Smalling / on loan to Roma 1 year

Status
Not open for further replies.

I Am Zlatan

Full Member
Joined
May 26, 2016
Messages
557
We can't loan or sell players that don't want to leave or no one wants. Someone wants Smalling and he's happy to go, so off he goes.
That’s true, I guess it is what it is, we definitely need reinforcements in January, so hopefully us clearing our wage bill out will allow us to bring the much needed reinforcements..
 

Lee565

Full Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2019
Messages
4,979
There goes the hope of seeing a logical balanced United side of 352, we will instead spend the season using a formation that requires wingers when we dont have any good ones and two average fullbacks going forward so we will basically see more of the same as what we have seen already where we are piss poor down the wings.


Guess we have given up on achieving anything of not this season as well because come the business end of the season there is no way injuries in all positions will mount up and will be reliant on Tuanzebe to come good and Jones to stay fit because bailly and rojo and not worth considering as they are complete liabilities, still not even sold on lindelof as the ideal partner for Maguire either as I dont think they compliment each other that well.
 

roonster09

Hercule Poirot of the scouting world
Scout
Joined
May 10, 2009
Messages
36,520
There goes the hope of seeing a logical balanced United side of 352, we will instead spend the season using a formation that requires wingers when we dont have any good ones and two average fullbacks going forward so we will basically see more of the same as what we have seen already where we are piss poor down the wings.


Guess we have given up on achieving anything of not this season as well because come the business end of the season there is no way injuries in all positions will mount up and will be reliant on Tuanzebe to come good and Jones to stay fit because bailly and rojo and not worth considering as they are complete liabilities, still not even sold on lindelof as the ideal partner for Maguire either as I dont think they compliment each other that well.
3-5-2 which requires good wingbacks, so average FBs somehow magically transform themselves into good wingbacks when we switch to 3-5-2.
 

pawanraj

Full Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2008
Messages
437
Location
.
Not true. Just because he has been played there in the past does not mean he can play there. He can’t.
Don't get me wrong, I don't want him to play in the midfield if I can help it... But considering our midfield options are Pogba, McTominay, Matic and Fred... we may very well need a body there.

At any rate, I rate Jones equal to or better than Smalling at most things except aerial battles (and that because Smalling has a 3 inches on Jones).
 

Lee565

Full Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2019
Messages
4,979
3-5-2 which requires good wingbacks, so average FBs somehow magically transform themselves into good wingbacks when we switch to 3-5-2.
Dalot would be good wing back but is not great/trusted in a back 4 as a full back and considering the work rate of James with his willingness to track back he could fill the left side which he looks much better on or even young who is has always looked far better on the left than he has on the right with his in swinging crosses.
 

roseguy64

Full Member
Joined
Aug 21, 2010
Messages
12,172
Location
Jamaica
He's a very honest professional but he is probably 7th or 8th choice central defender in the English national team. He should never have left Fulham when Hodgson was his manager there as that was his level as a player. How he lasted so long here will go down as one of footballs great mysteries.
Because he's a top 6 level defender. That's why he's going to a team who's regularly been a top 3 finisher in Italy and not Bournemouth.
 

roonster09

Hercule Poirot of the scouting world
Scout
Joined
May 10, 2009
Messages
36,520
Dalot would be good wing back but is not great/trusted in a back 4 as a full back and considering the work rate of James with his willingness to track back he could fill the left side which he looks much better on or even young who is has always looked far better on the left than he has on the right with his in swinging crosses.
So James who is physically weak is the answer for LWB. Create more problems and solution is playing more players out of position.
 

OleGunnar20

Full Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2018
Messages
2,158
Hmm, conflicted feelings on this one!

I rate him as a good defender, on par with Lindelof at least despite both being very different players (I don't rate either as good enough to be starting for a title challenging team).

While I'd much rather see any of our three crocks out the door I understand that's perhaps a big ask.

All things considered I'm just happy to see the omnipresent surplus figures in the squad finally being phased out. Seems we're working with an ounce or sense these days, prioritising promising youth above mediocre seniors - which is very very encouraging!
 

Lee565

Full Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2019
Messages
4,979
So James who is physically weak is the answer for LWB. Create more problems and solution is playing more players out of position.
Doesn't look that weak to me and most fullbacks are usually on the smaller side and he has done well tracking back and halting the opposition's attack down the wings
 

roonster09

Hercule Poirot of the scouting world
Scout
Joined
May 10, 2009
Messages
36,520
Doesn't look that weak to me and most fullbacks are usually on the smaller side and he has done well tracking back and halting the opposition's attack down the wings
That's like saying attacking FB can play as winger, ball playing CB can play as DM. Creating unnecessary problems.
 

amolbhatia50k

Sneaky bum time - Vaccination status: dozed off
Joined
Nov 8, 2002
Messages
95,337
Location
india
I agree, but finding another professional football club willing to allow Jones to play for them and pay him for the privilege is an impossible task. No one is that stupid.

We're stuck with Philip Jonas forever.
Pay a portion of Jones and Rojos wages to get rid of them.

Maybe Smalling is declining and we've gotten rid at the right time but he's been our best CB for years now. Always had faith in him as a defender.
 

Isotope

Ten Years a Cafite
Joined
Mar 6, 2012
Messages
23,554
Has Ole given up the Top 4 this season? We only have Maguire who's good with heading.
 

Ekeke

Full Member
Joined
Aug 1, 2006
Messages
53,080
Location
Hope, We Lose
A good CB on his day, as you say, but too inconsistent at the same time. His proneness to errors makes him unreliable, similar to Jones, Rojo and Bailly in that regard.
He's made less errors than Lindelof in his United career and Lindelof has only been around just over 2 seasons.
 

MikeKing

Full Member
Joined
Aug 7, 2017
Messages
5,125
Supports
Bournemouth
Pay a portion of Jones and Rojos wages to get rid of them.

Maybe Smalling is declining and we've gotten rid at the right time but he's been our best CB for years now. Always had faith in him as a defender.
That must be the case. I feel he'd at least deserve the chance to play alongside another natural CB like Maguire, to see how that would work out. Maybe Ole is one of those fans who always rated Jones ahead of Smalling and lumped them in together when Jones did bad and Smalling held us down. We have a lot of kids in the team, so to have two established CB's who are very good at defending would have been preferable.

Well, they can't get all decisions right. I like the incentive they have to change the squad but they have gotten the order very wrong. You can weaken the team for one season if it means that the next year you'll be in a stronger position, but we'll most likely have him back and still struggle to sell Rojo, Jones, Bailly etc.. :houllier:
 

Isotope

Ten Years a Cafite
Joined
Mar 6, 2012
Messages
23,554
This pile of deadwood players have been giving up on almost every season from quite a while now.
He's far away from a deadwood. Smalling is a reliable backup, where the other 4 CBs are questionable.

I just think this is an unnecessary gamble by Ole, given the last showing by Lindelof.
 

#07

makes new threads with tweets in the OP
Joined
Oct 25, 2010
Messages
23,258

...this is worse than when they started to say Dybala wasn't coming. Much worse...
 

LVGSdive

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Aug 20, 2019
Messages
534
When did this forum become so indecisive? Everybody wants the deadwood gone until it comes time to actually get rid of them.
Ill bet anything he's leaving because he doesn't want to be a bench player. Simple as that imo
Smalling isn't a player I consider to be deadwood. He is better than Jones, Bailey and Rojo. I think he and Lindelof are around the same level. Therefore, deadwood is Jones, Bailey, and Rojo not Smalling. Although other posters clearly don't rate Smalling.
 

Van Piorsing

Lost his light sabre
Joined
Feb 10, 2006
Messages
22,525
Location
Polska
He's far away from a deadwood. Smalling is a reliable backup, where the other 5 CBs are questionable.

I just think this is an unnecessary gamble by Ole, given the last showing by Lindelof.
Forgive me, if I'm not on my knees crying because Chris Smalling is leaving. This argument that he needs to stay because he's better than Rojo and Jones at this point sounds like a nice dodge from admitting the objective level of football abilities Smalling currently possess.

Ole will never be able to play desired football with players who have basic problems with controlling the ball. He didn't play pre-season, he's not playing currently, probably not improving on his ball control skills, not in any high form nor any match rhythm whatsoever.

I don't see much promising reasoning behind his further contribution to the team that needs to improve and not stagnate with same failing elements.
 

amolbhatia50k

Sneaky bum time - Vaccination status: dozed off
Joined
Nov 8, 2002
Messages
95,337
Location
india
Forgive me, if I'm not on my knees crying because Chris Smalling is leaving. This argument that he needs to stay because he's better than Rojo and Jones at this point sounds like a nice dodge from admitting the objective level of football abilities Smalling currently possess.

Ole will never be able to play desired football with players who have basic problems with controlling the ball. He didn't play pre-season, he's not playing currently, probably not improving on his ball control skills, not in any high form nor any match rhythm whatsoever.

I don't see much promising reasoning behind his further contribution to the team that needs to improve and not stagnate with same failing elements.
I doubt anybody wants you to be on your knees crying.

Smalling isn't merely better than the likes of Jones, Rojo and Bailly. He's been a very good CB for years. If we're selling him, I can only imaging theres been a decline starting from last year or at least I hope we have a strong enough reason such as that.
 

Van Piorsing

Lost his light sabre
Joined
Feb 10, 2006
Messages
22,525
Location
Polska
I doubt anybody wants you to be on your knees crying.

Smalling isn't merely better than the likes of Jones, Rojo and Bailly. He's been a very good CB for years. If we're selling him, I can only imaging theres been a decline starting from last year or at least I hope we have a strong enough reason such as that.
Very good CB for years ? Sorry but I tend to watch other big teams to know something close to objective definition of very good CB from years.

If he stays he won't play much anyway, unless we sack Ole and bring back LvG.
 

Lee565

Full Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2019
Messages
4,979
That's like saying attacking FB can play as winger, ball playing CB can play as DM. Creating unnecessary problems.
No, there is difference with the wingback position compared to being a winger or full back, moses was a winger who played fine as a wingback for Chelsea but obviously wasn't able to play as a full back and vice versa you wouldnt mind a player like dalot being used a wingback but you wouldnt really want him as a winger.
 

roonster09

Hercule Poirot of the scouting world
Scout
Joined
May 10, 2009
Messages
36,520
No, there is difference with the wingback position compared to being a winger or full back, moses was a winger who played fine as a wingback for Chelsea but obviously wasn't able to play as a full back and vice versa you wouldnt mind a player like dalot being used a wingback but you wouldnt really want him as a winger.
Moses was built like a tank, James is like fragile bicycle.
 

#07

makes new threads with tweets in the OP
Joined
Oct 25, 2010
Messages
23,258
Smalling being arguably better than Jones or Rojo means nothing. None of them would get near City's squad, nevermind first XI. They all need to go. The order in which they go is irrelevant. Chris is a decent centre back, nothing more. I am not going to mourn his overdue departure.
 

edgar allan

Full Member
Joined
May 15, 2017
Messages
2,734
Very good CB for years ? Sorry but I tend to watch other big teams to know something close to objective definition of very good CB from years.

If he stays he won't play much anyway, unless we sack Ole and bring back LvG.
One injury and we will have Jones back in the starting role. Two games later it will be Rojo.
 

Leftback99

Might have a bedwetting fetish.
Joined
Jan 11, 2015
Messages
13,967
A good CB on his day, as you say, but too inconsistent at the same time. His proneness to errors makes him unreliable, similar to Jones, Rojo and Bailly in that regard.
And Lindelof. The difference is Smalling defends better than any of them and ais actually a threat in the opposition box.

This looks like a cost cutting measure to me because we can't get rid of the other dross.
 

Jimmy_Bond

New Member
Joined
Jul 27, 2019
Messages
583
He has been one for the majority of his time at United. I used top 6 because that's where we've been while Roma have been in the top 3.
I don't really agree that he's top 6 to be honest. I'd say top half at best.

I personally think he's a poor players for a club like United, and I'm happy he's going. Each to their own though.
 

Van Piorsing

Lost his light sabre
Joined
Feb 10, 2006
Messages
22,525
Location
Polska
One injury and we will have Jones back in the starting role. Two games later it will be Rojo.
...and four games later will be another defender who should not play for this club from years. Thankfully Ole doesn't put any of Smalling Jones and Rojo even on the bench.

We're still trying to justify an underwhelming player by comparing him to even more underwhelming players so Smalling can look as not as bad.
 

Mihai

Full Member
Joined
Dec 11, 2013
Messages
4,614
Dalot would be good wing back but is not great/trusted in a back 4 as a full back and considering the work rate of James with his willingness to track back he could fill the left side which he looks much better on or even young who is has always looked far better on the left than he has on the right with his in swinging crosses.
Maguire-Lindelof-AWB
 

SteveW

Full Member
Joined
Mar 6, 2013
Messages
7,194
Really odd! I remember when we were playing Small and Jones everyone wanted them out, I do not mind who will go out first I want them all out! Are you sure you are not the agent of him? He's worth his weight in gold? wow, such a defender we lost! people are really odd here!
Ask Mbappe, Kane and countless others who have struggled against him. We have a number of worse defenders that we are keeping.

No, I'm not his agent. What a dumb question.
 

Dante

Average bang
Joined
Oct 22, 2010
Messages
25,280
Location
My wit's end
Really odd! I remember when we were playing Small and Jones everyone wanted them out, I do not mind who will go out first I want them all out! Are you sure you are not the agent of him? He's worth his weight in gold? wow, such a defender we lost! people are really odd here!
His weight in gold is about £3.24m, so the loan fee is about right.

81kg x £40,000
 

edgar allan

Full Member
Joined
May 15, 2017
Messages
2,734
...and four games later will be another defender who should not play for this club from years. Thankfully Ole doesn't put any of Smalling Jones and Rojo even on the bench.

We're still trying to justify an underwhelming player by comparing him to even more underwhelming players so Smalling can look as not as bad.
Every team needs back ups. The idea that we will go a full season without injuries is madness.
Of course he is not a top class player but he is miles better than Rojo & Jones.
 

Van Piorsing

Lost his light sabre
Joined
Feb 10, 2006
Messages
22,525
Location
Polska
Every team needs back ups. The idea that we will go a full season without injuries is madness.
Of course he is not a top class player but he is miles better than Rojo & Jones.
This will be a circular conversation unless, we'll see a big picture.

Yes, he's better than Rojo and Jones and that's probably most underwhelming achievement I ever heard for supposedly a quality defender.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.