Summer 2019 Midfield Rebuild

Mr Pigeon

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Did anyone ever see that film Lonely The Brave?

Classic 80s grindhouse movie about three builders from the North-West who can never agree on how to finish the porch steps on a public garden. They ponder their options because they've run out of money but know their local reputation is fecked if they don't finish it in the next two days. The old woman who runs the place is highly respected in the area and known as a bit of a gobshite, so they start to panic.

Eventually they get some cheap faux marble slabs but the old woman knows something's up so they kill her and bury her body under the porch. They leave a goodbye note from her and call the police. The next day a local detective inspector is on their backs about the whole thing and knows that something is up regarding the old lady just suddenly disappearing.

The final act of the film involves the three men being interrogated and none of them know what the others have said. The last scene of the film; the inspector comes into the room where one of the builders is still being held for questioning. He sits down, puts his glasses on the table and says "I'll give you £27.5 million for Fellaini."

Might have made the whole thing up, mind.
 

NoPace

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It's odd that we didn't just offer 70M the first day of the window to Ajax for Van De Beek.

Whether Ole would be playing him as the #10 or we'd be in a 4-3-3 or he and Pogba would be starting as a pair with McTominay backing them both up, I don't know, but he knows how to press, is good in the final 3rd and supposedly is better as an 8 than a 10. 22 years old. Runs hard, technically pretty good.
 

Ronaldo's Love Child

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A 4-4-2 diamond will maximize the abilities of our current and potential players.

Martial Rashford
Dybala
Pogba Bruno
Matic
Shaw Maguirre Lindelof Wan-Bissaka
De Gea

Bad news mate. We've ended talks with Dybala and have made no official move to sign Bruno.

Our summer midfield rebuild has yet to get started....
 

charlenefan

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It's odd that we didn't just offer 70M the first day of the window to Ajax for Van De Beek.

Whether Ole would be playing him as the #10 or we'd be in a 4-3-3 or he and Pogba would be starting as a pair with McTominay backing them both up, I don't know, but he knows how to press, is good in the final 3rd and supposedly is better as an 8 than a 10. 22 years old. Runs hard, technically pretty good.
It is surprising (for a layman at least) that that Ajax Squad hasn't been decimated more than it has, Van De Beek, Ziyech and even Neres I was sure would be picked up by someone
 

reddevil702

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Looks like it will Matic with Pogba and Mctominay vs Chelsea. No Dybala and it seems obvious we have little interest in Bruno. No rebuild coming boys.
 

MrSingh2002

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Ziyech and Fernandes is where I'd throw my money today.

Martial Rashford
Ziyech
Pogba Fernandes
McTominay
Shaw Lindelof Maguire AWB
De Gea​
 

Dominos

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How have we managed to let go of Herrera and Fellaini and not bring in a single midfielder? It makes absolutely no sense.
 

reddevilz007

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Losing Fellaini and Herrera, and it doesn’t look like we’re going to do anything about it.

Good job
 

mad1max954

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I’d say we are pretty ducked.

we need to hope like feck Scott turns into a Roy Keane regen and pogba doesn’t get injured, at all, ever.

If we somehow got Ruben neves in or someone else who could ping balls out, we might be ok, but even then your relying on the rashford, Jlingz and martial to do something they never have before.
 

MrSingh2002

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How have we managed to let go of Herrera and Fellaini and not bring in a single midfielder? It makes absolutely no sense.
We'll be trying to get free agents Riquelme and Rivaldo back out at this rate. Woodward won't sleep tonight... Was on the verge of a big deal and now looks like he shouldn't have let Felli and Herrera go. 3 and a half days to go. I'm anticipating a deadline day like when we got Falcao and Di Maria.

Mandzukic and two midfielders is what I'm expecting. With Lukaku and one centre back potentially leaving albeit on loan. See what happens.
 

PoTMS

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How have we managed to let go of Herrera and Fellaini and not bring in a single midfielder? It makes absolutely no sense.
Because we are a badly run club from top to bottom. No plan or strategy whatsoever. CEO doesn't know his ass from his elbow and our transfer strategy is scattergun as always. This is before you consider we have a rookie manager at the helm and only two good players, one of whom doesn't want to be here and the other who refuses to sign a new contract. Fully expect us to finish 6th again this season.
 

Redcy

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A 4-4-2 diamond will maximize the abilities of our current and potential players.

Martial Rashford
Dybala
Pogba Bruno
Matic
Shaw Maguirre Lindelof Wan-Bissaka
De Gea

Dybala and Bruni are not coming so maybe you can have this instead:

Martial Rashford
Lingard
Pogba Mata
McTominay
Shaw Maguirre Lindelof Wan-Bissaka
De Gea


There is no fire here​
 

Redcy

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We'll be trying to get free agents Riquelme and Rivaldo back out at this rate. Woodward won't sleep tonight... Was on the verge of a big deal and now looks like he shouldn't have let Felli and Herrera go. 3 and a half days to go. I'm anticipating a deadline day like when we got Falcao and Di Maria.

Mandzukic and two midfielders is what I'm expecting. With Lukaku and one centre back potentially leaving albeit on loan. See what happens.
I doubt even that, my guess is we sell Lukaku. Then we will get Woody : "Ole feels that with the great pre-season we have had that our young players, and experienced players like Matic, Mata and Fred will improve this year to challenge for the title". Best I sexpect right now is a 60m bid for Longstaff.
 

NoPace

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It is surprising (for a layman at least) that that Ajax Squad hasn't been decimated more than it has, Van De Beek, Ziyech and even Nereos I was sure would be picked up by someone
The Ziyech one is bizarre. He gives the ball away way too often, but he basically guarantees you goals and assists as a RW or a 10 and he runs his ass of. I would think one of the better non-Juve Italian sides in particular would be massively improved by him.
 

Scriblerus

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Fully expect us to finish 6th again this season.
I'd say that's highly optimistic given the business we've done so far. The midfield is weaker than last year, and it was inadequate then except for the few weeks after Ole arrived when Pogba actually got his finger out. The forward line is no better, and even though I'm a Rashford fan, that's not good enough. Greenwood and Gomes look good but aren't ready for more than a handful of starts next year. Other clubs have strengthened, and the likes of Wolves and Everton outplayed us last season.
This was supposed to be the window of a major rebuild, and we're very far from that.
 

bosnian_red

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I'd say that's highly optimistic given the business we've done so far. The midfield is weaker than last year, and it was inadequate then except for the few weeks after Ole arrived when Pogba actually got his finger out. The forward line is no better, and even though I'm a Rashford fan, that's not good enough. Greenwood and Gomes look good but aren't ready for more than a handful of starts next year. Other clubs have strengthened, and the likes of Wolves and Everton outplayed us last season.
This was supposed to be the window of a major rebuild, and we're very far from that.
:houllier: We took Leicester's main CB to fix a massive issue of ours. Took one of the best RB's in the league to fix the 2nd glaring issue in our squad. Arsenal's glaring issues have always been their defence - no change. They signed Pepe who can be a really good signing, but their attack was never the issue. Chelsea lost the best player in the league who they've been built around for years, lost Sarri and replaced him with Lampard,Higuain's loan ended, and have a transfer ban so they can't do anything but give younger players chances. Even then, their best young player, Hudson Odoi, tore his achilles so is out for a while. Spurs bought N'Dombele who should solidify them as 3rd, but could yet lose Eriksen which would be a backwards move overall for them this summer. Wolves bought the players who were previously on loan, and bought a striker from Milan who probably won't be a regular starter for them anyway. Liverpool bought nobody. City bought Rodri and soon to buy Cancelo.

So of all the teams in the top 8 teams or so, it's pretty clear that we've strengthened the most relative to last season. Some clubs just maintained, some clearly went backwards, but we addressed 2 massive issues that we had in a really big way. It's fine to think we aren't going to be amazing this year, but Chelsea is certainly going to take a backwards step with no more Hazard, while Arsenal will be their usual selves of having a very strong attack but a very bad defence. We're actually looking far more balanced now as our back 4 is sorted.

In terms of favourites, Spurs are clearly 3rd after City and Liverpool as 1 and 2, but 4/5 I'd say are close between United and Arsenal with United shading it, and Chelsea a more distant 6th, battling it out with Everton and Wolves and Leicester.
 

Scriblerus

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:houllier: We took Leicester's main CB to fix a massive issue of ours. Took one of the best RB's in the league to fix the 2nd glaring issue in our squad. Arsenal's glaring issues have always been their defence - no change. They signed Pepe who can be a really good signing, but their attack was never the issue. Chelsea lost the best player in the league who they've been built around for years, lost Sarri and replaced him with Lampard,Higuain's loan ended, and have a transfer ban so they can't do anything but give younger players chances. Even then, their best young player, Hudson Odoi, tore his achilles so is out for a while. Spurs bought N'Dombele who should solidify them as 3rd, but could yet lose Eriksen which would be a backwards move overall for them this summer. Wolves bought the players who were previously on loan, and bought a striker from Milan who probably won't be a regular starter for them anyway. Liverpool bought nobody. City bought Rodri and soon to buy Cancelo.

So of all the teams in the top 8 teams or so, it's pretty clear that we've strengthened the most relative to last season. Some clubs just maintained, some clearly went backwards, but we addressed 2 massive issues that we had in a really big way. It's fine to think we aren't going to be amazing this year, but Chelsea is certainly going to take a backwards step with no more Hazard, while Arsenal will be their usual selves of having a very strong attack but a very bad defence. We're actually looking far more balanced now as our back 4 is sorted.

In terms of favourites, Spurs are clearly 3rd after City and Liverpool as 1 and 2, but 4/5 I'd say are close between United and Arsenal with United shading it, and Chelsea a more distant 6th, battling it out with Everton and Wolves and Leicester.
Fair enough - but I think we'll draw and lose games to may lesser teams, as we have in the last few seasons, for want of attacking flair and finishing, and that our form overall will be nearer to last year under Jose and the period after Ole was confirmed as manager (when we were bloody awful in most games) that for that excellent run of results and luck after Ole came in as (apparently) a stopgap, which lifted out standing considerably. We'll see……….
 

oreon

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:houllier: We took Leicester's main CB to fix a massive issue of ours. Took one of the best RB's in the league to fix the 2nd glaring issue in our squad. Arsenal's glaring issues have always been their defence - no change. They signed Pepe who can be a really good signing, but their attack was never the issue. Chelsea lost the best player in the league who they've been built around for years, lost Sarri and replaced him with Lampard,Higuain's loan ended, and have a transfer ban so they can't do anything but give younger players chances. Even then, their best young player, Hudson Odoi, tore his achilles so is out for a while. Spurs bought N'Dombele who should solidify them as 3rd, but could yet lose Eriksen which would be a backwards move overall for them this summer. Wolves bought the players who were previously on loan, and bought a striker from Milan who probably won't be a regular starter for them anyway. Liverpool bought nobody. City bought Rodri and soon to buy Cancelo.

So of all the teams in the top 8 teams or so, it's pretty clear that we've strengthened the most relative to last season. Some clubs just maintained, some clearly went backwards, but we addressed 2 massive issues that we had in a really big way. It's fine to think we aren't going to be amazing this year, but Chelsea is certainly going to take a backwards step with no more Hazard, while Arsenal will be their usual selves of having a very strong attack but a very bad defence. We're actually looking far more balanced now as our back 4 is sorted.

In terms of favourites, Spurs are clearly 3rd after City and Liverpool as 1 and 2, but 4/5 I'd say are close between United and Arsenal with United shading it, and Chelsea a more distant 6th, battling it out with Everton and Wolves and Leicester.
The biggest glaring issue on this team is our midfield. We lost our starting midfielder and have not replaced him. And out starting CDM needs to be replaced. Fred and Periera were unplayable last season, what makes Ole think they will be better this season. McCTominay is under huge pressure to perform next season, ideally, he should be coming off the bench.
If I had to choose between Bruno Fernandes & Partey/CDM or Maguire & AWB, I would pick the midfield options every time. Say what you want about our CBs but we have enough options to squeeze through to 4th if the midfield was improved. I don't see how we can make it to 4th with this midfield. And if Pogba gets hurt, it's over.
 

davidmichael

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How have we managed to let go of Herrera and Fellaini and not bring in a single midfielder? It makes absolutely no sense.
Losing Fellaini and Herrera, and it doesn’t look like we’re going to do anything about it.

Good job
I’m thinking that Pereira is Fellaini’s replacement and McTominay is Herrera’s replacement so with Pogba, Matic and Fred we're only looking at a Matic alternative which I guess Longstaff was/is.

If we’re playing 4-2-3-1 this season then McTominay and Pogba is the way to go but we really need a better 10 than Mata or Lingard, guess Gomes will get a lot of minutes in that regard. I still think we’ll sign either a midfielder and a false 9/number 10 before the window closes.
 

Bestietom

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Among those we have only Pereira and McTominay that might be able to do the task.

Pereira got the technical abilities, can pass. If he is able to calm down and find his position, then he might function as our passer.
McTominay should be able to function in the role Matic has previously done. Need to improve his technical ability and passing range, as well as his ball handling speed(from receiving the ball until a pass has been made).

Still, highly unlikely. Get Marc Roca and Grillitsch in and the starting midfield is good. Should not cost more than Maguire combined.
My 2 Midfielders would be Partey and Pelegrini, Pogba roaming in front. We need steel and drive as well as class, and these 2 will give you plenty of that.
 

Werder Herzog

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Did i read in one of the many articles yesterday we are after a number 10 (in these dybala briefings)? Midfield is clearly our biggest weakness now, so if it is a number 10 why are we not following up our interest in Maddison? For me we have Lingard and Mata who could play that role- we need someone a bit deeper as we lost both Herrera and Fellaini- so at least one needs replacing as Perreira and McTominay were already at the club and Perreira is nowhere near good enough, i am scratching my head as to who- in the PL only Neves stands out- i am half hopeful Tottenham sign Fernandes or Lo Ceslo and we make a huge bid for Eriksen who can play the 10 or a bit deeper and kills 2 birds with one stone- just cannot see it happening as it makes to much sense.
 

Johan07

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Its surprising that we dont seem to have been looking at a more defensive midfielder this summer.
At the same time; its not the easiest thing to just replace Matic just like that, even if he is clearly declining. Its a position that is extremely difficult to play in the PL without tons of experience.
Everyone forgets how it took Fernandinho years to adapt even if he arrived in his prime.
Fabinho is starting to adapt but isnt really great yet either IMO.
Not to mention the fiasco that was Jorginho last season.
People can post FM-names from the Spanish, Italian and German leagues all they want, but the reality is that if we got for example like Partey in, he would be an understudy to Matic for now.
The biggest DM-talent in Europe (who I would have loved to have here) is Rodri, and the poor lad looked like he was scared to death when Liverpool upped the tempo second half yesterday. Granted, it was his first game, but he looked so far from anywhere near ready for the PL that it was crazy.
Ruben Neves looked good his first season but almost regressed the last one, which is a red flag to me.
If it was up to me I would have looked at getting a player like Matuidi off Juve, especially if they really want Lukaku. If he would like to come of course which is far from certain. For now just to take minutes of Matic.
Otherwise, tbf, there is not a ready made replacement for Matic in the market today, which makes it difficult to recruit.
Ideally we should get/have gotten one experienced DM and one prospect like Longstaff in this season. I would get rid of Pereira, he is an offensive CM where we are massively overstacked and just not going to be good enough longterm IMO.
Looks like it not happening though, which is a pity. But one cant ignore the fact that there just are not that many alternatives available.
 
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welshwingwizard

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In terms of favourites, Spurs are clearly 3rd after City and Liverpool as 1 and 2, but 4/5 I'd say are close between United and Arsenal with United shading it, and Chelsea a more distant 6th, battling it out with Everton and Wolves and Leicester.
10 years ago we had just won the double with one of the best squads in history. All the players in that squad were quality. The fact you have just written that paragraph and no-one is outraged anymore or we actually think 4th wouldn't be bad is absolutely amazing.

The Glazers have done a great job resetting expectations of what success is and around the planning/ investment we should have every year in the team. We have the money to buy 5-6 top quality players every year and take risks like Dan James on top. Its no surpise it always looks like we always "nearly" bring in big players but never really spend that much over summers. Hope i'm disproven.
 

Johan07

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10 years ago we had just won the double with one of the best squads in history. All the players in that squad were quality. The fact you have just written that paragraph and no-one is outraged anymore or we actually think 4th wouldn't be bad is absolutely amazing.

The Glazers have done a great job resetting expectations of what success is and around the planning/ investment we should have every year in the team. We have the money to buy 5-6 top quality players every year and take risks like Dan James on top. Its no surpise it always looks like we always "nearly" bring in big players but never really spend that much over summers. Hope i'm disproven.
Richie De Laet
Fabio
Darron Gibson
Rodrigo Possebon
Zoran Tosic
Macheda

Naw, you just rewrote history there.
 

Bestietom

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Its surprising that we dont seem to have been looking at a more defensive midfielder this summer.
At the same time; its not the easiest thing to just replace Matic just like that, even if he is clearly declining. Its a position that is extremely difficult to play in the PL without tons of experience.
Everyone forgets how it took Fernandinho years to adapt even if he arrived in his prime.
Fabinho is starting to adapt but isnt really great yet either IMO.
Not to mention the fiasco that was Jorginho last season.
People can post FM-names from the Spanish, Italian and German leagues all they want, but the reality is that if we got for example like Partey in, he would be an understudy to Matic for now.
The biggest DM-talent in Europe (who I would have loved to have here) is Rodri, and the poor lad looked like he was scared to death when Liverpool upped the tempo second half yesterday. Granted, it was his first game, but he looked so far from anywhere near ready for the PL that it was crazy.
Ruben Neves looked good his first season but almost regressed the last one, which is a red flag to me.
If it was up to me I would have looked at getting a player like Matuidi off Juve, especially if they really want Lukaku. If he would like to come of course which is far from certain. For now just to take minutes of Matic.
Otherwise, tbf, there is not a ready made replacement for Matic in the market today, which makes it difficult to recruit.
Ideally we should get/have gotten one experienced DM and one prospect like Longstaff in this season. I would get rid of Pereira, he is an offensive CM where we are massively overstacked and just not going to be good enough longterm IMO.
Looks like it not happening though, which is a pity. But one cant ignore the fact that there just are not that many alternatives available.
Stick to your financial posts, mate as you know nothing about football, if you don't think that Partey would be an upgrade on Matic.
Oh and you take a chance on every player you bring in, If you could forecast how they all turn out, then you would always be the best, right.
 

Riz

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I’m far more concerned about our midfield than attack to be honest even though both have been so horribly neglected this window.

Having lost Herrera and Fellaini it’s clear that their positions in the squad will be occupied by McTominay and Pereira. I can see both developing but unless they have real breakout years then neither are “good enough” to improve upon our dismal midfield performances last year.

Matic continues to decline and will be a huge problem this year whilst Fred hasn’t shown any signs of being a £50m player.

And then we have Pogba, he’ll have to yet again carry the burden of the midfield by himself and we’re going to have to rely on a player who probably has 1 eye on the summer 2020 window.

The extent of the issue is unknown given we won’t know how McTominay, Fred and Pereira adapt to their new found responsibilities, how much further Matic will sink and what sort of Pogba we’ll see this season but the fact we’re going into the new campaign after such a crucial window with these question marks is honestly depressing. Three of our rivals have made additions in this area with Rodri, Ndombele and Ceballos (all of which finished above us last season).

We actually now have a worse midfield than we did last season and unless something happens in the next 4 days we’re really going to struggle in this area yet again.
 

RedDevilRoshi

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Our midfield needs addressing more than our attack.

It’s criminal how we’ve just ignored it and will only sign someone if Pogba was to leave.
 

Fer

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I think the midfielder we are going to sign next summer is going to be Pogba's replacement.

We should go for a top midfielder able to play in a midfield of 2 (next to Mctominay). Someone like Saul would be great. If we sell Pogba and release Matic, then another mid like Neves, Rice, Ndidi would be a good addition.

Also, Sancho should be our priority next summer
 

Jacob

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Let's face it, we were never going to plug all holes in one summer. We adressed the two most critical positions with AWB and Maguire. Fellaini and Herrera weren't that great to begin with so I don't think we worsened in midfield with the addition of McTominay, Pereira and to a lesser extent Garner.
 

kouroux

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:houllier: We took Leicester's main CB to fix a massive issue of ours. Took one of the best RB's in the league to fix the 2nd glaring issue in our squad. Arsenal's glaring issues have always been their defence - no change. They signed Pepe who can be a really good signing, but their attack was never the issue. Chelsea lost the best player in the league who they've been built around for years, lost Sarri and replaced him with Lampard,Higuain's loan ended, and have a transfer ban so they can't do anything but give younger players chances. Even then, their best young player, Hudson Odoi, tore his achilles so is out for a while. Spurs bought N'Dombele who should solidify them as 3rd, but could yet lose Eriksen which would be a backwards move overall for them this summer. Wolves bought the players who were previously on loan, and bought a striker from Milan who probably won't be a regular starter for them anyway. Liverpool bought nobody. City bought Rodri and soon to buy Cancelo.

So of all the teams in the top 8 teams or so, it's pretty clear that we've strengthened the most relative to last season. Some clubs just maintained, some clearly went backwards, but we addressed 2 massive issues that we had in a really big way. It's fine to think we aren't going to be amazing this year, but Chelsea is certainly going to take a backwards step with no more Hazard, while Arsenal will be their usual selves of having a very strong attack but a very bad defence. We're actually looking far more balanced now as our back 4 is sorted.

In terms of favourites, Spurs are clearly 3rd after City and Liverpool as 1 and 2, but 4/5 I'd say are close between United and Arsenal with United shading it, and Chelsea a more distant 6th, battling it out with Everton and Wolves and Leicester.
Arsenal did sign a young CB.
 

Johan07

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Stick to your financial posts, mate as you know nothing about football, if you don't think that Partey would be an upgrade on Matic.
Oh and you take a chance on every player you bring in, If you could forecast how they all turn out, then you would always be the best, right.
Where did I state that? I dont even have an opinion until I see Partey in another surrounding than Atletico and La Liga, which was kinda my point. They are not that similar players to begin with tbf either; even if they are both DMs.
My point was that DM - and especially a position more of a pure No6 that players like Matic and Fernandinho occupies - is much more difficult to play in general, but especially in the PL. Much easier to adapt on a wing or as a FB as a new player. CB is tough as well, which is why Maquire was a good buy. He will slot right in.
I never wanted Matic to begin with and have wanted him phased out since he arrived. Reality is that he will clock major minutes this year as well, though. And he would even if we got a player like Partey in. The DM position is something that Mourinho should have started to address two seasons ago instead of crying about more CBs.
 

Raw

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Let's face it, we were never going to plug all holes in one summer. We adressed the two most critical positions with AWB and Maguire. Fellaini and Herrera weren't that great to begin with so I don't think we worsened in midfield with the addition of McTominay, Pereira and to a lesser extent Garner.
In terms of numbers we've definitely worsened, plus Matic is getting older and slower. Outside of Pogba, our most trusted midfielder is McTominay at this point in time. Then we have Fred (who's inconsistent and no one really knows where his best position is), Pereira (same as Fred), Matic (becoming a hindrance) and Garner (unknown quantity). It's an awful midfield selection. An injury to Pogba and our midfield is suddenly looking utter shite.
 

Adisa

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Our midfield is worse than last season, without question. Shambles.
 

Bestietom

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Where did I state that? I dont even have an opinion until I see Partey in another surrounding than Atletico and La Liga, which was kinda my point. They are not that similar players to begin with tbf either; even if they are both DMs.
My point was that DM - and especially a position more of a pure No6 that players like Matic and Fernandinho occupies - is much more difficult to play in general, but especially in the PL. Much easier to adapt on a wing or as a FB as a new player. CB is tough as well, which is why Maquire was a good buy. He will slot right in.
I never wanted Matic to begin with and have wanted him phased out since he arrived. Reality is that he will clock major minutes this year as well, though. And he would even if we got a player like Partey in. The DM position is something that Mourinho should have started to address two seasons ago instead of crying about more CBs.
Not going to keep answering you all day long. I will just finish with. WE need a TOP DM in this window and to REPLACE Matic, and not allow him play any part this season. Goodbye sir.
 

welshwingwizard

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492
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Richie De Laet
Fabio
Darron Gibson
Rodrigo Possebon
Zoran Tosic
Macheda

Naw, you just rewrote history there.
Congratulations on being pedantic whilst completely missing the bigger picture. Let me re-phrase: "all regular playing members of the squad were quality".

No idea why people have to be so literal just to score points. Main argument is same...glazers have re-set expectations so we are accepting of being second best.
 

Sparky Rhiwabon

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Jul 10, 2013
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People talking about Matic not playing any part this season....isn't he first choice still given that we've chosen not to address that situation? Not sure we have another option?