Glaston gem on Bayern vs Spurs

horsechoker

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Glaston In India
A Netflix Production



Episode 1

TOUR GUIDE: "These are the remains of a great monastery, built in the time of the Gupta Empire."
GLASTON: "Very impressive...but it doesn't have a retractable football pitch, does it?"
TOUR GUIDE: *snores*
GLASTON: "One-nil to Spurs."
Episode 2

Glaston lectures the Indian Cricket Team on why they wouldn't make top 4 in the Premier League.
 

Suedesi

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The last time Bayern faced a title challenging English team it didn’t end well, if I recall. Slapped 3-1 in your own backyard.

City are far better than you as well, and would totally control the game. Don’t let our horrendous capitulation or inability to defend fool you in to thinking this Bayern team is on Liverpool or City’s level .. it isn’t, and if you meet again in the CL knockouts that’ll be quickly obvious.
That was the worst Bayern in a decade with Rafinha, Ribery and Robben on their last legs and Muller and Kimich suspended, Tolisso injured. Even then he teams canceled each other out at Anfield.
 

Suedesi

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I think they’d both probably lose to city both home and away in the league, lose to Liverpool at anfield and wouldn’t dominate the rest of the top six like city/Liverpool do.

They might get 85-90 points but at no point do I really think they’d be in the thick of it with Liverpool or City.
City is overrated. This is the team that has never EVER made it past the CL semifinals and somehow we’re ready to crown them the best team in Europe? Because Sky said so. Nah.
 
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FootballHQ

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He did actually post straight after the game in fairness, simple message of Spurs were battered but still expected them to make knock outs.

I probably make him right tbh. Olympiakos blew a lead in Belgrade so that helped Spurs out.
 

SquishyMcSquish

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That was the worst Bayern in a decade with Rafinha, Ribery and Robben on their last legs and Muller and Kimich suspended, Tolisso injured. Even then he teams canceled each other out at Anfield.
They parked the bus at Anfield.
 

Random Task

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Why are you guys bullying Glaston, he's harmless leave him be.
There is a perfectly valid reason that Glaston has escaped a permanent ban all these years, that being: he is not a real boy. He is, in fact, a parody account created by the mods out of sheer boredom to mess with us fine upstanding caftards.

Truth.
 

cyberman

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This is what happens when your metric for quality is a cup competition set to classical music
The best sides in Europe routinely make it to the latter stages though. There are few upsets in Cl football which makes Peps lack of control in those games v inferior opposition all the more baffling
 

SquishyMcSquish

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The best sides in Europe routinely make it to the latter stages though. There are few upsets in Cl football which makes Peps lack of control in those games v inferior opposition all the more baffling
IMO if they beat us they comfortably defeat Ajax and it’s 60/40 in their favour for the final.

We got very, very lucky against them in the quarters. Llorente’s borderline handball goal and then a very narrow offside goal made the difference.

That’s the nature of knockout competitions. Luck plays a huge part. We know City are better than us or Liverpool, yet it was us two that got to the final.

I’d back City in a league competition to finish ahead of any team in Europe. Across that many games, they’re a machine.
 

adexkola

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The best sides in Europe routinely make it to the latter stages though. There are few upsets in Cl football which makes Peps lack of control in those games v inferior opposition all the more baffling
The best teams in Europe routinely win their league competitions. And other trophies. What happened to that metric?
 

KM

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Can't believe there are some people actually discussing it seriously.
 

Fortitude

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The best teams in Europe routinely win their league competitions. And other trophies. What happened to that metric?
Uber squads. It's not a valid metric and hasn't been for some time now. Battering teams with less money and resources than you and then coming up short when up against equally wealthy giants in Europe is actually and even worse reflection on an all-conquering league side and sets them out as flat-track bullies.
 

adexkola

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And they all build for Europe and see it as the ultimate goal
An ultimate goal only 2 teams have accomplished in the past 4 years. In only one of those years did the CL champion win their league. You see why I don't put as much stock in it as you've have?

Uber squads. It's not a valid metric and hasn't been for some time now. Battering teams with less money and resources than you and then coming up short when up against equally wealthy giants in Europe is actually and even worse reflection on an all-conquering league side and sets them out as flat-track bullies.
2 problems here:

1. In a cup competition it's more about the luck of the day than the overall quality of the side. If the CL was a proper league competition then I'd concede this point

2. How do you account for Barcelona beating Real Madrid, a CL champion for 3 years straight, in El Classico after El Classico, senselessly at times? How do you account for City beating Liverpool and Tottenham, teams that knocked them out in CL competition, in the league in head to head competition?
 

Fortitude

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An ultimate goal only 2 teams have accomplished in the past 4 years. In only one of those years did the CL champion win their league. You see why I don't put as much stock in it as you've have?



2 problems here:

1. In a cup competition it's more about the luck of the day than the overall quality of the side. If the CL was a proper league competition then I'd concede this point

2. How do you account for Barcelona beating Real Madrid, a CL champion for 3 years straight, in El Classico after El Classico, senselessly at times? How do you account for City beating Liverpool and Tottenham, teams that knocked them out in CL competition, in the league in head to head competition?
1. has always been nonsense and it's a discussion that is never resolved on here because those talking about 'cup competition' always fade out and avoid the bare bones (crux) of the conversation, only to then repeat the same thing ad infinitum a few months/years later. In the end, everyone just leaves it be and has others believe in what they believe without contesting it as it'll never be settled one way or the other. I will add here that for the fact these are mere cup competitions, the amount of winners who were favoured to do so before a ball is even kicked is uncanny and we can that back to the 1930's, if not earlier with it being more solidified in the 50's and 60's when the European Cup was officially formed.

2. The pressures of league competition and European competition are polls apart. There won't be many games ever played where the pressure of an intra competition outweighed those of a CL latter stage contest. An example being the sheer terror and apprehension of losing the derby to City or Liverpool in a CL semi or final compared to a trivial (in relative terms) game in the league. Pressure ramps up mistakes and flappability and also sees players and teams fold, which is why it is a tangible measure of greatness - to overcome - and those supposedly great teams who do not, are ultimately looked down upon in the annuls of time, or at the very least, their victory and standing comes with an asterisk that begs examination.

The Champions League is still the only competition that hasn't been bought whereas domestic football has, multiple times over, across the top leagues in Europe. That lowers the league and actually gives the CL even more reason to be revered.
 

adexkola

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@Fortitude more derailment, yay!!!

1. It's never been nonsense. Liverpool in 2005, Chelsea in 2012. Schalke in 2011. Shoot... City, the year they made the semis, were worse than any iteration of Pep's City after his first year with them. Conversely, look at how United have been fecked over in years where our quality could not be argued against. 2010 against Bayern. SAF's last year against Real. There is too much volatility for me personally to take it as a sole indicator of quality unless it is augmented with accompanying evidence. Others see it differently and that's cool, I just classify such viewpoints as myopic

2. Eh, sometimes. Look at Atletico's title run in 2014, Leicester's title run in, last year's PL title race. Pressure can exist in both cup and league competitions.

The ultimate crown of quality for me is a clean double sweep, sure. Anything short of that is up to interpretation. A CL final appearance alone or a trophy isn't cutting it.
 

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Fortitude

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@Fortitude more derailment, yay!!!

1. It's never been nonsense. Liverpool in 2005, Chelsea in 2012. Schalke in 2011. Shoot... City, the year they made the semis, were worse than any iteration of Pep's City after his first year with them. Conversely, look at how United have been fecked over in years where our quality could not be argued against. 2010 against Bayern. SAF's last year against Real. There is too much volatility for me personally to take it as a sole indicator of quality unless it is augmented with accompanying evidence. Others see it differently and that's cool, I just classify such viewpoints as myopic

2. Eh, sometimes. Look at Atletico's title run in 2014, Leicester's title run in, last year's PL title race. Pressure can exist in both cup and league competitions.

The ultimate crown of quality for me is a clean double sweep, sure. Anything short of that is up to interpretation. A CL final appearance alone or a trophy isn't cutting it.
!. If you do an objective sweep of World Cups, Euros, Copa Americas comparing those who were expected to win or contest the final before a ball had even been kicked compared to shocks and underdogs, the results are overwhelmingly in favour of the former, same goes for the Champions League and European Cup before it - you can name the glitches because they are infrequent and thus stick out like a sore thumb, just as with Greece winning the Euros. Anomalies that actually prove there is a natural order rather than show cup competitions as a farcical.

2. And in reverse, you're putting out blips, plucky gunners who the stars aligned for in the midst of bought leagues left, right and centre. And to be sure, leagues always had stacked 1st xi's, but when uber squads were introduced, with benches that in the old way would be a contesting side in their own right, the league became about who could stack the greater supplemental set of players rather than about xi's that took hits when star men were out and gave other, equally skilled xi's, their chance to steal ahead in title races. All leagues can attest to this: from the phenomenal competition of Serie A across 10 teams in the 80's and 90's to Juventus just juggernauting, via resources, to how things became in La Liga, The PL and Ligue Un over time. It's a proven, formulaic and rather underwhelming devolution of what the leagues once stood for. These insane point totals aren't being accrued by xi men + chancers anymore; it's a wholly different ball game, one that bails out these sides in the league and exposes them in Europe, which is why we see, 'suddenly', all that glitters isn't gold as these Uber sides fall short time and time and time again.
 

adexkola

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!. If you do an objective sweep of World Cups, Euros, Copa Americas comparing those who were expected to win or contest the final before a ball had even been kicked compared to shocks and underdogs, the results are overwhelmingly in favour of the former, same goes for the Champions League and European Cup before it - you can name the glitches because they are infrequent and thus stick out like a sore thumb, just as with Greece winning the Euros. Anomalies that actually prove there is a natural order rather than show cup competitions as a farcical.

2. And in reverse, you're putting out blips, plucky gunners who the stars aligned for in the midst of bought leagues left, right and centre. And to be sure, leagues always had stacked 1st xi's, but when uber squads were introduced, with benches that in the old way would be a contesting side in their own right, the league became about who could stack the greater supplemental set of players rather than about xi's that took hits when star men were out and gave other, equally skilled xi's, their chance to steal ahead in title races. All leagues can attest to this: from the phenomenal competition of Serie A across 10 teams in the 80's and 90's to Juventus just juggernauting, via resources, to how things became in La Liga, The PL and Ligue Un over time. It's a proven, formulaic and rather underwhelming devolution of what the leagues once stood for. These insane point totals aren't being accrued by xi men + chancers anymore; it's a wholly different ball game, one that bails out these sides in the league and exposes them in Europe, which is why we see, 'suddenly', all that glitters isn't gold as these Uber sides fall short time and time and time again.
I kind of agree with you, I think (I don't actually, I think you overestimate the impact of squad packing on team's results in different leagues), but I think we are arguing different points, so let me restate mine.

CL success or progress is, on its own, an inadequate metric of a team's quality. That was my original point.

Do you agree with that?