What's the excuse for the bad run last season?
"A quagmire of mediocrity" - anonymous member of staff at United
- Thread starter Bastian
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I think if Ole had a spine in the team (which he has tried to add with his 3 signings) he can bed in young players, not totally rely on them. Rashford wasn't relied on as a main striker after others came back from injury.
Like I said, James is 22 and wasn't bought to be a starter..yet because Ole wasn't backed, James is now first on the team sheet.
To understand how badly run and having absolutely no intention of backing this rebuild.. think back to the summer when you, I and all other fans logged into the Maguire thread everyday and refreshed it all summer to see if the deal was done. The deal was completed the last week of the window. WHY? Leicester didn't change their stance all summer.
Reason why is cause there was no intention in getting a midfielder this window. No intention of replacing Lukaku, Herrera, Sanchez...
Yes Ole said there is good youngsters but he never wanted to completely rely on unproven kids simple because we bought James, Maguire and AWB. If us as fans can see that would never work why would you think Ole would think that...you really think he's that stupid?
I'm sorry if you feel offended as a fan. I also feel offended that our fan base refuse to see the problems at the club.
I will hold Ole's team accountable for the injury list. There has to be an issue there. But expecting Ole to get kids to perform with no spine to the team is asking for a miracle.
Like I said, we all saw the plan during the preseason Asia tour...Lukaku and Sanchez were not involved but the plan wasn't to have players like Greenwood, Chong, Gomes and James as starters in the team.
No I think most fans are realistic that there are serious long term problems here and that a rebuild is needed. Just most believe Ole is not the man to do it.
I don't know, I'm reading this reading that, this is wrong, that's bit is right, give this one more time , that ones to young, etc etc, my head is bleeding.
What is right, were shit on the pitch, no two ways about it, that needs addressing before investments, sponsors dividends to share holders.
We're in the shit big time, and this international break will test the resolve of Ole and Woodward. I'm not in charge but I'd use this break to get a Manager in , and sack ole, and Woodward.
What is right, were shit on the pitch, no two ways about it, that needs addressing before investments, sponsors dividends to share holders.
We're in the shit big time, and this international break will test the resolve of Ole and Woodward. I'm not in charge but I'd use this break to get a Manager in , and sack ole, and Woodward.
I can't disagree that immediate performances and results would improve under a new manager but I feel sacking Ole now will ultimately lead to us being in the same situation under the same inept board a year from now. I just cannot see the club moving in a positive direction, regardless of manager, under this ownership. There are so much bigger problems than Ole yet we've new thread after new thread on the manager. We need to be thinking bigger here.
Started as just getting in to top 4 as the target after we were headed for 10th under Jose... but then we progressed in the CL and FA cup...the players were not fit enough to continue in the play style Ole brought in which led to the bad run to end the season.
The goal posts moved when we beat PSG. Also De Gea let in some goals which also cost us badly.
My point is that there is no man to do it with this ownership and board in place.
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What style has he brought in?
So you think Ole has a plan and that given it isn't working has a back-up. Sorry, it's how some of us said when he got the job: not experienced enough. Winning at Molde means feck all
I suggested preseason that we could well finish 9th and that there was a huge disparity between how fans evaluated the squad and the expectations they placed on that squad, and was met with a barrage of "we're Man Utd we should be trying to win the league every season!"
I don't think most fans are realistic at all. I think most fans acknowledge the owners and Woodward are a problem, but they simultaneously think that there is still a manager who can come in and almost magically have us back as title challengers with zero change at the top.
Of course we do but that doesn't excuse Ole.
Ole is a massive problem. he hasn't a clue what he's doing and he's clearly not a good enough manager for a PL club, let alone Utd. That much is blatantly obvious. What good things is he doing that we would lose by sacking him?
I keep seeing on here "well there's no point in getting rid of Ole til we fix the board" but I don't get it. Why? Why do we have to persist with a manager who is clearly not up to the job until we sort the other issues out? It makes no sense.
If you seriously don't think that overall we would benefit from sacking Ole in favour of a much better manager at this moment in time then I really can't comprehend that, personally.
Well my point was that we can fire and hire all the managers in the world under this board but it will not return the club to past glories. Makes sense to me? Longterm the club is f*cked.
Every fan should want our team to be at least coached properly and the players raise their game.
Our current manager is the worst one we hired so far and despite the ownership and other management issues he's one of the biggest problems we have so far and the reason why we're relegation level since March.
Exactly. We've got many issues, but we're not even doing the basics right of having a manager good enough to do his job.
Ole has been dealt a poor hand but he also dropped Lukaku and said he's playing second to others hence why he wanted to leave, it was clear since Ole arrived and made clear to him at the end of last season. He's got 28 goals in 66 league games.
If the right strikers aren't available (which Ole has said) then you have to make the best of what you have and that means sticking with a proven player while looking for someone better in the future. I would've made a midfielder a priority instead snubbing Lukaku. We have a dysfunctional midfield and are left with two left hand side inside average forwards and a 17/18 year old reserve player. I'd say realistically we don't have any strikers, even more so with Martial injured.
We you rebuild you don't throw out essentials to survive. Ole will get sacked putting his faith in crap. We can only hope Martial returns with the form of his life and others start contributing.
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Great so let's just not bother to actually try and sign a better manager then, what's the point? Come on!
Okay, say we sack Ole. What manager comes in? What manager would now be interested working under Woodward? How does the board keep the new manager happy with only two / three signings a season to very slowly rebuild the squad? What happens when the team go through another disastrous bout of form under the new manager? How does the new manager feel losing his best player (Pogba) in his first summer in the job? How does a new manager get performances from a Watford level midfield?
Would love to know what "Negotiations" he actually does, as it seems we always pay exactly what the club and player want.
Ah they have me depressed.
I don't have the answers, but I have all the questions.
It is the manager's job to plan the squad in the Summer and bring in players in positions that need strengthening.
If he blows his whole budget on CB and RB and then we have little to no cover for CF,CM,AM,RW then it's mostly his fault not overseeing this.
If you are short on players or you know some players suck - bring in replacements. Loan them if you don't have money to fix all positions.
But to prioritize certain positions that we have 6 players to cover and 3 left wingers and completely ignore CM and CF is mostly on him.
You can't have an injury crisis every time you lose just one or two players in certain positions.
There were ton of players that changed clubs for 10-20m and are infinitely better than one Ashley Young. 160m is still not peanuts in every era you are looking at.
What it does say prove is that we didnt have the budget to get more players in. If the staff know we needed 9 players out but only got 3 in the summer, then we will have to wait another 2 transfer windows to get the other 6 out. It will take longer to get the right players in still.
Question is, why doesn’t our owners react? If the guys with responsibility are doing a really poor job, shouldn’t they be replaced?
That would suggest that he didnt see their real value, if he lets them leave and doesnt have a replacement ready to go
Just because we didn't sign anyone in those positions doesn't mean Ole didn't want to strengthen them though. He clearly said he would only sell Lukaku if we replaced him and yet that didn't happen. So either the players we scouted weren't available and in that scenario we shouldnt have sold Lukaku or he was told to make do with what he had.
I mean Lukakus sale alone essentially financed the AWB and Dan James signings. Money really shouldnt have been an issue and if further signings were ruled out due to the final Jose payment then the club is in financial difficulty. We didnt replace Fellaini, we didn't replace Herrera and we didn't replace Lukaku. Thats more than a coincidence.
I think too many posters on here are laying all the blame at his feet when it's pretty clear to anyone even remotely objective that the club is holding back right now at a time it should be ploughing more money in. It's not just a Managerial issue, it's a problem right at the top and it circulates all the way down to players who should have been sold a while back and haven't been.
It's a club wide issue and no Manager will come in and fix us while the club is being held back by the owners. They can't keep papering over the cracks, a full rebuild is required it's that simple.
But he's doing a fine job at what they care about, bringing in money. Ed isn't awful at his whole job, the football side he's clueless and making a mess of, the rest he's clearly not terrible.
We can not do in the transfer market what others can only dream of. Our owners who have put us in huge debt to get our club, are unwilling to invest a single penny other than the club itself earns. They are also reluctant to fire our CEO who has achieved a square roof of sweet feck all when it comes to football matters. They are still living off the great heritage built by SAF. Fans need to start to show their anger at OT. We need to be vocal, are are now 2 points off the relegation zone and our next game is a 99.9% loss too. This quagmire of mediocrity will continue until we start employing people who are best in their field. Best CEO, best manager, best coaches, best assistants, best physios etc.
So Woodward decided we need a CB, RB and a 20 years old LW for 150m?
The bolded was already proven untrue as Ole already said there were forwards that were available.
If our on pitch performances keeps dropping he will struggle to make money in the future. Surely they understand that it is connected?
Does Matt Judge reallly need to be a footballing man? I'd say no, but he needs guidance as to the level of contract players need. He acts under the CEO, who in my eyes should have a better control on the ludicrous contracts that MJ has been offering out.A real footballing man clearly
Imagine a footballing man in charge of contracts - would be a disaster.
Are you disagreeing with the purchases? Lets ignore Dan James because he's low valued and was a punt, those types of signings shouldn't even dent our finances. We needed a first choice RB and we bought one. We needed a first choice CB and we bought one. Everyone was complaining about our defense last year. I mean, everyone. Could we have bought cheaper players? Yes of course. We could have taken more gambles like Bailly who proved to be not good enough and instead we went for top tier talents instead. Hard to argue with that strategy. The issue was clearly lack of investment in midfield and forward line, if thats down to Ole not wanting them then fair enough fault lies with him. But imo all signs point to the club not allowing it. We've sold 3 first teamers (4 if you include Sanchez) and replaced only 1 of them with an unproven Championship player.
Quote me please as I haven't read that.
See I think he did, for that point in time. Whenever he was asked about Lukaku and Sanchez going in the summer the reply was that we were looking for players and would be replacing them. That suggests to me that either the players he wanted weren't available, or he was sold a lie by the higher ups who knew despite sales we would not be bringing anyone else in.
I honestly don't have a problem with anyone who has left in the last 10 months, what I have a problem with is the serious under investment and replacing said players.
It's just struck me but when the Giggs and his brother news broke a few years back, how haven't one of the tabloids gone with a "Giggsity, Giggsity" headline?
Quotes? I can’t remember to have read what you claim.
I find it strange that you expect an agenda when an anonymous source tells a journalist something, but will take a manager defending his club at face value. Apart from Mourinho, most managers will not hang their bosses, colleagues or players out to dry. Sometimes, someone will leak something via journalists to suit an agenda, but most of the times, journalists will use anonymous sources precisely to get closer to the truth than what you get from official sources. And even when it’s leaked, most of the times the agenda is to get truth out that can not be put out through official sources.
Most likely, when Simon Stone actually is so specific about a source, I expect it’s more likely to be pretty much truth than to be completely false.
CM and CF were higher priority than improving 6 CB's already at the club. Obviously we needed a full back or two and a first teamer CB, but in terms of priority after selling Herrera and Lukaku I'd say they were comfortably behind CF,CM and RW.
If you don't have the money to create a backbone and a balanced squad you don't splash the whole budget on 2 positions.
Especially since you are very short in those. You don't also send your backup forwards on loan after the window has closed without a replacement.
The squad management was all over the shop this Summer and the results are visible for everyone to see.
https://talksport.com/football/6084...sfer-news-five-strikers-ole-gunnar-solskjaer/
MacGyver?
Severe lack of physical fitness. Every team simply outran us, and I have the dataset to show it.
Wait, are you in all seriousness, going to sit there and tell me that Martial, Pogba, AWB, Shaw ALL being out with "long term" injuries has NO BEARING on this teams effectiveness at winning matches? Mayne, those 4 are instrumental to our offense.
He only needed to hang around between the 5th and 10th position and play some good football. Most fans didnt expect a title challenge or even a top 4 fight. Clever transfers in and out, good squad management and some good football and tactical nous. We are seeing none of that and results are horrendous to top it off
Ole is a spoofer, always talked about a couple of players coming in and the United way. Now suddenly he wanted the huge squad changes he never mentioned before but rather a smooth transition. The managers at United are never at fault, always the others. Do your job, how about improving the existing players and unearth some talented (foreign) players, you cant always get tour targets and 10 players in. Work with what you got, look at the shit job you are doing first. If you cant coach or manage (or hire talented coaches), you are out of your depth
Ole is a spoofer, always talked about a couple of players coming in and the United way. Now suddenly he wanted the huge squad changes he never mentioned before but rather a smooth transition. The managers at United are never at fault, always the others. Do your job, how about improving the existing players and unearth some talented (foreign) players, you cant always get tour targets and 10 players in. Work with what you got, look at the shit job you are doing first. If you cant coach or manage (or hire talented coaches), you are out of your depth
I would disagree, if the ownership and CEO could be completely removed from the football side of things (to focus solely on generating money and providing a fair transfer budget and wage structure as well as dividends) and set up a proper footballing structure that neither the Glazers or Woodward interfere with I think we would be ok. We have the issue of the Glazers not being consistent in the money they provide but at the same time we are only second to City in our spending in the past 7 years. If that same money was made available consistently and was trusted to proper football men rather than bankers playing a real life game of Football manager then the we would succeed both on and off the pitch.
Its pure vanity causing the issues now, that Woodward & Judge see themselves as being up to the task of managing football matters. However I think in the long run its better we are owned by business men rather than rich oligarchs who see us a play thing (and who might eventually get bored, go broke or get ousted due to political turmoil).
Ultimately its very hard to see who could buy United at the price we are worth and then pump millions into the club for footballing purposes. We need the Glazers to work and they can if they just hand over the reins to football men and sit back and enjoy their slightly reduced dividends.
As above, I think the changes don't need to be wholesale, just they need to realise that they are better served by separating the commercial and the football side of things. We are making so much money and are such a recognizable brand and football team that the commercial side can still benefit while still investing heavily in squad and infrastructure. But I think most fans realise that the problems go top to bottom and that changes are necessary and that there is no single change that will make us title winners. that being said a better coach could at least improve our playing and we might perform better than we have been against pretty crap opposition.
How much longer is that rat Woodeard going to hide behind another manager so all fans can point blame at Ole.
How much longer?
The rat has been front and centre of this clubs demise since Fergie left. Knows feck all about football yet he is tasked to run one of the biggest clubs in world football.
How is the media not heaping pressure on this cretin?
Until we fix the Woodeard issue, nothing is going to change.
How much longer?
The rat has been front and centre of this clubs demise since Fergie left. Knows feck all about football yet he is tasked to run one of the biggest clubs in world football.
How is the media not heaping pressure on this cretin?
Until we fix the Woodeard issue, nothing is going to change.