Who's in the worst position?

[charlenefan]

As per title (or if you're a glass half full type of person who's in the best position to address their current issues)

Arsenal - poor defence and a poor midfield with limited transfer budget and average manager out of contract in the summer. Fans not happy with the owners/those in charge

Spurs - 3 first choice players out of contract in the summer and their squad as a whole reaching the end of it's cycle, limited transfer budget, their best manager in the PL era possibly reaching the end of his tenure

Man Utd - poor midfield and attack, average manager, fans not happy with the owners/those in charge

3 relative mainstays of the Top 4 over the past 10 years or so all with similar issues. Arsenal and Spurs probably have better foundations in place from an attacking perspective but potentially dont have the funds to address their weaknesses, we on the other hand dont have the foundations but do have the money to address them (even if it does take 2 more summer transfer windows to do so). All 3 sides potentially changing manager in the next 12 months

(hope this is the right forum to put this)

 

[roonster09]

It just takes on spark to change everything. Just month ago, people said Chelsea are in worse position and they won't finish in top 6, now they are looking like 3rd best team in the league.

Things change very quickly in football. When the results are poor, everything looks worse than it is.

To the point of OP, we are in worse position. We have very poor midfield, no right winger and also not good enough manager.

 

[charlenefan]

It just takes on spark to change everything. Just month ago, people said Chelsea are in worse position and they won't finish in top 6, now they are looking like 3rd best team in the league.

Things change very quickly in football. When the results are poor, everything looks worse than it is.

To the point of OP, we are in worse position. We have very poor midfield, no right winger and also not good enough manager.

Is our midfield worse than Arsenals? I mean I know ours is not great but Pogba and McTominay individually are better than what they have no?

 

[noodlehair]

You'll be adding Chelsea to the list later in the season when the younger players inevitably become inconsistent and the more experienced ones do their usual trick of giving up for the season around December time.

 

[izec]

Should be in the football forum i feel.

United for me. Pogba may leave, Ed and the Glazers, our squad management, the coaching staff, Ole, the fanbase. There is no limit to our bottom level. Arsenal and Spurs might struggle, but they will finish around 4th to 6h place, Arsenal always do and they have a great attack, same for Spurs. Spurs need to replace Poch properly, but i feel they are already working behind the scenes on his replacement, I dont see the same with us, we are just too in love/deluded/patient and incompetent. And the 3 players leaving are not that big of an issue. Alderweireld is useless, while Eriksen is not motivated and Vertonghen is getting old. Replacing Vertonghen and Eriksen's impact in the last few years wont be easy, but you still expect them to be around top 4, which i cant say for us. When we spend, the investment turns out to be subpar.

 

[charlenefan]

You'll be adding Chelsea to the list later in the season when the younger players inevitably become inconsistent and the more experienced ones do their usual trick of giving up for the season around December time.

Agree

 

[Samid]

Depends what the goal/aim is. If the end goal is relative to historic success and expectations then we are worse off. Arsenal have been irrelevant for 15 years and Spurs have been irrelevant since... forever.

If it's just about getting regular CL football over the next 5-6 years then Spurs are worse off. Poch is a goner soon and their underpaid superstars will follow suit. I wouldn't be surprised if Leicester overtake/replace them in the traditional top 6.

Let's see how Chelsea perform when their new manager bounce wears off.

 

[Leftback99]

Short term us, squad no where near good enough for top 4 this season unless we have a good January window.

Long term I'd say Spurs. I'd rather have their squad in the short term but replacing the quality that they are expected to lose for nothing won't come cheap. We've learnt the hard way how hard it is to get signings right.

 

[Roboc7]

We are in the worst position because we’re relying on Woodward and his ‘brilliant football people’ who have failed repeatedly and a manager with no pedigree who looks out of his depth. They seem to be placing all their hope on future transfer windows despite not actually being any good at buying players.

Spurs clearly have issues but a new manager and few players leaving will probably help them given their current state. They also have some very good players.

Arsenal have a decent chance of top 4 this season, they seem to have a plan in place which will probably keep them competitive for 4th-6th and they have few good youngsters as well.

 

[Greck]

Realistically it's us because our key figures in the boardroom, dug out and on the pitch have a history of solid mediocrity. Any projections of positivity has to be based on faith and hope

 

[Raw]

Arsenal and Spurs have the potential to score enough goals to drag them in the top 4 race. We don't. It doesn't matter how good our defence can be, if we're scoring 1 goal a game at most then we're never getting in the top 4. There's a very good chance we're finishing midtable and good players aren't going to want to join us, and our best outfield player will probably leave. With that plus incompetent management it seems like we're in a worse position. We absolutely have to ace the upcoming transfer windows and sort out our attack and midfield, we simply can't afford to waste time on more flops.

 

[dove]

I know most people will say us but I think it's still Arsenal closely followed by Spurs who I think will struggle a lot in the next few years due to their best players leaving on a free. We can bounce back if we stop this ridiculous experiment with Ole and find a proper manager.

 

[roonster09]

Is our midfield worse than Arsenals? I mean I know ours is not great but Pogba and McTominay individually are better than what they have no?

The way we set up makes our midfielder weaker than it is, that's the problem.

 

[brownyorkshireman]

Think United are in the worst position as for this season at least. Poor midfield and attack means we will struggle regardless of the system we play, but arsenal and Tottenham can change there style to better suit there players.

But in terms of next season i actually think united will be in a decent position, the clear out over the summer (and a few to leave next summer) should leave united with the sole focus of buying players. Meanwhile Tottenham will have to decide if them and Poch are to part ways to rebuild the next squad, deal with key players being out of contract over the summer, and arsenal will have the problem of both being able to sell the poor players and then to purchase the right players.

 

[andycolegangstainnit]

You'll be adding Chelsea to the list later in the season when the younger players inevitably become inconsistent and the more experienced ones do their usual trick of giving up for the season around December time.

They've also had a few lucky results as well and have avoided injuries thus far. I'm confident we'll be threatening the top two sooner than the other three members of the big six. A big caveat is though is ambition. Do the Glazers/Ed really want to spend the necessary money? We can afford a net spend of £200m over the next two windows but will they go out and get say Kane and Erikson? Ambramowich has pulled the plug and Arsenal & Spurs are small time

 

[Schmeichel's Cartwheel]

Us

 

[Dancfc]

You'll be adding Chelsea to the list later in the season when the younger players inevitably become inconsistent and the more experienced ones do their usual trick of giving up for the season around December time.

Interesting theory, can you expand?

 

[harms]

I’d still bet on Arsenal to struggle the most in the long run. At the moment their forwards are bailing them out, but Auba isn’t getting any younger and is too reliant on his speed. The rest of their squad is even more average than ours.

We still have the money and the name that can buy us someone who’ll lead us out of this mess. We’re bound to make a great transfer sometime, aren’t we?

Spurs are at the edge, of Levy settles the situation, they’ll still be in a good position with a young and promising squad and a new stadium. But if he fails to retain and replace those stars that will inevitably want to move on, they can be in big trouble.

Chelsea are also not out of the danger zone yet.

 

[RG 11]

We're worse off than Arsenal but better than Spurs imo. Pogba's going to leave next summer leaving us with a midfield of McTominay, hopeless Fred and a finished Matic. We'll need at least 2 quality CMs, a backup CM, a quality RW, a backup LB and a 15-20 goals / season striker to be competitive for top 4 next season.

Arsenal has a great attack so a couple of decent signings for midfield / defense can sort them out under the right manager.

Spurs seems to be the worst off considering their lack of funds compared to us. We have much bigger gaps but have much better chances of a decent transfer window due to our revenue (if Woodward gets his head out of his ass).

 

[passing-wind]

Of course it's us Arsenal have at best a poor away record, Spurs have a mentality problem which seems to be effecting the teams performances.

We have all the above and more, inept manager, inept coaching staff, poor record at home, poor record away, no threat in attack, no patterns of play, unable to break teams down, useless board members, lack of consistency, no DOF etc.

 

[harms]

Interesting theory, can you expand?

It’s pretty straight-forward, isn’t it? The young players, with few exceptions like Ronaldo/Rooney/Mbappe, are usually not consistent enough throughout the season to carry the team - and you are relying heavily on some of them to provide a result. It can be that your youngsters are the exception, but it’s not very likely.

 

[Coxy]

Us - we're the bigger club (historically) and we're a shambles. Ed. The owners. Squad depth appalling, first team appalling.

 

[DRM]

Arsenal and Spurs have the potential to score enough goals to drag them in the top 4 race. We don't. It doesn't matter how good our defence can be, if we're scoring 1 goal a game at most then we're never getting in the top 4. There's a very good chance we're finishing midtable and good players aren't going to want to join us, and our best outfield player will probably leave. With that plus incompetent management it seems like we're in a worse position. We absolutely have to ace the upcoming transfer windows and sort out our attack and midfield, we simply can't afford to waste time on more flops.

This!

 

[Flanders Devil]

In order, I think I’d rather be:

1. spurs
2. Us
3. Arsenal

However I think we are currently in the worst position. I live in (hopefully not false) hope that we are better equipped to get out of this than arsenal.

 

[FootballHQ]

I still think in long run Spurs will be o.k. In attack they still have Son, Kane, Lucas Moura, Lamela, Dele Alli etc which is hardly terrible set of options.

Midfield construction is a bit of a mess atm and teams sense their defence is bad and are attacking it with direct balls but I'd still expect them to be not that far off top 4 at end of the season.

 

[Mr Anderson]

Clearly we are worse, the squad depth is awful and we are always a handful of injuries away from trouble.

Arsenal have more options, just a poor playing patch. Spurs have a decent squad but internal issues. Both can be solved internally, whereas we need more depth - which we can't solve right now.

 

[GBBQ]

Realistically it's us because our key figures in the boardroom, dug out and on the pitch have a history of solid mediocrity. Any projections of positivity has to be based on faith and hope

A solid history of mediocrity that has brought a trophy cabinet that Spurs and Arsenal could only dream of. Spurs have improved for sure but falling short in the CL final and now the drop off in performance, the inevitable loss of players the and lack of faith in Poch is going to result in a massive reset that they will need to get right. They failed to invest last season and are now reaping the benefits of it.

Arsenal have been playing for the top 4 trophy for much longer than United and have spent the last few seasons in Europa league. Their recruitment has been just as questionable as United and judging by online forums they have lost patience with Emery.

I don't think its as clear cut as you make out. Probably all 3 teams have to put in a lot of work to get things right but I believe that Arsenal have it worst, then United then Spurs (and only because in general their signings have been good and Poch has proven to be effective in the EPL).

 

[Greck]

A solid history of mediocrity that has brought a trophy cabinet that Spurs and Arsenal could only dream of. Spurs have improved for sure but falling short in the CL final and now the drop off in performance, the inevitable loss of players the and lack of faith in Poch is going to result in a massive reset that they will need to get right. They failed to invest last season and are now reaping the benefits of it.

Arsenal have been playing for the top 4 trophy for much longer than United and have spent the last few seasons in Europa league. Their recruitment has been just as questionable as United and judging by online forums they have lost patience with Emery.

I don't think its as clear cut as you make out. Probably all 3 teams have to put in a lot of work to get things right but I believe that Arsenal have it worst, then United then Spurs (and only because in general their signings have been good and Poch has proven to be effective in the EPL).

Who/what did you think I was referring to with the solid history of mediocrity comment? Im referring to ole, the coaching staff, Woodward and some of the players not the club

 

[Sky1981]

We're in the deepest shit.

Why? Arsenal spurs know when they've become shit and calls it as it is. We're trying to fool ourselves that our shit is actually gold when everyone has been telling us it's shit.

Spurs : yeah, time for poch to go. It's come to this.

Us : ole at the wheel, short term pain, 3rd year champion.

 

[12OunceEpilogue]

It's us I think. At Spurs the manager and a few key players look to have reached the end of the line and they'll need three or four ins and outs in the next 12 months but if they choose wisely they can cement third in England and look to challenge in Europe. While Arsenal look nowhere near ready to challenge for top honours they are still in the mix for fourth and looking good for at least an EL finish.

We could easily finish below the EL places from here and we're another bad managerial appointment and more dud signings away from being outside of Europe with very little to offer good players apart from loads of money. January is looking key and we have to see improvements in performances and particularly results soon or we will be writing off the season and starting again in 2020/21 from an even worse position than we started this year.

I'm hopeful of improvements, and once we get going on an upward trajectory I think we'll see a fast resurgence, but it feels like we are far nearer to falling into outright mediocrity than the other two clubs at the minute.

 

[HNK55]

They've also had a few lucky results as well and have avoided injuries thus far. I'm confident we'll be threatening the top two sooner than the other three members of the big six. A big caveat is though is ambition. Do the Glazers/Ed really want to spend the necessary money? We can afford a net spend of £200m over the next two windows but will they go out and get say Kane and Erikson? Ambramowich has pulled the plug and Arsenal & Spurs are small time

Chelsea has been lucky with injuries? Kante and Rudiger two of our best players have been missing for 95% of the season so far. And please do tell which one of our results were lucky?

 

[1950]

Arsenal - poor defence and a poor midfield with limited transfer budget and average manager out of contract in the summer. Fans not happy with the owners/those in charge

Spurs - 3 first choice players out of contract in the summer and their squad as a whole reaching the end of it's cycle, limited transfer budget, their best manager in the PL era possibly reaching the end of his tenure

Man Utd - poor midfield and attack, average manager, fans not happy with the owners/those in charge

Some perspective on the average managers. One has won the Europa League three times, qualified for Euopean football in a competitive league on a regular basis, won the domestic triple in France the season before last, never finished lower than 9th, even when managing a promoted side and has a better win% and higher ppg than Pochettino in the Premier League. The other won his last title 7 years ago (in Norway) and finished dead last in the Premier League before getting the sack in the Championship 5 years ago. Hasn't won a title since (in Norway).

 

[Nou_Camp99]

Without question its us. Squad not good enough, manager obviously not and board certainly not. Stadium also showing its age.

 

[Dancfc]

It’s pretty straight-forward, isn’t it? The young players, with few exceptions like Ronaldo/Rooney/Mbappe, are usually not consistent enough throughout the season to carry the team - and you are relying heavily on some of them to provide a result. It can be that your youngsters are the exception, but it’s not very likely.

I was actually referring to the bit where the experienced players supposedly tank on purpose after Christmas.

 

[lysglimt]

Depends on what period of time we are talking about - short-term we are not in a good position. But our current crop of youngsters is special - we have 8-10 players between 16-19 years of age who all could go on to reach first-team level. Naturally all of them wont - but I am convinced 3-4 of them will. We have Tuanzebe, James, Rashford, Martial, McTominay, AWB - 6 more or less regulars between 21-23 years of age.

So yes we will struggle for a while - but I am NOT nervous about our future in 2-3 years

 

[Bestietom]

We will most likely sack the manager around Christmas time and start all over again. Then same thing in the summer. Asking price too much for players, only to give in on last day. Misses out on 2/3 players again.
We need to look at CEO who has only got a Premiership winning side into top 4, just twice. ffs. We will always be worse off with this mutt in charge.

 

[Pow]

They've also had a few lucky results as well and have avoided injuries thus far. I'm confident we'll be threatening the top two sooner than the other three members of the big six. A big caveat is though is ambition. Do the Glazers/Ed really want to spend the necessary money? We can afford a net spend of £200m over the next two windows but will they go out and get say Kane and Erikson? Ambramowich has pulled the plug and Arsenal & Spurs are small time

What ?
Loftus cheek hasnt played a minute
Hudson odoi has just come back.
Our best player kante has barely played this season cause of injury
Our best cb rudiger has played a single half
And now emerson is injured.
Nonsesne to say weve not had injuries.

 

[Fosu-Mens]

MUFC.

The average technical quality of the players in the squad is way below the rest of the teams. Our only player able to play against a set defence wants to leave unless we pay him stupid money. 75% of our players will perform way better in a deep sitting counter attacking setup than in a more possession oriented setup (not the best approach when you are expecting to control 75% of the games). We have the highest expenditure on wages in the league with a number of players on bad contracts making it difficult to sell them, and expected decrease in income. Our manager's approach is Klopp at BVB 2.0.

 

[duffer]

What ?
Loftus cheek hasnt played a minute
Hudson odoi has just come back.
Our best player kante has barely played this season cause of injury
Our best cb rudiger has played a single half
And now emerson is injured.
Nonsesne to say weve not had injuries.

It's because we coped so well with the injuries that some think we haven't had any!

Kante alone is a huge loss.

 

[Dancfc]

It's because we coped so well with the injuries that some think we haven't had any!

Kante alone is a huge loss.

I actually think Jorginho would be the biggest loss out of everyone in this set up.

With Kante we do have adequate cover that can do a decent job in Kova, he's not as good as Kante (if he was he'd be in Real Madrid's first team and not here as a rotation player) but he can play that role to a good level.

With Jorginho, we don't have another player that can play that DLP role and if/when he's out I think our build up play and control in midfield will suffer greatly.