that article is full of: 'some insiders,' 'people think,' 'it could,' 'Sanchez is the problem,' etc. It's just another opinion among a growing number of opinions on Utd.
 

Inigo Montoya

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Pass me the rope......

It’s not quite the apocalypse yet but it’s going to be a dystopian future. Hordes of scousers with flaming torches. Beating drums that are emblazoned with Wijnaldums face.

We can either wallow in self pity or fight back.....

Question is. Do we have any fight left?
It's the Hunger Games meets Fawlty Towers
 

acnumber9

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Depressing but nothing we didn't know.

I like Andy and have spoken to him a few times but that article is full of: 'some insiders,' 'people think,' 'it could,' 'Sanchez is the problem,' etc. It's just another opinion among a growing number of opinions on Utd.
It’s standard Mitten fare. Using a lot of words to say very little. Why are we in danger of those teams overtaking us? Where was this insider knowledge when Solskjaer was appointed?
 
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settembrini

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"Solskjaer said that we wouldn’t be seeing some of his players again. He’s right, but there will be no major cull. It’s too expensive and too difficult to shift too many out. This isn’t Barcelona looking to cash in on Ivan Rakitic, a proven winner, but United looking to offload players who earn so much that they don’t have to move anywhere."

If this is true then next season will be another disaster and Solskjaer won't last to the end.

A major cull and rebuilding job is not just his best chance of success on the pitch but also his best chance of keeping the fans supporting him. I believe they will be patient and understanding with a club legend if they see he is trying to rebuild us into a new team. However if they see the same failed players still in the side and results don't improve significantly... it will get nasty fast.
 

amolbhatia50k

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This is obvious.

The owners ultimately only care about making money, we all know this. But so far, they've shown ambition in that regard, by which I mean that they've sought to expand the "brand" (rather than just milking something existing for all it is worth).

They can't just keep on going in the same, hopeless manner on the football side and expect the brand to take care of itself, it clearly isn't how it works. They'll start to make less money from their cash cow, it's inevitable.

They have to be aware of this, though.
Absolutely. To be honest I'm more worried about their capabilities than their intent/ambition.
 

crossy1686

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Solksjaer is in his DREAM job. He isn't going to sabotage it. He's the guy who woke up in bed with Scarlett Johansson. He isn't going to complain that she isn't very good at doing the laundry.
His management career will be over at the top level anyway if the board don't back him in the summer. Might as well go down swinging.
 

JPRouve

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Also hard with the draft too.
Draft and salary cap. You are not in complete control of who comes to you and who leaves for a bigger paycheck, that's why the NFL works in windows at the exception of the Steelers and the Patriots with Belichick, no one knows how the Steelers managed to only have 3 head coaches in 50 years.
 

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And still you have fans who think the manager is the problem right now.
 

11101

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"Solskjaer said that we wouldn’t be seeing some of his players again. He’s right, but there will be no major cull. It’s too expensive and too difficult to shift too many out. This isn’t Barcelona looking to cash in on Ivan Rakitic, a proven winner, but United looking to offload players who earn so much that they don’t have to move anywhere."

If this is true then next season will be another disaster and Solskjaer won't last to the end.

A major cull and rebuilding job is not just his best chance of success on the pitch but also his best chance of keeping the fans supporting him. I believe they will be patient and understanding with a club legend if they see he is trying to rebuild us into a new team. However if they see the same failed players still in the side and results don't improve significantly... it will get nasty fast.
Ole doesn't need to sell 10 players to show he means business.

One or two high profile departures on our terms would do it. The highest priority has to be to get rid of Sanchez. Even if we subsidise his salary elsewhere we have to get him out of the club. The wages and lack of performance are eating away at everything else we do.

Then there are the others. I don't want to see Pogba leave but if that's what it takes to show the rest of the players Ole is really in charge then so be it. We can't allow his agent to turn it into a summer saga, if he is going to leave then the club needs to make very clear from day one we want to sell him.

We can't ship the likes of Young, Jones, Smalling & Co out in one go but Ole needs to be showing everyone that their level is not acceptable. None of them should play much next season.
 

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How have we got to this? Something has to happen, but what?
I think this is what has disappointed so many of us about Ole getting the job permanently. Absolutely no disrespect to Ole who has come in and worked his balls off for the club, but compared to City in particular (and Liverpool are getting there too) it is like arming us with a catapult against someone with an AK47.

There is so much wrong throughout the club and Ole is basically being set up to fail. Even Pep Guardiola would need to spend £400 million to get this team competing at the very top - and I very much doubt that Ole will receive even half of that amount.
 

M Bison

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What i don't understand is how we went from 14/19 wins as we entered April, to 2 in 10, just as Ole was appointed as permanent manager

Fatigue? Did the players down tools? Did Ole suddenly decide we should start playing shit? Might be wishful thinking, but i think this is our low point and it can only go up from here.
This is what i dont understand. If anything, you'd expect a gradual improvement as the new managers methods/tactics etc took hold, but we started with a bang and it showed there was quality in the side and we were seeing a lot more from a number of players, and then we've declined which is the opposite of what you'd expect.

There's obviously issues with the owners and that cant be underestimated, but that shouldnt affect our players fitness and ability to follow basic instructions, along with the teams tactics.

We're on a loop, we start with criticism of the players, then it turns to the manager, then to the owners.
 

DomesticTadpole

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I think this is what has disappointed so many of us about Ole getting the job permanently. Absolutely no disrespect to Ole who has come in and worked his balls off for the club, but compared to City in particular (and Liverpool are getting there too) it is like arming us with a catapult against someone with an AK47.

There is so much wrong throughout the club and Ole is basically being set up to fail. Even Pep Guardiola would need to spend £400 million to get this team competing at the very top - and I very much doubt that Ole will receive even half of that amount.
What is frightening is that players are leaving, but the ones who should be leaving won't. People accusing Herrera of being a money grabber, well to me the likes of Jones and Young are money grabbers as they know if they left they would be on a third of the money. They are just happy to pick up their money and drag United into the gutter. I am beginning to hate the team and that is not healthy. I have never felt like that before.
 

Nou_Camp99

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I have said it for a while. I think things will start to turn ugly at the club soon. Fan protests are coming. Our fans won't blame Ole for this mess and nor should they.

The Glazer scum and their yes man need to go. They have ruined this club.
 

dove

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And still you have fans who think the manager is the problem right now.
Find me one person who thinks manager is 100% to blame. We all know our board is a joke, we all know Ed is clueless in football side of things and we all know that having a clueless manager doesn't help as well. Each share their blame, first 2 much more than the last but still.
 

DomesticTadpole

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Find me one person who thinks manager is 100% to blame. We all know our board is a joke, we all know Ed is clueless in football side of things and we all know that having a clueless manager doesn't help as well. Each share their blame, first 2 much more than the last but still.
I would not blame Ole for this, but poor bloke will end up being the casualty.
 

Rusholme Ruffian

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What is frightening is that players are leaving, but the ones who should be leaving won't. People accusing Herrera of being a money grabber, well to me the likes of Jones and Young are money grabbers as they know if they left they would be on a third of the money. They are just happy to pick up their money and drag United into the gutter. I am beginning to hate the team and that is not healthy. I have never felt like that before.
I read somewhere today that Inter will be paying Godin £111K per week when he moves there - which is roughly what we pay Rojo for contributing the square root of feck all. It's no wonder we can't bloody shift any of them. The time has come to cut our losses, accept that we've messed up massively and just give some of these players away.
 

DomesticTadpole

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I read somewhere today that Inter will be paying Godin £111K per week when he moves there - which is roughly what we pay Rojo for contributing the square root of feck all. It's no wonder we can't bloody shift any of them. The time has come to cut our losses, accept that we've messed up massively and just give some of these players away.
Poor Darmian has been desperate to leave and we are quibbling or a couple of million pounds, can't affect the Glazer's pocket money can we?
 

dove

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I would not blame Ole for this, but poor bloke will end up being the casualty.
Of course he will be, like in every single club in the world manager is the easiest target when your team performs like shite. However he knew very well where he is getting into.
 

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Think if that happens then the shit will really hit the fan. Sacking LVG and Jose, there was not the emotional attachment to them. Ole is a different matter.
Something must happen. Fans can't watch this and do nothing. Being a fan from abroad most I can do is unfollow the club on Instagram. :D
 

Paxi

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But remember, any discussion for fans action is cringeworthy, embarrassing or pointless and anyway, Ed scowled at the camera anyway and gave a look that said 'football manager signings mode'.

Every bit of decline from here, many fans are complicit. When are we going to get real and stop swallowing the shit
This.
 

DomesticTadpole

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Of course he will be, like in every single club in the world manager is the easiest target when your team performs like shite. However he knew very well where he is getting into.
I know, but they made the decision to not follow the strategy they spouted, about not making a rash decision. They should have waited until the end of the season. Don't think the pressure from ex-players actually helped there.
 

Nou_Camp99

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Think if that happens then the shit will really hit the fan. Sacking LVG and Jose, there was not the emotional attachment to them. Ole is a different matter.
My thoughts too. Feels like a last roll of the dice from Glazers and Ed.

Ole won't be booed and jeered. They will be.
 

JoaquinJoaquin

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Seems about right. I've honestly lost my love for football right now. I can't feel anything for these players and though I enjoy watching other teams play, I often find myself feeling down and even depressed when it reminds me of what we're becoming.
Feel the same. Problem I have is my NBA team the Knicks are awful and so are my NFL team the Dolphins :(
 

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I like Andy Mitten.

But he always gives the impression he knows what's going on but never actually tells you anything another frustrating article tbh.
 

settembrini

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Ole doesn't need to sell 10 players to show he means business.

One or two high profile departures on our terms would do it. The highest priority has to be to get rid of Sanchez. Even if we subsidise his salary elsewhere we have to get him out of the club. The wages and lack of performance are eating away at everything else we do.

Then there are the others. I don't want to see Pogba leave but if that's what it takes to show the rest of the players Ole is really in charge then so be it. We can't allow his agent to turn it into a summer saga, if he is going to leave then the club needs to make very clear from day one we want to sell him.

We can't ship the likes of Young, Jones, Smalling & Co out in one go but Ole needs to be showing everyone that their level is not acceptable. None of them should play much next season.
Obviously you are right about Sanchez and I agree with you that if Pogba is not committed then he should go too (provided we get a good offer, minimum £100m and none of Madrid's own deadwood). Same for Martial and De Gea.

I disagree that that will be enough though. We are stuck with Jones now after his ridiculous new long term deal and we will have Young for at least one more season as well. But that's just scratching the surface of our failed players list. Mata has done nothing to justify a new contract and I would happily sell Rojo, Darmian, Matic and Bailly as well. With Valencia and Herrera (probably) also leaving then our squad will genuinely start to have a fresh look to it. We are long past the point where 'one or two' changes will make a difference. A major rebuild like Guardiola did in the summer of 2017 is in order.
 

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So an adequate manager would solve most problems then?
When Poch signed for Spurs their squad was also in disarray with a number of overpaid and unmotivated players, yet he managed to to improve their results whilst spending very little money. Its because he's a very good manager. Is Ole?

The idea that Ole will be Ed's scapegoat is laughable to me because already the opposite dynamic is true.

There are fans actually already spouting nonsense such as finishing 6th next season will be an achievement.
 

dove

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I know, but they made the decision to not follow the strategy they spouted, about not making a rash decision. They should have waited until the end of the season. Don't think the pressure from ex-players actually helped there.
What else did you expect from clueless board :lol: I always think "well, surely even they can't make more stupid decision than that" and I am always getting surprised. Seriously, why, just why would you offer Ole a permanent job in March and put yourself in this situation we are in now? It's just plain stupid. Even though I don't think Ole is the right man for the job I hope that at least it will create a serious public movement against the board, unsettle our sponsors and it will hit us financially. I said in the other thread that I am actually happy we missed on TOP 4 as otherwise it would just paper over the cracks again. The only chance something will change is if we start losing money.
 

Un4givableB

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Poor Darmian has been desperate to leave and we are quibbling or a couple of million pounds, can't affect the Glazer's pocket money can we?
No, that's Woodward trying to prove he's some kind of transfer player instead of the nob-head we all know he is.
 

DomesticTadpole

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What else did you expect from clueless board :lol: I always think "well, surely even they can't make more stupid decision than that" and I am always getting surprised. Seriously, why, just why would you offer Ole a permanent job in March and put yourself in this situation we are in now? It's just plain stupid. Even though I don't think Ole is the right man for the job I hope that at least it will create a serious public movement against the board, unsettle our sponsors and it will hit us financially. I said in the other thread that I am actually happy we missed on TOP 4 as otherwise it would just paper over the cracks again. The only chance something will change is if we start losing money.
I cannot make my mind up if we would have easily got CL football if we had kept as a temporary manager or not. It might have kept the players playing to get him the job, maybe. I think he has taken his eye off the ball a bit as well. Is it fitness? I think it is to an extent, but that will not change straight away. I am grasping at straws here. Help!!:lol:
 

calodo2003

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"There are people on the football side who think it will get worse before it gets better; that Wolves, Everton and Leicester are primed to overtake England’s most decorated league champions in the country"

https://www.fourfourtwo.com/feature...-ole-gunnar-solskjaer-ed-woodward-andy-mitten

I think we're gonna find out what the Tampa fans felt when the Glazer's ruined them. Unless we can get them out somehow..
As a Tampa Bay fan & season ticket holder since the orange sorbet & Bucco Bruce - a winking pirate with a stiletto in his lips, large feathered tri-point felt hat & a come hither look, it currently is shit for the Bucs. Sure, we won our only Super Bowl under the Glazer regime, but we also haven’t been to the playoffs in almost a decade. I thought the early Bucs were shit in their first years, but that is understandable for an expansion team (my family first started getting season tickets in 1978), but we also made it to the NFC Championship game the very next season. Then it was shit for fifteen years. Then we started making the playoffs, then won the Super Bowl, then shit again.

The reason for our long periods of being shitty can be boiled down to two things: poor coaching hires & poor drafting. We were / are also abysmal with free agency signings, but that falls under poor coaching hires. This is where the Bucs & United align, the wrong coaches & the wrong transfers.

The Bucs & the stadium make the Glazers a pretty penny even with the inferior product on the field. I never say a comparison between the two sports clubs until a few months ago when both clubs were entering key periods of the offseason with no head coach in place, no direction for the teams. The Bucs head coach hire has created some feel good emotions just like Ole has with United. But, for a decent part of the offseason, the Bucs has a GM who should have been fired a couple of years ago & the Glazers running the Bucs, similar to United having an interim manager & the Glazers running United.

I kind of look at us winning the league in 2013 as United’s Super Bowl victory. United is on a very similar descent immediately after, just like the Bucs.

Unfortunately, I don’t think either club has hit rock bottom yet.
 

GDaly95

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It's so bleak right now. It might not be rock bottom either, but it is in the sense that I think we've all come to realise that we won't be coming back from this anytime soon.

I find the incompetence incredible. I don't even know what to say anymore.
 

Toddler

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Pass me the rope......

It’s not quite the apocalypse yet but it’s going to be a dystopian future. Hordes of scousers with flaming torches. Beating drums that are emblazoned with Wijnaldums face.

We can either wallow in self pity or fight back.....

Question is. Do we have any fight left?
We have find a mean son of a bit'ch, a bastard who will beat the reigning order down and rise to the throne. Am I right?