England pre Euro 2020

GlasgowCeltic

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He's trying to switch to a possession game from the counter and set piece model that was working. In doing so he's ignoring that the midfield options are crap
 

Spiersey

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It's quite interesting that the media have probably went a full 180 after this World Cup. In the past, Good England sides have played good football and lost to good sides (2002,04,06 etc). In my opinion, England were incredibly average this time. They created next to nothing in open play over the course of the World Cup and scored mainly from Set pieces. They played poor sides generally and struggled against the only good sides they faced. Southgate was awful last night and he is poor tactically. After 70 minutes, England were mentally shot and desperately needed some subs. A good manager would have taken off Alli for sure as he had lost his head. None of this will actually be mentioned because everyone is just hung up on the fact that England reached the Semis and nothing else.
I wrote this just after the World Cup. England team is great and he's really holding them back. Quite astonishing that a very good England generation (and future) is in the hands of Gareth Southgate and Aidy Bothroyd. I'm Scottish so very happy to see Southgate continue but I'd be desperate to get rid if I was English. I don't think he has any place managing the talents that he is. First half against Spain was the best performance under him and even then the second half was a complete battering.
 

FootballHQ

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Midfield really needs to be regenerated otherwise it will be found out as usual v top teams in later stages.

Need to start giving Maddison some serious minutes (think he'll be a little ahead of Mount who found the step up tough tonight). Grealish needs to start getting called up. Also need Foden to go out on loan in January and get serious minutes. Of course England could just call him up anyway but he won't make serious impression on Euro 2020 just playing the odd league cup game.

At least then you have a few options who can pick up the ball in central midfield and create a chance, England still lack a tempo player from deep that pretty much any side that makes a major final has e.g. Modric, Xavi, Pirlo etc.

Also central defence options are pretty weak still, would be amazed if Michael Keane starts at euros, he's a bit like Jagielka, solid back up but you wouldn't want him playing 6-7 games in major tournament.
 

Yagami

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Only real problem I have at the moment is his bizarre picks in midfield.

Henderson, Rice and Barkley make our midfield look mouth-watering. I don't know why he doesn't give Winks and Maddison game time. Foden I get because even though I already think he's good enough to play, it's on him that he's not making the squads for settling for a bench spot at City.
Midfield really needs to be regenerated otherwise it will be found out as usual v top teams in later stages.

Need to start giving Maddison some serious minutes (think he'll be a little ahead of Mount who found the step up tough tonight). Grealish needs to start getting called up. Also need Foden to go out on loan in January and get serious minutes. Of course England could just call him up anyway but he won't make serious impression on Euro 2020 just playing the odd league cup game.

At least then you have a few options who can pick up the ball in central midfield and create a chance, England still lack a tempo player from deep that pretty much any side that makes a major final has e.g. Modric, Xavi, Pirlo etc.

Also central defence options are pretty weak still, would be amazed if Michael Keane starts at euros, he's a bit like Jagielka, solid back up but you wouldn't want him playing 6-7 games in major tournament.
I agree with everything. I'm surprised Grealish didn't get a call up this time. I got it before because he wasn't competing in the top flight, but he is now and is performing well.

As for that tempo player from deep we lack, I think our best option is Winks there. Hes far from perfect but I think he's got the attributes to become a good one (maybe not too class like the examples you gave) so I'd like to see him get some game time. I find it strange that he doesn't even get minutes off the bench.
 

Sir Scott McToMinay

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England haven’t produced a world class midfielder in two decades.
Wilshere was the only one I saw breaking through during that time with the potential to become one, at the very least he was a different breed in terms of one touch play, technique and guile, maybe Foden could be that player.

I hope United stay as far as possible from paying over the odds for limited English midfielders, unless we manage to get them for cheap.
 

starman

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I think England should play 3 at the back with anyone of Rice, Maguire or Stones capable of stepping into midfield, but also provide a base to play more adventurous players in midfield.
Also given the right tends to be weak defensively, could also try AWB at RCB to cover TAA who will be pushed up high

Pickford
Stones/AWB Rice Maguire
TAA Maddison Foden Chilwell
Sancho Kane Sterling

 

norm87cro

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Henderson is stealing a living both for club and country. How can such a limited player get over 50 England caps and somehow trick Klopp into playing him is beyond me. And aldo he is kind of a wasted talent Barkley at least had an impact on the game since coming in with that through ball to Kane.
 
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paraguayo

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I'm not british but I would implode this bland team and start a young creative team looking into 2022 just like Germany did.

Pope

TAA Lascelles Mings Tomori Someone

Foden Grealish Mount Sancho

Abraham
 

Treble

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I'm not british but I would implode this bland team and start a young creative team looking into 2022 just like Germany did.

Pope

TAA Lascelles Mings Tomori Someone

Foden Grealish Mount Sancho

Abraham
Stering and Kane will be in their prime in 2022, not in their 30s.
 

Champ

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Foden needs to actually play before people can judge surely!!?
I wish Grealish chose Ireland, he really should have. He would have made a massive difference instead of Henderson last night for England.
 

SilentWitness

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Southgate has done what nearly all recent England managers have done, he's got his favourites and picked them even if they were in terrible form. It's the usual trap.
Was about to come into the thread to say exactly this! He's publicly came out and said that a problem was that some of the players who played aren't playing well for their clubs currently and that probably had an effect. Why did they play then!? Ffs.
 

Bobski

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Not just England who are struggling for midfielders. France started last night with Sissoka, Matuidi and Tollisso in a 3. Missing Kante and Pogba of course but there are a lot of workhorse midfields out there at the moment, perhaps how the game has progressed.
 

SquishyMcSquish

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I'm not british but I would implode this bland team and start a young creative team looking into 2022 just like Germany did.

Pope

TAA Lascelles Mings Tomori Someone

Foden Grealish Mount Sancho

Abraham

Thank god you’re not the manager then. Imagine removing the likes of Kane and Sterling (our only two world class players, and two of our best performers in qualifiers) just to get the average age of the team down.

The team you’ve posted would struggle to get out of a group.
 

Revaulx

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I thought Southgate was tactically pretty savvy at the World Cup. He took account of our midfielders being crap by just playing a reliable workhorse there (Henderson) and splitting the rest of the midfield’s duties between the defence and attack. He also seemed capable of giving the players instructions that they were able to understand and follow, so at least there was some cohesion to their play.

Now he seems to have abandoned all that, and returned to the fiction that our midfielders are good. The rest of the players know that they aren’t, hence the number of hopeful punts forward from the defence and keeper. Maybe he believes that if Klopp can do it with such a limited midfield, so can he.
 

SilentWitness

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I'm not british but I would implode this bland team and start a young creative team looking into 2022 just like Germany did.

Pope

TAA Lascelles Mings Tomori Someone

Foden Grealish Mount Sancho

Abraham
Grealish and Mount as a 2 man midfield. Foden on the right. Do you watch football?
 

Judas

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I thought Southgate was tactically pretty savvy at the World Cup. He took account of our midfielders being crap by just playing a reliable workhorse there (Henderson) and splitting the rest of the midfield’s duties between the defence and attack. He also seemed capable of giving the players instructions that they were able to understand and follow, so at least there was some cohesion to their play.

Now he seems to have abandoned all that, and returned to the fiction that our midfielders are good. The rest of the players know that they aren’t, hence the number of hopeful punts forward from the defence and keeper. Maybe he believes that if Klopp can do it with such a limited midfield, so can he.
Yeah I think this is true too, he's regressed tactically, isn't playing to our strengths and seems to have got caught up in the hype a bit, which is really disappointing.

I just hate the idea of us wasting such a talented crop of players on a manager who I don't truly believe will get the best out of them, or even select the right ones.
 

Dancfc

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Pickford

Walker (TAA against teams that will sit back)
Maguire
Tomori/Gomez (whoever is more in form come May)
Chilwell

James (assuming he hits the ground running for Chelsea like the other boys have, which is very likely)
Madison
Mount
(Winks or Henderson in over one of JM/MM Vs elite oppo)

Sancho
Sterling
(With Hudson Odoi breathing down both necks)

Kane (would say with Tammy there to keep him on his toes but Southgate would pick Kane even with one leg removed)

Other squad players (not mentioned above): Heaton, Pope, Stones/Mings, AWB, Rice, Grealish/Ross, Rashford, Tammy.

Almost certainly won't get us to victory in Euro's but it would atleast get some good football and something to build on. There's literally no excuse for the likes of Keane and Rose being in the squad.
 

Revaulx

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Yeah I think this is true too, he's regressed tactically, isn't playing to our strengths and seems to have got caught up in the hype a bit, which is really disappointing.

I just hate the idea of us wasting such a talented crop of players on a manager who I don't truly believe will get the best out of them, or even select the right ones.
The only positive is that last night’s debacle may have been noticed by Ed, and made it less likely that Southgate will be the one to follow Ole. Which I’m convinced is a real possibility, being the option that involves the least loss of face.
 

SquishyMcSquish

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Pickford

Walker (TAA against teams that will sit back)
Maguire
Tomori/Gomez (whoever is more in form come May)
Chilwell

James (assuming he hits the ground running for Chelsea like the other boys have, which is very likely)
Madison
Mount
(Winks or Henderson in over one of JM/MM Vs elite oppo)

Sancho
Sterling
(With Hudson Odoi breathing down both necks)

Kane (would say with Tammy there to keep him on his toes but Southgate would pick Kane even with one leg removed)

Other squad players (not mentioned above): Heaton, Pope, Stones/Mings, AWB, Rice, Grealish/Ross, Rashford, Tammy.

Almost certainly won't get us to victory in Euro's but it would atleast get some good football and something to build on. There's literally no excuse for the likes of Keane and Rose being in the squad.

Southgate picks Kane because Kane is still ten times the footballer Tammy is despite playing a different role/being in a struggling team this season.

Kane was by far the best player against the Czech’s, basically playing a deeper role that Tammy doesn’t have the ability to play in a million years. He’s earned his place in the squad but never to lead the line.
 

Megadrive Man

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Henderson is stealing a living both for club and country. How can such a limited player get over 50 England caps and somehow trick Klopp into playing him is beyond me. And aldo he is kind of a wasted talent Barkley at least had an impact on the game since coming in with that through ball to Kane.
He's been excellent for Liverpool under Klopp.

I think the way Liverpool set up their midfield three suits him more than the way England set up.

The defence is England's biggest problem. None of the back 5 that started last night are good enough to start regularly for England. England have really good full back options in TAA,AWB,Chillwell and Shaw, but they only have average options at CB and GK.

Gomez looked great last year but has looked shaky since returning from injury. Keane isn't good enough and Maguire is a decent player who effectively starts by default due to a lack of alternatives.
 

Dancfc

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Southgate picks Kane because Kane is still ten times the footballer Tammy is despite playing a different role/being in a struggling team this season.

Kane was by far the best player against the Czech’s, basically playing a deeper role that Tammy doesn’t have the ability to play in a million years. He’s earned his place in the squad but never to lead the line.
I didn't mean Tammy should outrightly replace him i meant if Kane has another complete shit show like he did in Euro 2016 then he should have some pressure for his place now a clinical finisher who (unlike Vardy) Southgate seems to somewhat like is right behind him. Back in that tournament he should have lost his place to Vardy and if nothing else Tammy's presence should atleast serve to motivate him against letting his standards drop that far again.
 

SquishyMcSquish

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I didn't mean Tammy should outrightly replace him i meant if Kane has another complete shit show like he did in Euro 2016 then he should have some pressure for his place now a clinical finisher who (unlike Vardy) Southgate seems to somewhat like is right behind him. Back in that tournament he should have lost his place to Vardy and if nothing else Tammy's presence should atleast serve to motivate him against letting his standards drop that far again.

Ah ok, in which case I agree. Similar issue with Spurs actually where we don’t have an alternative to Kane so too much is on his shoulders.

Vardy would be a fantastic (and very different) alternative, but he’s going to be very old by the Euro’s. I wouldn’t mind seeing Kane dropped in to a deeper role behind Tammy actually, because these days Kane doesn’t really lead the line like he used to.
 

GenZRed

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Southgate has done what nearly all recent England managers have done, he's got his favourites and picked them even if they were in terrible form. It's the usual trap.
Based on the fact that Michael Keane started last night and Kane starting over Abraham, despite Abraham's great form, I fear you might be right.

I highly doubt England have a good chance at winning Euro 2020, base don our rubbish defense. Michael Keane should never start for England again, unless he improves and our midfield is not good enough. I like Ruben Loftus-Cheek but is he really the answer to our midfield on its own? I doubt it.
 

awop

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It is scary how bad England's midfield is. You're pretty much relying on Mount & Madison becoming amazing, the rest is proven average and won't get you far in the Euros.
At CB, on paper Gomez-Mcguire is probably the best bet. If he gets back to fitness and has 2 full season, i don't see why Rob Holding would not be given a chance. Arsenal bias aside i'm sure he will be part of the 23 squad that goes.
 

bp19992

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It is scary how bad England's midfield is. You're pretty much relying on Mount & Madison becoming amazing, the rest is proven average and won't get you far in the Euros.
At CB, on paper Gomez-Mcguire is probably the best bet. If he gets back to fitness and has 2 full season, i don't see why Rob Holding would not be given a chance. Arsenal bias aside i'm sure he will be part of the 23 squad that goes.
Players like Henderson seem to be good enough to win the Champions League. You don't need super amazing central midfielders if you have the right surroundings and tactics. Hard working, disciplined central midfielders can do wonders if you have pacy, creative wingers and forwards.
 

adexkola

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I find it funny that people here think England need to play a more clogged and cynical form of football. Yeah, your attackers would thrive in such conditions.
 

Sir Scott McToMinay

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Players like Henderson seem to be good enough to win the Champions League. You don't need super amazing central midfielders if you have the right surroundings and tactics. Hard working, disciplined central midfielders can do wonders if you have pacy, creative wingers and forwards.
Henderson shares a midfield with Fabinho and Wijnaldum, both are top players.
 

Holocene

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I didn't mean Tammy should outrightly replace him i meant if Kane has another complete shit show like he did in Euro 2016 then he should have some pressure for his place now a clinical finisher who (unlike Vardy) Southgate seems to somewhat like is right behind him. Back in that tournament he should have lost his place to Vardy and if nothing else Tammy's presence should atleast serve to motivate him against letting his standards drop that far again.
Ah ok, in which case I agree. Similar issue with Spurs actually where we don’t have an alternative to Kane so too much is on his shoulders.

Vardy would be a fantastic (and very different) alternative, but he’s going to be very old by the Euro’s. I wouldn’t mind seeing Kane dropped in to a deeper role behind Tammy actually, because these days Kane doesn’t really lead the line like he used to.
Didn't Vardy retire from the national team?
 

Sir Scott McToMinay

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Revisionist take. It is a widely held opinion that Liverpool's midfield offers energy and little else. I put Wijnaldum in team of the season once and got laughed out the room
Revisionist...
More like, they’ve proven their worth over a considerable amount of time.
They are not a patch on some of the great midfield trios ala peak Barca or Madrid 2-3 years ago or City, but these two are comfortably better players than any English midfielder out there.
 

Untd55

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Henderson would be fine to have in the team but not at the same time as Rice. I would prefer to see Chamberlain back in the midfield; that would at least add some creativity and drive in there. We need to get Maddison into the team, also.

I think our attack links up well and creates good opportunities; I have no issue there. The problem is that there is a massive disconnect between the midfield and the attack. The gap between Rice and Henderson and the front four was huge; it is not really surprising that England was struggling with keeping possession.

It doesn't help that Rice is absolutely awful; I don't really like the look of him at all. I hope we can get Chamberlain, at least, back in to replace him. We also need to change the style of play.

The current style is very defensive and yet we don't seem to be any better at defending. It is also weakening our attack. Southgate has to change it, but I don't think he is the right man for the job. He was fine for the last world cup, but I think we needed to move on after that.

If we are going to stick with English managers, I wouldn't mind seeing Howe get the job. I think his style would suit this team more than what Southgate is trying to do.
 

Revaulx

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I find it funny that people here think England need to play a more clogged and cynical form of football. Yeah, your attackers would thrive in such conditions.
Absolutely. England looked much better at the World Cup with Henderson on his own in there.
 

rcoobc

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We were bang average at the World Cup.

Half of Kane's goals were penalties, one was a fluke, two were tap ins. He was played out of position and failed to bring Sterling into play when it mattered.

We were outrun by a tired Croatian team.

The games we won in 90 minutes were: Tunisia, Panama, Sweden. The games we lost were Belgium (twice) and Croatia. It took penalties to get past Colombia.

It would be a surprise if we didn't qualify for the Euros, but I wouldn't count un us getting out past the Quarter Finals.