Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)

Sack or Keep OLE?

  • Sack Ole & appoint new coach ASAP

  • Keep Ole & back him to finish rebuild


Results are only viewable after voting.
Status
Not open for further replies.

fergiesarmy1

New Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2013
Messages
3,595
Oh, my... Excuses, missed penalties, injuries. Some people are hellbent to make it easy for him and have a free ride at one of the biggest clubs in the world (yet).

Really stopped reading there. We're 17th in the ranking in terms of big chances created. Have played inferior teams and as you would love excuses - a very very limited Chelsea team under a new and unproven manager as well who battered us in the first half and should've been 2 up.

The squad is bare bones and the tactics and style of play is worse than Moyes.

The fact remains that he's 4 wins in 17, needed penalties to win against mighty Rochdale and looked clueless yet again against AZ.

It's truly remarkable how some of the top reds are trying to explain failure.

Also the amount of muscle injuries we picked down the road since he took over is also probably down to the training methods considering we didn't pick so many under Jose last year.

Over the course of the season we will pick even more injuries and the squad will be even more restricted. Fatigue will also come into play as those players will be run into the ground. Rashford who is 21 was visibly tired as early as end of September.

The whole post reeks of delusion, especially if you think that Ole will miraculously turn things around. We saw him at Cardiff.

If you are willing to bet I can gladly oblige and bet you £1000 he will be gone at some point this season or at the end of it.

Worst PL appointment in some time.
I’ll take £50 of that

I don’t think Woodward can sack him without sacking himself........
 

Enigma_87

You know who
Joined
Aug 7, 2008
Messages
27,577
Deal, that’s my argument how can the ceo keep blaming his own appointments without falling on his sword?
It happens to all clubs mate, why everyone keeps assuming we're special?

Also Woodward is only partly in the convo when it comes to appointing new managers - this is also on the board.

Besides Ole already overstayed here and has been for 9 months.

People expect that we are going to get better after the international break because of players coming back, but really fail to realize that the season is just beginning and when the realy fatigue and damp conditions start to kick in we will be glad with such options we have now.

It's just a question on when he will get the boot. A heavy defeat against Pool and I'd imagine he's off before the end of the month.
 

Rood

nostradamus like gloater
Scout
Joined
Jun 21, 2008
Messages
21,191
Location
@United_Hour
crazy how 1 result with 6 first team players out changes the vote from 60% keep to majority sack :wenger:
 

fergiesarmy1

New Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2013
Messages
3,595
:D
It happens to all clubs mate, why everyone keeps assuming we're special?

Also Woodward is only partly in the convo when it comes to appointing new managers - this is also on the board.

Besides Ole already overstayed here and has been for 9 months.

People expect that we are going to get better after the international break because of players coming back, but really fail to realize that the season is just beginning and when the realy fatigue and damp conditions start to kick in we will be glad with such options we have now.

It's just a question on when he will get the boot. A heavy defeat against Pool and I'd imagine he's off before the end of the month.
The value of the club has also fallen $900m since February, Ed maybe the golden balls to the glazers but no one likes losing a billion it starts to add up to real money, I’m gonna double down and say Ed is gone before Ole :D
 

Enigma_87

You know who
Joined
Aug 7, 2008
Messages
27,577
:D

The value of the club has also fallen $900m since February, Ed maybe the golden balls to the glazers but no one likes losing a billion it starts to add up to real money, I’m gonna double down and say Ed is gone before Ole :D
That's wildly optimistic to say at least :D
 

ash_86

Full Member
Joined
Sep 4, 2013
Messages
6,337
Oh, my... Excuses, missed penalties, injuries. Some people are hellbent to make it easy for him and have a free ride at one of the biggest clubs in the world (yet).

Really stopped reading there. We're 17th in the ranking in terms of big chances created. Have played inferior teams and as you would love excuses - a very very limited Chelsea team under a new and unproven manager as well who battered us in the first half and should've been 2 up.

The squad is bare bones and the tactics and style of play is worse than Moyes.

The fact remains that he's 4 wins in 17, needed penalties to win against mighty Rochdale and looked clueless yet again against AZ.

It's truly remarkable how some of the top reds are trying to explain failure.

Also the amount of muscle injuries we picked down the road since he took over is also probably down to the training methods considering we didn't pick so many under Jose last year.

Over the course of the season we will pick even more injuries and the squad will be even more restricted. Fatigue will also come into play as those players will be run into the ground. Rashford who is 21 was visibly tired as early as end of September.

The whole post reeks of delusion, especially if you think that Ole will miraculously turn things around. We saw him at Cardiff.

If you are willing to bet I can gladly oblige and bet you £1000 he will be gone at some point this season or at the end of it.

Worst PL appointment in some time.
You start by accusing poster of excuses and then you yourself finding excuses for Chelsea that they should be two up but in reality they weren't. It's the the same excuse as if we've scored 2 penalty we'd have more points.
 

Enigma_87

You know who
Joined
Aug 7, 2008
Messages
27,577
You start by accusing poster of excuses and then you yourself finding excuses for Chelsea that they should be two up but in reality they weren't. It's the the same excuse as if we've scored 2 penalty we'd have more points.
I was highlighting the claim that you can use luck/penalties/injuries both ways and it doesn't really matter if we're game 8 or 38.

We picked up points against Chelsea and Leicester (they could've equalized in the end as well) and lost to missed penos, so even in his equation already it has evened out.

9 points in 8 games is shit as it is, not really something you can pin on external factors.
 

MisterLupus

New Member
Joined
Feb 19, 2019
Messages
505
Location
Bollocking about fluently.
I have stated previously that we should at least give Ole this full season and then make a decision in May on whether it is working or if change is needed. I don't think sentiment plays a part in that, it needs to be a fact based decision based on all aspects of his performance in the role and a consideration of what alternatives are available and if we think they can improve us. Ole has by no means been given a fair shot and is being prematurely judged in some part due to a press that loves to kick us when we are down and due to the selective memory of those who seem to think we were promised a contending team this year.

In the summer the club and Ole made clear that short term fixes had failed and a longer term plan was needed, stripping the squad of overpaid and underperforming veterans, giving opportunities to youth players to see what they had and reshaping the team over several transfer windows. The message was clear that we would probably go backwards before things improved and considering we were a 6th place team what exactly were people expecting? If nothing else I would say this in defence of Ole. If you are told you have a couple of years to build a winning team and you make your decisions on that basis it is ridiculous to then move the goalposts less than a quarter of the way into the season and say we need to be competing right now. I imagine the decisions he made would have been different if he knew that the mob would start baying for blood as soon as things got tough and he would have made the same short term decisions that have hamstrung us for 6 years.

I don't think last season has much bearing on anything as most of it was spent in a caretaker role and even when that tag was removed we were a couple of months away from the end of the season and with no opportunity to change the squad so for me the real assessment began with this summer. To that end I don't really credit Ole all that much for the initial success nor do I blame him for the team running out of gas.

I was happy with the job done is the summer although like 99% of posters and Ole himself I felt we needed a couple more players to replace what we lost. The style of play was evident, the new signings all look like money well spent and the first XI at least looked capable of doing a job and that was backed up by the performances in the opening couple of games when we looked more solid at the back and dangerous going forward. Losing Martial and Shaw impacted us significantly and it has been a pretty dire few weeks since then as the lack of depth has been ruthlessly exposed. Ole has tried to maintain the style of play introduced in pre season but without the right players for the system it just is not working and with not a lot going right for us panic has started to set in.

The fact remains we are 8 league games into Ole's first full season on the job and as mentioned elsewhere we could easily be top 6 without missed penalties etc. and though we might still be complaining about the tactics etc. we wouldn't be talking about firing anyone. Over a full season luck ceases to be a factor, we will get a couple of wins we probably didn't earn etc. and it will balance out but that has not been the case so far. We will get a run of games with our first choice attack and we will have the opportunity to add a player or two in January. Come seasons end we should be minus a couple more of the deadbeats and hopefully will have added a couple more good players. If Ole still looks a bad fit then his replacement will be inheriting a far better situation than Ole himself did and that is really the worst case scenario. I will cheerfully take money from anyone who wants to bet on us going down because that is not happening and therefore we have nothing to lose by sticking to the plan we only made 2 months ago and potentially a whole lot to gain by showing some backbone and taking our lumps this year to finally fix this squad.
Good post - but to be nitpicky I would argue that there's no excusing not reinforcing at least our offensive setup prior to this season - that was a huge blunder and even though you're planning far ahead you still have to secure your footing at present to even hope getting there. It's undeniable that they failed miserably in that regard - something we're currently paying the price for. Also - I doubt very much Ole didn't see this shitstorm coming if the results didn't improve from last season's finale - he's been a professional footballer all his life he knows how the mob operates. I'm also curious if you'll feel the same if we're still within striking range of relegation come Christmas - and if this horrible forms continues despite our starting eleven being back in business again?

But anyways - I'm glad to see someone making sense in here - be prepared for a lot of people attempting to arrest you on everything except your actual arguments though and then if that fails simply pretend you never happened. It's usually how this fares :lol:
 

ash_86

Full Member
Joined
Sep 4, 2013
Messages
6,337
I was highlighting the claim that you can use luck/penalties/injuries both ways and it doesn't really matter if we're game 8 or 38.

We picked up points against Chelsea and Leicester (they could've equalized in the end as well) and lost to missed penos, so even in his equation already it has evened out.

9 points in 8 games is shit as it is, not really something you can pin on external factors.
Alright. I do think we've been very unlucky to miss our only striker for 2 months this early into the season. If Arsenal lose Auba or Chelsea lose their inform striker maybe they'd drop prints too. I'm glad we'd soon be getting most back againt pool and hope we start producing some good performances.
 

Class of 63

Sourness
Joined
Aug 15, 2017
Messages
9,028
Location
Going through the Desert on a Horse with no Name
SAF took over when we were plummeting into the relegation zone. Like we are now.

18 months later we finished second in the league. Like we were less than 18 months ago.

So not a true story. Not remotely.
I was talking about the style of football, which considering SAF had the likes of Bryan Robson, Paul McGrath, Remi Moses, Norman Whiteside, Kevin Moran, Jesper Olsen, Peter Davenport and Gordon Strachan(most if not all would walk into our current team)in his squad wasn't great even taking into consideration the position we were in when he took over.

And yes we did finish 2nd in his first-full season but it was hard to watch at times, and SAF knew he needed to phase that group out and bring his own players, and that's exactly what he did.

So yeah very much a true story.
 

Mainoldo

New Member
Joined
Sep 17, 2004
Messages
22,965
I was talking about the style of football, which considering SAF had the likes of Bryan Robson, Paul McGrath, Remi Moses, Norman Whiteside, Kevin Moran, Jesper Olsen, Peter Davenport and Gordon Strachan(most if not all would walk into our current team)in his squad wasn't great even taking into consideration the position we were in when he took over.

And yes we did finish 2nd in his first-full season but it was hard to watch at times, and SAF knew he needed to phase that group out and bring his own players, and that's exactly what he did.

So yeah very much a true story.
Really what side are you on. It’s like you know Ole is rubbish but just want to go against the arguments of people telling you how rubbish he is just for a debate.
 

USREDEVIL

Full Member
Joined
Aug 2, 2018
Messages
4,775
Location
California U.S.A.
crazy how 1 result with 6 first team players out changes the vote from 60% keep to majority sack :wenger:
I don't agree with the current majority but I understand their viewpoint entirely. They're looking at it like Ole is just a rookie manager, we've been shit for far too long, and our players, not world beaters mind you, are at least good enough to handle the likes of Newcastle. I'll keep my Ole stay vote and re-assess at Christmas time.
 

Caesar2290

New Member
Joined
Apr 27, 2019
Messages
1,283
crazy how 1 result with 6 first team players out changes the vote from 60% keep to majority sack :wenger:
Has it ever occurred to you that this was a gradual process?
Drawing against Rochdale, having 0 shots on target against AZ, losing convincingly against a relegation side, always saying that “things aren’t that bad, we need more time”. All of these things erroded any confidence that was left.
Newcastle was simply the boiling point...
 

Eriku

Full Member
Joined
Jul 18, 2007
Messages
16,109
Location
Oslo, Norway
Debate on a forum, whatever next??

Ole isn't making a great fist of a tough job but nowhere have I said he was rubbish, i'll leave that to others.
Nuance is old school, mate... In 2019 you say everything is either shit or brilliant, no half-measures.
 

redMundo

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Jul 15, 2019
Messages
86
Location
South Manchester
Voted keep.

Literally the only reason being that Woodward will stay regardless so nothing will change with any new manager.

If we get a DOF or something similar then I’d be all for a managerial change.

May as well be “one of us” in the job if it doesn’t really matter
 

Micky Targaryen

Full Member
Joined
Nov 3, 2017
Messages
1,339
Location
Malaysia
What has Milan got to do with United?
Never said it has anything to do with United. Just that both clubs have different standards I guess. Both manager's stats are similar in the current season, Milan deem the results as sackable, whereas United chooses to keep the manager. Whichever side of the fence you wanna be in.

Haven’t you heard? We are the new Milan.
In a way, we sort of are. Milan hired an ex-player as manager. We all know how how that went.
 

Micky Targaryen

Full Member
Joined
Nov 3, 2017
Messages
1,339
Location
Malaysia
I'm actually alright with the idea of giving Ole one more window to save this shitshow of a season.... I'm just dreading where the club will be on the table by the time the next transfer window approaches.
 

ash_86

Full Member
Joined
Sep 4, 2013
Messages
6,337
If we don't get anymore injuries to Martial and Pogba we should be able to catch up point difference to top 4. Get to January and hopefully we can reenforce a couple of positions and make one final push for top4. If we get lucky with Injuries it's certainly possible.
 

Sky1981

Fending off the urge
Joined
Apr 12, 2006
Messages
29,996
Location
Under the bright neon lights of sincity
I'm actually alright with the idea of giving Ole one more window to save this shitshow of a season.... I'm just dreading where the club will be on the table by the time the next transfer window approaches.
Sure, because good players would love to play under Ole Gunnar Solskjaer.... because... hey, probably they still have him in his 99 pose poster in their bedroom
 

slir32

Full Member
Joined
Dec 10, 2009
Messages
6,402
Location
Sydney
What worries me is even with 3 to 6 first team players injured we should be comfortably be beating the bottom 10 in the PL and also teams that where created 10 years ago.
 

Foxbatt

New Member
Joined
Oct 21, 2013
Messages
14,297
Every manager in the big clubs have a manager that has been successful in a big league apart from the biggest club in the PL. I mean, Liverpool, City, Arsenal and Spurs. Yes Chelsea has a rookie manager too but they will kick him out without a blink the moment things start to go wrong.
These lot may not be able to dribble past an opponent but surely they can take a corner kick.
The fact they don't take a decent corner kick is entirely the fault of Ole.
The fact that we have only one CF is the entirely the fault of Ole.
He is a below average manager the sooner everyone accept it the better for the club.
 

Marcus

Full Member
Joined
Oct 3, 1999
Messages
6,079
If I were the Glazers I would be panicking now. Being cheap and letting United be kind of mediocre but earning money is ideal. Being cheap but having United in danger of relegation thereby affecting future earnings and sponsorship deals both present and future is surely very bad for business.
 

Bobcat

Full Member
Joined
Feb 2, 2014
Messages
6,365
Location
Behind the curtains, leering at the neighbors
Every manager in the big clubs have a manager that has been successful in a big league apart from the biggest club in the PL. I mean, Liverpool, City, Arsenal and Spurs. Yes Chelsea has a rookie manager too but they will kick him out without a blink the moment things start to go wrong.
These lot may not be able to dribble past an opponent but surely they can take a corner kick.
The fact they don't take a decent corner kick is entirely the fault of Ole.

The fact that we have only one CF is the entirely the fault of Ole.
He is a below average manager the sooner everyone accept it the better for the club.
:lol: Ok i get that emotions are running quite high here, but that is just absurd. We have been shite on set pieces for an eternity now, especially corners.
 

Micky Targaryen

Full Member
Joined
Nov 3, 2017
Messages
1,339
Location
Malaysia
Sure, because good players would love to play under Ole Gunnar Solskjaer.... because... hey, probably they still have him in his 99 pose poster in their bedroom
No disagreement from me here.. I think Ole should be sacked sooner rather than later. I'm just saying give the man another window to bring in the players he wants, so we can shut up all the posters saying that Ole wasn't backed after every damn loss.
 

Strelok

New Member
Joined
Jan 10, 2018
Messages
5,279
If you can earn it based on results then surely it stands to reason that you should be able to lose it based on results? You can't start off successful but when it goes sour, call it a long term rebuiding project requiring you to go on relegation form runs. His appointment was made on the assumption he could keep us winning AND make progress.

Furthermore, how many managers expect the level of leeway we give Ole based purely on calling this a 'Project'. In no other club could a manager underperform so much citing rebuild. The job of a good manager is to do both. Rebuild with continuing competetive results.
Well I didn't say anything like he should not be sacked regardless of the results. All I said was he was appointed as caretaker and earned his permanent contract thanks to his results mate.

What?

You mentioned that it's understandable to hire a manager who is a club legend while waiting for a permanent manager. So why do you think he earned his permanent manager contract? I thought Ole was meant to be a caretaker manager only, while we sort out a proper replacement?
Because he had good results I think? Especially knocking out PSG with basically a backup team?

I think it's a common knowledge that a caretaker usually is appointed while waiting for a permanent manager but if he does good enough he'd be rewarded with a permanent contract?

And even when Ole had his miracle run of games, why oh why did we offer him a permanent contract midway through his caretaker stint?
Agreed that the permanent contract was a bit hasty.

For your question maybe Ed thought Ole did good enough and should be rewarded with a permanent contract? Or he just found it was an incredible opportunity to not have to think about finding another manager ? Or a cheap scapegoat to throw under the bus when necessary?

You gotta ask Ed on this, frankly I have no idea.

---------------------
I run out of quota so gonna post here.

Honestly at the start of the season I made a bet with a friend, an Arsenal fan that Ole would not last until the 15th round. Who lose would have to buy the whole lot (our group of football friends) a drink.

On one hand I did believe in his vision/plan, still somewhat do. On the other hand I also believed that having a shit midfield gonna cost him his job.
 
Last edited:

Foxbatt

New Member
Joined
Oct 21, 2013
Messages
14,297
No disagreement from me here.. I think Ole should be sacked sooner rather than later. I'm just saying give the man another window to bring in the players he wants, so we can shut up all the posters saying that Ole wasn't backed after every damn loss.
The problem with this is that
1). Is he going to get the players he wants? The chances are that he would want world class players. World class players have a knack of trying to go to clubs that has a good chance of winning trophies.
So they probably don't want to come to United.
2) By the time he gets the sack we may be in much more trouble than we are right now. It means starting from scratch.
United right now is not an attractive proposition to world class players. Ole messed it up by thinking that this is the Manchester United that he played. This is not. He is no Sir Alex and this team is entirely different.
He should have forgotten about the Sanchos, the Dybalas, the DeLigts etc. He should have gone for players who are better than what he has now and that's the half of the PL players. It's the same old story of Moyes trying to buy Bale, Fabregas, Ronaldo etc. If Moyes could not get them interested in coming to United at that time United being the champions of England, what chance as Ole got with United struggling not to get involved in a relegation battle?
 

Abhinav

Full Member
Joined
Nov 6, 2017
Messages
843
The main things that come out when you watch united play are lethargic play, no one taking risks in passing/runs, poor movement and vertical runs from strikers/cmf/full backs, lack of aggression in tackling and closing down, being 2nd to second balls, poor composure in the final third and in the box.

Now all of these can be easily attributed to coaching but I think it goes beyond that. Primarily issues arise from the following reasons:

1) Fitness: Full backs, wide forwards and sometime central midfielders need to be making sprints up and down to be more dynamic and to open up the field. If you are not fit enough then you will be reluctant to make those forward sprints as you tire for the fear of leaving space behind

2) Mentality/ Attitude: Some of this is natural and some circumstantial. In all walks of life, what separates equally talented people is the mental resilience, drive, attitude. In general, there is a large mentality malaise within the squad that may also be attributed to previous managers/ and lack of leaders. Nobody on the football pitch wants to take responsibility and take risks. Everyone plays it safe so that they are not blamed for any mistakes. Its an attitude for someone who is trying to hide/ get away rather than looking to win. I think it started with LVG (remember the video sessions and emphasis on taking a touch before shooting) and then continued under Jose (calling out individuals in public). Lack of leaders within the group means that nobody challenges the team mates when they take the safe option

3) Lack of Confidence in themselves and in each other: This is primarily because of constant failures and leads to players doubting themselves, taking an extra touch, not taking risks. One of the things that Ole changed when he came last year was to instil confidence and with each victory the group became more confident. This went on till we were winning but as soon as we lost to Arsenal, the self doubts came back and the players crumbled. Also highlights the mental fragility of some of our players.

4) Training: I do feel that movement on the pitch can be trained/coached by practice and repetitions on the training pitch. Our strikers don’t make simple movements like coming in a little deep to lay off the ball and then turning the defender and making the run behind. That should be easily be coached and practiced

5) Talent/ skill: The last and the most contributing factor is the lack of skill. Our midfielders and forwards are not able to execute basic skills such as first touch, passing, dribbling, finishing at the highest level. If you compare our forwards to players such as Aguero, RVP, Salah, there is a clear gap in talent. Those players fashioned chances on their own in the box through tight control, quick feet, movement. Similarly, our midfielders apart from Pogba don’t have the skill to accurately play 50-60 yard passes, to dribble in central areas, play into the strikers feet. And the first touch of most of our players is so horribly inconsistent that it constantly leads to moves breaking down.

So while issue 1,2,3,4 should be to an extent tackled with better coaching, all of them take time to improve and the results might not be immediately visible. The fact that it is a combination of these factors and not just one isolated factor makes it much harder to create and sustain changes. Thats why I feel its to premature to judge Ole and the staff because what we see is the result on the pitch. They might be working on all of the above and yet players have not yet internalised these to make sustainable improvements. And with some players, you can try to coach on all 4 aspects but they may show an incapability to learn. In which case, you need to get new players in, which again takes time.
 

Enigma_87

You know who
Joined
Aug 7, 2008
Messages
27,577
So while issue 1,2,3,4 should be to an extent tackled with better coaching, all of them take time to improve and the results might not be immediately visible. The fact that it is a combination of these factors and not just one isolated factor makes it much harder to create and sustain changes. Thats why I feel its to premature to judge Ole and the staff because what we see is the result on the pitch. They might be working on all of the above and yet players have not yet internalised these to make sustainable improvements. And with some players, you can try to coach on all 4 aspects but they may show an incapability to learn. In which case, you need to get new players in, which again takes time.
Compare it to what Lampard is doing and trying to implement at Chelsea - that's clearly visible and took him 8 games. Ole has been here since more than 9 months.

You blame the players but it's also possible Ole is unable to put his ideas across.
 

roonster09

Hercule Poirot of the scouting world
Scout
Joined
May 10, 2009
Messages
36,448
He should be sacked. Excuse is always that rebuild is too big and he needs at least 3 years but rebuild will always be bigger when you don't hire good managers. Also time should be given to the managers who show they are capable of turning it around or who shows they deserve it based on results/progress.

Signing right players is part of the rebuild but building a system to get maximum out of them is the toughest part. From what I have seen, I don't think Ole is capable of that.

Rebuild is needed and long term planning should be there for any club but that doesn't mean short term goals should be ignored.
 

Enigma_87

You know who
Joined
Aug 7, 2008
Messages
27,577
Alright. I do think we've been very unlucky to miss our only striker for 2 months this early into the season. If Arsenal lose Auba or Chelsea lose their inform striker maybe they'd drop prints too. I'm glad we'd soon be getting most back againt pool and hope we start producing some good performances.
Martial is injury prone so that was a bit expected. Auba is incredibly fit he barely misses a game:
https://www.transfermarkt.com/pierre-emerick-aubameyang/verletzungen/spieler/58864

Before the season started it was to be expected these turn of events.

We have 5 games in 13 days after the break. With a short squad we would probably pick more injuries. If those players are rushed it can backfire quickly, especially the likes of Shaw - as proven in the past.
 

JSW Devil

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Oct 4, 2019
Messages
37
But Mou did that, played to the strength of the players, most fans wanted him gone too.

Nobody cant seem to win
Mou is a toxic narcissistic manager who wasn’t unsuccessful at United he won trophies and finished second to city the best of the rest so to speak and backed further I’m pretty sure would of made a greater challenge on the title but he’s always capable of imploding and creating problems that never existed. What we have now is an interim manager become permanent not based on quality or ability just based on a few games and we are paying the price for that, its likely to get even worse given the fixtures to come.

A manger on Mourinho’s level who plays more attractive football I’m pretty sure would be backed by the board it’s not like we don’t spend money it’s just not been spent wisely give Pep or Klop half of what we have spent do you think we would be in this mess? And this is the whole point give time and money to the right manager.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Status
Not open for further replies.