Sea-Cow
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If he is willing to take it, then yes, absolutely I would. There is still time to save this season from being such an embarrassment.
Who do you rate more? Poch or Allegri?Good points about Allegri
a- He's got plenty of experience in dealing with a flawed owner. If you think the Glazers are bad then you haven't heard about Berlusconi. Imagine a scenario were one of the Glazers suddenly thinks that he's Sir Alex Ferguson but doesn't bother taking the job himself for fear of having to sack himself out of it. That is Berlusconi in his latter years at Milan.
b- He's a top top quality man manager. Unlike LVG/Mou, Allegri doesn't have a philosophy. He builds his strategy by speaking his players, learn their strengths and weaknesses and build the team around him. In fact his formations changed regularly throughout the years. The guy isn't afraid to play players out of position either. He's the master of versatility.
c- No one organise a defence better then he does.
d- I (and half of those watching Italian tv at the time) had a crush at his girlfriend when they were young.
Bad points about Allegri
a- he would always prefer workrate & attitude over technique.
b- because of A, he tends to go for the older players. Kids might showboat something Allegri doesn't like
c- That doesn't mean that he doesn't rate kids. He does rate them. Unlike Conte who couldn't bother knowing their name and used to just call them 'boys', Allegri cares about the young generation. Just don't expect him to build around 17 year olds. He won't
d- He's a genuinely nice guy. He will joke around players, in interviews etc. However don't try and piss him off though. The guy held his ground against both Sacchi and Adani
Conclusion
Allegri is not LVG or Mourinho. Rather then a rigid manager who thinks that everything rotates around his brilliance, Allegr is more like the Mcgyver of football who would scavenge around trying to sort his problems with the limited resources he's got. That what he did at Milan, Cagliari, Sassuolo etc were he had to punch over his weight with the limited resources given. Having said that, this usually result into a team built around players who are hard working and have great attitude. That doesn't mean he's scared of superstars. He did well with the likes of Ibra, Pogba and Ronaldo as well.
Can he cover Sir Alex job? I very much doubt it. There again no one can. These days managers rely on DOFs and great football CEOs as much as a human being rely on oxygen to breathe. Allegri had worked with Paratici/Marotta whom I think are among the best in the job. However, if we get Allegri we will get a solid manager, whose a great man manager and whose extremely versatile in terms of tactics. On that regard he's the closest manager we've had to Sir Alex since this very day. In many ways he does remind me of Sir Alex during his last years.
Cech, Terry, Lamps, Hazard, Ivanioc, Luiz, Torres, Mikel, Oscar, Azpilicueta, Mata, Moses, Ramires is what he took over as well as Marin and you left out they had just won the Uefa cup with most of the tem that won the CL season before and add the 200 million jose added to that squad and two yrs later won the league, but you're post wouldn't look too good with that added I suppose.If you think Moyes needed more time totally up to you. All I know we had a squad that finished 1st. Mourinho took over a squad that finished 3rd with players like Marin and got the title back in 2 years... But we needed to give Moyes 3-4 years.
Can we stop claiming Ole's failure is just down to injuries?What is the point of changing the coach now.. Ole has had real hard troubles due to injures. The squad is not strong enough to handle it. He has only just a couple of months ago begun to rebuild the squad so that he can have hungry talented players with mentality and the right qualities for his style. If you "save" the season now, that means quickfixing and a restart of the endless cycle. This shit has to be allowed to play through. Rome was not built on one day. United is so damaged that it will need longer time to get stable and world class than some weeks under any manager. reading all the crap in here, I wish Ole had said no to the job. He deserves better than what both fans and players are giving him.
I am sure it was not like I am also sure it wasn't built by someone who has no idea wha he is doing.What is the point of changing the coach now.. Ole has had real hard troubles due to injures. The squad is not strong enough to handle it. He has only just a couple of months ago begun to rebuild the squad so that he can have hungry talented players with mentality and the right qualities for his style. If you "save" the season now, that means quickfixing and a restart of the endless cycle. This shit has to be allowed to play through. Rome was not built on one day. United is so damaged that it will need longer time to get stable and world class than some weeks under any manager. reading all the crap in here, I wish Ole had said no to the job. He deserves better than what both fans and players are giving him.
Weirdly enough, Allegri fits most of that qualities you had mentioned. He is young , dramatically improves players, very flexible and promotes youth.Allegri would be a disaster. The fans that want him are the same ones who begged for Van Gaal and Jose.
We need a young hungry energetic innovative coach, with a record of improving players, promoting youth, playing attractive style.
Nagelsmann is the dream. Marco Rose looks awesome.
Eddie Howe also a good option. We should be looking no further than those 3 and really need to land the best (Nagelsmann) this time.
No it wouldn’t similar to what you’re last paragraph made United’s team look average. It’s not United’s fault Moyes dittered on transfers and decided to just go with Fellaini. I mean his name at Everton was dittered Dave and they was known for making last minute deals.Cech, Terry, Lamps, Hazard, Ivanioc, Luiz, Torres, Mikel, Oscar, Azpilicueta, Mata, Moses, Ramires is what he took over as well as Marin and you left out they had just won the Uefa cup with most of the tem that won the CL season before and add the 200 million jose added to that squad and two yrs later won the league, but you're post wouldn't look too good with that added I suppose.
To be fair to Moyes, christ he took over a team who had players who didnt want to be here, rooney, a player in RVP who went into a sulk as the reason he came retired, and players who were past it and players like jones, smalling not UTD standard, now havent said that, he messed up by not be sorted and ready to go as soon as AF left.
The squad is strong enough to comfortably beat teams that where created 10 years ago and relegation quality teams.What is the point of changing the coach now.. Ole has had real hard troubles due to injures. The squad is not strong enough to handle it. He has only just a couple of months ago begun to rebuild the squad so that he can have hungry talented players with mentality and the right qualities for his style. If you "save" the season now, that means quickfixing and a restart of the endless cycle. This shit has to be allowed to play through. Rome was not built on one day. United is so damaged that it will need longer time to get stable and world class than some weeks under any manager. reading all the crap in here, I wish Ole had said no to the job. He deserves better than what both fans and players are giving him.
Unrelated to the situation, but yeah, a lot of Rome was built by absolute madmen.I am sure it was not like I am also sure it wasn't built by someone who has no idea wha he is doing.
Tuchel?Allegri would be a disaster. The fans that want him are the same ones who begged for Van Gaal and Jose.
We need a young hungry energetic innovative coach, with a record of improving players, promoting youth, playing attractive style.
Nagelsmann is the dream. Marco Rose looks awesome.
Eddie Howe also a good option. We should be looking no further than those 3 and really need to land the best (Nagelsmann) this time.
This does my head in. It's not like he's made the best of what we have and we have just been unlucky because of the injuries. We've been fecking shite, not enough people working for the team. Clueless tactics and zero coaching to improve it.Can we stop claiming Ole's failure is just down to injuries?
Tuchel could be at PSG for a good while. They just hammered Madrid and will cruise to another league titleTuchel?
It's the club so called 'ethos' can pressuring themselves actually. The club won't move on from the 'United DNA' thing. So we are now a past club. Always looking backOle needs two more windows. I hope he gets them. Whether we finish 6th or 17th doesn’t matter. This season and most seasons is a mess because of Woodward.
Ole doesn’t have the numbers to compete never mind the talent to play how he wants to play. Hopefully get in another 6 players minimum over the next few windows and we’ll see a team start to form.
I think people need to reset their expectations for this team for a while. It’s not going to happen quickly no matter who is in charge. Forget Fergie, those days are gone. Time for the future. Stop putting pressure on these players and the manager. There are so many circumstances against them.
Its very difficult to say.Who do you rate more? Poch or Allegri?
Ole will never have the players to play his way as there is no magic strategy. He employs mid table tactics. Other managers who started new afresh could instantly imprint their stamp without 6 Windows. It's an excuse and delaying the inevitable. If he had a grand plan he would not have spent 10 years in the doldrums of management. The guys with a "way of playing" get snapped up real quickOle needs two more windows. I hope he gets them. Whether we finish 6th or 17th doesn’t matter. This season and most seasons is a mess because of Woodward.
Ole doesn’t have the numbers to compete never mind the talent to play how he wants to play. Hopefully get in another 6 players minimum over the next few windows and we’ll see a team start to form.
I think people need to reset their expectations for this team for a while. It’s not going to happen quickly no matter who is in charge. Forget Fergie, those days are gone. Time for the future. Stop putting pressure on these players and the manager. There are so many circumstances against them.
The long term approach is way forward and that’s exactly why Ole should go. He’s not even a mid-table manager in all honesty, someone who can actually coach the players and knows something about tactics is required. Giving Ole time and money for no reason other than he can stay long term is just going to make everything worse.Ole needs two more windows. I hope he gets them. Whether we finish 6th or 17th doesn’t matter. This season and most seasons is a mess because of Woodward.
Ole doesn’t have the numbers to compete never mind the talent to play how he wants to play. Hopefully get in another 6 players minimum over the next few windows and we’ll see a team start to form.
I think people need to reset their expectations for this team for a while. It’s not going to happen quickly no matter who is in charge. Forget Fergie, those days are gone. Time for the future. Stop putting pressure on these players and the manager. There are so many circumstances against them.
This is pure insanity.I'm talking about people like you.
We SHOULD have given Moyes more time..
The day we turned from a well-run club into this mess was the exact moment we sacked Davey Moyes.
I was not a fan of his appointment... I wanted Mourinho to follow Fergie. But when he was appointed, it was obvious we would need 3-4 years of backing him until he had his players in the dressing-room. Ever since we sacked Moyes, we've twisted ourselves into a mess of firing and hiring. NO MANAGER on this planet was going to do what Fergie did within a season or two. None whatsoever; not even a 45-year-old Ferguson again.
ANY manger that comes in needs 3-4 years to build his own mentality. No manager has been given that amount of time. That's why we're a mess.
That's why I say that those calling for Ole to be sacked haven't learned a thing over the past 6 years.
Had we stuck with Moyes, - 6 years down the line - we'd be a well-run dressing-room now. And a well-run dressing-room would be performing a helluva lot better.
Have bad track record with owners.Tuchel?
Indeed.It is fishy how it's always the newest members who tend to be the desperately over the top posters wanting managers to keep their jobs.
Sorry, correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like you are defending the idea of keeping Ole for as long as it takes to rebuild the club in his image, regardless of on field results.I try to stay away from manager discussion threads atm as it only supports the short termism dominating and at the same time is unnecessarily polarized and divisive (I’m no better than anybody else). I’ll make an exception here because this to me is about the owners and where they are taking the club:
Appointing Moyes, Van Gaal and Mourinho at United was three mistakes in a row. Appointing them in a row, is hair on end stuff. Not only does it speak to the poor football work of Woodward, but also to his employers.
Now, at this point (in February), appointing Ole Solskjær and supporting him in rebuilding the club from the ground up is either a sign of the hierarchy being on the right way - i.e., that regardless of wether Solskjær will prove to be adept enough as a football manager to last the course at United, if the G’s and Woody has understood that their haphazard way is flawed and the club needs being built in a consistent way over time, we will be on the right course even if Solskjær fails to deliver results on the pitch in the longer run. We will get a new manager who are thinking in roughly the same vein as Solskjær, and will be able to make use of the players Solskjær have assembled, and of the talent produced by an Academy thinking along the same lines.
If, however, Allegri is the next manager, it will prove that Solskjær was not hired because his Woody wanted his ideas of building the club, but because Woodward thought he would be a good quick fix appointment. Or that Woodward simply doesn’t care, and would actually pick any momentarily popular choice. Or that Woodgate’s understanding of cinsistency and building process is so low that he could be able to think ‘oh well, now we’ve tried concistency for twelve months, it obviously doesn’t work, let’s go for haphazard instead, or maybe the famed Woodward Gut Feeling.
Either of those scenarios would be too depressing to even bother considering, and a clear proof that the owners have actually no idea whatsoever what they are dealing with, and are not able to or interested in learning either. Let’s hope (against much evidence?) that it isn’t so.
Our form is shocking and we're reaching a new low on a weekly basis. You can't expect the club not to reach to that especially since Ole has been out of depth at any club outside Norway.I try to stay away from manager discussion threads atm as it only supports the short termism dominating and at the same time is unnecessarily polarized and divisive (I’m no better than anybody else). I’ll make an exception here because this to me is about the owners and where they are taking the club:
Appointing Moyes, Van Gaal and Mourinho at United was three mistakes in a row. Appointing them in a row, is hair on end stuff. Not only does it speak to the poor football work of Woodward, but also to his employers.
Now, at this point (in February), appointing Ole Solskjær and supporting him in rebuilding the club from the ground up is either a sign of the hierarchy being on the right way - i.e., that regardless of wether Solskjær will prove to be adept enough as a football manager to last the course at United, if the G’s and Woody has understood that their haphazard way is flawed and the club needs being built in a consistent way over time, we will be on the right course even if Solskjær fails to deliver results on the pitch in the longer run. We will get a new manager who are thinking in roughly the same vein as Solskjær, and will be able to make use of the players Solskjær have assembled, and of the talent produced by an Academy thinking along the same lines.
If, however, Allegri is the next manager, it will prove that Solskjær was not hired because his Woody wanted his ideas of building the club, but because Woodward thought he would be a good quick fix appointment. Or that Woodward simply doesn’t care, and would actually pick any momentarily popular choice. Or that Woodgate’s understanding of cinsistency and building process is so low that he could be able to think ‘oh well, now we’ve tried concistency for twelve months, it obviously doesn’t work, let’s go for haphazard instead, or maybe the famed Woodward Gut Feeling.
Either of those scenarios would be too depressing to even bother considering, and a clear proof that the owners have actually no idea whatsoever what they are dealing with, and are not able to or interested in learning either. Let’s hope (against much evidence?) that it isn’t so.